464 réponses à ce sujet

[ToLazy4Name]

parico wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...


Not once in this entire thread have I replied to someone with a stupid comeback that didn't have an argument behind it (Not that i've discussed strategy or tactics with the Volus in this thread since it's never come up).

If you guys REALLY think the Volus is bad, look at the thread in my signature and try the build and strategy out. 

your basic reason seems to be that no one knows how to play them.  I hardly call that a valid arguement against many of the good reasons in this thread that players have given for not liking the volus. 

1. There are MANY people on the forum who don't know how to play them. 

2. The wording on the replies you gave me made it seem as though you just refused to play them because of a stupid bias and because you're mad about a lack of Salarians and blaming it on the Volus. And, to be clear, you have played them, but I still don't think you know how to play them, or at least not the VanGOD. 

[DHKany]

the direction of this thread.....

[ToLazy4Name]

DarkOrgasm wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

DarkOrgasm wrote...

Give every vanguard a Predator X. Spec each one for max damage output for power or weapon, your choice.

Now, who has the total worst damage output and/or melee and powers that can synergize with biotic charge?

Volus

Except that we have more things than a Predator X to choose from. 

That's like saying take away Grenade Capacity from the Drell/Asari. 

That's correct, but level the playing field for al vanguards and pick based on that. OP asked not how can you make any vanguard work effectively, just which one is the worst?

You give the lolreegar to any vanguard and his damage output goes up. But I'll take a smashguard over a volguard any day if both have only a predator because PV has better synergy going for him

But a Volus with a Reegar will outperform a Phoenix with a Reegar (Unless it's Knockingbr4in playing, and even still he might be better with a Volus. Never seen him play one). 

Another good comparison would be putting a Kroguard with nothing but a Predator up against Collectors. He'd have to rely on Melee, and then, he'd probably be the worst of the Vanguards under those conditions. 

[Cyonan]

cowwy wrote...

Ok I can see what you're saying but I wouldn't agree that the Phoenix is crippled on maps like Condor, they don't help him at all but they don't gimp him completely. But honestly Smash is still rather underrated and does a very large amount of damage when specced properly. And to be clear the PV is tied with the Volus for my least favorite Vanguard but at least the PV has some kind of power synergy.

I wouldn't say it takes him out of the fight, but Condor is certainly much riskier than Glacier is. If you die then it doesn't really matter how much damage Smash could have done, and Condor makes it much easier for you to die.

The main reason I put the Volus ahead of the Phoenix is because of Shield Boost bringing some utility that none of the other Vanguards have. If you don't go for it(as you said you think it's more trouble than it's worth) then I would agree on Volus being worse than the Phoenix.

[parico]

DarkOrgasm wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

DarkOrgasm wrote...

Give every vanguard a Predator X. Spec each one for max damage output for power or weapon, your choice.

Now, who has the total worst damage output and/or melee and powers that can synergize with biotic charge?

Volus

Except that we have more things than a Predator X to choose from. 

That's like saying take away Grenade Capacity from the Drell/Asari. 

That's correct, but level the playing field for al vanguards and pick based on that. OP asked not how can you make any vanguard work effectively, just which one is the worst?

You give the lolreegar to any vanguard and his damage output goes up. But I'll take a smashguard over a volguard any day if both have only a predator because PV has better synergy going for him

thats a good point take way the reager and volus wont be doing much dps.  All other vanguards have ways to effectively kill with powers.  This is something the Volus is greatly lacking in.  

[Grun7mas7er]

Idk about the worst, but since I've learned to play the Phoenix, I want to note that it's not bad like people think. Smash works better than most people give it credit for (even post nerf).

[Cyonan]

ToLazy4Name wrote...

But a Volus with a Reegar will outperform a Phoenix with a Reegar (Unless it's Knockingbr4in playing, and even still he might be better with a Volus. Never seen him play one). 

Another good comparison would be putting a Kroguard with nothing but a Predator up against Collectors. He'd have to rely on Melee, and then, he'd probably be the worst of the Vanguards under those conditions. 

The Phoenix can actually just spec full weapon damage and have a weapon damage advantage over the Volus because of his passive.

[palmof40sorrows]

dava6711 wrote...

I'd say the volus protector or the krogan, I know the krogan is powerful but I just find him extremely boring to use! The smashguard is a lot of fun, especially if you take the 50% chance of no cool down evolution, charge instantly followed by smash is pretty devastating!

Boring does not equal worst.

On topic, probably the Phoenix, although the Cabal seems borderline un-vanguardish to me.

Modifié par palmof40sorrows, 23 avril 2013 - 01:56 .

[parico]

ToLazy4Name wrote...

parico wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...


