883 réponses à ce sujet

[rapscallioness]

Organics--or, at least humans, don't need tech to evolve.

The final stage of evolution? For who? The Synthetics. I don't see it as a foregone conclusion that the ideal next step of evolution for organics is to become biosynthetic constructs.

I would rather think that the next steps would be more along the lines of humans using more than 5% of their brains.

That'd be cool.

Organics don't need tech to evolve, but synths need organics. Personally, I think organics being fused w/tech is more a step down

[rapscallioness]

If anything, I'd say the Reapers significantly harmed the evolution of organics.

How far along could we be if not for having to start from scratch every 50,000 years? All knowledge of previous cultures gone. And No chance for the growth of that knowledge because each civilization was wiped out at abt 50,000 years.

The knowledge the Reapers carry from the goo of previous civilizations is stagnant. It only goes to a certain point of understanding before being harvested. We never got a chance to flourish cuz they kept cutting us off.

A billion years, or so, of organic evolution lost because of the Reapers interference.

[omegamantis113]

rapscallioness wrote...

If anything, I'd say the Reapers significantly harmed the evolution of organics.

How far along could we be if not for having to start from scratch every 50,000 years? All knowledge of previous cultures gone. And No chance for the growth of that knowledge because each civilization was wiped out at abt 50,000 years.

The knowledge the Reapers carry from the goo of previous civilizations is stagnant. It only goes to a certain point of understanding before being harvested. We never got a chance to flourish cuz they kept cutting us off.

A billion years, or so, of organic evolution lost because of the Reapers interference.

Ask the Leviathan. They've been around longer than anybody else.

It's hightly likely the reaper's saved humans from destruction countless times without the humans ever knowing. Humanity benefited from the dinosaurs extinction too and that came from a natural cause. Death is a part of life and in order for life to grow somethings have to die. Of course it sucks to be the ones that have to die but look at nature.

Even our own society practices the act of reaping. Look at agriculture. If you don't clear out the current life you cannot successfully grow the next life. It sucks to be the weeds but we need the grain so the weeds have got to go.

Once I learned that the Reaper's are not reaping for a sinister purpose My hatred for them disappeared.

[rapscallioness]

omegamantis113 wrote...

rapscallioness wrote...

If anything, I'd say the Reapers significantly harmed the evolution of organics.

How far along could we be if not for having to start from scratch every 50,000 years? All knowledge of previous cultures gone. And No chance for the growth of that knowledge because each civilization was wiped out at abt 50,000 years.

The knowledge the Reapers carry from the goo of previous civilizations is stagnant. It only goes to a certain point of understanding before being harvested. We never got a chance to flourish cuz they kept cutting us off.

A billion years, or so, of organic evolution lost because of the Reapers interference.

Ask the Leviathan. They've been around longer than anybody else.

It's hightly likely the reaper's saved humans from destruction countless times without the humans ever knowing. Humanity benefited from the dinosaurs extinction too and that came from a natural cause. Death is a part of life and in order for life to grow somethings have to die. Of course it sucks to be the ones that have to die but look at nature.

Even our own society practices the act of reaping. Look at agriculture. If you don't clear out the current life you cannot successfully grow the next life. It sucks to be the weeds but we need the grain so the weeds have got to go.

Once I learned that the Reaper's are not reaping for a sinister purpose My hatred for them disappeared.

But we don't know that (in the bold). And who's to say we wouldn't have figured it out for ourselves? In fact, we would have.

Death is a part of life, but death by the orders of sum AI is not. And I never hated the Reapers. Imo, they're doing what they truly believe needs to be done. But their sincerity does not make them right. It makes them a broken AI that needs to be shut down.

[rapscallioness]

As far as Leviathan, I really don't understand their motivation. Couldn't they have leashed the Reapers along time ago? Why didn't they? Cuz they think everything is fine? That's why they're hiding for their lives?

I genuinely do not understand the....role, or purpose of Leviathan.

[robertthebard]

tickle267 wrote...

Seival wrote...

Argolas wrote...

Robots? Yes. Husks? No. Husks are way past the "mental decay" of indoctrination. Husks will be the slaves that will make post-Synthesis society possible. They will do the work that Synthetics don't have to do anymore.

In Synthesis epilogue synthesized husk looks too human-like, just still has "scary" appearance. So I believe that ex-husks will become a part of society as well. I really don't think they will become slaves though. They can think for themselves now.

yes let us all share the love!

Run, FemShep, Run....

[Seival]

robertthebard wrote...

Seival wrote...

robertthebard wrote...

