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[inversevideo]

Is fitness necessary for gold / platinum matches?

I've seen threads indicating that fitness may be skipped and if necessary made up for by using a cyclonic.

I've tried using no fitness on characters that have base health of 500.
More often than not I end up downed more often.

But why? There seems to be little difference between 500 and 625 health.

Is it just a matter of using cover better? Are some build better 'no fitness' builds?
Or is it just practical to include fitness as part of all builds?

Is play style a factor?

[Thylakaleo]

I don't understand what you mean by "Wisdom? Or Dogma?

Wisdom is defined as "the soundness of an action with regard to application of experience.

Dogma is defined as "principles laid down by an authority on a matter."

So, you're asking if it's principles laid down by people who have wisdom on the subject, or if it is wisdom in and of itself...?

I say neither. I think it's dumb not to have at least a little shield boost, granted depending on the set, and how good you are, but unless you're stellar, or using a kit with a lot of base health and shield, it isnt wisdom or dogma, it's stupidity.

Sorry, didn't read post, title confused and distracted me...

[ToLazy4Name]

Depends on the character.

[Grun7mas7er]

krogan melee or gtfo.

[phunkeybuddha]

ToLazy4Name wrote...

Depends on the character.

[Tokenusername]

Survivability = (Health+Shields * (Regen * Damage Resistance) + Mobility) / Hitbox ^P

P = Powers

Modifié par Tokenusername, 12 mai 2013 - 05:51 .

[inversevideo]

Thylakaleo wrote...

I don't understand what you mean by "Wisdom? Or Dogma?

Wisdom is defined as "the soundness of an action with regard to application of experience.

Dogma is defined as "principles laid down by an authority on a matter."

So, you're asking if it's principles laid down by people who have wisdom on the subject, or if it is wisdom in and of itself...?

I say neither. I think it's dumb not to have at least a little shield boost, granted depending on the set, and how good you are, but unless you're stellar, or using a kit with a lot of base health and shield, it isnt wisdom or dogma, it's stupidity.

Sorry, didn't read post, title confused and distracted me...

Is it wisdom that you must always spec fitness?
Or is it dogma? A point of view put forward as authoritative without adequate grounds ( see Merriam Webster).

I don't know. It does seem that you need to spec fitness. But is that an absolute?
Are their builds that you actually benefit by putting the points you would spend in fitness, into another tree?

[KalilKareem]

Neither

[Original Twigman]

Thylakaleo wrote...

I don't understand what you mean by "Wisdom? Or Dogma?

Wisdom is defined as "the soundness of an action with regard to application of experience.

Dogma is defined as "principles laid down by an authority on a matter."

So, you're asking if it's principles laid down by people who have wisdom on the subject, or if it is wisdom in and of itself...?

I say neither. I think it's dumb not to have at least a little shield boost, granted depending on the set, and how good you are, but unless you're stellar, or using a kit with a lot of base health and shield, it isnt wisdom or dogma, it's stupidity.

Sorry, didn't read post, title confused and distracted me...

a dogma can mean a principle or idea that is "known" (i.e. assumed to be true through tradition), much like an axiom.

when it comes to fitness, there will be people who dogmatically promote one side over the other

[mybudgee]

CRUCIAL for Krogan

[StoxRegalia]

ToLazy4Name wrote...

Depends on the character.

Yeah. I generally put in as many points as I think I can spare without sacrificing damage output though.  If I can get enough to survive 3 ravenger shots without a cyclonic then I'll take it as often as I can as well.  I like not needing any extra defensive buffs from equipment so I can instead use that for offensive purposes.  All my builds must be platinum ready too.

[JulianRmz]

Can't imagine a fitness less Juggernaut, but can't bring my self to one Tac cloak infiltrator. Sure I can go fitness less Asari adept, and spec out hawk missile launcher, it depends on the character.

Wisdom is to know how do you play, your capabilities and weakness.

For me: 3 points comfort cast character; 4-5 conservationist; 6 melee builds/ juggernaut/power less kit. That's it I think.

Modifié par PhazonJulian, 12 mai 2013 - 07:08 .

[RoZh2400]

Fitness is essential for melee builds, if that's what you mean. It's also good if you don't want to spec into all 3 powers because they just steal cooldowns from each other.

[Thylakaleo]

inversevideo wrote...

