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Am I the only one who feels Legion betrayed his ME2 characterization?


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#451
remydat

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sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

You know it is such a kick watching Remy take every single thing to the absolute extreme. You sidestep everything that is inconvenient. Remy, you are fantastic entertainment.


Wait so attacking a group that has not done anything wrong except have the misfortune of being created by douchebags that want to kill them because they gave them the ability to kill is not taking things to the extreme?

I am merely pointing out your logic is shared by the very enemy you wish to defeat.  What conclusions you wish to draw from that is up to your but it is telling you refrain from saying anything to defend your point.

You seem confused by this point.  Having a fear or concern is fine.  Using that fear and concern as a justification to kill something that has simply served you faithfully is not fine.

Modifié par remydat, 16 mai 2013 - 05:42 .


#452
S.A.K

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remydat wrote...

S.A.K wrote...

Wait! what? So the Geth agreed to help Reapers as a trade? Like "if you give us Reaper tech we'll help you attack the citadel and kill organics."? Then again in ME3 the rest of the Geth, "if you save our a**es we'll be your slaves forever". Things like that? Geth don't give a damn about organics at all. Their only concern is survival. And they'll still be that way even if it means the end of everyone else.
So what's to say Geth won't switch sides again and join Reapers if they feel the final battle is going bad for the organics? They'll do that in a heart beat if the Reapers say they'll be spared.


Organics don't give a damn about synthetics except in so far as they can be their tools or slaves.  So what is the point?  Their only concern is ensuring synthetics remain their tools and slaves.

My point here is pretty simple. The Geth cannot be trusted in a war against Reapers. They'll switch sides again if it suits them. And as organics, we don't have to make sacrifices to save a synthetic species who don't give a damn about organics. I don't know about you, but I am an organic.

If the Geth were like EDI, my Shepard will die to save them.

#453
Morlath

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remydat wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

You know it is such a kick watching Remy take every single thing to the absolute extreme. You sidestep everything that is inconvenient. Remy, you are fantastic entertainment.


Wait so attacking a group that has not done anything wrong except have the misfortune of being created by douchebags that want to kill them because they gave them the ability to kill is not taking things to the extreme?

I am merely pointing out your logic is shared by the very enemy you wish to defeat.  What conclusions you wish to draw from that is up to your but it is telling you refrain from saying anything to defend your point.

You seem confused by this point.  Having a fear or concern is fine.  Using that fear and concern as a justification to kill something that has simply served you faithfully is not fine.


But the Geth were involved in the Morning War and did horrible things (granted). Of course the Geth aren't allowed to not be like that any more.

And of course the Salarians used a bioweapon.
The Turians attacked humans for mistakingly trying to open a Mass Relay
The Krogans tried to breed the galaxy into submission.

#454
KingZayd

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S.A.K wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

S.A.K wrote...

KingZayd wrote...
Only because I was there. If it was a Quarian accompanying them you know what they'd have done? killed the Geth and then exiled the Quarian

Religious beliefs didn't cause the split but the Heretics did develop them. The Reapers don't just give handouts. Legion tells you: Sovereign was approaching a bunch of races looking for an army. It was a trade.

Wait! what? So the Geth agreed to help Reapers as a trade? Like "if you give us Reaper tech we'll help you attack the citadel and kill organics."? Then again in ME3 the rest of the Geth, "if you save our a**es we'll be your slaves forever". Things like that? Geth don't give a damn about organics at all. Their only concern is survival. And they'll still be that way even if it means the end of everyone else.
So what's to say Geth won't switch sides again and join Reapers if they feel the final battle is going bad for the organics? They'll do that in a heart beat if the Reapers say they'll be spared.


Some Geth*

What about those organics that helped the Reapers (Saren, Benezia, their Asari and Krogan and then Cerberus)? Clearly organics can't be trusted either. They'll side with the Reapers in a heartbeat!

Those are a very few individual organics. Other organics helped to take them down. Geth took their decisions as a whole species with their consensus. Only some Geth joined the Reapers as Heretics. But the rest of the Geth approved and didn't do anything about it. And now all of them have joined Reapers because they couldn't face the Quarians. It doesn't even look like they even considered any alternetives. Only the Geth have joined Reapers as a species. How can they be trusted at all? Legion itself went against almost everything it said in ME2.