Seival wrote...

Any Reaper device is a fragment of the Reaper tech. No matter part of a Reaper ship, or some small generator - they all eradiate the same thing with power source or without it. Indoctrination is a part of organic half of Reaper tech. Remember destroyed proto-reaper remains inside Cerberus base, and how Liara reacted on its presence? "It's observing us!", but it's dead - only small pieces of it are still intact.

They tried to create their own husks based on Reaper tech they discovered, and we both know how that ended. They all became indoctrinated.

Lawson didn't look like indoctrinated? Yes, just like TIM. There are no visual signs of indoctrination until after person gets some Reaper tech based implants.

So, is my computer a part of my car?  My car has an onboard computer too.  Is the Collector Rifle capable of indoctrination?  It is, after all, Reaper Tech.  Maybe you're confused by the word fragment?   http://www.merriam-w...ionary/fragment  By definition, a complete device is not a fragment.  I'm really not interested in twisting the lore to fit your theory, and I am a staunch supporter of not twisting the English language to support theories as well, have been for a long time.

Comparing Reaper tech to something familiar is incorrect.

I believe that contacting with anything produced by the Reapers isn't good idea for the lesser creature. Even if it's just a Collector's rifle. But this rifle will not be as dangerous to its owner as something larger based on Reaper tech of course. The larger the Reaper object - the more dangerous it is. I think you can imagine how dangerous can be millions of derelict Reaper ships.

Leviathans' orbs are called Fragments, but they are not a part of some larger device - each orb is independent object.

Or perhaps they are part of something larger?  I, however, did not call the artifacts fragments, this is a name pinned on them by Leviathans.  I may have used it in this context however, I'm not sure.  However, that is far and away from saying the Arrival device is a fragment.  It is a complete machine, with a specific purpose.  Millions of derelict Reapers, if they are still functioning on some level can indeed be dangerous.  However, truly dead Reapers, I don't know, and nobody does.  The only one we have ever had contact with was the one in ME 2, and it wasn't dead, more like, it was in sleep mode.  Just enough power to keep it's Mass Effect field running, which would be enough for it to indoctrinate, evidently, since it did.  Stating what you think will happen with them as fact doesn't make it a fact.  I think what will happen is that they are completely shut down, and harmless.  See, I have now stated my opinion as fact, and I can support my theory with "Since it doesn't have any power, and the Indoctrination Signal requires power to function, they cannot indoctrinate".  So I guess my fact is more valid than your fact?

This is derelict Reaper's condition. Hull breached in several places. Some pieces of the Reaper are floating nearby. This Reaper is dead. At the same time, Destroy epilogue doesn't show such massive damage to the Reaper ships. They all look almost intact.

How many different devices will remain intact inside dead Reaper ships? Tons of them.

In the Leviathan DLC Ann Bryson tells us that Nazara's part in the lab is shielded to avoid indoctrination. And this is just a human-sized piece of wrack without any power sources inside. It doesn't matter if we have just a wrack or a whole device. Reaper tech will indoctrinate anyway. It's just a matter of time.

You can shield a small wrack, good luck with finding and shielding all of them.
You can't shield the whole Reaper.
You can't stop all people who will try to get some Reaper remains to study them.
You can't stop all people who will try to enter derelict Reapers.

Only Leviathans can clean Destroy mess.

Modifié par Seival, 28 avril 2013 - 12:35 .

[AresKeith]

Seival wrote...



This is derelict Reaper's condition. Hull breached in several places. Some pieces of the Reaper are floating nearby. This Reaper is dead. At the same time, Destroy epilogue doesn't show such massive damage to the Reaper ships. They all look almost intact.

How many different devices will remain intact inside dead Reaper ships? Tons of them.

In the Leviathan DLC Ann Bryson tells us that Nazara's part in the lab is shielded to avoid indoctrination. And this is just a human-sized piece of wrack without any power sources inside. It doesn't matter if we have just a wrack or a whole device. Reaper tech will indoctrinate anyway. It's just a matter of time.

You can shield a small wrack, good luck with finding and shielding all of them.
You can't shield the whole Reaper.
You can't stop all people who will try to get some Reaper remains to study them.
You can't stop all people who will try to enter derelict Reapers.

Only Leviathans can clean Destroy mess.

Actually that's wrong, if the Reaper's organic core is still functional and intact they can still indoctrinate people

But if the core is destroyed then you don't have to worry about getting indoctrinated by said Reaper

ME2 shows you this

Modifié par AresKeith, 28 avril 2013 - 12:38 .

