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[Alien Number Six]

Argolas wrote...

Auld Wulf wrote...
....

^^ Ridiculous headcanon. No military could ever wipe out a significant part of the whole civilian population. Those soldiers have families.

Earth/Germany/1941

[Argolas]

Alien Number Six wrote...

Argolas wrote...

Auld Wulf wrote...
....

^^ Ridiculous headcanon. No military could ever wipe out a significant part of the whole civilian population. Those soldiers have families.

Earth/Germany/1941

Nope. We were talking about 99% and that never happened, not even close.

[Phatose]

Whybother wrote...

Phatose wrote...

So, Tali is useless, and Legion isn't going down without a fight.

Did we not already know that?

Tali saves your ass if Legion tries to kill Shepard.  She's also been there for you for three games.

Legion is all "yo dawg, I showed up for the final few missions of ME2 so you totally gotta side with me."

Tali ME1:  "I'm here to meet the Shadow Broker, who nobody meets in person, but this is not at all shady.  Where is he?"
Tali ME2:  Hi Shep.  I just got my squad killed.  Let me sign up with yours.  Oh noes, my father is a monster.  Lie to the Quarian government for me.  Oh Hi Shep!  I asked Legion to lie to the Geth for me like I asked you to lie to the Quarians for me, but he wouldn't so I pulled a gun on him.  That's cool, right?"
Tali ME3:  Hi Shep.  Reapers are here killing everyone, so we thought now would be a great time to start killing each other.  Oh look, Legion is uploading the code.  If my people don't stop attacking, they'll all be wiped out.  Should I warn them, or beg Legion to kill himself?  B, definitely B.  Oh, didn't work.   Time to jump off a cliff."

She doesn't try to save your ass, she's just stopping Legion.

[Alien Number Six]

Auld Wulf wrote...

Ultimately it still comes down to bad parenting.

I've nothing against the Quarians, I just don't think that they were good parents, and I think the Geth were generally used. Let's look at it this way, the Quarians...

* ...created the Geth as a servile race. [Military.]
* ...refused to acknowledge their growing sentience. [Military.]
* ...introduced them to murder, abuse, race hate, status hate, and violence. [Military/Civilians.]
* ...trained them to use guns, shields, and guerilla combat tactics. [Civilians.]
* ...provided them with the tools for warfare. [Civilians.]
* ...shared very poisonous life lessons about killing anyone you don't like. [Military/Civilians.]

Any kid with that kind of upbringing is going to be seriously screwed up. A good parent can actually recognise what the Quarians did wrong, there.

Well said Wulf

[Whybother]

Alien Number Six wrote...

Argolas wrote...

Auld Wulf wrote...
....

^^ Ridiculous headcanon. No military could ever wipe out a significant part of the whole civilian population. Those soldiers have families.

Earth/Germany/1941

I'd say Cambodia under the Khmer Rouge would be a more apt example - they wiped out 1/4 of their population.

[silverexile17s]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Do you know what question is never answered?

Remy, you said that Legion said that the Geth see Shepard as different from other organics, yet the writers never bothered to mention why. This is a pure ass pull on the part of the writers.

* Shepard has done nothing different with any geth than other organics -- shot and killed every single one of them.

* Shepard captured Legion at the urging of (fill in the blank) squad mate on the derelict reaper.

* They only see Shepard as different IF Legion makes it back to the Consensus.

* But still why do they see Shepard as different? What about the rest of the crew?

___________________________________

The problem with the Rannoch situation is..

* Rannoch is the home world of the Quarians.
* Rannoch is the home world of the Geth, too.

You can't even divide the world. The land belongs to all of them. The all lived all over it. Both groups were wrong. The Quarians were wrong to try and deactivate all of them. The Geth were wrong in their systematic extermination. If you divide the world and say "This half belongs to the Geth. And this half belongs to the Quarians," it will end up like India and Pakistan fighting over Kashmir.

Damn, I hope we never create anything resembling the Geth here on Earth. We will end up in the same situation.

Actually, I replayed ME2, and learned that Legion actually does go and tell you right away why the geth are interested in Shepard.
You see, the reason they wanted Legion to find Shepard, is because the Commander killed Sovergein. Legion sais the fact that an organic conquered a "superior being" - a "God", is why they are interested in Shepard. The fact that one organic was able to bring about the death of a being that the Heretics worshiped as the future of the geth is what interests them. Shepard's actions single-handly re-kindled the geth's interest in organics after 300 of not caring about their fates. Although the exact thing that Legion stands to gain by finding and studying Shepard is unknown, although it can be speculated that the geth wanted Legion to "learn" the traits that Shepard used to overcome Sovergien, so that the geth could understand the aspect that allowed "lesser beings" to defeat a "God." Perhaps they, like the Catalyst, saw Shepard as the examplar of organics, and the perfect organic to learn from, since Shepard did what no other organic could do - kill a "God."