It's not that they approved. They simply didn't force their choices on other Geth. Also Cerberus was pretty big, and the Heretic Geth were a minority.

What alternatives? Die for the sake of a galaxy that hates them?

Modifié par KingZayd, 16 mai 2013 - 05:51 .


#455
Excella Gionne

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Morlath wrote...

johnnythao89 wrote...

I think we're all going in circles here. We bring up the same solution and dissolution to everything. There are so many ways to one solution. We're never gonna find a solution for this thread unless everyone agrees to one thing. I think it's ridiculous on how long this thread has gone.

Legion wanted the Geth to find their own path to a better future, but once ME3 came along the Geth were creating that superstructure so that Geth no longer had to be isolated and that programs could be held within that superstructure. But no, the Quarians attacked it and a large amount of Geth programs were destroyed and non-recoverable. This led to the dimming within the Geth intelligence---relating this similar concept to the "Shutdown Geth Servers" mission about "shutting the lights off". With the Geth intelligence dimmed, it was survival at all cost even if it meant submission to the reapers as slaves. Legion in ME2 said that they wouldn't side with the Reapers and that only the Heretics did because they saw the Reapers as gods, therefore, they left the consensus and built their own. The circumstances of the "No siding with the Reapers" changed after the superstructure was destroyed. They were desperate, and like any Organics they had to choose which choice was the best for them. This relates to a dialogue that EDI says when she's talking about humans trying to make peace with the Reapers or siding with the reapers or not help the reapers. The Geth chose to self-preserve their own race. Mordin's idea of saving and destroying Maelon's data is no different. Circumstances changed, and new decisions had to be made or else the Geth would have gone extinct if they never sided with the Reapers and chose to defend against the Quarians' upgrades to hinder the Geth. Legion knew that without the upgrade, his race was doomed against the fight with Quarians. He wanted the Geth to be an individual and not tied to a consensus. "Does this unit have a soul?" a Geth once said, and even after all this time not one Geth had their own conscience not even Legion until he died. This sort of proves that the Geth, or Synthetic evolution had its limits and with the Reaper upgrades, they could achieve it since they are much more advance. Everyone benefits from the Reapers. Legion grew his own conscience through his experiences with Shepard and with the upgrades. I believe Legion saw himself changing as you can see he starts to act more humanly after the upgrades. he started to show emotions. This must be why he supported it. The Geth VI(Alternated Legion)did not have those experience with Shepard and it was "not" Legion himself, thus, it had its own solution and ideas and contradicting everything Legion was.


And this is essentially my argument.

There are extenuating circumstances for what the Geth have done. It doesn't excuse any of it from an organic perspective but the reasons are actually there and valid. But the anti-Geth brigade don't seem to be interested in any of that.


Yeah, I can see that. I don't think they're really digging very deep into the Pros and Cons and are just throwing what they think is out there. I had to just memorize things that made sense to me while writing this. I had to go into things I never thought I did remember. And to that statement about the Geth doing nothing with Rannoch? Not true. The anti-geth people must rememeber the "reason" why the Geth were built in the first place. They were built to help the Quarians manage Rannoch. And even after they exiled the Quarians, they continue as caretakers of Rannoch. They helped sustain Rannoch's life and all that good stuff. 

#456
remydat

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S.A.K wrote...

My point here is pretty simple. The Geth cannot be trusted in a war against Reapers. They'll switch sides again if it suits them. And as organics, we don't have to make sacrifices to save a synthetic species who don't give a damn about organics. I don't know about you, but I am an organic.

If the Geth were like EDI, my Shepard will die to save them.


That is fine SAK but again, that is the very defintion of prejudice.  The minute you introduce as an argument I will take care of me and my own it is prejudice.  The very same prejudice the Geth employed in siding with the Reapers.  Except you wear yours as a badge of honor while condemning them for theirs.  Further your species has existed for hundreds of thousands if not millions of years and should have learned better yet you condemn the 300 year old species for not learning in 300 years something you apparently still have not learned, lol.  Oh the irony.

