115 réponses à ce sujet

[Wulfram]

ThinkSharp wrote...

Why so serious?

It's just a feel good scene, nothing more and nothing less.

It breaks the fourth wall. Emphasizes the "epic" feel of the game.

If it serves any functional purpose, it's to link all of your ME playthroughs--"one more story"--which isn't a necessary thing at all.

But geesh. Why nitpick it to death? It's clearly not meant to be overanalyzed. Why not just enjoy it for what it is?

Because we're extremely short on information about what the future of the ME universe is.  And we were even more so prior to the EC.

And once you've thought about it a bit, the feel good bit of it kind of vanishes.  Implied collapse of civilisation doesn't make me feel good.

[AlanC9]

KaiserShep wrote...

Eh, that was just FUD the Starkid was spewing anyway. No way it could predict any of this with 100% certainty 

Not really FUD.  He believes it. Either the synthetics revolt, etc. or his whole theory's wrong. And he doesn't believe his whole theory is wrong.

[Ticonderoga117]

Wulfram wrote...

ThinkSharp wrote...

Why so serious?

It's just a feel good scene, nothing more and nothing less.

It breaks the fourth wall. Emphasizes the "epic" feel of the game.

If it serves any functional purpose, it's to link all of your ME playthroughs--"one more story"--which isn't a necessary thing at all.

But geesh. Why nitpick it to death? It's clearly not meant to be overanalyzed. Why not just enjoy it for what it is?

Because we're extremely short on information about what the future of the ME universe is.  And we were even more so prior to the EC.

And once you've thought about it a bit, the feel good bit of it kind of vanishes.  Implied collapse of civilisation doesn't make me feel good.

But hey! They might go back to space... someday!

BioWare's idea of hope people.

[kalasaurus]

It's a relic of the vanilla ending when the galaxy was brought into a dark age.

[Peranor]

With the EC the Stargazer scene is even more ridiculous.

[Kelgair]

Ahh this forum, a place where people will admit they don't understand the message behind having a man who walked on the face of the moon talk about going to the stars to explore and imagining the wonders and possibilities to be found out there.

Take a bow.

[M74]

BioWare/EA was paying A LOT of dough to Buzz Aldrin.
After that, Buzz was all over the moon.
Tell me another story about this Shepard....
alright then...
This scene doesn't make ANY sense whatsoever apart from a marketing aspect that we are reminded about the fake moon landing(s).

[ThinkSharp]

Wulfram wrote...

ThinkSharp wrote...

Why so serious?

It's just a feel good scene, nothing more and nothing less.

It breaks the fourth wall. Emphasizes the "epic" feel of the game.

If it serves any functional purpose, it's to link all of your ME playthroughs--"one more story"--which isn't a necessary thing at all.

But geesh. Why nitpick it to death? It's clearly not meant to be overanalyzed. Why not just enjoy it for what it is?

Because we're extremely short on information about what the future of the ME universe is.  And we were even more so prior to the EC.

And once you've thought about it a bit, the feel good bit of it kind of vanishes.  Implied collapse of civilisation doesn't make me feel good.

OK. Fair enough. I suppose I am more optimistic. I took the destruction of the mass relays as significantly changing civilization, not causing it to collapse entirely. But I'm aware of the speculation about stranded species going extinct and all that, and that's a gap in knowledge that can't be denied. I also can't fault anyone for wanting more information about what happened to the universe, especially pre-EC.

But I suppose my main point is that the stargazer scene is removed from the proper narrative. It's clearly meant to be a fourth-wall-breaking scene that pulls us out of the game rather than a concluding explanation still within it. if you think it's entirely out of place and unnecessary, that's one thing. But I still think it's futile to tear it apart for not being more than it was ever intended to be.

Modifié par ThinkSharp, 26 avril 2013 - 11:41 .

[dreamgazer]

Kelgair wrote...

Ahh this forum, a place where people will admit they don't understand the message behind having a man who walked on the face of the moon talk about going to the stars to explore and imagining the wonders and possibilities to be found out there.

Take a bow.

You'd be surprised how many people do, in fact, comprehend this and still find the execution lacking.

[N7PT]

It's horribly done, unfitting, makes no sense and it should be completely eliminated from existence.

Modifié par N7PT, 26 avril 2013 - 11:46 .

[Kelgair]

dreamgazer wrote...