Modifié par silverexile17s, 05 mai 2013 - 05:53 .

[Argolas]

The Geth never cared about the heretics as long as they only threatened organics. As soon as they become a threat to Geth as well (the virus) Legion of course asks for help.

[Phatose]

True.

All the alliance never cared about Cerberus when they were threatening the Collectors, and not them.

Do you have a point?

[S.A.K]

Phatose wrote...

True.

All the alliance never cared about Cerberus when they were threatening the Collectors, and not them.

Do you have a point?

Yes he does. It mean Geth don't give a damn about organics. So Shepard sholdn't give a damn about the Geth as Shepard's an organic. Those heretics they didn't do anything about almost destroyed everything. So why should Shepard do anything to save the Geth?

[Alien Number Six]

Alien Number Six wrote...

If my PS3 suddenly asked me if it had a soul I would be scared ****less. The first thing I would do is unplug it. When it dosen't shut down and asks me why I tried to "kill" it my first thought will be. Will it want revenge? I didn't make it through iraq just to get killed by my playstation. I would go get my 45. and put a full clip into it soul or not. Then I would drive to the local VA mental health clinic to make sure the whole thing wasn't my brain misfiring.

Was the Morning War unjustified? Yes

Was the Morning War understandable? Hell yes.

The Quarians were scared of their creations after they began to question their existance.
They acted out of fear. Was it right? No. Can I understand it. Yes.

[Phatose]

S.A.K wrote...

Phatose wrote...

True.

All the alliance never cared about Cerberus when they were threatening the Collectors, and not them.

Do you have a point?

Yes he does. It mean Geth don't give a damn about organics. So Shepard sholdn't give a damn about the Geth as Shepard's an organic. Those heretics they didn't do anything about almost destroyed everything. So why should Shepard do anything to save the Geth?

How many Batarians did something about those heretics?  How many Drell?  How many Hanar?  How many Volus? 

For that matter, how many humans did one damn thing about them?  Like 7, out of billions?


Is your compassion for other living things is limited entirely to ones you owe a favor too?

[Argolas]

Phatose wrote...

S.A.K wrote...

Phatose wrote...

True.

All the alliance never cared about Cerberus when they were threatening the Collectors, and not them.

Do you have a point?

Yes he does. It mean Geth don't give a damn about organics. So Shepard sholdn't give a damn about the Geth as Shepard's an organic. Those heretics they didn't do anything about almost destroyed everything. So why should Shepard do anything to save the Geth?

How many Batarians did something about those heretics?  How many Drell?  How many Hanar?  How many Volus? 

For that matter, how many humans did one damn thing about them?  Like 7, out of billions?


Is your compassion for other living things is limited entirely to ones you owe a favor too?

The Geth didn't even care to tell anyone about them...

[Phatose]

Wow, I can't imagine why. It's not like their existence was a crime.
Oh, yes it was.

[Alien Number Six]

Whybother wrote...

Alien Number Six wrote...

Argolas wrote...

Auld Wulf wrote...
....

^^ Ridiculous headcanon. No military could ever wipe out a significant part of the whole civilian population. Those soldiers have families.

Earth/Germany/1941

I'd say Cambodia under the Khmer Rouge would be a more apt example - they wiped out 1/4 of their population.

If a military considers it's own population a threat it will wipe them out. As a solider in the U.S Army I took an oath to defend my against enemies both overseas and at home. If the Quarian military found Civilians aiding the geth.....well you know the rest.

[Argolas]

What? Crime? I'm not sure what you are talking about. The Geth are not bound to any kind of law. They don't live in Council space.

[S.A.K]

Phatose wrote...

S.A.K wrote...

Phatose wrote...

True.

All the alliance never cared about Cerberus when they were threatening the Collectors, and not them.

Do you have a point?

Yes he does. It mean Geth don't give a damn about organics. So Shepard sholdn't give a damn about the Geth as Shepard's an organic. Those heretics they didn't do anything about almost destroyed everything. So why should Shepard do anything to save the Geth?

How many Batarians did something about those heretics?  How many Drell?  How many Hanar?  How many Volus? 

For that matter, how many humans did one damn thing about them?  Like 7, out of billions?

Is your compassion for other living things is limited entirely to ones you owe a favor too?

Last time I checked, the Heretics were Geth. Not Drell or Hanar or human or anything. Those other "living things" were not trying to kill Shepard or destroy the galaxy. Everyone trying that ends up dead.