[Seival]

AresKeith wrote...

Seival wrote...



This is derelict Reaper's condition. Hull breached in several places. Some pieces of the Reaper are floating nearby. This Reaper is dead. At the same time, Destroy epilogue doesn't show such massive damage to the Reaper ships. They all look almost intact.

How many different devices will remain intact inside dead Reaper ships? Tons of them.

In the Leviathan DLC Ann Bryson tells us that Nazara's part in the lab is shielded to avoid indoctrination. And this is just a human-sized piece of wrack without any power sources inside. It doesn't matter if we have just a wrack or a whole device. Reaper tech will indoctrinate anyway. It's just a matter of time.

You can shield a small wrack, good luck with finding and shielding all of them.
You can't shield the whole Reaper.
You can't stop all people who will try to get some Reaper remains to study them.
You can't stop all people who will try to enter derelict Reapers.

Only Leviathans can clean Destroy mess.

Actually that's wrong, if the Reaper's organic core is still functional and intact they can still indoctrinate people

But if the core is destroyed then you don't have to worry about getting indoctrinated by said Reaper

ME2 shows you this

ME2 shows that mass effect core (which is not organic of course) holds derelict Reaper on the orbit. Destruction of the core forced derelict Reaper to fall down, but didn't "turn off its indoctrination capabilities".

Modifié par Seival, 28 avril 2013 - 12:46 .

[adayaday]

Technically speaking the human body is a machine,and human can be very dead without any superficial signs.A reaper hit by the destroy beam might be in far worse condition then it appearance suggest.ofc this is all speculations...

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Gotta love that Seival insanity.

It's just delicious.

[robertthebard]

Seival wrote...



This is derelict Reaper's condition. Hull breached in several places. Some pieces of the Reaper are floating nearby. This Reaper is dead. At the same time, Destroy epilogue doesn't show such massive damage to the Reaper ships. They all look almost intact.

How many different devices will remain intact inside dead Reaper ships? Tons of them.

In the Leviathan DLC Ann Bryson tells us that Nazara's part in the lab is shielded to avoid indoctrination. And this is just a human-sized piece of wrack without any power sources inside. It doesn't matter if we have just a wrack or a whole device. Reaper tech will indoctrinate anyway. It's just a matter of time.

You can shield a small wrack, good luck with finding and shielding all of them.
You can't shield the whole Reaper.
You can't stop all people who will try to get some Reaper remains to study them.
You can't stop all people who will try to enter derelict Reapers.

Only Leviathans can clean Destroy mess.

So uh, what happens when you shut destroy the ME core on the ship?  Oh yeah, it falls into the dwarf because it no longer has any power to keep it in orbit.  See what happened there, it still had power, so it could still indoctrinate.  Of course, I have already explained it, and the game also explains it, but you choose to ignore it because, well, reasons.  So what gives, is it that you have to go through these mental gymnastics to say somebody else did something wrong, or to justify a choice that doesn't sit well with you for some reason?  Because frankly, having to go through all the mental gymnastics of the Harbinger DeM and the endings is why I die in London.  You see, instead of making my brain work overtime trying to make something fit what I want it to fit, I just quit right there, and I'm happy.  If it had a legend save there, I'd be really happy.

[AresKeith]

robertthebard wrote...

So uh, what happens when you shut destroy the ME core on the ship?  Oh yeah, it falls into the dwarf because it no longer has any power to keep it in orbit.  See what happened there, it still had power, so it could still indoctrinate.  Of course, I have already explained it, and the game also explains it, but you choose to ignore it because, well, reasons.  So what gives, is it that you have to go through these mental gymnastics to say somebody else did something wrong, or to justify a choice that doesn't sit well with you for some reason?  Because frankly, having to go through all the mental gymnastics of the Harbinger DeM and the endings is why I die in London.  You see, instead of making my brain work overtime trying to make something fit what I want it to fit, I just quit right there, and I'm happy.  If it had a legend save there, I'd be really happy.

Seival is literally one of those people who goes "I'm right, your wrong, accept it"

[The Night Mammoth]

robertthebard wrote...

So uh, what happens when you shut destroy the ME core on the ship?  Oh yeah, it falls into the dwarf because it no longer has any power to keep it in orbit.  See what happened there, it still had power, so it could still indoctrinate.  Of course, I have already explained it, and the game also explains it, but you choose to ignore it because, well, reasons.  So what gives, is it that you have to go through these mental gymnastics to say somebody else did something wrong, or to justify a choice that doesn't sit well with you for some reason?  Because frankly, having to go through all the mental gymnastics of the Harbinger DeM and the endings is why I die in London.  You see, instead of making my brain work overtime trying to make something fit what I want it to fit, I just quit right there, and I'm happy.  If it had a legend save there, I'd be really happy.