Kelgair wrote...

Ahh this forum, a place where people will admit they don't understand the message behind having a man who walked on the face of the moon talk about going to the stars to explore and imagining the wonders and possibilities to be found out there.

Take a bow.

You'd be surprised how many people do, in fact, comprehend this and still find the execution lacking.

What more could you possibly want from a scene like that? How would you do it better?

[Voodoo2015]

"Shh shh shh shh shh" THEY are listening!

Modifié par Voodoo2015, 26 avril 2013 - 11:46 .

[dreamgazer]

Kelgair wrote...

What more could you possibly want from a scene like that? How would you do it better?

Simple: I wouldn't. It's unnecessary, unless it's set up like a framing device similar to Cloud Atlas (and even then it's not terribly effective). They could find other ways to reassure the audience that everything's going to eventually turn up okay in the future.

[themikefest]

I would like to hear the version of the man/woman who told the story to the stargazer. I'm sure its quite different from what stargazer told the child.

I would like to know who told the oringinal story with no one knowing what happened on the Citadel except Shepard if high ems destroy was chosen.. TIM and Anderson are dead.

[GreyLycanTrope]

dreamgazer wrote...

Kelgair wrote...

What more could you possibly want from a scene like that? How would you do it better?

Simple: I wouldn't. It's unnecessary, unless it's set up like a framing device similar to Cloud Atlas (and even then it's not terribly effective). They could find other ways to reassure the audience that everything's going to eventually turn up okay in the future.

I'd just add that the message would have had much more impact if we actually spent some time exploring in ME3. The wonders of the star fall a bit flacid when you spent the last few hour hopping form battle to battle. "These people barely survived an onslaught of killer machines by making monumental sacrifices, ain't the stars grand?"

[CaIIisto]

At least with the refusal ending stargazer scene it's confirmed that Shepard's actions throughout the trilogy weren't all for naught, and eventually delivered a victory against the Reapers in the following cycle.

[ThinkSharp]

themikefest wrote...

I would like to hear the version of the man/woman who told the story to the stargazer. I'm sure its quite different from what stargazer told the child.

I would like to know who told the oringinal story with no one knowing what happened on the Citadel except Shepard if high ems destroy was chosen.. TIM and Anderson are dead.

You've solved the problem of the last five minutes: it's so disconnected because it had to be entirely made up by a fanciful old man.


^Joke.

Modifié par ThinkSharp, 27 avril 2013 - 12:14 .

[CaIIisto]

Like it - Starbrat is just a figment of old father time's imagination. Daft old b@$t@rd.....

[GreyLycanTrope]

ThinkSharp wrote...
You've solved the problem of the last five minutes: it's so disconnected because it had to be entirely made up by a fanciful old man.

^Joke.

Is it?

[spirosz]

Wulfram wrote...

ThinkSharp wrote...

Why so serious?

It's just a feel good scene, nothing more and nothing less.

It breaks the fourth wall. Emphasizes the "epic" feel of the game.

If it serves any functional purpose, it's to link all of your ME playthroughs--"one more story"--which isn't a necessary thing at all.

But geesh. Why nitpick it to death? It's clearly not meant to be overanalyzed. Why not just enjoy it for what it is?

Because we're extremely short on information about what the future of the ME universe is.  And we were even more so prior to the EC.

And once you've thought about it a bit, the feel good bit of it kind of vanishes.  Implied collapse of civilisation doesn't make me feel good.

I think it would help if they weren't making a new ME game.  Especially since we don't know when it will take place, if there was none, it would be easier to handcannon that scene and the future of Mass Effect itself.

[Kelgair]

dreamgazer wrote...

Kelgair wrote...

What more could you possibly want from a scene like that? How would you do it better?

Simple: I wouldn't. It's unnecessary, unless it's set up like a framing device similar to Cloud Atlas (and even then it's not terribly effective). They could find other ways to reassure the audience that everything's going to eventually turn up okay in the future.

That's not a desire for a better execution that's a desire for the scene to not even be there. Which is probably what you should've said to begin with then.  As ThinkSharp points out, it's more a message to the player themselves about space and exploration, not exposition on the state of the galaxy. I thought I implied that a bit myself. If you want to limit it to context within the game fine, it might lose a bit of it's purpose then. But I never got that vibe from the scene, especially since it's in the context of a grandfather telling a story to a grandchild.

