731 réponses à ce sujet

[andar91]

I'm a pro-mage player, but I've always thought there should be oversight for mages. Just not as extreme as it is currently.

[EdwinLi]

Hazegurl wrote...

I always end up picking the Templar side in DA2 as I don't need to see mages like the one in the comic to know that there are plenty of mages who do not need to be influenced by demons to think like him. Actually the fact that many choose to make deals with demons pretty much means that it isn't the influence of a demon they were driven by, but their own desire for power and their own laziness and need to take a shortcut to that power.

I hope I meet this guy in DA3 so I can shoot a lightening bolt up his ***.

What so you prefer to kill every single person born with magic becuase they are born with Magic?

Nothing has changed with or without Magic. Humanity by nature is the most destructive force in the world. Killing all mages because certain ones choose to be evil doesn't justify killing the ones who actually use their abilities for good or were never a part of the crime.

What they fear is what Humanity has always feared. Things that are not seen as Human. Anything Humanity has seen as not Human they will always assume that they are monsters and have no possible way of feeling any good emotions such as love and happiness. What they fear is not Mages being taken over by demons. It is being born with a power that not everyone can have and if Humanity cannot have that power their view will always be that those who have that power must never have freedom or a life because they are not living beings in their eyes.

That is were they are wrong. Mages are human and they are living beings. mages such as Alain are examples of Mages who are good but they choose to continue to ignore this becuase they will relly only on their fear of Mages to determine their actions. They are not monsters who are born with no good emotions. However, in the end the fear of not having what those mages have will always consume Humanity or any other race that don't have that power.

Modifié par EdwinLi, 02 mai 2013 - 07:52 .

[Hazegurl]

EdwinLi wrote...

What so you prefer to kill every single person born with magic becuase they are born with Magic?

No.

Nothing has changed with or without Magic. Humanity by nature is the most destructive force in the world. Killing all mages because certain ones choose to be evil doesn't justify killing the ones who actually use their abilities for good or were never a part of the crime.

I chose the Templars because I don't see much good from siding with either side. But I believe that Templars are more of asset to combat destructive mages, mages do far more damage to the world than regular people and therefore I would much rather kill off any blood mages before they flee into the general public.

The way I see it, let the city guard handle regular people and let the Templars handle mages.

What they fear is what Humanity has always feared. Things that are not seen as Human. Anything Humanity has seen as not Human they will always assume that they are monsters and have no possible way of feeling any good emotions such as love and happiness. What they fear is not Mages being taken over by demons. It is being born with a power that not everyone can have and if Humanity cannot have that power their view will always be that those who have that power must never have freedom or a life because they are not living beings in their eyes.

What Mages need to do is learn how to take responsiblity for their own actions and stop proving to everyone that they have a reason to fear them. Stop summoning demons because someone stole your freaking lunch money and you're too lazy to put in real work to obtain power, stop tearing open veils and ruining people's lives, stop claiming your superior just because you have powers, stop scarifcing innocent people to fuel your magic, stop helping people who scarifice others to fuel their magic. See how that works?

I just wish that people would stop treating mages like they are children and hold them accountable for their bad behavior for once. Yes everybody can do bad things, big whoop. A regular bad guy can be put down without any long lasting effects for his crime, a mage crime could be so severe it probably won't ever go away. Just look at Kirkwall. before someone brings up rich and powerful regular people, how many regular people manage to obtain such power and wealth to cause long lasting damage? Not many. How many mages can cause long lasting damage? As many that are born.

That is were they are wrong. Mages are human and they are living beings. mages such as Alain are examples of Mages who are good but they choose to continue to ignore this becuase they will relly only on their fear of Mages to determine their actions. They are not monsters who are born with no good emotions. However, in the end the fear of not having what those mages have will always consume Humanity or any other race that don't have that power.

Yes, mages are human beings, so what? They are not special victims that should be granted a free pass all because their lives stink. They can stand in the "Life stinks" line along with everyone else in Thedas. I so wonder where everyone's passion for city elves who get raped and abused everyday. I'm sure no one had much issues with killing them off during the Qunari attack, but choose to kill some mages and everyone wants to cry a river. 

[EdwinLi]

I won't continue this argument any farther because I know everyone have their own views of what is right and wrong but I will still stand by my belief that punishing those who are not responsible for the actions of those who are actually responsible is wrong.