Basically your argument is as long as they are organic I will accept prejudice whether it be from the Council, Quarians, or yourself.  However, how dare the Geth do the same?  How dare there?

And I think as long as the Quarians stop trying to kill them they can be trusted.  I mean for the record, when did please stop trying to kill became an unreasonable condition for cooperation?

Modifié par remydat, 16 mai 2013 - 05:57 .


#457
Argolas

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S.A.K wrote...
The Geth cannot be trusted in a war against Reapers. They'll switch sides again if it suits them.


That's pretty true. Every organic can be indoctrinated, but the Geth are a whole race that willingly submits to the Reapers if it benefits them more than not to do it. Even a Batarian terrorist understands that once you ally with the Reapers you are screwed, you only take the whole rest of the galaxy with you.

#458
shodiswe

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The Answer to the OP's question is: No. Legion didn't betray his ME2 characterization.

There is also something to said about ideals.
In ME2 Legion said that they rejected the Reapers proposal because they wanted their own future.
The first reason for them to reject the offer of Reaper technology was that the "Price" back then was slavery and enthralment and likely Death after ceasing to be useful. Then they would absolutely have been trading away their future for Technologhy which was totaly unacceptable.
The second part is that accepting technology freely with no pricetags attached to it was still somewhat impopular since they were hoping to find their own perfect future. Their own evolution and all that.
But that wasn't nearly as much of a problem as throwing away everythign that they were and their freedom and possibly lives ans the acceptance of a reaper offer would signify.
Legion fought the Reaper takeover to the end, which is why it wasn't under Reaper Control despite being plugged into all that Reaper tech.
Legion rejected the Reapers just like the Rachni Queen that you can save on Noveria.
Salvaging reaper Tech with no pricetag but your own pride attached to it isn't the same thing when your species faces extinction either by the hands of the Quarians or the Reapers.
Salvaging that Reaper code and reverseengineering it to make their own coding and platforms more efficient isn't that much of a moral issue. It's more of one of pride.
It's like Thanix Canons, it changed warfare in the galaxy by introdusing something new.
If they handn't learned about Thanix cannons then they might have invented a different type of weapon.
In the end the galaxy was loosing badly, the homeworlds of every major citadel race except maybe the Salarians was under attacked, the whole galaxy including Legion and his Geth would loose if they don't find the means of fighting and bridging the technological gap to the Reapers.
The truth is, that when times are grim and desperate then you need to adapt, those who don't dies. On Earth there are species dieing every day while others adapt to humanity and start furishing.
Adaptation, evolution and change are important parts of any species sucessful survival. Those on the top who's current adaptations are a perfect match to the current situation has very little need to change even if all/most Life strives for a chance to improve their own situation.
It's easier however to resist change when youre at the top since a change then could be determental to your wellbeing and sucess.
Humanity is the most adaptable species on our planet, and in the Mass effect universe were described as such aswell. Sucess seems to come from humanitys adaptability and drive to suceed.

Legion and the Geth had come to realize how important it was to change their way and Legion had proven that it's code was "superior" which the word Legions uses to describe Shepard.
Legion and the Geth sought out Shepard to learn from that superior "code" it was part who they were, they wern't above Learning from others they just had a preference to finding their own solutions.
When Legion was dispatched to study Shepards code it was just as much to learn from Shepard and Shepards way that made Shepard such a sucess at fighting Reapers.
If their ideals as perfect isolationists was to reject all foreign influences good or bad then they woudln't have sent Legion in the first Place.
Unless Legion was a Shepard worshipper gone rogue.
In the darkest hour of the Geth, with the Quarians attackign the the Reapers at the doorsteps Legion held superior code that allowed it to free Geth from the Reapers and fight them more effectively than any other Geth. It fulfilled the promise of having aquired "superior code" which was the Legions expressed mission in ME2.
Question: What was the mission? Answer: To seek out Shepard!
Question: Why Shepard?  Answers: Shepards code was superior, it/they wished to learn.
Question: Did Legion betray his core characterization and mission as presented in ME2?
Answer: No, Legion provided superior code and experiences to his people that would make them more efficient at fighting the Reapers and securing their future. The price tag was negleable and the sphere/bubble project had already been scrapped by the Quarians.

