889 réponses à ce sujet

[Falaxe]

Finn the Jakey wrote...

...

If the Quarians really are all genocidal maniacs, why is it they agree to cooperate with the Geth once they know they're not a threat and don't continue killing them when peace is obtained?

Maybe because:
1) Tali is admiral
2) You saved that old quarian fart from beach, who was commanding the ships
3) Having at least 4 bars of reputation means that you either are a super hero or a person that could be referred as satan

If one of these lacks, quarians won`t cooperate and they commit suicide

[remydat]

Finn the Jakey wrote...

We're not talking about whether the Geth killed Quarians indiscriminetely, nearly all evidence we have points toward this anyway. No one is questioning whether the Quarians tried to surrendur, but it's ridiculous assuming that every Quarian was put killing the Geth over their own lives.

And the fact people have an issue with the Geth using chemical weapons is the same reason people frown on bombing civillian centres during a war.

And you bring up the Geth 'learning from' the Quarians. Well of course the Quarians didn't give the Geth any version of morality, they didn't expect the Geth to go rogue did they!
And for blaming the deaths of infants on the other Quarians, how is the average Quarians supposed to magically know that:  Getting rid of the Geth = dead children ?

If you sit there and let the other Quarians start killing the Geth then yes you have put your life over theirs.  There is nothing wrong about this in general but then you can't cry when the other side puts their life over yours.

And it is perfectly fine if you have a problem with chemical weapons.  I do too.  I am simply saying can't expect someone not to use it against their enemy when their enemy never bothered to tell them it is bad.  Even if the Geth did a quick scan of organic history, they would see many examples of organics killing other organics en masse using nukes, chemical, or biological weapons.  Hell the Turians and Salarians infected an entire race with the genophage ie a biological weapon.

So we agree they didn't teach the Geth morality.  So the Quarians understand they did not teach the Geth morality and yet they did think that logically if they try and shut down the Geth forcibly and fail those machines, it might put their kids in danger.  Like I said, if a Dad sits there with his son and kicks a hornets nest, should the Dad be shocked when his kid gets stung?

[Soldier096]

Ledgend1221 wrote...

S.A.K wrote...

billy the squid wrote...

Finn the Jakey wrote...

Ledgend1221 wrote...
Why shouldn't the Geth want to kill the Quarians?

Except they don't, Legion tells you this.

And he also says they don't trust the creators. And he's proved exactly right, the Quarians species aggressive irrational drive them to attack the Geth. The Geth, react accordingly once they are threatened, again. 

It is aggressive only because Geth have given them no choice. It's completely rational to take back their world. Geth were irrational in holding the Quarian worlds and not expecting Quarians to try and take them back. Geth logic don't seem to be working very well.

It's not logic, it's emotion.

Why would you try and reclaim a hostile world when you can easily settle a new one? That's logical.
The quarians have an emotional attachment to Rannoch. How the hell can the Geth be expected to understand that?

The Quarians did try to settle on other worlds. It usually ended up in failure as the world is either too hostile or the council intervenes and gives it to another citadel race. The codex  says that Rannoch is a cultural and biological necesity to the Quarians. It doesn't make sense for the Geth to remain on Rannoch. The Geth don't need Rannoch for their survival. The Geth could have easily inhabited another system. 

Modifié par Soldier096, 04 mai 2013 - 05:34 .

[S.A.K]

Ledgend1221 wrote...

It's not logic, it's emotion.

Why would you try and reclaim a hostile world when you can easily settle a new one? That's logical.
The quarians have an emotional attachment to Rannoch. How the hell can the Geth be expected to understand that?

Man I have been saying this whole day. Ok here it is again. Quarians need Rannoch because it's the only planet they can adapt to within one life time ("it's the difference between 60 years and 600" remember that from ME2?) and they may have an emotional attachment which is also understandable. But Geth don't need to think any of those. It's simple logic Quarians will want their world back. Don't tell me Geth are too stupid to figure that out.

remydat wrote...

Go fly over any country in an enemy ship
and see if they stop and talk to you.  Do you think during WWII, a
German plane claiming peace and flying over Britain is going to be
listened too?

