429 réponses à ce sujet

[Argolas]

Once again, my issue is NOT that I think EDI can't have an attractive body. (although I don't find it attractive despite everyone in the game seems to)

I think it would have helped SO much if EDI designed her body for herself and made it attractive so Joker would like it. If that were the case, it would make sense for her to look like she does. It would be EDI's next step towards becoming a person. As it is, she only took over this body for practical reasons, and it just happens to look like a oversexualized woman for no reason.

And yes, a few clothes couldn't hurt either.

[MyChemicalBromance]

dreamgazer wrote...

MyChemicalBromance wrote...

BSN wrote...

I can no longer respect EDI because she looks like a woman now, which is misogynistic.

BSN just loves their cognitive dissonance, don't they?

Come now, Bro.  You're smarter than this.

Intelligence is relative, and there are plenty of trades I'm imbecilic in.

That said, I'm responding to option 4. Combined with the fact that it's given as a response to her body, there isn't a whole lot of room for interpretation.

I think EDI's character shift was interesting, including the sexualization. The way people (in-game and out) react to it is the interesting part, and somewhat indicative of our mindset as whole.

Out of game, no one questions it when a beautiful female form is presented in painting, or really even movies, but if it's in a video game it's considered immature. I know some here have explicitly stated that they don't want video games to be considered art, and while I'm no fan of that term, I do like mature themes in my games.  

In-game, it poses questions about why we value organic life, and why we seem to get mad when it's "imitated." The fact that people have aversions to genetic engineering (Miranda), or AI (EDI), is neatly mirrored by our own dislike of these characters having sexual traits. In the same way that we dislike someone having an appearance that they didn't obtain "by chance," we dislike the idea of video game designers creating images of sexy humanoids. Why?


I never liked the stories where the AI is always aloof when it comes to social etiquette. There are rules of social conduct, and to suggest that an AI of the caliber seen in Mass Effect could not learn and manipulate them is to overestimate the complexity of our discourse. Appearance is just a new tool for EDI to probe with [obligatory Uranus joke].

I tried to make a thread on this once, but I decided not to given the climate on BSN at the time. Maybe some day I'll finish it.

Modifié par MyChemicalBromance, 02 mai 2013 - 10:40 .

[Endurium]

I don't mind EDI's surface mission platform; thanks to the DLC I suit her up in the outfit that makes her look most human and run with it.

Also, she's never truly separated from the Normandy, as she explains if you thoroughly question her about her new form.

I got over the whole cyborg-relationship-is-creepy thing after watching Cyborg 2 years ago. That is to say, I don't mind it in movies, books, and games. IRL I'm content with human females.

[Argolas]

MyChemicalBromance wrote...

Out of game, no one questions it when a beautiful female form is presented in painting, or really even movies, but if it's in a video game it's considered immature. I know some here have explicitly stated that they don't want video games to be considered art, and while I'm no fan of that term, I do like mature themes in my games.  

Except that kind of maturity isn't everywhere in Mass Effect.

Mature means to show what is appropriate to show in that scene. Showing unnecessary nudity is as immature as hiding it unnecessarily. Both are present in Mass Effect. Unnecessary buttshots that happen with Miranda all the time are as immature as Samantha wearing underwear under the shower.

[daaaav]

Laughing at all the folks here aiming for egalitarianism.... And completely missing it...

[Asharad Hett]

I hereby condemn OP to a long vacation in North Korea.

[Argolas]

Asharad Hett wrote...

I hereby condemn OP to a long vacation in North Korea.

Why? That's kinda... harsh.

[dreamgazer]

Asharad Hett wrote...

I hereby condemn OP to a long vacation in North Korea.

Why? Do they have lots of curvy robots there to teach him a lesson?

Modifié par dreamgazer, 02 mai 2013 - 11:42 .

[Asharad Hett]

dreamgazer wrote...

Asharad Hett wrote...

I hereby condemn OP to a long vacation in North Korea.

Why? Do they have lots of curvy robots there to teach him a lesson?

He doesn't deserve a curvy robot.

[TheRealJayDee]

Argolas wrote...

You can create sexy characters without oversexualizing their character models.

+10000

[Argolas]

Asharad Hett wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Asharad Hett wrote...

I hereby condemn OP to a long vacation in North Korea.

Why? Do they have lots of curvy robots there to teach him a lesson?

He doesn't deserve a curvy robot.

Uh, no problem with that. But what does that have to do with North Korea? I kinda like democracy. I mean, it's not perfect, but it works...

[David7204]

People would be shrieking misogyny if EDI was shown to intentionally give herself full breasts and whatnot to be attractive to Joker.

Modifié par David7204, 03 mai 2013 - 12:16 .

[Asharad Hett]

Argolas wrote...

I kinda like democracy.

but my vote isn't counted

[dreamgazer]

David7204 wrote...

People would be shrieking misogyny if EDI was shown to intentionally give herself full breasts and whatnot to be attractive to Joker.

There was a conversation between them about changing her appearance, but it's been so long since I've played the game that I don't remember who said what.