Not once in this entire thread have I replied to someone with a stupid comeback that didn't have an argument behind it (Not that i've discussed strategy or tactics with the Volus in this thread since it's never come up).

If you guys REALLY think the Volus is bad, look at the thread in my signature and try the build and strategy out. 

your basic reason seems to be that no one knows how to play them.  I hardly call that a valid arguement against many of the good reasons in this thread that players have given for not liking the volus. 

1. There are MANY people on the forum who don't know how to play them. 

2. The wording on the replies you gave me made it seem as though you just refused to play them because of a stupid bias and because you're mad about a lack of Salarians and blaming it on the Volus. And, to be clear, you have played them, but I still don't think you know how to play them, or at least not the VanGOD. 

This arguement is as stupid as it is pointless.  Your view is the only one that matters.  you have attempted to invalidate everyone who dislikes your precious volus and  I'm bored with it so enjoy the rest of your night.  

Modifié par parico, 23 avril 2013 - 01:59 .

[DarkOrgasm]

ToLazy4Name wrote...

DarkOrgasm wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

DarkOrgasm wrote...

Give every vanguard a Predator X. Spec each one for max damage output for power or weapon, your choice.

Now, who has the total worst damage output and/or melee and powers that can synergize with biotic charge?

Volus

Except that we have more things than a Predator X to choose from. 

That's like saying take away Grenade Capacity from the Drell/Asari. 

That's correct, but level the playing field for al vanguards and pick based on that. OP asked not how can you make any vanguard work effectively, just which one is the worst?

You give the lolreegar to any vanguard and his damage output goes up. But I'll take a smashguard over a volguard any day if both have only a predator because PV has better synergy going for him

But a Volus with a Reegar will outperform a Phoenix with a Reegar (Unless it's Knockingbr4in playing, and even still he might be better with a Volus. Never seen him play one). 

Another good comparison would be putting a Kroguard with nothing but a Predator up against Collectors. He'd have to rely on Melee, and then, he'd probably be the worst of the Vanguards under those conditions. 

A vanguard charges and hopefully synergizes with his other powers to kill. Using any powerful weapon on to compensate for lack thereof is just my point, that vanguard is weak.

Kroguard has at least better melee than a Volus

Thats fine that you found a way to make the Volguard work as well as you do, but he is the worst one of the bunch

[ToLazy4Name]

Cyonan wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

But a Volus with a Reegar will outperform a Phoenix with a Reegar (Unless it's Knockingbr4in playing, and even still he might be better with a Volus. Never seen him play one). 

Another good comparison would be putting a Kroguard with nothing but a Predator up against Collectors. He'd have to rely on Melee, and then, he'd probably be the worst of the Vanguards under those conditions. 

The Phoenix can actually just spec full weapon damage and have a weapon damage advantage over the Volus because of his passive.

Yes, but can a Phoenix tank multiple boss units while spraying a Reegar in their face? 

[DHKany]

Cyonan wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

But a Volus with a Reegar will outperform a Phoenix with a Reegar (Unless it's Knockingbr4in playing, and even still he might be better with a Volus. Never seen him play one). 

Another good comparison would be putting a Kroguard with nothing but a Predator up against Collectors. He'd have to rely on Melee, and then, he'd probably be the worst of the Vanguards under those conditions. 

The Phoenix can actually just spec full weapon damage and have a weapon damage advantage over the Volus because of his passive.

^this. 

Also, having a ludicrous amount of barriers automatically makes the Kroguard top tier along with his rage bonuses. Not to mention that his melee is also quite excellent (infinitely better than the voluses in terms of damage). 

[oO Stryfe Oo]

Jaison1986 wrote...

I aways thought everybody hated the drell... guess I was wrong.

Lol, no...People here have like a hard-on for anything Drell.

I'd say the worst is Phoenix. Despite the Drell and Volus being squishier, he somehow ends up feeling both more fragile and not worth the trouble. Plus, he's like a carbon copy of the Adept. I feel like his somewhat bad fitness/melee options are to blame.

[DHKany]

ToLazy4Name wrote...

Cyonan wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

But a Volus with a Reegar will outperform a Phoenix with a Reegar (Unless it's Knockingbr4in playing, and even still he might be better with a Volus. Never seen him play one). 

Another good comparison would be putting a Kroguard with nothing but a Predator up against Collectors. He'd have to rely on Melee, and then, he'd probably be the worst of the Vanguards under those conditions. 

The Phoenix can actually just spec full weapon damage and have a weapon damage advantage over the Volus because of his passive.

Yes, but can a Phoenix tank multiple boss units while spraying a Reegar in their face? 

Heard of soft cover? 

[ToLazy4Name]

DHKany wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

Cyonan wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

But a Volus with a Reegar will outperform a Phoenix with a Reegar (Unless it's Knockingbr4in playing, and even still he might be better with a Volus. Never seen him play one). 

