157 réponses à ce sujet

[Brovikk Rasputin]

AresKeith wrote...

Brovikk Rasputin wrote...

Well.. Yea?!

And that's not all Boss Battles in a nutshell

Yes it is. 

[AresKeith]

Brovikk Rasputin wrote...

AresKeith wrote...

Brovikk Rasputin wrote...

Well.. Yea?!

And that's not all Boss Battles in a nutshell

Yes it is. 

Says who? You?

[Mr.House]

AresKeith wrote...

Greylycantrope wrote...

Brovikk Rasputin wrote...

Boss battles are rarely any good. Not to mention that they almost always feels completely out of place in a story based game.

The less boss battles, the better the game is.

Dark Souls, The Witcher, Persona, the Witcher and several other games say hello. Just because bioware can't quite get a handle on them doesn't mean good ones don't exist.

Bioware's best and most well done boss battle is Tela Vasir in LotSB, so its definitely possible for a good one in ME3

Nope, that title belongs to the clone

Anyways, it's clear Brovikk has not played  BG2 which had great boss designs. Bioware can do it, They proved that with LOTSB and Citadel. That is because these boss fights where not made just for the sake of them being a boss fight(Frog Saren and T-800 I'm looknig at you)

[Mr.House]

Brovikk Rasputin wrote...

AresKeith wrote...

Brovikk Rasputin wrote...

Well.. Yea?!

And that's not all Boss Battles in a nutshell

Yes it is. 

OMG, please play a Legend of Zelda or Metroid game before you bring up nonsense.

Modifié par Mr.House, 28 avril 2013 - 08:17 .

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

David7204 wrote...

The quarians and geth can certainly play a big role, but in general, no. This is a story about Shepard. Shepard is the protagonist. Not the quarians. Shepard needs to be one defeating the Reapers. If the quarians do all the work, the story needs to be about the quarians. Not about Shepard, and not about all the other races and themes Shepard encounters.

War Assets. Weapons development. Dead reaper on Rannoch. Xen already developed a weapon to work against Geth. Now using parts from the dead reaper modify it to work against Reapers and equip the ships. But still you need Shepard. Shepard is the protagonist, but Shepard cannot do it alone. The theme is about how unity defeats overwhelming odds. Without Shepard there is no unity. Shepard cannot defeat the Reapers by his/herself. That's up to the fleets. There is still The Illusive Man w/ Cerberus who want to control the reapers for the purpose of human dominance ("Cerberus and Humanity are one in the same." - and you've seen what that looks like) and The Intelligence itself to defeat. These are Shepard's jobs.

This is going to mean finding the Intelligence in the Citadel and delivering a nuke (a 10 - 20 KT briefcase nuke should do the job). Same conditions as I listed before. If you can't execute TIM one of your squad will (hierarchy: VS, Jack, Garrus..., Liara), unless you give the order to let him go ("I'm detonating a nuke here. You've got 10 minutes to get to safety. If I were you I'd start running."). If you let TIM go EDI will remain with the bomb (logical choice -- body can be replaced) in High EMS. Otherwise see hierarchy for the rest. Shepard survives High EMS only.

But again it doesn't matter because it's not going to happen anyway.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

AresKeith wrote...

Brovikk Rasputin wrote...

Worst part of the entire Shadow Broker DLC. You pretty much do the same boring thing for five minutes straight. Bossbattles in a nutshell.

All your opinion and subjective

Vasir was easy. Did anyone bother to max out Liara's stasis? As soon as Vasir appeared I had Liara put her in Stasis, took out the drones, and the engineers, Liara took out the others, then waited for the stasis to drop, and stood directly over her and shot her until she started to recover, then had Liara put her right back in stasis. I had Miranda with her maxed out overload taking out the shields on everything, too. Vasir couldn't go back to the roof. Took out the next wave. Then rounded up some thermal clips, and shot her again. Did the stasis thing. Dead Vasir. This was on insane with an infiltrator Shepard (Widow + Tempest + Cain)

[dreamgazer]

Boss battles can be great.