That was what Meredith did in the end when it should not have happened when the one responsible was right in front of her.

[Fredward]

Titus' behaviour can't be generalized to all mages. Or even to all Magisters for that matter, since Mae (a Magister) is helping to defeat him.

So I'll keep preaching what I've been preaching - individuals should be punished for their actions, not the collective.

Modifié par Foopydoopydoo, 03 mai 2013 - 07:20 .

[Nalia_dArnise]

To dislike all mages because of one idiot want to play a dark-dark-dark lord? Mmm. It like... to leave Redcliff to the mercy of undead only because some man (Voughan, for example) did something bad to you.
And one important point. Mages is the main weapon of Thedosian agains the qunari. If there will be no or few mages, qunari bring all Thedas to the Qun. Because they have artillery and bad mages. People have good mages and no artillery. Without first they wouldn't have any advantage over qunari. Because mages will fight to death, siding with templars/seekers/etc. = siding with Qun. And I hate Qun.

[LobselVith8]

Hazegurl wrote...

EdwinLi wrote...

What so you prefer to kill every single person born with magic becuase they are born with Magic?

No.

Isn't that the goal of the rebel templars who elected to defect from the Chantry to hunt down the mages who chose autonomy over servitude?

Hazegurl wrote...

EdwinLi wrote...

Nothing has changed with or without Magic. Humanity by nature is the most destructive force in the world. Killing all mages because certain ones choose to be evil doesn't justify killing the ones who actually use their abilities for good or were never a part of the crime.

I chose the Templars because I don't see much good from siding with either side. But I believe that Templars are more of asset to combat destructive mages, mages do far more damage to the world than regular people and therefore I would much rather kill off any blood mages before they flee into the general public.
The way I see it, let the city guard handle regular people and let the Templars handle mages.

I've never seen the point in helping Meredith kill the mages in Kirkwall. Condemning an entire population of people because they have a criminal element? That could be used as justification for wiping out pretty much anyone.

Hazegurl wrote...

EdwinLi wrote...What they fear is what Humanity has always feared. Things that are not seen as Human. Anything Humanity has seen as not Human they will always assume that they are monsters and have no possible way of feeling any good emotions such as love and happiness. What they fear is not Mages being taken over by demons. It is being born with a power that not everyone can have and if Humanity cannot have that power their view will always be that those who have that power must never have freedom or a life because they are not living beings in their eyes.

What Mages need to do is learn how to take responsiblity for their own actions and stop proving to everyone that they have a reason to fear them. Stop summoning demons because someone stole your freaking lunch money and you're too lazy to put in real work to obtain power, stop tearing open veils and ruining people's lives, stop claiming your superior just because you have powers, stop scarifcing innocent people to fuel your magic, stop helping people who scarifice others to fuel their magic. See how that works?

You're condemning all mages for the actions of a few. That's like condemning all dwarves because some dwarves are members of the carta.

Hazegurl wrote...

I just wish that people would stop treating mages like they are children and hold them accountable for their bad behavior for once. Yes everybody can do bad things, big whoop. A regular bad guy can be put down without any long lasting effects for his crime, a mage crime could be so severe it probably won't ever go away. Just look at Kirkwall. before someone brings up rich and powerful regular people, how many regular people manage to obtain such power and wealth to cause long lasting damage? Not many. How many mages can cause long lasting damage? As many that are born.

People hold mages accountable for their actions. They simply don't vilify all mages simply for being mages.

Hazegurl wrote...

EdwinLi wrote...
That is were they are wrong. Mages are human and they are living beings. mages such as Alain are examples of Mages who are good but they choose to continue to ignore this becuase they will relly only on their fear of Mages to determine their actions. They are not monsters who are born with no good emotions. However, in the end the fear of not having what those mages have will always consume Humanity or any other race that don't have that power. 

Yes, mages are human beings, so what? They are not special victims that should be granted a free pass all because their lives stink. They can stand in the "Life stinks" line along with everyone else in Thedas. I so wonder where everyone's passion for city elves who get raped and abused everyday.

Which is why some people condemn the Chantry for what happened to the Dales, and would prefer to help the elves instead of the Orlesian politicians bickering over the throne.

Hazegurl wrote...

I'm sure no one had much issues with killing them off during the Qunari attack, but choose to kill some mages and everyone wants to cry a river.  