This is silly SAK.  Organics say they should not
exist, tried to exterminate them, and then exterminated an AI race on
the Citadel shortly before these ships alleging they came in peace INVADED Geth space.  How stupid do you have to be to think you can just go flying around enemy space after just trying to destroy them?

Then why the hell do people blame the Quarians for attacking the Geth to take their world back. They had no choice other than war.

[The Night Mammoth]

Soldier096 wrote...

The Quarians did try to settle on other worlds. It usually ended up in failure as the world is either too hostile or the council intervenes and gives it to another citadel race. The codex  says that Rannoch is a cultural and biological necesity to the Quarians. It doesn't make sense for the Geth to remain on Rannoch. The Geth don't need Rannoch for their survival. The Geth could have easily inhabited another system. 

The geth weren't living on Rannoch, they inhabited the space around it and other systems. They didn't move because they didn't need to move. Why would they up sticks and shift away from Rannoch for a species which wants them enslaved or exterminated? 

Modifié par The Night Mammoth, 04 mai 2013 - 05:40 .

[remydat]

Just to clarify, Tali says settling Rannoch vs another plent is like the difference between 60 vs 600 years. Tali has done no research when she says this. She is just throwing out numbers to make a point. Trying to use that as proof it really take 600 years as if that is a statement based on science is a stretch.

Obviously this alleged 600 years didn't matter when they colonized planets other than Rannoch. So why would it matter now. The reality is this. The Quarians did not settle another world because the douchebag council wouldn't let them. If this 600 years was such a big deal, they would not have petitioned the Council for Ekuna.

[Soldier096]

The Night Mammoth wrote...

Soldier096 wrote...

The Quarians did try to settle on other worlds. It usually ended up in failure as the world is either too hostile or the council intervenes and gives it to another citadel race. The codex  says that Rannoch is a cultural and biological necesity to the Quarians. It doesn't make sense for the Geth to remain on Rannoch. The Geth don't need Rannoch for their survival. The Geth could have easily inhabited another system. 

The geth weren't living on Rannoch, the inhabited the space around it and other systems. They didn't move because they didn't need to move. 

Why did they stay in the system that had the homworld of their enemy? Why didn't they build their Dyson Shere somwhere else. Did they not expect retaliation from the Quarians? If the Geth occupied several other systems why couldn't they have built it in one of those other areas. I like both Geth and Quarians but it was a really stupid move on their part. 

Modifié par Soldier096, 04 mai 2013 - 05:49 .

[S.A.K]

remydat wrote...

Just to clarify, Tali says settling Rannoch vs another plent is like the difference between 60 vs 600 years. Tali has done no research when she says this. She is just throwing out numbers to make a point. Trying to use that as proof it really take 600 years as if that is a statement based on science is a stretch.

Obviously this alleged 600 years didn't matter when they colonized planets other than Rannoch. So why would it matter now. The reality is this. The Quarians did not settle another world because the douchebag council wouldn't let them. If this 600 years was such a big deal, they would not have petitioned the Council for Ekuna.

Well some planet is better than no planet. Also what Tali says is to get an idea. It don't have to be accurate. Just get the idea it would take about 10 times longer to adapt to another world.

[S.A.K]

Soldier096 wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

Soldier096 wrote...

The Quarians did try to settle on other worlds. It usually ended up in failure as the world is either too hostile or the council intervenes and gives it to another citadel race. The codex  says that Rannoch is a cultural and biological necesity to the Quarians. It doesn't make sense for the Geth to remain on Rannoch. The Geth don't need Rannoch for their survival. The Geth could have easily inhabited another system. 

The geth weren't living on Rannoch, the inhabited the space around it and other systems. They didn't move because they didn't need to move. 

Why did they stay in the system that had the homworld of their enemy? Why didn't they build their Dyson Shere somwhere else. If the Geth occupied several other systems why couldn't they have built it in one of those other areas. I like the Geth but it was a really stupid move on their part. 

Geth have proven they are stupid more than once. I was happy when I heard that Dyson Sphere contained about a billion Geth morons.

[remydat]

S.A.K wrote...

Then why the hell do people blame the Quarians for attacking the Geth to take their world back. They had no choice other than war.