Another good comparison would be putting a Kroguard with nothing but a Predator up against Collectors. He'd have to rely on Melee, and then, he'd probably be the worst of the Vanguards under those conditions. 

The Phoenix can actually just spec full weapon damage and have a weapon damage advantage over the Volus because of his passive.

Yes, but can a Phoenix tank multiple boss units while spraying a Reegar in their face? 

Heard of soft cover? 

With a Reegar, soft cover isn't an option alot of the time. 

[DHKany]

ToLazy4Name wrote...

DHKany wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

Cyonan wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

But a Volus with a Reegar will outperform a Phoenix with a Reegar (Unless it's Knockingbr4in playing, and even still he might be better with a Volus. Never seen him play one). 

Another good comparison would be putting a Kroguard with nothing but a Predator up against Collectors. He'd have to rely on Melee, and then, he'd probably be the worst of the Vanguards under those conditions. 

The Phoenix can actually just spec full weapon damage and have a weapon damage advantage over the Volus because of his passive.

Yes, but can a Phoenix tank multiple boss units while spraying a Reegar in their face? 

Heard of soft cover? 

With a Reegar, soft cover isn't an option alot of the time. 

Charging out in the open 1v1 ing bosses isn't a smart option most of the time either. 
Just wait for them around corners, and unload. Reegar's mobility penalty when firing also adds to the reasons you should NOT 'tank' bosses. 

[Cyonan]

ToLazy4Name wrote...

Yes, but can a Phoenix tank multiple boss units while spraying a Reegar in their face? 

Well you aren't taking Biotic Orbs to the point where you get recharge speed making the only advantage you get being the DR from Shield Boost,

So the Phoenix will have a DPS advantage while the Volus will have a survivability advantage

To say that the Volus will outperform the Phoenix is not a fair statement to make. It's going to be fairly close between the two.

Unfortunately this competition is going on at the bottom of the Vanguard barrel.

[Zyzimorph]

ToLazy4Name wrote...

parico wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...


Not once in this entire thread have I replied to someone with a stupid comeback that didn't have an argument behind it (Not that i've discussed strategy or tactics with the Volus in this thread since it's never come up).

If you guys REALLY think the Volus is bad, look at the thread in my signature and try the build and strategy out. 

your basic reason seems to be that no one knows how to play them.  I hardly call that a valid arguement against many of the good reasons in this thread that players have given for not liking the volus. 

1. There are MANY people on the forum who don't know how to play them. 

2. The wording on the replies you gave me made it seem as though you just refused to play them because of a stupid bias and because you're mad about a lack of Salarians and blaming it on the Volus. And, to be clear, you have played them, but I still don't think you know how to play them, or at least not the VanGOD. 

You're really stretching it now buddy

[ToLazy4Name]

DHKany wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

DHKany wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

Cyonan wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

But a Volus with a Reegar will outperform a Phoenix with a Reegar (Unless it's Knockingbr4in playing, and even still he might be better with a Volus. Never seen him play one). 

Another good comparison would be putting a Kroguard with nothing but a Predator up against Collectors. He'd have to rely on Melee, and then, he'd probably be the worst of the Vanguards under those conditions. 

The Phoenix can actually just spec full weapon damage and have a weapon damage advantage over the Volus because of his passive.

Yes, but can a Phoenix tank multiple boss units while spraying a Reegar in their face? 

Heard of soft cover? 

With a Reegar, soft cover isn't an option alot of the time. 

Charging out in the open 1v1 ing bosses isn't a smart option most of the time either. 
Just wait for them around corners, and unload. Reegar's mobility penalty when firing also adds to the reasons you should NOT 'tank' bosses. 

The Volus ignores movement penalties associated with a gun firing. You didn't know that, I take it. 

Also, if charging into the open and fighting a boss is a bad idea, then why do Kroguards do it with such great success? Because they can take the punishment. So can a Volus. 

[ToLazy4Name]

Cyonan wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

Yes, but can a Phoenix tank multiple boss units while spraying a Reegar in their face? 

Well you aren't taking Biotic Orbs to the point where you get recharge speed making the only advantage you get being the DR from Shield Boost,

So the Phoenix will have a DPS advantage while the Volus will have a survivability advantage

To say that the Volus will outperform the Phoenix is not a fair statement to make. It's going to be fairly close between the two.

Unfortunately this competition is going on at the bottom of the Vanguard barrel.

The Phoenix only gets a, what, 25% bonus? That's only 2.5% more than the Volus, and the Volus doesn't have to worry about hiding behind cover. 

Also, I put 3 points into Biotic Orbs which gives me a 30% cooldown bonus. It's enough to Cloak -> Charge + Empty Reegar -> Shield Boost -> Repeat Process.