Some of us have a problem with killing hundreds of men, women, and children who are innocent of Anders' actions.

[Noctis Augustus]

I want him as an ally in the war! I just hope EAware doesn't take away choice when dealing with him.

Modifié par ibbikiookami, 03 mai 2013 - 03:23 .

[Hazegurl]

EdwinLi wrote...

I won't continue this argument any farther because I know everyone have their own views of what is right and wrong but I will still stand by my belief that punishing those who are not responsible for the actions of those who are actually responsible is wrong.

That was what Meredith did in the end when it should not have happened when the one responsible was right in front of her.

Thank you and I do respect your opinion. I won't tell anyone that siding with mages is wrong I just want the same respect so I tend to get defensive. It's all about how we view the situation from our own game experience in the end.

[Hazegurl]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...

EdwinLi wrote...

What so you prefer to kill every single person born with magic becuase they are born with Magic?

No.

Isn't that the goal of the rebel templars who elected to defect from the Chantry to hunt down the mages who chose autonomy over servitude?

*sigh* Your comment has nothing at all to do with what we were discussing. We're talking about MY decision at the end of the game.

I've never seen the point in helping Meredith kill the mages in Kirkwall. Condemning an entire population of people because they have a criminal element? That could be used as justification for wiping out pretty much anyone.

Yet some people have no problem condemning the entire Templar order to death for the actions of a few. I find both Mages and Templars at fault here but I was given a choice and I picked the one that I personally view as less chaotic in the end. I see nothing good coming from Mages running loose all over Thedas and fighting Templars in the streets. The Circles need to change and the Templars duties need to be revamped but killing the whole order and war in the streets is not the anwser for me. Mages need to realize that they do in fact need supervision whether they like it or not, just not the way the system is currently run.

You're condemning all mages for the actions of a few. That's like condemning all dwarves because some dwarves are members of the carta.

And you're doing the same thing to the Templars, why is it okay for you and not for me simply because I picked a side you disagree with? Anyway, I don't condemn all mages, I save whomever I can at the end. I have also set free Emile during the On the Loose quest because I believed he was harmless and didn't need to be locked away in the circle, and I also wanted to help Grace until she told me to kill a Templar for her, I also went easy on Alain until Carver was kidnapped and by then I had enough of the mages crap. So no, I'm not about condemning all mages. But if it makes you happy to think that way then so be it.

People hold mages accountable for their actions. They simply don't vilify all mages simply for being mages.

I have yet to read a single comment from you that holds mages accountable for their own actions.

Which is why some people condemn the Chantry for what happened to the Dales, and would prefer to help the elves instead of the Orlesian politicians bickering over the throne.

Get back to me when I see such a great outcry on these fourms for the elves the same as I do the mages.

Some of us have a problem with killing hundreds of men, women, and children who are innocent of Anders' actions.

You've avoided the entire point. But I guess that is easier than admitting that you have no issues with slaughtering the disadvantaged elves in the streets of Kirkwall during the Qunari attack.

[kathic]

This thread makes me want to rule the world with an iron fist as a mage. If you condemn me as a blood mage I may as well be a blood mage.

[OdanUrr]

kathic wrote...

This thread makes me want to rule the world with an iron fist as a mage. If you condemn me as a blood mage I may as well be a blood mage.

Isn't that Orsino's reasoning at the end of DA2? Worked out perfectly for him, didn't it?

[KingsTiger]

Quyk Sylvyr wrote...

People come in all shapes and sizes - some are down right evil, some are good, some are crazy, some are mischievous, etc. That means some mages have to be evil as well. To have not believed mages could be evil is naive. However, that doesn't mean all mages are evil.

By the way, many mages agree that there needs to be some sort of mechanism in place to protect against situations like this. (In Legend of the Seeker, it was a mage who helped Cassandra stop the plot.) The problem is that the current mechanism isn't working. Imagine a slightly different templar/mage relationship. Can you see a place where mage children are taught that they are not evil, families are welcome to join the children (with stipends) and templars are taught to see that mages are humans as well?

This, so much.

[LobselVith8]

[quote]Hazegurl wrote...

[quote]LobselVith8 wrote...