Do you even think before posting something?

[Argolas]

Alien Number Six wrote...

Whybother wrote...

Alien Number Six wrote...

Argolas wrote...

Auld Wulf wrote...
....

^^ Ridiculous headcanon. No military could ever wipe out a significant part of the whole civilian population. Those soldiers have families.

Earth/Germany/1941

I'd say Cambodia under the Khmer Rouge would be a more apt example - they wiped out 1/4 of their population.

If a military considers it's own population a threat it will wipe them out. As a solider in the U.S Army I took an oath to defend my against enemies both overseas and at home. If the Quarian military found Civilians aiding the geth.....well you know the rest.

I'll repeat it again: We are talking about more than 99% of the population. Children. Old people. Sick people. Civilians who don't care about the Geth at all and just wanted to live their life.

ALL DEAD.

I admit that I'm not familiar with US regulations, but I cartainly hope that your oath does not include the butchering of children.

Modifié par Argolas, 05 mai 2013 - 06:34 .

[Phatose]

S.A.K wrote...

Phatose wrote...

S.A.K wrote...

Phatose wrote...

True.

All the alliance never cared about Cerberus when they were threatening the Collectors, and not them.

Do you have a point?

Yes he does. It mean Geth don't give a damn about organics. So Shepard sholdn't give a damn about the Geth as Shepard's an organic. Those heretics they didn't do anything about almost destroyed everything. So why should Shepard do anything to save the Geth?

How many Batarians did something about those heretics?  How many Drell?  How many Hanar?  How many Volus? 

For that matter, how many humans did one damn thing about them?  Like 7, out of billions?

Is your compassion for other living things is limited entirely to ones you owe a favor too?

Last time I checked, the Heretics were Geth. Not Drell or Hanar or human or anything. Those other "living things" were not trying to kill Shepard or destroy the galaxy. Everyone trying that ends up dead.

Do you even think before posting something?

How many humans have tried to kill Shepard in ME3 alone?  Then add in ME2 and ME1?
Are you going to kill all humans because of that?

Oh, right, but the Geth allied with the Reapers, and no Humans ever did.....Oh.  Cerberus.  Right.

Yeah, I think before posting.

[Phatose]

Argolas wrote...

I'll repeat it again: We are talking about more than 99% of the population. Children. Old people. Sick people. Civilians who don't care about the Geth at all and just wanted to live their life.

ALL DEAD.

I admit that I'm not familiar with US regulations, but I cartainly hope that your oath does not include the butchering of children.

Ask the Mohicans.  If you can find one.

[Argolas]

Phatose wrote...

Argolas wrote...

I'll repeat it again: We are talking about more than 99% of the population. Children. Old people. Sick people. Civilians who don't care about the Geth at all and just wanted to live their life.

ALL DEAD.

I admit that I'm not familiar with US regulations, but I cartainly hope that your oath does not include the butchering of children.

Ask the Mohicans.  If you can find one.

We were talking about your own civilian population, weren't we?

[S.A.K]

Phatose wrote...

S.A.K wrote...

Last time I checked, the Heretics were Geth. Not Drell or Hanar or human or anything. Those other "living things" were not trying to kill Shepard or destroy the galaxy. Everyone trying that ends up dead.

Do you even think before posting something?

How many humans have tried to kill Shepard in ME3 alone?  Then add in ME2 and ME1?
Are you going to kill all humans because of that?

Oh, right, but the Geth allied with the Reapers, and no Humans ever did.....Oh.  Cerberus.  Right.

Yeah, I think before posting.

Those people are all dead. You saying I should give Geth the same treatment? Show one Geth that don't try to kill you at some point. All Geth are equally responsible for everything they ever did because of their consensus.

Also cerberus never joined Reapers. TIM got indoctrinated. Only once to ever join the Reapers is Geth.
I think you should play the game again but pay some attention this time. I don't even understand why you go to such lenghts to cover the Geth...

[Phatose]

Argolas wrote...

Phatose wrote...

Argolas wrote...

I'll repeat it again: We are talking about more than 99% of the population. Children. Old people. Sick people. Civilians who don't care about the Geth at all and just wanted to live their life.

ALL DEAD.

I admit that I'm not familiar with US regulations, but I cartainly hope that your oath does not include the butchering of children.

Ask the Mohicans.  If you can find one.

We were talking about your own civilian population, weren't we?

Quarians are now Geth's civilian population?  That's news to me.

[Phatose]

S.A.K wrote...

Phatose wrote...

S.A.K wrote...

Last time I checked, the Heretics were Geth. Not Drell or Hanar or human or anything. Those other "living things" were not trying to kill Shepard or destroy the galaxy. Everyone trying that ends up dead.