Ah, a man after my own heart. 

I've long since decided that either Shepard dies in London, or the fate of the galaxy is remains vague and undecided. 

[MassivelyEffective0730]

AresKeith wrote...
Seival is literally one of those people who goes "I'm right, your wrong, accept it"

Don't forget, he also uses his headcanon as factual and objective evidence (like what he's doing right now).

He really is psychotic.

Modifié par MassivelyEffective0730, 28 avril 2013 - 04:43 .

[TheProtheans]

If Seival was a character in Mass effect, he would probably be Dr Saleon.
Obviously he would need have his plot strengthened and spanning over the 3 games.

[Yestare7]

TheProtheans wrote...

If Seival was a character in Mass effect, he would probably be Dr Saleon.

LOL

[robertthebard]

The Night Mammoth wrote...

robertthebard wrote...

So uh, what happens when you shut destroy the ME core on the ship?  Oh yeah, it falls into the dwarf because it no longer has any power to keep it in orbit.  See what happened there, it still had power, so it could still indoctrinate.  Of course, I have already explained it, and the game also explains it, but you choose to ignore it because, well, reasons.  So what gives, is it that you have to go through these mental gymnastics to say somebody else did something wrong, or to justify a choice that doesn't sit well with you for some reason?  Because frankly, having to go through all the mental gymnastics of the Harbinger DeM and the endings is why I die in London.  You see, instead of making my brain work overtime trying to make something fit what I want it to fit, I just quit right there, and I'm happy.  If it had a legend save there, I'd be really happy.

Ah, a man after my own heart. 

I've long since decided that either Shepard dies in London, or the fate of the galaxy is remains vague and undecided. 

I call it Ultimate Refusal.  Yes, the Reapers win, but I died trying.

[Siripho]

Seival wrote...

Nature itself consumes lives. For what? Just to create new ones. A lot of them. Better then the previous ones.

Yeah, no.

I am aware of the comedic intent of your topics Seival but, with all the respect in the world, you may want to do some research into Evolutionary Theory to improve their robustness in the face of the fire they always attract. The number of flaws in the above sentences horribly outweighs the effect you are attempting to create by using them.

[Seival]

robertthebard wrote...

Seival wrote...



This is derelict Reaper's condition. Hull breached in several places. Some pieces of the Reaper are floating nearby. This Reaper is dead. At the same time, Destroy epilogue doesn't show such massive damage to the Reaper ships. They all look almost intact.

How many different devices will remain intact inside dead Reaper ships? Tons of them.

In the Leviathan DLC Ann Bryson tells us that Nazara's part in the lab is shielded to avoid indoctrination. And this is just a human-sized piece of wrack without any power sources inside. It doesn't matter if we have just a wrack or a whole device. Reaper tech will indoctrinate anyway. It's just a matter of time.

You can shield a small wrack, good luck with finding and shielding all of them.
You can't shield the whole Reaper.
You can't stop all people who will try to get some Reaper remains to study them.
You can't stop all people who will try to enter derelict Reapers.

Only Leviathans can clean Destroy mess.

So uh, what happens when you shut destroy the ME core on the ship?  Oh yeah, it falls into the dwarf because it no longer has any power to keep it in orbit.  See what happened there, it still had power, so it could still indoctrinate.  Of course, I have already explained it, and the game also explains it, but you choose to ignore it because, well, reasons.  So what gives, is it that you have to go through these mental gymnastics to say somebody else did something wrong, or to justify a choice that doesn't sit well with you for some reason?  Because frankly, having to go through all the mental gymnastics of the Harbinger DeM and the endings is why I die in London.  You see, instead of making my brain work overtime trying to make something fit what I want it to fit, I just quit right there, and I'm happy.  If it had a legend save there, I'd be really happy.

You are completely ignore the fact that even Reaper wrack without any power sources still can influence minds. Watch and listen carefully, please:


That was just a small piece of Nazara. A piece of armor or a part of some device. Who knows?
You are trying to argue without knowing the whole story.
Millions of dead Reapers are threat that only Leviathans can deal with.

[robertthebard]

Seival wrote...

robertthebard wrote...

Seival wrote...



This is derelict Reaper's condition. Hull breached in several places. Some pieces of the Reaper are floating nearby. This Reaper is dead. At the same time, Destroy epilogue doesn't show such massive damage to the Reaper ships. They all look almost intact.