Isn't that the goal of the rebel templars who elected to defect from the Chantry to hunt down the mages who chose autonomy over servitude?[/quote]

*sigh* Your comment has nothing at all to do with what we were discussing. We're talking about MY decision at the end of the game. [/quote]

Your decision to help Meredith kill hundreds of people who are innocent of Anders' actions because she wants to appease a hypothetical mob of people who will demand their death? It seems as flimsy as the goal of the rebel templars who want to hunt and kill mages because they chose autonomy over servitude to the Chantry.

[quote]Hazegurl wrote...

[quote]LobselVith8 wrote...

I've never seen the point in helping Meredith kill the mages in Kirkwall. Condemning an entire population of people because they have a criminal element? That could be used as justification for wiping out pretty much anyone. [/quote]

Yet some people have no problem condemning the entire Templar order to death for the actions of a few. I find both Mages and Templars at fault here but I was given a choice and I picked the one that I personally view as less chaotic in the end. I see nothing good coming from Mages running loose all over Thedas and fighting Templars in the streets. The Circles need to change and the Templars duties need to be revamped but killing the whole order and war in the streets is not the anwser for me. Mages need to realize that they do in fact need supervision whether they like it or not, just not the way the system is currently run. [/quote]

While I picked the one that allowed me to protect hundreds of innocent people from their executioners.

Also, an anti-mage religious organization shouldn't be supervising mages.

[quote]Hazegurl wrote...

[quote]LobselVith8 wrote...

You're condemning all mages for the actions of a few. That's like condemning all dwarves because some dwarves are members of the carta. [/quote]

And you're doing the same thing to the Templars, why is it okay for you and not for me simply because I picked a side you disagree with? Anyway, I don't condemn all mages, I save whomever I can at the end. I have also set free Emile during the On the Loose quest because I believed he was harmless and didn't need to be locked away in the circle, and I also wanted to help Grace until she told me to kill a Templar for her, I also went easy on Alain until Carver was kidnapped and by then I had enough of the mages crap. So no, I'm not about condemning all mages. But if it makes you happy to think that way then so be it. [/quote]

Decimus and Grace don't make sense. He thinks apostate Hawke and Merrill are templars while she wants revenge even if Hawke helped her. Insane and stupid mages don't persuade me. As for Alain, he was raped by templars, and sided with Thrask to overthrow the tyrant Meredith from her dictatorship over Kirkwall.

Also, I'm okay with killing templars who are trying to murder hundreds of men, women, and children simply for being mages. Meredith 's only argument to annul the Circle is that people will want the mages dead; that's it. There's no rebellion, there's no insurrection; Meredith wants to commit genocide to appease a hypothetical mob.

[quote]Hazegurl wrote...

[quote]LobselVith8 wrote...

People hold mages accountable for their actions. They simply don't vilify all mages simply for being mages. [/quote]

I have yet to read a single comment from you that holds mages accountable for their own actions. [/quote]

That's because I don't vilify mages for refusing to live in servitude to the Chantry, while I hold specific mages accountable for their actions and their mistakes: like Marethari's failings as a leader, and her endangering Merrill and the Sabrae clan with her reckless actions.

[quote]Hazegurl wrote...

[quote]LobselVith8 wrote...

Which is why some people condemn the Chantry for what happened to the Dales, and would prefer to help the elves instead of the Orlesian politicians bickering over the throne. [/quote]

Get back to me when I see such a great outcry on these fourms for the elves the same as I do the mages. [/quote]

Considering how marginalized the elves were in the last game, that likely won't happen unless we get racial options back and treat the elves as an integral part of the story again.

[quote]Hazegurl wrote...

[quote]LobselVith8 wrote...

Some of us have a problem with killing hundreds of men, women, and children who are innocent of Anders' actions. [/quote]

You've avoided the entire point. But I guess that is easier than admitting that you have no issues with slaughtering the disadvantaged elves in the streets of Kirkwall during the Qunari attack. [/quote]

Because the situations are entirely different. The mages fight specifically against the templars who are trying to kill them for an act they had nothing to do with, while the Qunari elves are trying to help the Arishok take over Kirkwall.

[Hazegurl]

LobselVith8 wrote...
Your decision to help Meredith kill hundreds...

Stop trying to make your comment make sense.

While I picked the one that allowed me to protect hundreds of innocent people from their executioners.