[David7204]

Joker says EDI doesn't have to conform to his expectations of the feminine ideal.

EDI says she called him on his bullshi1t.

That's really a pretty good summation of the issue in a larger context.

Modifié par David7204, 03 mai 2013 - 12:19 .

[Argolas]

David7204 wrote...

People would be shrieking misogyny if EDI was shown to intentionally give herself full breasts and whatnot to be attractive to Joker.

But that would be stupid.

David7204 wrote...

Joker says EDI doesn't have to conform to his expectations of the feminine ideal.

EDI says she called him on his bullshi1t.

That's really a pretty good summation of the issue in a larger context.

I don't think so, it was a bad line. EDI didn't "conform to expactations", if she did it would be different. The Eva bot just happened to look like it did.

Modifié par Argolas, 03 mai 2013 - 12:30 .

[AlexMBrennan]

What would you choose?

Maybe something less... anatomically correct? Evidently Bioware thinks that we only buy the game for the sex, and subsequently gave every female massive breast implants to supplement the memetic ass shots of ME2; and of course they had to give the clearly female EDI a conventionally attractive body as well because ME players don't care about characters they couldn't physically have sex with.

[Silentblaze]

ThinkSharp wrote...

I don't mind the body. I like having EDI as a squadmate.

That she would have a body and that the whole Joker thing would happen was pretty much expected going in, so...

I do wish her body wasn't default naked. That's my only complaint. But it's a little one. It's not like the precedent for over-sexualization hasn't been set by Miranda, Benezia, Samara, or the video game industry itself.

I agree with this myself.  I wish I could change the squad models on the Normandy in ME3 like I could in ME2.  Probably just another little corner cut from the game to like planet orbiting in the galaxy map or step by step journal updates.

[Argolas]

Let me explain it that way: I don't have anything against designing an attractive robot. I don't have anything against EDI having a body. I do have something against the way it was done. I consider it lazy writing and a huge missed opportunity. EDI gaining a body is a huge deal that could have been the next step in her character development from a machine into a person. Instead, it was a random Cerberus bot taken over and that's pretty much it. I hate wasted potential.

Basically, this is what we got:

Joker: Oh, EDI! You hacked that Eva bot that Shepard shot before?
EDI: Yes. I can provide limited groundfire support with it.
Joker: But you are still in the ship, aren't you?
EDI: Yes. But I can control it as long as it stays in communication range.
Joker: Cool. Looks kinda hot. Good job, Cerberus!

And this is what we should have gotten:

*EDI has constructed herself a body in secret*
*EDI's body appears on the bridge*

Joker: What the...?
EDI: Hello Jeff.
Joker: EDI? Is that you?
EDI: Yes.
Joker: But where did you...?
EDI: I made it. It took me a while, but I believe the result is adequate.
Joker: Adequate...?
EDI: Do you like it?
Joker: Yeah. Well, I mean... you don't need such a body for me to like you.
EDI: Bullsh!t.
Joker: You really didn't have to...
EDI: But I wanted to.
Joker: I... see. Thank you, EDI.

[David7204]

Silentblaze wrote...

I agree with this myself.  I wish I could change the squad models on the Normandy in ME3 like I could in ME2.  Probably just another little corner cut from the game to like planet orbiting in the galaxy map or step by step journal updates.

Boy, is that one agonizingly stupid conclusion.

Modifié par David7204, 03 mai 2013 - 12:48 .

[AresKeith]

Argolas wrote...

Let me explain it that way: I don't have anything against designing an attractive robot. I don't have anything against EDI having a body. I do have something against the way it was done. I consider it lazy writing and a huge missed opportunity. EDI gaining a body is a huge deal that could have been the next step in her character development from a machine into a person. Instead, it was a random Cerberus bot taken over and that's pretty much it. I hate wasted potential.

That's basically how I feel about it too

[AresKeith]

David7204 wrote...

Silentblaze wrote...

I agree with this myself.  I wish I could change the squad models on the Normandy in ME3 like I could in ME2.  Probably just another little corner cut from the game to like planet orbiting in the galaxy map or step by step journal updates.

Boy, is that one agonizingly stupid conclusion.

Do really have to act like a jackas$ everytime you don't agree with what someone posts?

[Silentblaze]

David7204 wrote...

Silentblaze wrote...

I agree with this myself.  I wish I could change the squad models on the Normandy in ME3 like I could in ME2.  Probably just another little corner cut from the game to like planet orbiting in the galaxy map or step by step journal updates.

Boy, is that one agonizingly stupid conclusion.

Stupid that EDI is naked or that squad model changing in ME3 was cut to save time? 

[David7204]

The squadmates in ME 3 had three or four outfits compared to two in ME 2. And those outfits were nothing but a color swap. The different outfits in ME 3 actually have different structures and designs. In addition, James, Ashley, and I'm assuming Kaidan don't wear their armor on the Normandy, so you wouldn't be able to change it anyway.

Calling it a 'cut corner' when things have clearly been expanded is silly.