Or is it dogma? A point of view put forward as authoritative without adequate grounds ( see Merriam Webster).

Dictionary.com- a settled or established opinion, belief, or principle

Merriam-Webster- something held as an established opinion; especially : a definite authoritative tenet

urban dictionary- A doctrine or a corpus of doctrines relating to matters such as
morality and faith, set forth in an authoritative manner by a church.


Oxford dictionary- a principle or set of principles laid down by an authority as incontrovertibly true.

Google- A principle or set of principles laid down by an authority as incontrovertibly true: "the Christian dogma of the Trinity".

Synonyms- Tenet, Doctrine.

I don't think the word means "without adequate grounds" or at least that's an extremely uncommon usage of it, and there are a thousand more accurate words you could have used.

Modifié par Thylakaleo, 12 mai 2013 - 07:20 .

[FlowCytometry]

hard for something to be wisdom when most people on here denounce, rather than promote, the concept of speccing heavy into fitness for most kits.

I dunno, what kits do you mean? How willing are you to burn CMs?

[Computron2000]

The real factor that many don't appreciate is that on mid range burst fires of mooks, 1 bullet means whether shield gate holds off enough damage or you drop. At close range it doesn't matter because a burst fire will hit 90% of its bullets and you'll drop but beyond close range, even 100 extra matters

Lets say you have 80 shields and 40 health without fitness and the enemy does 40 damage
Burst fire 4 bullets = shield gate breaks on the 2nd shot, health gate hit on the 3rd shot. Health 0 on the 4th

Lets say with fitness you have 88 shields and 44 health. Enemy still does 40 damage.
On the 2nd shot, you have 8 shields. On the 3rd shot, shield gate breaks and you have 44 health. On the 4th shot, you have 4 health and your health gate.

[rcolol]

Notorious P I G wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

Depends on the character.

Yeah. I generally put in as many points as I think I can spare without sacrificing damage output though.  If I can get enough to survive 3 ravenger shots without a cyclonic then I'll take it as often as I can as well.  I like not needing any extra defensive buffs from equipment so I can instead use that for offensive purposes.  All my builds must be platinum ready too.

This. I usually can tolerate sacrificing a point in a power or passive for 3-4 in fitness, it can make a difference that's worth it.

[Dalakaar]

Depends on the maneuverability, unbuffed hp/sh, what level I'll likely be playing on, and if I'm going to slap a Cyclonic IV on it to compensate.

Whether that's a dogma or a wisdom I leave to you.

[LuckyBullet95]

More like Fitness - Melee Build. Speed Boost or That Third Power...

Seriously OP I only spec Fitness if either
a) I'm running a Stardusk-esque build (Throwless Fury)
The power doesn't synergise with my build (Proxy Mine on the TSol, AR on a concussive shot Soldier).
c) I just hate the third power (Flamer, Turrets, Bio/Electric Slash, Sticky Nades).
d) The power is useless on the build (Electrical Hammer on a Reegar Warlord)

Modifié par LuckyBullet95, 12 mai 2013 - 09:21 .

[Fortack]

It's called the Melee Tree stupid. Fitness is for noobs.

[Deerber]

... What is this "fitness" you're talking about?

[The Mysterious Stranger]

ToLazy4Name wrote...

Depends on the character.

[N7Kopper]

The HP evolutions of Fitness are nothing by themselves on squishies like volus or Alliance marines. But they can be useful when combined with stuff like shield regen time evos/Power Cells, volus heavy melee and Shield Boost Protection evo DR, tech armour, or even heavy use of hard cover to null the enemy's target-out-of-cover damage bonus. Or even better, several of these combined. (I also have my sneaking suspicions from personal Destroyer play that the rumours of the Typhoon's in-cover DR bonus not working are just that, and based off of a misunderstanding of cover mechanics - namely that they buffed player DR rather than debuffing enemy damage - but I'll need to test it to be sure, and might just be an idiot)

That said, I'm in the camp that no Fitness is just dumb except for incredibly specialist builds or *cringe* support volus. Even just three points nets you a solid 250 HP and 20%+ melee damage on an Alliance marine, and oftentimes more HP than that.

[Caldari Ghost]

fitness is overrated.

[d_nought]

If your character has some sort of damage resistance power (Blade Armor, Biotic Focus, Drell dodge etc.), it's worth investing