So what? I never said you were wrong yet you seem to think that by me picking another side is somehow claiming you are wrong.  The choice is there for a reason, get over it and move on.

Also, an anti-mage religious organization shouldn't be supervising mages.

Says you. The way I see it its better than Mages trying to non police themselves.

Decimus and Grace don't make sense...... As for Alain, he was raped by templars, and sided with Thrask to overthrow the tyrant Meredith from her dictatorship over Kirkwall.

Oh well, that's how the story was written on Grace and Decimus. Complain to David Gaider about that. As for Alain, I feel for him but getting involved with crazy blood mages twice and cosigning a kidnapping in order to blackmail someone for aid etc are not things I take lightly. Thrask was a fool who ended up a dead fool.

Also, I'm okay with killing templars who are trying to murder hundreds of men, women, and children simply for being mages. Meredith 's only argument to annul the Circle is that people will want the mages dead; that's it. There's no rebellion, there's no insurrection; Meredith wants to commit genocide to appease a hypothetical mob.

Well let's see, the divine was already checking out Kirkwall for a possible Exalted March then a mage blow up the Chantry and murders the grand cleric. If Kirkwall suffers unrest and riot because of this that would probably be enough to call the city lost. If the divine calls for the March everyone would get put down including the Mages anyway. I would probably call for an RoA just to prevent that from happening. Why save the mages of Kirkwall if they may die anyway? I'd much rather use the lives of the mages to save the citizens. But that's just how I see it. I don't care about Meredith's reasons.

That's because I don't vilify mages for refusing to live in servitude to the Chantry, while I hold specific mages accountable for their actions and their mistakes: like Marethari's failings as a leader, and her endangering Merrill and the Sabrae clan with her reckless actions.

You forgot the very reasons why mages are feared to begin with. Tearing open veils, demon summoning, blood sacrifices. Don't just pick the lightweight failures here. And who says I vilify mages for wanting freedom? I vilify mages who use blood magic for shortcuts and end up destorying themselves and everyone around them, I vilify mages to turn to demons thinking they are clever and on par with them when they are not (looking at you Merrill), I vilify mages like Danarious, and mages like Anders, the walking abonmination. I have wlays said that the circles should become schools ruled jointly by Mages and Templars, places for mages to learn and then go home to their families, but they should still submit phylacteries. Or if they want freedom they should try the Lucrosian approach and buy it. But vilifying people for wanting independance is ridiculous.

Considering how marginalized the elves were in the last game, that likely won't happen unless we get racial options back and treat the elves as an integral part of the story again.

Why do elves have to be important for people to care about them? And this is coming from someone who laughed while she killed those elves during the Qunari attack.

Because the situations are entirely different. The mages fight specifically against the templars who are trying to kill them for an act they had nothing to do with, while the Qunari elves are trying to help the Arishok take over Kirkwall.

The only difference here is that you have a choice to save the mages or not. The Elves sided witht he Qunari because they were segregated and living in subpar conditions and from what we saw in the city elf playthough in origins. Have suffered constant abuses from humans there whole lives. As the city elf warden can tell King Calian when he asks about the alienages: Murder, rape, and injustice and one the conflicts that brought Hawke there was the city guard's lack of care for the murder of an elf from the alienage.

I can't blame the elves for siding with the Arishok. At least someone actually cared enough about them to bring them in and give them a better chance even if it is within the Qun.

But, as much as I feel for these elves. I cannot condone them running amok in the city streets killing people. But unlike the mages, I don't see many threads talking about how unfair it is that we have to kill them.

[MisterJB]

Hazegurl wrote...
Why do elves have to be important for people to care about them? And this is coming from someone who laughed while she killed those elves during the Qunari attack.

That part just so surreal. In RPGs, you spend most of the time standing up for the underdog. But here we were, killing all of these city elves; desperate for an improvement of their living conditions; on our way to save the nobles.

[Noctis Augustus]

OdanUrr wrote...

kathic wrote...

This thread makes me want to rule the world with an iron fist as a mage. If you condemn me as a blood mage I may as well be a blood mage.

Isn't that Orsino's reasoning at the end of DA2? Worked out perfectly for him, didn't it?

Poor writing nothing more. Why would someone turn into a creature with no reason like that is beyond me. At least demons are intelligent and have reason, the sloth, desire and pride ones I mean.

[Reaverwind]

andar91 wrote...