Greylycantrope wrote...

I'd just add that the message
would have had much more impact if we actually spent some time exploring
in ME3. The wonders of the star fall a bit flacid when you spent the
last few hour hopping form battle to battle. "These people barely
survived an onslaught of killer machines by making monumental
sacrifices, ain't the stars grand?"

We'll have to agree to disagree on that I suppose. If you've only played ME3 you visit some fantastical places, even if you're fighting through most of them. And if you played the first two the exploration is manifold greater. My thoughts are more in the "Man space is awesome, would be nice not to have an eldritch horror waiting for us though." line.

Modifié par Kelgair, 27 avril 2013 - 01:20 .

[Eterna]

 I always liked this guys view on it:

I’m happy that we got new content, of course. More cut scenes, more dialogue, more Mass Effect. I’d be crazy to complain about that.But I do think it distracts from the Stargazer scene, which I personally loved.

The Stargazer is voiced by Buzz Aldrin, one of the first humans to land on the moon in 1969. He’s a hero to space nerds, and his casting as the Stargazer, as well as his dialogue, is a huge treat, as well as a subtle breaking of the fourth wall, which I’ll explain:

Child: “When can I go to the stars?
”Stargazer: “One day, my sweet.”
Child: “What will be there?
”Stargazer: “Anything you can imagine. Our galaxy has billions of stars. Each of those stars could have many worlds. Every world could be home to a different form of life. And every life is a special story of its own.”

This may seem tangential, but did you know that NASA’s annual budget, at $19 billion, is just 0.5% of the US federal budget? That’s enough to land rovers on Mars and to find hundreds of extrasolar planets, many of which might harbor life. Yet despite these huge successes, funding is being cut more and more.We’re in a situation right now where in many countries like Canada, the UK and the US, science funding — especially in the so-called “STEM” (science, technology, engineering, mathematics) fields — are diminishing faster than can be justified by the ailing economy.

Space exploration and science in general needs as much encouragement as it can get right now, and surely, that’s why Buzz agreed to this role, and why Bioware chose such a relatively obscure public figure over someone who might have been more popular or a better actor.

The Stargazer scene is terse, but it’s important. It ties one of the themes of the Mass Effect series — scientific and civilizational progress — to the real world here in 2012. It makes the ending uplifting in a very real way, and attempts to give Mass Effect social significance, as unsuccessful as it might sadly have been at that. But I think it was a really good attempt at something worthwhile that most game studios don’t have the balls to do.

Modifié par Eterna5, 27 avril 2013 - 01:45 .

[dreamgazer]

Kelgair wrote...

That's not a desire for a better execution that's a desire for the scene to not even be there. Which is probably what you should've said to begin with then.  As ThinkSharp points out, it's more a message to the player themselves about space and exploration, not exposition on the state of the galaxy. I thought I implied that a bit myself. If you want to limit it to context within the game fine, it might lose a bit of it's purpose then. But I never got that vibe from the scene, especially since it's in the context of a grandfather telling a story to a grandchild.

Sure, I understand that it has a meta context itself (and I think that might be why they used a familiar space-forest design as the template for the backdrop), but it's riding on the coattails of a three-pronged decision that taps into philosophical feelings in regards to the universe---and whether you made the right choice. In the original ending, after dizzying and surreal exposition, it could provide an anchor for interpretation where so much was left completely up in the air. The EC gave the scene room to breathe, but you're still left with longevity and the future in mind.

The scene reminds the audience that there's a vast universe to explore in their real lives, and that this exploration could happen in the near future, but I think those watching are more concerned with the outcome of the universe that they just directly altered to embrace that connotation.

[christrek1982]

ok there are two way you can look this

1 It brakes the 4th wall and it is buzz telling us that at some point in the future we will go to the stars with a sneaky add for DLC this make it meaningless within the context of the ME story.

2 this is a glinps of hope and show us that life goes on I understand and kind of like what the team are trying to do with this but it would of had a far better impact on me at least if I hadn't just seen my Shepard commit suicide because some glowing child told her to.

[In Exile]

mass perfection wrote...
They appear to be as advanced as modern day humanity (not being able to travel to the stars) and still know about the Reaper War and Shepard?

Before they fixed things with the EC, all of galactic society was supposed to collapse. That was probably whatever magic world the Normandy crashed landed on.