Really, we're told that Legions primary mission was to seek out superior code. It also ended up fighting the Heretics because it learned that they were plotting to brainwash the True Geth into becoming Reapers slaves. The Heretic mission became a secondary mission for which Shepards help and that of a Stealth vessel was highly desirable and useful.
One small strike team to infiltrate and defeat the enemy surely seemed far more desirable than sendign the whole Geth fleet to engage the Heretics and leave them open to an attack by the Quarians who would see the Geth civil war as a sign of weakens.
If we tell the Quarians about the two different Geth factions then they hardly seem surprised, they just state that it will make destroying the Geth even easier if they are busy killing each other, or something along those lines.
The Geth were mostly against foreign influences that would be detrimental to the Geth. Like forced slavery and death.
The Quarians and the Reapers represented both of these. Shepard represented a "neutral party" who was capable of resisting and fighting any of these threats sucessfully, they wanted to learn from it on their own terms.

The Answer to the OP's question is: No. Legion fulfilled it's primary ME2 mission to aquier superior code that would help the Geth to fight the Reapers. It had proven that the code was indeed superior and that it had been scrubbed and was safe from Reaper Control and very sucessful when fighting Reapers and any other hostile forces.

Modifié par shodiswe, 16 mai 2013 - 06:08 .


#459
S.A.K

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Auintus wrote...

S.A.K wrote...

You expect me to trust that thing even after it went back on everything it said in ME2? Not only that, it lies repeatedly during ME3. It ever tries to kill Shepard when he disagreed. You failed to provide one reason why I should trust that thing.

I am sorry. I understand what you said, but I don't accept anything Legion says without proof because it's a damned lier. It's not my fault the Bioware butchered ME2 Legion.


So they changed previous beliefs for their own survival. Humans do that all the time. And it never lies in ME3. It does willfully refuse to divulge certain information, but it explains its reasons and I cannot say that I would have done differently. Lastly, why would it not attack Shepard? The wheel says "We're letting the Geth die." Shepard condemns his entire race to extiction. There is no reason to expect it not to fight back.

As for "butchering" Legion, recall that it has been an entire year since the last time you spoke with him and the degree and speed of Geth interactions. Expecting him not to change is like expecting a friend from the 2nd grade to be exactly the same. People change.

Can you provide an example for something like that done by humans? Geth were at war with Heretics for those believes. They wanted Shepard to wipe out/brain wash the Heretics because of these believes. One attack from Quarians later(which they had 17 days to figure something out) they just drop all those principles and join Reapers themselves just because they are too stupid to face the Quarians themselves. As for letting Geth die, it's either Quarians or Geth and Shepard had to make a choice like on Virmire. Legion know damn well Shepard is the only one able to beat the Reapers. But Legion tries to kill him when he didn't choose them.

People changing in one year and Legion practically becoming a Heretics is two different things. In ME2, Legion wanted Heretics taken care of because of those beliefs. Now Legion is just Reaper code or death. If that 2nd grade friend you mentioned changed like that to the absolute worst, he would no longer be my friend.

#460
Morlath

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S.A.K wrote...

My point here is pretty simple. The Geth cannot be trusted in a war against Reapers. They'll switch sides again if it suits them. And as organics, we don't have to make sacrifices to save a synthetic species who don't give a damn about organics. I don't know about you, but I am an organic.

If the Geth were like EDI, my Shepard will die to save them.


Aside from being extremely prejudiced, there's something that's ignored.

Heretics sided with the Reapers (Saren, Benezia...)
Geth sided with Reapers only at the very risk of their lives and at the cost of their self-control.

The Geth actually sat around, discussed things and the majority of them agreed that it wasn't in their best interests to side with the Reapers....oh wait, you don't believe anything Legion says even if it's from ME2.

Modifié par Morlath, 16 mai 2013 - 06:05 .