A Harbinger boss battle would be ridiculous.

The TIM battle had the potential to be "better" than taking on King Reaper, but BioWare's concepts really did appear to be damn silly.

[Aaleel]

A human vs. Capital ship reaper boss fight would have been terrible, and completely unbelievable with the human winning. Shepard didn't even defeat the reaper on Rannoch the combined arsenal of the fleet did, all Shepard did was target.

[Reptilian Rob]

dreamgazer wrote...

Boss battles can be great.

A Harbinger boss battle would be ridiculous.

The TIM battle had the potential to be "better" than taking on King Reaper, but BioWare's concepts really did appear to be damn silly.

Agreed. 

The only way to actually do a Harbinger boss battle was with a ****ty QTE. 

[AresKeith]

Reptilian Rob wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Boss battles can be great.

A Harbinger boss battle would be ridiculous.

The TIM battle had the potential to be "better" than taking on King Reaper, but BioWare's concepts really did appear to be damn silly.

Agreed. 

The only way to actually do a Harbinger boss battle was with a ****ty QTE. 

Or they make it like the Derelict Reaper mission in ME2

[AlanC9]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

I can't tell the serious proposals from the parodies anymore.

The use of the "unflinching walk" trope, and the fact I said this was an example of a badly done boss fight two posts later should indicate it was a parody. Sometimes parodies are fun to write out. I thought the use of the knives to climb up the exterior of Harbinger was quite ridiculous yet I've seen stuff like that done in action movies that are parodies of action movies. The fact that a small amount of explosive could blow a reaper apart with a Michael Bay explosion absolutely requires the unflinching walk and the lighting of the cigar. Oh crap. I forgot the sunglasses.

Yep. This is me having a problem, not you underdoing it.

[chemiclord]

SpamBot2000 wrote...

Goddamn it, Ray Muzyka, the boss of those developers, did indeed use that as defense, and everything the developers have stated since has been based on that. Like you damn well know. It's been what, a week since I last posted the actual quote as a reply for you parroting the lie that they haven't.

Talk about tedious. Here we go, again:

"I believe passionately that games are an art form, and that the power of our medium flows from our audience, who are deeply involved in how the story unfolds, and who have the uncontested right to provide constructive criticism. At the same time, I also believe in and support the artistic choices made by the development team.  The team and I have been thinking hard about how to best address the comments on ME3’s endings from players, while still maintaining the artistic integrity of the game."

blog.bioware.com/2012/03/21/4108/

What more is it going to take for your superior intelligence to grasp that? A papier mache model?

Yep.  Here we go again... with the intentional twisting of words to mean an insult to their fans and thus justify fan rage.

Muzyka is defending his writer's right to not change the story if they don't want to.  If they don't want to rewrite it, he's not going to tell them to do so because a group of fans are incensed about it.

That's ALL that statement is saying.  Attempting to add any further implication to that statement is being intentionally disingenous for the sake of being insulted.

[AlanC9]

Mr.House wrote...


Anyways, it's clear Brovikk has not played  BG2 which had great boss designs. Bioware can do it, They proved that with LOTSB and Citadel. That is because these boss fights where not made just for the sake of them being a boss fight(Frog Saren and T-800 I'm looknig at you)

The AD&D rule system might have something to do with that.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Aaleel wrote...

A human vs. Capital ship reaper boss fight would have been terrible, and completely unbelievable with the human winning. Shepard didn't even defeat the reaper on Rannoch the combined arsenal of the fleet did, all Shepard did was target.

You forgot it's grandpa telling the child a story. I think my iteration of the Shepard vs. Harbinger Final Boss Fight would be perfect for that. ...

"All that really happened?"

"Yes, indeed it did. Harbinger was the leader of all the Reapers. When Commander Shepard destroyed Harbinger, the Reapers could no longer stand up to the United Galactic Fleet. Commander Shepard was soon promoted to Admiral Shepard and led the United Fleet to victory."

