883 réponses à ce sujet

[Zazzerka]

You call Sovereign Nazara? You're just too hipster for words.

[Seival]

Steelcan wrote...

@Seival, Destroy destroys Reaper technology. I'm guessing any material formerly capable of indoctrination would be inert because its completely wiped by the Destroy beam.

Unlike dead Reaper threat, your assumption doesn't have any in-game proof. Destroy slides prove nothing, because we all know that Leviathans are still out there and eager to help galactic Civilization.

[Steelcan]

Seival wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

@Seival, Destroy destroys Reaper technology. I'm guessing any material formerly capable of indoctrination would be inert because its completely wiped by the Destroy beam.

Unlike dead Reaper threat, your assumption doesn't have any in-game proof. Destroy slides prove nothing, because we all know that Leviathans are still out there and eager to help galactic Civilization.

. First of all the Leviathans are not eager to help anybody but themselves.  They are selfish, isolationis, and narcissistic, my first act post war will be to thouroughly glass their entire planet.

Second of all, it is supported in game.  Geth, EDI, relays, Reapers.  What do they all have in common?  Reaper coding. Destroy wipes it out, I'm guessing this would extend to their indoctrination capabilities because indoctrination requires energy to work and if the Reaper is inert than the indoctrination will not happen.

[Seival]

Zazzerka wrote...

You call Sovereign Nazara? You're just too hipster for words.

I like Nazara name more. Why did Sovereign introduce itself to the Geth differently? Who knows...

[AresKeith]

Its pointless trying to talk to someone like Seival

[robertthebard]

Seival wrote...

I remember all your points well enough. And you are refusing to agree that dead Reapers (and even small pieces of them) are the real threat even after I gave video proof of that directly from the game.

I see no point in arguing with you anymore. I can only suggest you to replay the whole trilogy with all DLCs to refresh you memories about the story.

So show me this irrefutable proof, instead of a video of people using common sense when dealing with alien components that nothing are known about.  As I said before, and you were obviously afraid to go back and see, shielding unknown artifacts is wise.  Even if they are harmless, if there is a potential for danger, it is better to exercise caution.  All indoctrination in Leviathan was done by Leviathan, through the artifact.  There is one in the office when we first arrive, sitting in the same place it is when we allow Ann Bryson to get "possessed" by it.  All you have provided is a video showing that Dr. Bryson had a piece of Sovereign.  I already knew that.  So flip me a video of somebody being indoctrinated in Bryon's lab by the piece of Sovereign before you claim that I am too stupid for you to argue with.  Because w/out that, all you are doing is making yourself into the worst kind of troll.

[Seival]

Steelcan wrote...

Seival wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

@Seival, Destroy destroys Reaper technology. I'm guessing any material formerly capable of indoctrination would be inert because its completely wiped by the Destroy beam.

Unlike dead Reaper threat, your assumption doesn't have any in-game proof. Destroy slides prove nothing, because we all know that Leviathans are still out there and eager to help galactic Civilization.

. First of all the Leviathans are not eager to help anybody but themselves.  They are selfish, isolationis, and narcissistic, my first act post war will be to thouroughly glass their entire planet.

Second of all, it is supported in game.  Geth, EDI, relays, Reapers.  What do they all have in common?  Reaper coding. Destroy wipes it out, I'm guessing this would extend to their indoctrination capabilities because indoctrination requires energy to work and if the Reaper is inert than the indoctrination will not happen.

The whole Catalyst thing was about helping lesser creatures. If Leviathans didn't care they would leave lesser beings alone with their own problems. Leviathans depend on lesser beings somehow, or they just care about them.

Reaper coding has nothing to do with indoctrination capabilities. I already linked the video where you can see a small piece of Reaper that had to be shielded to avoid indoctrination. That means indoctrination doesn't require any power sources. It's like radiation. But without power sources and a mind behind that radiation it will be chaotic. People will just become insane instead of following master's orders. 

That is post-Destroy reality. Only Leviathans can help. And according to the slides they did. Lesser beings themselves are incapable of reconstructing the Citadel and Mass Relays.

Modifié par Seival, 28 avril 2013 - 05:50 .

[GreyLycanTrope]

Zazzerka wrote...

You call Sovereign Nazara? You're just too hipster for words.

Nazara's just easier to spell, tbh.

[Steelcan]

Seival wrote...

The whole Catalyst thing was about helping lesser creatures. If Leviathans didn't care they would leave lesser beings alone with their own problems. Leviathans depend on lesser beings somehow, or they just care about them.

Reaper coding has nothing to do with indoctrination capabilities. I already linked the video where you can see a small piece of Reaper that had to be shielded to avoid indoctrination. That means indoctrination doesn't require any power sources. It's like radiation. But without power sources and a mind behind that radiation it will be chaotic. People will just become insane instead of following master's orders.

And that is post-Destroy reality. Only Leviathans can help. And according to the slides they did. Lesser beings themselves are incapable of reconstructing the Citadel and Mass Relays.