#461
S.A.K

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remydat wrote...

S.A.K wrote...

My point here is pretty simple. The Geth cannot be trusted in a war against Reapers. They'll switch sides again if it suits them. And as organics, we don't have to make sacrifices to save a synthetic species who don't give a damn about organics. I don't know about you, but I am an organic.

If the Geth were like EDI, my Shepard will die to save them.


That is fine SAK but again, that is the very defintion of prejudice.  The minute you introduce as an argument I will take care of me and my own it is prejudice.  The very same prejudice the Geth employed in siding with the Reapers.  Except you wear yours as a badge of honor while condemning them for theirs.  Further your species has existed for hundreds of thousands if not millions of years and should have learned better yet you condemn the 300 year old species for not learning in 300 years something you apparently still have not learned, lol.  Oh the irony.

Basically your argument is as long as they are organic I will accept prejudice whether it be from the Council, Quarians, or yourself.  However, how dare the Geth do the same?  How dare there?

And I think as long as the Quarians stop trying to kill them they can be trusted.  

Is All-other-races > Geth prejudice?

I said that like about EDI to make it clear that my choice is not based on Geth being Synthetic. I want Geth gone as much as I want Cerberus gone. Quarian attack made it clear that Geth are willing to submit to Reapers as a species if it suites them. I don't accept Geth had only 2 choices (Death or Reaper code) since a complex situation like that is never so black and white.

#462
Morlath

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S.A.K wrote...

Can you provide an example for something like that done by humans? Geth were at war with Heretics for those believes. They wanted Shepard to wipe out/brain wash the Heretics because of these believes. One attack from Quarians later(which they had 17 days to figure something out) they just drop all those principles and join Reapers themselves just because they are too stupid to face the Quarians themselves. As for letting Geth die, it's either Quarians or Geth and Shepard had to make a choice like on Virmire. Legion know damn well Shepard is the only one able to beat the Reapers. But Legion tries to kill him when he didn't choose them.

People changing in one year and Legion practically becoming a Heretics is two different things. In ME2, Legion wanted Heretics taken care of because of those beliefs. Now Legion is just Reaper code or death. If that 2nd grade friend you mentioned changed like that to the absolute worst, he would no longer be my friend.


Denmark, WW2, decided that it was in their country and people's best interest to side with the ****s and basically become a token government so that more people didn't have to die than was "necessary". And all it cost them was giving up their Jewish population (thankfully the resistance actually made it the country that lost the fewest), their morality and being slaves to this all consuming, all destroying force.

#463
S.A.K

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Morlath wrote...

S.A.K wrote...

My point here is pretty simple. The Geth cannot be trusted in a war against Reapers. They'll switch sides again if it suits them. And as organics, we don't have to make sacrifices to save a synthetic species who don't give a damn about organics. I don't know about you, but I am an organic.

If the Geth were like EDI, my Shepard will die to save them.


Aside from being extremely prejudiced, there's something that's ignored.

Heretics sided with the Reapers (Saren, Benezia...)
Geth sided with Reapers only at the very risk of their lives and at the cost of their self-control.

The Geth actually sat around, discussed things and the majority of them agreed that it wasn't in their best interests to side with the Reapers....oh wait, you don't believe anything Legion says even if it's from ME2.

I don't see what is prejudice about that. No other race had sided with Reapers before. Geth done that twice already. And there is no reason they wouldn't again.

#464
S.A.K

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Morlath wrote...

S.A.K wrote...

Can you provide an example for something like that done by humans? Geth were at war with Heretics for those believes. They wanted Shepard to wipe out/brain wash the Heretics because of these believes. One attack from Quarians later(which they had 17 days to figure something out) they just drop all those principles and join Reapers themselves just because they are too stupid to face the Quarians themselves. As for letting Geth die, it's either Quarians or Geth and Shepard had to make a choice like on Virmire. Legion know damn well Shepard is the only one able to beat the Reapers. But Legion tries to kill him when he didn't choose them.

People changing in one year and Legion practically becoming a Heretics is two different things. In ME2, Legion wanted Heretics taken care of because of those beliefs. Now Legion is just Reaper code or death. If that 2nd grade friend you mentioned changed like that to the absolute worst, he would no longer be my friend.