[tjbearpig]

So much hate for the bowling ball

Light melee > Charge > Melt with Reegar

Shield boost for up to 90% DR

Orbs decrease cooldowns

IMO (and by IMO, I mean I know I'll get flamed for this yolo) the "worst" vanguard is the Drell. He gets swag points, but everything he can do a Asariguard can do better (do-you-even-lift nades > cluster 'nades... IMO). Also he's too squishy for my tastes. You can just charge into a scion and instantly loose your barriers from one shot even with BC DR.

By all means, he's still a great character.

[Cyonan]

ToLazy4Name wrote...
The Phoenix only gets a, what, 25% bonus? That's only 2.5% more than the Volus, and the Volus doesn't have to worry about hiding behind cover. 

Also, I put 3 points into Biotic Orbs which gives me a 30% cooldown bonus. It's enough to Cloak -> Charge + Empty Reegar -> Shield Boost -> Repeat Process.

Also an additive 20% headshot damage bonus that works on bosses that the Volus doesn't get.

While you get some recharge speed, you also have a lower weight capacity.

Edit: Even if you were to win the Volus vs Phoenix, that still makes him the second worst Vanguard in the game =P

Modifié par Cyonan, 23 avril 2013 - 02:19 .

[CHRrOME]

You will try to burn me for this, but I'll say it anyways: Asari.
Not because she is terrible, all the opposite. Its because she's buggy as hell for me. 4 of 5 times I use biotic charge I die. My barrier doesn't refill and I get one-shot kill from the first lucky bastard in front of me. I hate that, and that is on-host. I will not even talk about off-host.

But now, serious, Cerberus vanguard is sort of meh. The only good thing he has is the heavy melee

[ToLazy4Name]

Cyonan wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...
The Phoenix only gets a, what, 25% bonus? That's only 2.5% more than the Volus, and the Volus doesn't have to worry about hiding behind cover. 

Also, I put 3 points into Biotic Orbs which gives me a 30% cooldown bonus. It's enough to Cloak -> Charge + Empty Reegar -> Shield Boost -> Repeat Process.

Also an additive 20% headshot damage bonus that works on bosses that the Volus doesn't get.

While you get some recharge speed, you also have a lower weight capacity.

And this is why I like you, you're actually pointing out stuff that I didn't think of. 

I'll concede your point that, yes, he can out damage the Volus, but I still say that the Volus can dish out more damage simply because he doesn't have to worry about hiding or dodging around. The Volus can constantly keep his Biotic Charge weapon damage bonus up as well, because, again, survivability. 

Edit: And in regards to your edit, I don't think so. Outside of the Phoenix, all the Vanguards serve a different purpose. The Kroguard is the Kroguard, I don't even need to speak about that. The Cabal is the fastest character in the game. The Novaguard has AMAZING synergy with power combos. The Drell and Asari are amazing spawn nukers, the Drell having more damage output while the Asari's Grenades go through walls and are easier to land. The Slayer is a mix of Spawn Nuking, Tanking, and synergy with Power Combos, and the Volus is a Kroguard with slightly less damage output and much more utility (Can get Barriers back without charging, and immensely helpful during objectives). 

Modifié par ToLazy4Name, 23 avril 2013 - 02:22 .

[DHKany]

ToLazy4Name wrote...

DHKany wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

DHKany wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

Cyonan wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

But a Volus with a Reegar will outperform a Phoenix with a Reegar (Unless it's Knockingbr4in playing, and even still he might be better with a Volus. Never seen him play one). 

Another good comparison would be putting a Kroguard with nothing but a Predator up against Collectors. He'd have to rely on Melee, and then, he'd probably be the worst of the Vanguards under those conditions. 

The Phoenix can actually just spec full weapon damage and have a weapon damage advantage over the Volus because of his passive.

Yes, but can a Phoenix tank multiple boss units while spraying a Reegar in their face? 

Heard of soft cover? 

With a Reegar, soft cover isn't an option alot of the time. 

Charging out in the open 1v1 ing bosses isn't a smart option most of the time either. 
Just wait for them around corners, and unload. Reegar's mobility penalty when firing also adds to the reasons you should NOT 'tank' bosses. 

The Volus ignores movement penalties associated with a gun firing. You didn't know that, I take it. 

Also, if charging into the open and fighting a boss is a bad idea, then why do Kroguards do it with such great success? Because they can take the punishment. So can a Volus. 

Kroguards can do it because they have a bajillion barriers and health followed by a DR boosting power and DR giving melee tree.Not to mention that they are durable enough to empty 2-3 uninterrupted reegar clips into the enemies before having to take a break by charging. 

Volus need to constantly shield boost cutting down on DPS by a lot, not to mention their inferior passives to the kroguard.