1.  The Catalyst was made to ensure that the sewer races remained enslaved to the Leviathans, "tribute does not flow from a dead race".  This is blatently stated by the Leviathans themselves.

2.  There could have been indoctrination boosters in that piece, throughout the entire superstructure, bu these could have been deactivated by Destroy.  Indoctrination works through signals which have to be broadcasted, which requires energy.  Without energy to power it's broadcast it won't be there.  

3.  The races of the galaxy built the Crucible, I think they can repair the relays and Citadel.  

[MassivelyEffective0730]

I wonder what game Seival played.

It certainly wasn't Mass Effect 3. I don't even think he knows anything about Mass Effect beyond what he makes up about it.

[Seival]

Steelcan wrote...

Seival wrote...

The whole Catalyst thing was about helping lesser creatures. If Leviathans didn't care they would leave lesser beings alone with their own problems. Leviathans depend on lesser beings somehow, or they just care about them.

Reaper coding has nothing to do with indoctrination capabilities. I already linked the video where you can see a small piece of Reaper that had to be shielded to avoid indoctrination. That means indoctrination doesn't require any power sources. It's like radiation. But without power sources and a mind behind that radiation it will be chaotic. People will just become insane instead of following master's orders.

And that is post-Destroy reality. Only Leviathans can help. And according to the slides they did. Lesser beings themselves are incapable of reconstructing the Citadel and Mass Relays.

1.  The Catalyst was made to ensure that the sewer races remained enslaved to the Leviathans, "tribute does not flow from a dead race".  This is blatently stated by the Leviathans themselves.

2.  There could have been indoctrination boosters in that piece, throughout the entire superstructure, bu these could have been deactivated by Destroy.  Indoctrination works through signals which have to be broadcasted, which requires energy.  Without energy to power it's broadcast it won't be there.  

3.  The races of the galaxy built the Crucible, I think they can repair the relays and Citadel.  

(1) Yes. And that proves that Leviathans care about lesser races. Reason for that care doesn't matter.

(2) And radiation doesn't always require power sources. You can't prove that piece has any devices inside it. They refere to it as to a "piece of Reaper" for the reason.

(3) They built the Crucible that was designed to be simple in construction. And the Crucible obviously wasn't designed by lesser beings. You can't invent something with unknown purpose. Or you believe that "let's invent something... I don't know what that thing will do, but let's invent it" is sane way of thinking? Most likely Crucible was Leviathans' work. They constructed the very first one using thralls. After that they made sure the design will come from one Cycle to another... Yes, Leviathan clearly lied about the Crucible - the way it responded proves that.

[Wynterdust]

Got the emotion part from a quote. (Quoting from 3 pages ago, curse XbL IE.)
You said that everyone is closer in mind. How? Can people suddenly see what everyone thinks and feels and become "one"? That is killing everyones individuality and a huge part of what makes us alive. You also mentioned unneeded emotions (probably where I got it from) which is basically everyone should be tranquil, killing the other part of what makes us alive. In essence we're turning into machines.
The only other way to make everyone closer is by altering peoples minds to adhere to the same code which is an abhorrent violation of peoples free will and in essence is forcing someone to follow your viewpoint. It is where the term mind rape comes into play.

[Steelcan]

Seival wrote...
(1) Yes. And that proves that Leviathans care about lesser races. Reason for that care doesn't matter.

(2) And radiation doesn't always require power sources. You can't prove that piece has any devices inside it. They refere to it as to a "piece of Reaper" for the reason.

(3) They built the Crucible that was designed to be simple in construction. And the Crucible obviously wasn't designed by lesser beings. You can't invent something with unknown purpose. Or you believe that "let's invent something... I don't know what that thing will do, but let's invent it" is sane way of thinking? Most likely Crucible was Leviathans' work. They constructed the very first one using thralls. After that they made sure the design will come from one Cycle to another... Yes, Leviathan clearly lied about the Crucible - the way it responded proves that.

.
1.  That isn't care, that ps manipulation.

2.  Indoctrination isn't radiatuion, it's a signal with a source, more akin to wifi.

3.  So because your head canon says so?  That's not an argument.

[Seival]

Steelcan wrote...

Seival wrote...
(1) Yes. And that proves that Leviathans care about lesser races. Reason for that care doesn't matter.

(2) And radiation doesn't always require power sources. You can't prove that piece has any devices inside it. They refere to it as to a "piece of Reaper" for the reason.

(3) They built the Crucible that was designed to be simple in construction. And the Crucible obviously wasn't designed by lesser beings. You can't invent something with unknown purpose. Or you believe that "let's invent something... I don't know what that thing will do, but let's invent it" is sane way of thinking? Most likely Crucible was Leviathans' work. They constructed the very first one using thralls. After that they made sure the design will come from one Cycle to another... Yes, Leviathan clearly lied about the Crucible - the way it responded proves that.

.
1.  That isn't care, that ps manipulation.

2.  Indoctrination isn't radiatuion, it's a signal with a source, more akin to wifi.

3.  So because your head canon says so?  That's not an argument.

(1) Call it whatever you want. Leviathans have desire to influence the galaxy and all lesser beings inside it. Leviathans will not stay inactive after Destroy. And they have reasons to help galactic civilization, even if the main point of that is to help themselves.