I'm a pro-mage player, but I've always thought there should be oversight for mages. Just not as extreme as it is currently.

The religious extremism needs to be removed from the oversight - but that won't happen in a society where organised religion is allowed so much control.

[Hazegurl]

MisterJB wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...
Why do elves have to be important for people to care about them? And this is coming from someone who laughed while she killed those elves during the Qunari attack.

That part just so surreal. In RPGs, you spend most of the time standing up for the underdog. But here we were, killing all of these city elves; desperate for an improvement of their living conditions; on our way to save the nobles.

Yeah, I even told the Arishok that I wouldn't turn over the elves and that I would fight for them. I wish I had gotten atleast an option to pick a side. I probably still would have opt to kill them because I wouldn't want the Qunari to take over but still, the option would have been nice. Instead you have to mow them down like nothing in favor of saving the nobles.

[Reaverwind]

Reaverwind wrote...

andar91 wrote...

I'm a pro-mage player, but I've always thought there should be oversight for mages. Just not as extreme as it is currently.

The religious extremism needs to be removed from the oversight - but that won't happen in a society where organised religion is allowed so much control.

MisterJB wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...
Why do elves have to be important for people to care about them? And this is coming from someone who laughed while she killed those elves during the Qunari attack. [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/grin.png[/smilie]

That part just so surreal. In RPGs, you spend most of the time standing up for the underdog. But here we were, killing all of these city elves; desperate for an improvement of their living conditions; on our way to save the nobles.

Nothing surreal about it. They chose a side, and chose to fight....and die for that side.

[Cainhurst Crow]

There wasn't really much wrong with the old circle system that a few good reforms wouldn't have hurt, but it was thank to psychopathic templars that now all the circles have failed. Ones who wanted to eradicate, lobotomize, or otherwise enslave all mages, rather than guard them and the innocent people both.

Kirkwalls templars made me hate all the templars, and playing origins templars and seeing knight commander greagoir again reminded me of why I never hated them before. He was fair, but harsh, and he listened to irving and to reason and didn't see all the mages as evil walking death machines.

It really does take only a few bad apples to spoil the bunch, templars and mages both.

[Plaintiff]

MisterJB wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...
Why do elves have to be important for people to care about them? And this is coming from someone who laughed while she killed those elves during the Qunari attack.

That part just so surreal. In RPGs, you spend most of the time standing up for the underdog. But here we were, killing all of these city elves; desperate for an improvement of their living conditions; on our way to save the nobles.

The elves provoke violence by attacking Hawke. He's acting in self-defense.

[Rawgrim]

Plaintiff wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...
Why do elves have to be important for people to care about them? And this is coming from someone who laughed while she killed those elves during the Qunari attack.

That part just so surreal. In RPGs, you spend most of the time standing up for the underdog. But here we were, killing all of these city elves; desperate for an improvement of their living conditions; on our way to save the nobles.

The elves provoke violence by attacking Hawke. He's acting in self-defense.

So does about 800 mages.

[Xilizhra]

Hazegurl wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...
Why do elves have to be important for people to care about them? And this is coming from someone who laughed while she killed those elves during the Qunari attack.

That part just so surreal. In RPGs, you spend most of the time standing up for the underdog. But here we were, killing all of these city elves; desperate for an improvement of their living conditions; on our way to save the nobles.

Yeah, I even told the Arishok that I wouldn't turn over the elves and that I would fight for them. I wish I had gotten atleast an option to pick a side. I probably still would have opt to kill them because I wouldn't want the Qunari to take over but still, the option would have been nice. Instead you have to mow them down like nothing in favor of saving the nobles.

There's nothing to be done. The mages don't attack me, the elves there do. In any case, they themselves are traitors to their own people and culture, so it's not that different from killing templars.

[Plaintiff]

Rawgrim wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...
Why do elves have to be important for people to care about them? And this is coming from someone who laughed while she killed those elves during the Qunari attack.

That part just so surreal. In RPGs, you spend most of the time standing up for the underdog. But here we were, killing all of these city elves; desperate for an improvement of their living conditions; on our way to save the nobles.

The elves provoke violence by attacking Hawke. He's acting in self-defense.

So does about 800 mages.

Which is an excuse for killing those 800 mages. Not for slaughtering unconnected Circle Mages that have done nothing to you.