Let's see.

1.   After Legion meets Tali and Shep, there was an opportunity for them all to work towards peace.  Neither side took it.  That includes both the Geth and Quarians.  The only difference is the Geth weren't planning on exterminating the Quarians so I fault them less.

2.  There is this small little conflict called the Reaper War that the Geth are not currently allies of the Reaper.  You know what would be a good idea?  Let's attack them and force them to ally with the Reapers because the Galaxy doesn't have enough problems.

3.  And to top it off, they conveniently omit the fact that they are about to start a war and don't bother to tell the Council or Shep.  No lie of ommission there, lol.

[Soldier096]

Soldier096 wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

Soldier096 wrote...

The Quarians did try to settle on other worlds. It usually ended up in failure as the world is either too hostile or the council intervenes and gives it to another citadel race. The codex  says that Rannoch is a cultural and biological necesity to the Quarians. It doesn't make sense for the Geth to remain on Rannoch. The Geth don't need Rannoch for their survival. The Geth could have easily inhabited another system. 

The geth weren't living on Rannoch, the inhabited the space around it and other systems. They didn't move because they didn't need to move. 

Why did they stay in the system that had the homworld of their enemy? Why didn't they build their Dyson Shere somwhere else. Did they not expect retaliation from the Quarians? If the Geth occupied several other systems why couldn't they have built it in one of those other areas. I like the Geth  but it was a really stupid move on their part. 

That's why if I am unable to make peace I will choose the Quarians over the Geth. 

Modifié par Soldier096, 04 mai 2013 - 05:52 .

[The Night Mammoth]

Soldier096 wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

Soldier096 wrote...

The Quarians did try to settle on other worlds. It usually ended up in failure as the world is either too hostile or the council intervenes and gives it to another citadel race. The codex  says that Rannoch is a cultural and biological necesity to the Quarians. It doesn't make sense for the Geth to remain on Rannoch. The Geth don't need Rannoch for their survival. The Geth could have easily inhabited another system. 

The geth weren't living on Rannoch, the inhabited the space around it and other systems. They didn't move because they didn't need to move. 

Why did they stay in the system that had the homworld of their enemy? Why didn't they build their Dyson Shere somwhere else. If the Geth occupied several other systems why couldn't they have built it in one of those other areas. I like the Geth but it was a really stupid move on their part.

Rannoch is their homeworld too, and a planet is a planet. Why move somewhere else when they have resources and infrastructure already established? It's not like they occupied the entire system and the surface, they specifically kept the latter healthy so the quarians might return one day. 

What do you think they should have done, just upped-sticks and moved because the quarians, who were on the verge of extinction thanks to them, and who were their enemy who in large part wanted them enslaved or destroyed, had their own sentimental attachment? 

Modifié par The Night Mammoth, 04 mai 2013 - 05:58 .

[Steelcan]

The Night Mammoth wrote...

Rannoch is their homeworld too, and a planet is a planet. Why move somewhere else when they have resources and infrastructure already established? It's not like they occupied the entire system and the surface, they specifically kept the latter healthy so the quarians might return one day. 

. Yet when Tali and Legion were discussing this, they shut it down.....

[Soldier096]

The Night Mammoth wrote...

Soldier096 wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

Soldier096 wrote...

The Quarians did try to settle on other worlds. It usually ended up in failure as the world is either too hostile or the council intervenes and gives it to another citadel race. The codex  says that Rannoch is a cultural and biological necesity to the Quarians. It doesn't make sense for the Geth to remain on Rannoch. The Geth don't need Rannoch for their survival. The Geth could have easily inhabited another system. 

The geth weren't living on Rannoch, the inhabited the space around it and other systems. They didn't move because they didn't need to move. 

Why did they stay in the system that had the homworld of their enemy? Why didn't they build their Dyson Shere somwhere else. If the Geth occupied several other systems why couldn't they have built it in one of those other areas. I like the Geth but it was a really stupid move on their part.

Rannoch is their homeworld too, and a planet is a planet. Why move somewhere else when they have resources and infrastructure already established? It's not like they occupied the entire system and the surface, they specifically kept the latter healthy so the quarians might return one day. 