(2) Reaper piece from Leviathan DLC proves your wrong.

(3) Where is "headcanon" in stating that you can't invent something without purpose? You know how a device works and what exactly it will do if you really invented it. It's just a simple logic. Show me at least one lesser being who knew how the Crucible works and what exactly it will going to do.

[Steelcan]

Seival wrote...


(1) Call it whatever you want. Leviathans have desire to influence the galaxy and all lesser beings inside it. Leviathans will not stay inactive after Destroy. And they have reasons to help galactic civilization, even if the main point of that is to help themselves.

(2) Reaper piece from Leviathan DLC proves your wrong.

(3) Where is "headcanon" in stating that you can't invent something without purpose? You know how a device works and what exactly it will do if you really invented it. It's just a simple logic. Show me at least one lesser being who knew how the Crucible works and what exactly it will going to do.

1.  They will stay inactive after I've hunted them down and killed them all.  I can use sad canon as well.

2.  Is it really unbelievable that the Reapers are completely covered in indoctrination boosters?  Besides for all  we know the shielding might have been unnecessary 

3.  Hackett, Liara, and the scientist on the Crucible all knew that it would be able to generate energy to destroy the Reapers.  Tey even know that the Catalyst (Citadel, not star brat) is necessary in order for it to work.  They didnt know it would affect the relays and EDI as well, but they got the just of it.

[Steelcan]

Good lord Seival you sound like an ITer.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

tickle267 wrote...

Seival wrote...

(1) Call it whatever you want. Leviathans have desire to influence the galaxy and all lesser beings inside it. Leviathans will not stay inactive after Destroy. And they have reasons to help galactic civilization, even if the main point of that is to help themselves.

(2) Reaper piece from Leviathan DLC proves your wrong.

(3) Where is "headcanon" in stating that you can't invent something without purpose? You know how a device works and what exactly it will do if you really invented it. It's just a simple logic. Show me at least one lesser being who knew how the Crucible works and what exactly it will going to do.

2.what reaper piece?

Exactly. Seival is making it up. He always makes his crap up and passes it off as canon, lore, and, most insultingly, actual science.

[Samtheman63]

Seival wrote...

...Also, let's not forget one obvious thing: there are only two main choices in the end - apply Synthesis now, or delay it for some time by different means.

[Seival]

Wynterdust wrote...

Got the emotion part from a quote. (Quoting from 3 pages ago, curse XbL IE.)
You said that everyone is closer in mind. How? Can people suddenly see what everyone thinks and feels and become "one"? That is killing everyones individuality and a huge part of what makes us alive. You also mentioned unneeded emotions (probably where I got it from) which is basically everyone should be tranquil, killing the other part of what makes us alive. In essence we're turning into machines.
The only other way to make everyone closer is by altering peoples minds to adhere to the same code which is an abhorrent violation of peoples free will and in essence is forcing someone to follow your viewpoint. It is where the term mind rape comes into play.

I only mentioned unneeded emotions while talking to other players, who were too emotional about Shepard's death and didn't like the ending concept in general. That was a suggestion to calm down and think carefully.

Becoming closer mentally doesn't mean ability of reading the mind. It means understanding of other beings' ways of thinking, because that way of thinking is not alien to you anymore.

[Steelcan]

Samtheman63 wrote...

Seival wrote...

...Also, let's not forget one obvious thing: there are only two main choices in the end - apply Synthesis now, or delay it for some time by different means.

. Because apparently Destroy is really only waiting for Synthesis to happen.  It can't possibly be saying, we don't need it.

[Seival]

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

tickle267 wrote...

Seival wrote...

(1) Call it whatever you want. Leviathans have desire to influence the galaxy and all lesser beings inside it. Leviathans will not stay inactive after Destroy. And they have reasons to help galactic civilization, even if the main point of that is to help themselves.

(2) Reaper piece from Leviathan DLC proves your wrong.

(3) Where is "headcanon" in stating that you can't invent something without purpose? You know how a device works and what exactly it will do if you really invented it. It's just a simple logic. Show me at least one lesser being who knew how the Crucible works and what exactly it will going to do.

2.what reaper piece?

Exactly. Seival is making it up. He always makes his crap up and passes it off as canon, lore, and, most insultingly, actual science.

Do you even read my replies?

Seival wrote...

You are completely ignore the fact that even Reaper wrack without any power sources still can influence minds. Watch and listen carefully, please:


That was just a small piece of Nazara. A piece of armor or a part of some device. Who knows?
You are trying to argue without knowing the whole story.
Millions of dead Reapers are threat that only Leviathans can deal with.

[Yestare7]

Seival wrote...

...Also, let's not forget one obvious thing: there are only two main choices in the end - apply Synthesis now, or delay it for some time by different means.

This is definately deserving of a waffle, enjoy!!

[Argolas]

Don't worry, there is no need for Synthesis. We have husks who can make waffles just as well.