"And that's why we have peace today?"

"Yes, my sweet. Without The Shepard, neither you nor I would be here."

"Tell me another story about The Shepard."

"It's getting late, but okay. One more story."

..........

Commander Shepard has become a legend. Buy DLC.

[Mr.House]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Aaleel wrote...

A human vs. Capital ship reaper boss fight would have been terrible, and completely unbelievable with the human winning. Shepard didn't even defeat the reaper on Rannoch the combined arsenal of the fleet did, all Shepard did was target.

You forgot it's grandpa telling the child a story. I think my iteration of the Shepard vs. Harbinger Final Boss Fight would be perfect for that. ...

"All that really happened?"

"Yes, indeed it did. Harbinger was the leader of all the Reapers. When Commander Shepard destroyed Harbinger, the Reapers could no longer stand up to the United Galactic Fleet. Commander Shepard was soon promoted to Admiral Shepard and led the United Fleet to victory."

"And that's why we have peace today?"

"Yes, my sweet. Without The Shepard, neither you nor I would be here."

"Tell me another story about The Shepard."

"It's getting late, but okay. One more story."

..........

Commander Shepard has become a legend. Buy DLC.

Epic win.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

chemiclord wrote...

SpamBot2000 wrote...

Goddamn it, Ray Muzyka, the boss of those developers, did indeed use that as defense, and everything the developers have stated since has been based on that. Like you damn well know. It's been what, a week since I last posted the actual quote as a reply for you parroting the lie that they haven't.

Talk about tedious. Here we go, again:

"I believe passionately that games are an art form, and that the power of our medium flows from our audience, who are deeply involved in how the story unfolds, and who have the uncontested right to provide constructive criticism. At the same time, I also believe in and support the artistic choices made by the development team.  The team and I have been thinking hard about how to best address the comments on ME3’s endings from players, while still maintaining the artistic integrity of the game."

blog.bioware.com/2012/03/21/4108/

What more is it going to take for your superior intelligence to grasp that? A papier mache model?

Yep.  Here we go again... with the intentional twisting of words to mean an insult to their fans and thus justify fan rage.

Muzyka is defending his writer's right to not change the story if they don't want to.  If they don't want to rewrite it, he's not going to tell them to do so because a group of fans are incensed about it.

That's ALL that statement is saying.  Attempting to add any further implication to that statement is being intentionally disingenous for the sake of being insulted.

Muzyka also thought the original ending was fun. That is on a video on Youtube. He was directly answering a question at a conference. It is not taken out of context. You can watch the entire presentation if you wish. I don't have the link.

When I saw that I couldn't believe it. How miserable must one's life be to think that was fun?

[webhead921]

It would have been really cool to engage in a final battle with the Illusive man, while also giving commands to the Normandy/fleet, like at the end of Mass Effect 1, where we got to choose whether to save the Destiny Ascension while also having a final boss battle with Saren.

[chemiclord]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Muzyka also thought the original ending was fun. That is on a video on Youtube. He was directly answering a question at a conference. It is not taken out of context. You can watch the entire presentation if you wish. I don't have the link.

When I saw that I couldn't believe it. How miserable must one's life be to think that was fun?

Whether he thought the ending was fun or not is irrelevant to the context of that blog post.  Would he have demanded they change it if he didn't think it was fun?  Who knows?  That's conjecture not in evidence... which is the entire thrust of my argument; of people intentionally misrepresenting what has been said to justify their rage.  It's intellectually dishonest.

Modifié par chemiclord, 28 avril 2013 - 09:36 .

[Reptilian Rob]

AresKeith wrote...

Reptilian Rob wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Boss battles can be great.

A Harbinger boss battle would be ridiculous.

The TIM battle had the potential to be "better" than taking on King Reaper, but BioWare's concepts really did appear to be damn silly.

Agreed. 

The only way to actually do a Harbinger boss battle was with a ****ty QTE. 