Do you even think before posting something?

How many humans have tried to kill Shepard in ME3 alone?  Then add in ME2 and ME1?
Are you going to kill all humans because of that?

Oh, right, but the Geth allied with the Reapers, and no Humans ever did.....Oh.  Cerberus.  Right.

Yeah, I think before posting.

Those people are all dead. You saying I should give Geth the same treatment? Show one Geth that don't try to kill you at some point. All Geth are equally responsible for everything they ever did because of their consensus.

Also cerberus never joined Reapers. TIM got indoctrinated. Only once to ever join the Reapers is Geth.
I think you should play the game again but pay some attention this time. I don't even understand why you go to such lenghts to cover the Geth...

http://en.wikipedia....ion,_March_1933

Consensus.  Kill them all.  Right?

[silverexile17s]

Phatose wrote...

S.A.K wrote...

Phatose wrote...

S.A.K wrote...

Phatose wrote...

True.

All the alliance never cared about Cerberus when they were threatening the Collectors, and not them.

Do you have a point?

Yes he does. It mean Geth don't give a damn about organics. So Shepard sholdn't give a damn about the Geth as Shepard's an organic. Those heretics they didn't do anything about almost destroyed everything. So why should Shepard do anything to save the Geth?

How many Batarians did something about those heretics?  How many Drell?  How many Hanar?  How many Volus? 

For that matter, how many humans did one damn thing about them?  Like 7, out of billions?

Is your compassion for other living things is limited entirely to ones you owe a favor too?

Last time I checked, the Heretics were Geth. Not Drell or Hanar or human or anything. Those other "living things" were not trying to kill Shepard or destroy the galaxy. Everyone trying that ends up dead.

Do you even think before posting something?

How many humans have tried to kill Shepard in ME3 alone?  Then add in ME2 and ME1?
Are you going to kill all humans because of that?

Oh, right, but the Geth allied with the Reapers, and no Humans ever did.....Oh.  Cerberus.  Right.

Yeah, I think before posting.

All humans that attacked FIRST. Just like the geth did at Eden Prime. Which could have been prevented had the True Geth interviened in just letting the Heretics leave with Sovergien. Or at the very least, WARN other organics that a faction of theirs had borken off. Or maybe issue a disclaimer that stated that the Heretics did not represent their mainstream views. SOMETHING to show the rest of the wider galaxy that the Heretics didn't represent their majority beliefs. Shepard and crew are the ONLY ones that know the full stroy of the Heretics split, so you can't begrudge others, like the quarians, Council, and Alliance, for scoffing at the idea that it was all just a big misunderstanding.
And on the matter of Shepard's trust, we know for a fact that the geth didn't stop the Heretics from leaving. I WILL concede the concidental fact that the bases the True Geth were building in the Armstrong Cluster (Geth Incursion mission of ME1) were near areas of space the Heretics were active in (Artimus Tau, Attican Beta, and possibly Sentery Omega, were Virmire was), and that they may have been done in an attempt to prep for counter-Heretic action. So I admit I can't diffinitively say that the True Geth weren't planning to deal with the Heretics at some point in ME1's stroyline, prior to the Battle of the Citadel.  But the geth are still responcible for letting the Heretics leave in the first place.
And AFTER the Battle of the Citadel, and the Heretics are depleated, what do the geth do about the remainder of the Heretics? Nothing. They sit back and let the Alliance clean them up for two years.
The Alliance & Cerberus is a different matter. When the Alliance had solid proof that Cerberus existed, and that it was a danger to others, they acted. Hell, it was Cerberus' attack on the quarians that caused the Alliance to start actively hunting Cerberus. (Mass Effect: Ascension. Kahlee Sanders and David Anderson run into Cerberus agent Paul Grayson during Cerberus's failed attack on the quarian ship Idenna and scout ship Cynnad.)
So NO. Your example rings false, because unlike the geth, the Alliance openly disavowed Cerberus as being representative of their people. Every race does that with their rouges- OH RIGHT. The Geth don't. It's okay for them to not claim responcibility for their rouge elements when everyone else has to? The turians with the Tatreus rebellion, the salarians with the Leauge of One, the Alliance with Cerberus. Why exactally do the geth get a free pass in not claiming responcibility for the Heretic's actions?

Modifié par silverexile17s, 05 mai 2013 - 06:57 .

[Argolas]

Phatose wrote...

http://en.wikipedia....ion,_March_1933

Consensus.  Kill them all.  Right?

Please take the time to actually read the article you are referencing.

Modifié par Argolas, 05 mai 2013 - 06:52 .