How many different devices will remain intact inside dead Reaper ships? Tons of them.

In the Leviathan DLC Ann Bryson tells us that Nazara's part in the lab is shielded to avoid indoctrination. And this is just a human-sized piece of wrack without any power sources inside. It doesn't matter if we have just a wrack or a whole device. Reaper tech will indoctrinate anyway. It's just a matter of time.

You can shield a small wrack, good luck with finding and shielding all of them.
You can't shield the whole Reaper.
You can't stop all people who will try to get some Reaper remains to study them.
You can't stop all people who will try to enter derelict Reapers.

Only Leviathans can clean Destroy mess.

So uh, what happens when you shut destroy the ME core on the ship?  Oh yeah, it falls into the dwarf because it no longer has any power to keep it in orbit.  See what happened there, it still had power, so it could still indoctrinate.  Of course, I have already explained it, and the game also explains it, but you choose to ignore it because, well, reasons.  So what gives, is it that you have to go through these mental gymnastics to say somebody else did something wrong, or to justify a choice that doesn't sit well with you for some reason?  Because frankly, having to go through all the mental gymnastics of the Harbinger DeM and the endings is why I die in London.  You see, instead of making my brain work overtime trying to make something fit what I want it to fit, I just quit right there, and I'm happy.  If it had a legend save there, I'd be really happy.

You are completely ignore the fact that even Reaper wrack without any power sources still can influence minds. Watch and listen carefully, please:


That was just a small piece of Nazara. A piece of armor or a part of some device. Who knows?
You are trying to argue without knowing the whole story.
Millions of dead Reapers are threat that only Leviathans can deal with.

Considering I have already touched on this, I'll just let you scroll back up for the point.

[Steelcan]

@Seival, Destroy destroys Reaper technology. I'm guessing any material formerly capable of indoctrination would be inert because its completely wiped by the Destroy beam.

[Seival]

robertthebard wrote...

Seival wrote...

robertthebard wrote...

Seival wrote...



This is derelict Reaper's condition. Hull breached in several places. Some pieces of the Reaper are floating nearby. This Reaper is dead. At the same time, Destroy epilogue doesn't show such massive damage to the Reaper ships. They all look almost intact.

How many different devices will remain intact inside dead Reaper ships? Tons of them.

In the Leviathan DLC Ann Bryson tells us that Nazara's part in the lab is shielded to avoid indoctrination. And this is just a human-sized piece of wrack without any power sources inside. It doesn't matter if we have just a wrack or a whole device. Reaper tech will indoctrinate anyway. It's just a matter of time.

You can shield a small wrack, good luck with finding and shielding all of them.
You can't shield the whole Reaper.
You can't stop all people who will try to get some Reaper remains to study them.
You can't stop all people who will try to enter derelict Reapers.

Only Leviathans can clean Destroy mess.

So uh, what happens when you shut destroy the ME core on the ship?  Oh yeah, it falls into the dwarf because it no longer has any power to keep it in orbit.  See what happened there, it still had power, so it could still indoctrinate.  Of course, I have already explained it, and the game also explains it, but you choose to ignore it because, well, reasons.  So what gives, is it that you have to go through these mental gymnastics to say somebody else did something wrong, or to justify a choice that doesn't sit well with you for some reason?  Because frankly, having to go through all the mental gymnastics of the Harbinger DeM and the endings is why I die in London.  You see, instead of making my brain work overtime trying to make something fit what I want it to fit, I just quit right there, and I'm happy.  If it had a legend save there, I'd be really happy.

You are completely ignore the fact that even Reaper wrack without any power sources still can influence minds. Watch and listen carefully, please:


That was just a small piece of Nazara. A piece of armor or a part of some device. Who knows?
You are trying to argue without knowing the whole story.
Millions of dead Reapers are threat that only Leviathans can deal with.

Considering I have already touched on this, I'll just let you scroll back up for the point.

I remember all your points well enough. And you are refusing to agree that dead Reapers (and even small pieces of them) are the real threat even after I gave video proof of that directly from the game.

I see no point in arguing with you anymore. I can only suggest you to replay the whole trilogy with all DLCs to refresh you memories about the story.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Seival, you outright do not understand evolutionary theory, and you do not understand the basic fundamentals of argument.

Using your opinion as logos is wrong. You are claiming what you believe (without any proof to your idea, and indeed with a great deal of proof against it) is absolute truth and that anyone who doesn't agree is deluded.