Or they make it like the Derelict Reaper mission in ME2

Think about that for a minute...Inside Harbinger...In Atmoshpere...

Being thrown against the walls at 600+MPH would be so cool...

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

chemiclord wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Muzyka also thought the original ending was fun. That is on a video on Youtube. He was directly answering a question at a conference. It is not taken out of context. You can watch the entire presentation if you wish. I don't have the link.

When I saw that I couldn't believe it. How miserable must one's life be to think that was fun?

Whether he thought the ending was fun or not is irrelevant to the context of that blog post.  Would he have demanded they change it if he didn't think it was fun?  Who knows?  That's conjecture not in evidence... which is the entire thrust of my argument; of people intentionally misrepresenting what has been said to justify their rage.  It's intellectually dishonest.

I watched his entire presentation in that video. It was not edited. I understand what you're saying. My feelings were 'how the mighty have fallen.' Well maybe it was time for the doctors to move on. They did. If the passion is no longer there, it's time. He said that the passion was gone and that's why he was leaving to do some other kind of work.

Fun is relative. Compared to making a life decision maybe it was fun? Not my place.

[SpamBot2000]

chemiclord wrote...

Yep.  Here we go again... with the intentional twisting of words to mean an insult to their fans and thus justify fan rage.

Muzyka is defending his writer's right to not change the story if they don't want to.  If they don't want to rewrite it, he's not going to tell them to do so because a group of fans are incensed about it.

That's ALL that statement is saying.  Attempting to add any further implication to that statement is being intentionally disingenous for the sake of being insulted.

Uh? The issue I was responding to was David claiming BioWare never defended Mass Effect 3 citing "artistic integrity", which should be pretty damn plain, like having plain vanilla on plain day on the Great Plains plain. Whether I or anyone believes this statement is "intentionally disingenuous" is irrelevant to the incontrevertible fact that it was made. There is no "twisting of words" here. The point is, this is what they did, and it is up to everyone to judge the claim's ingenuosness for themselves. 

Let's be honest, for Pete's sake. You too defend BW because you defend their artistic integrity, even though you don't find their work such a smashing success. Why would you deny your own cause?

[chemiclord]

Because he DIDN'T do so.

Muzyka is not using the phrase to defend ANYTHING. He is not saying anything about we won't change it because of "artistic integrity." THAT is where the disingenuous part comes in. You WANT him to be saying that so that you can turn him, and by extension Bioware, into an enemy; an enemy you can justifiably rage against (which you have done so MANY times with any number of conspiracy theories, I may add).

Seriously, guys and gals, you should listen to this fellow rant about how Walters INTENTIONALLY destroyed the Mass Effect video game series so that he could sell more comic books about the setting he just intentionally destroyed.  It's hilarious.

All that statement says is, "I support my team's decision to not do something they don't want to do. This is the ending they want." That you want it to say more isn't Muzkya's or Bioware's problem.

Modifié par chemiclord, 29 avril 2013 - 03:59 .

[kw0lf]

JDee3 wrote...

Come on.. can you actually imagine fighting Harbinger? Not even fleets of a bunch of different races could defeat him. It wouldn't have made sense. 

I was thinking something like a Project Overlord or Geth Server type battle ... some way to fight and destroy him from within.

Answer to OP question is simple: no time.

[AresKeith]

kw0lf wrote...

JDee3 wrote...

Come on.. can you actually imagine fighting Harbinger? Not even fleets of a bunch of different races could defeat him. It wouldn't have made sense. 

I was thinking something like a Project Overlord or Geth Server type battle ... some way to fight and destroy him from within.

Answer to OP question is simple: no time.

And the Derelict Reaper mission from ME2

[ZerebusPrime]

Yestare7 wrote...

 

Because Harbinger would win:P:P

Sad but true.  In order to do a boss fight with Harby, Harby would have to come down to our level in some way.... oh right, so all of ME2 was basically a string of Harby boss fights. Huh.