Rannoch is ther homeworld but they do not need it. Synthetics have no emotional attachments. They did not take care of Rannoch for their creators. Legion says they don't know why they did it. 

Modifié par Soldier096, 04 mai 2013 - 06:01 .

[S.A.K]

remydat wrote...

S.A.K wrote...

Then why the hell do people blame the Quarians for attacking the Geth to take their world back. They had no choice other than war.

Let's see.

1.   After Legion meets Tali and Shep, there was an opportunity for them all to work towards peace.  Neither side took it.  That includes both the Geth and Quarians.  The only difference is the Geth weren't planning on exterminating the Quarians so I fault them less.

2.  There is this small little conflict called the Reaper War that the Geth are not currently allies of the Reaper.  You know what would be a good idea?  Let's attack them and force them to ally with the Reapers because the Galaxy doesn't have enough problems.

3.  And to top it off, they conveniently omit the fact that they are about to start a war and don't bother to tell the Council or Shep.  No lie of ommission there, lol.

*facepalm* This again?
1. Not really. They were holding that planet and provided no means of communication (they were actively blocking comms) for 300 years. So the Geth were asking for war.

2. Nobody would have guessed the Geth would be so chicken sh!t to p*ssy out and join the Reapers.

3. Who is Shepard to them anyway and what should they tell the council? "Hey a**holes we are about to attack the Geth. Come and stop us!" Is that it? Did they even have an obligation to tell anyone? Only once they should have told is the Geth. Too bad they don't allow communications including Legion. It's just 17 days since the attack started.

Were you trying to make a point?

[The Night Mammoth]

Steelcan wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

Rannoch is their homeworld too, and a planet is a planet. Why move somewhere else when they have resources and infrastructure already established? It's not like they occupied the entire system and the surface, they specifically kept the latter healthy so the quarians might return one day. 

. Yet when Tali and Legion were discussing this, they shut it down.....

Shut what down? 

[Steelcan]

The Night Mammoth wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

Rannoch is their homeworld too, and a planet is a planet. Why move somewhere else when they have resources and infrastructure already established? It's not like they occupied the entire system and the surface, they specifically kept the latter healthy so the quarians might return one day. 

. Yet when Tali and Legion were discussing this, they shut it down.....

Shut what down? 

. Legion and Tali were discussing the possibility of peace, but the geth stopped communicating.

[remydat]

Finn the Jakey wrote...

How many people here actually go out and protest against injustices commited by their government? Things like Guantamano Bay, the invasion of Afghanistan, drone strikes, the arms trade, civil liberties etc. etc. 
If not, does that mean they deserved to die if they get blown up in a terrorist attack? 

What makes you think the majority of Quarians even had a say in what was going on with the Geth? That's saying that because they weren't throwing themselves under the tanks over an issue that wasn't even that relevant to them, they got what was coming to them.

In a terrorist attack no.  But if the US starts a war with a country where they try to exterminate their people and that country retaliates with chemical weapons then that is the consequences of sitting by and letting them start a war.

You are responsible for the leaders you put in power.  That is how government works.  And no they didn't get what was coming to them.  They are just not in any position to cry when they sat there and let their government try and kill doemetic and agricultural units because they thought they were toasters.

[Whybother]

Finn the Jakey wrote...

Ledgend1221 wrote...
Why shouldn't the Geth want to kill the Quarians?

Except they don't, Legion tells you this.

Legion lies multiple times during ME3 and caught.  He may have lied other times in both games and not been caught - did Shepard even try to verify the Geth's assertion that they didn't start the war, that they actually "honored" the Quarians who sided with the Geth, etc.? 

Legion is an unreliable source of information.

[Ryzaki]

Finn the Jakey wrote...

I'm sure humans would just move on and find a new world if an advanced race of synthetics invaded their homeworld and...

https://encrypted-tb...NHx-Krt7TxRF8Ur

Oh.

Bad comparison is bad.

reapers attacked humans for the express purpose of killing them and turning them into Reapers. Not out of self defense. Reapers also would not allow any humans that escaped to live (for very long). Reapers are also attacking all advanced organic life.

Horrible comparison.