Denmark, WW2, decided that it was in their country and people's best interest to side with the ****s and basically become a token government so that more people didn't have to die than was "necessary". And all it cost them was giving up their Jewish population (thankfully the resistance actually made it the country that lost the fewest), their morality and being slaves to this all consuming, all destroying force.

Does that make what Denmark did a good thing? Is it acceptale?

#465
remydat

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S.A.K wrote...

Is All-other-races > Geth prejudice?

I said that like about EDI to make it clear that my choice is not based on Geth being Synthetic. I want Geth gone as much as I want Cerberus gone. Quarian attack made it clear that Geth are willing to submit to Reapers as a species if it suites them. I don't accept Geth had only 2 choices (Death or Reaper code) since a complex situation like that is never so black and white.


Yes but the problem with your posts is your inherent bias bleeds into your arguments.  The bold in the below is inherently a biased statement to make.  Once you start going down that road it undermines whatever logic you may have.  Replace synthetics and organics with black or white and the problem with the below becomes obvious.

S.A.K wrote...

My point here is pretty simple. The Geth cannot be trusted in a war against Reapers. They'll switch sides again if it suits them. And as organics, we don't have to make sacrifices to save a synthetic species who don't give a damn about organics. I don't know about you, but I am an organic.

If the Geth were like EDI, my Shepard will die to save them.



#466
Morlath

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S.A.K wrote...

I don't see what is prejudice about that. No other race had sided with Reapers before. Geth done that twice already. And there is no reason they wouldn't again.


Because you're painting all Geth with the Heretic brush and ignoring the circumstances with the Rannoch arch to fit in with your "sided with Reapers twice" claim. The Geth, as a concensus, have only sided with the Reapers once when they found themselves on the brink of extinction.

#467
S.A.K

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@Morlath,
This is taking us nowhere. Just tell me what makes the Geth so trustworthy to you. But please keep in mind everything the Geth done. Also don't say what other parties have done. I want to know only about the Geth.

#468
Morlath

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S.A.K wrote...

Does that make what Denmark did a good thing? Is it acceptale?


The morality of what Denmark did has been debated ever since it first happened and is still a major issue in the country.

However, you asked for examples where organics have done/would do the same as the Geth in the same situation. I provided one. Makes neither morally right but it does make both decisions understandable in the "oh my god, we might all die" reaction.

#469
shodiswe

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Ok, Remy.. For the sake of experimentation I'll take a look at what that change woudl look like...

editing quote...

S.A.K wrote...

My point here is pretty simple. The Black cannot be trusted in a war against Reapers. They'll switch sides again if it suits them. And as Whites, we don't have to make sacrifices to save a Black species who don't give a damn about Whites. I don't know about you, but I am a White.

If the Black were like Tyra Banks, my Shepard will die to save them.


Still sounds pretty much the same to me as the original message tbh.

Modifié par shodiswe, 16 mai 2013 - 06:17 .


#470
sH0tgUn jUliA

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remydat wrote...

S.A.K wrote...

My point here is pretty simple. The Geth cannot be trusted in a war against Reapers. They'll switch sides again if it suits them. And as organics, we don't have to make sacrifices to save a synthetic species who don't give a damn about organics. I don't know about you, but I am an organic.

If the Geth were like EDI, my Shepard will die to save them.


That is fine SAK but again, that is the very defintion of prejudice.  The minute you introduce as an argument I will take care of me and my own it is prejudice.  The very same prejudice the Geth employed in siding with the Reapers.  Except you wear yours as a badge of honor while condemning them for theirs.  Further your species has existed for hundreds of thousands if not millions of years and should have learned better yet you condemn the 300 year old species for not learning in 300 years something you apparently still have not learned, lol.  Oh the irony.

Basically your argument is as long as they are organic I will accept prejudice whether it be from the Council, Quarians, or yourself.  However, how dare the Geth do the same?  How dare there?

And I think as long as the Quarians stop trying to kill them they can be trusted.  I mean for the record, when did please stop trying to kill became an unreasonable condition for cooperation?


Remy, I'll admit, I'm prejudiced against the Geth. Now will you admit you are prejudiced against the Quarians. You're posts reek of it: i.e. calling the Quarians "douchebags", continuously misspelling Gerrel's name, using hyperbole to support your pro-Geth arguments. Just admit your own prejudice and be done with it. You are no better.

#471
S.A.K

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Morlath wrote...

S.A.K wrote...

I don't see what is prejudice about that. No other race had sided with Reapers before. Geth done that twice already. And there is no reason they wouldn't again.


Because you're painting all Geth with the Heretic brush and ignoring the circumstances with the Rannoch arch to fit in with your "sided with Reapers twice" claim. The Geth, as a concensus, have only sided with the Reapers once when they found themselves on the brink of extinction.

Geth allowed Heretics to do what they did, did they not? They also didn't bother to act about it is that, is that wrong? So the Geth are partly responsible for what Heretics did. Also why do you accept the Rannoch war was so black and white? Reaper code or death! Really? You are also ignoring Geth got themselves into that spot with may of their early actions.

#472
Morlath

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S.A.K wrote...

@Morlath,
This is taking us nowhere. Just tell me what makes the Geth so trustworthy to you. But please keep in mind everything the Geth done. Also don't say what other parties have done. I want to know only about the Geth.


And this is why one of my posts brought up the fact that it's incredibly difficult to prove a negative.

You've already taken the decision that the Geth are guilty until proven innocent.

Someone is found in a room with a dead body. One court needs guilt to be proven, the other innocence.

Evidence - There was an argument.
Evidence - No fingerprints of any kind on murder weapon

Innocent Court - Well the argument means that there may have been a motive but without proof said person did it/used the weapon, we can't find guilty.

Guilty Court - I've seen no proof of innocence. No finger prints means they may have wiped them off or used gloves. The argument is a smoking gun, guilty as charged.

#473
S.A.K

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shodiswe wrote...

Ok, Remy.. For the sake of experimentation I'll take a look at what that change woudl look like...

editing quote...

S.A.K wrote...

My point here is pretty simple. The Black cannot be trusted in a war against Reapers. They'll switch sides again if it suits them. And as Whites, we don't have to make sacrifices to save a Black species who don't give a damn about Whites. I don't know about you, but I am a White.

If the Black were like Tyra Banks, my Shepard will die to save them.

What are you saying? Black people joined Reapers?:lol:

#474
Excella Gionne

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All of this prejudice will not solve the OP's question. And I'm pretty sure by now, he's gonna have to pick one or none. And right now, we are only looking at Legion's view and the Geth's. Bringing exclusive problems that do not relate to the thread will not help the halt of the expansion of this ridiculous thread that should have stopped pages ago.

#475
shodiswe

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S.A.K wrote...

shodiswe wrote...

Ok, Remy.. For the sake of experimentation I'll take a look at what that change woudl look like...

editing quote...

S.A.K wrote...

My point here is pretty simple. The Black cannot be trusted in a war against Reapers. They'll switch sides again if it suits them. And as Whites, we don't have to make sacrifices to save a Black species who don't give a damn about Whites. I don't know about you, but I am a White.

If the Black were like Tyra Banks, my Shepard will die to save them.

What are you saying? Black people joined Reapers?:lol:


Just playing around with Remys sugestion. I do wonder however if the Jews in the na*zi camps woudl have accepted guns and superior equipment from the Reapers in Exchange for killing their tormentors.

The Geth's choice wasn't made easily. A lot of people will go to great lengths to fight back and will accept just about any offer if it helps them fight their arch nemesis who has been visiting them with horrors since they were born.
The Geth held out til the last moment.
I think it's totaly unfair to blame them for taking the Reapers offer, I'm pretty sure "I" would have taken it given their circumstances. At least I would get my revenge, and there is still hope while you're still alive(no matter how remote).
The Geth claims they don't belive in such "emotional" luggage, but Legion keeps proving it wrong.

Modifié par shodiswe, 16 mai 2013 - 06:26 .