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Dalish Elf - Roleplaying Decisions (spoilers)


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#1
Pantherus

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I'm looking to make my next play through a Dalish Rogue Archer (Ranger/Bard Build) and am considering key decisions to make throught the storylines in the main quests.

The character I'm looking to role-play is that of a very patriotic Dalish and borderline Xenophobic of everyone NOT Dalish - especially Humans.  To that end I'm looking to setup the party as "No Humans Allowed" or at least "No Loyal Ferelden Humans Allowed" - specifically Morrigan, Sten & Dog (possibly switch to Ogren later) with the idea that she wouldn't side with the Humans but will settle for a Qunari, Hermit-Witch and Puppy :)  Zevran would fit better for roleplaying but at this point I put my meta-gaming cap on and don't want to double-up my rogues...This would also fit with some alignment-related decisions made as her attitude torwards helping humans (i.e. DON'T) would largely coincide with the attitudes of Morrigan and Sten.

Anyway - to the main quest decisions:

 - Nature of the Beast: Will obviously side with the Dalish against the Werewolves but will probably take the "Kill em all" tact rather than curing them - "Shoot first and ask questions later" will largely be the attitude...
 - Broken Circle: Little harder - who would such a Dalish prefer to side with - the origin of Human Corruption in the Mages, or an Oppressive band like the Templars?  I'm thinking of sticking with the Mages as a lesser of two evils as it were...not sure Morrigan or Sten would agree but you never know...not sure yet whether I'll switch Wynne in for Morri or Dog during the Tower...or can you kill her and her allies yet still ultimately side with the Mages?
 - Sacred Ashes: Tough call - Desecrating the ashes seems to fit the attitude and allies (plus ticking off the humans) yet Andrastre helped free the Elves (for a while) and so desecrating her ashes seems to go against that
 - Connor - Kill or go into the Fade - I'm thinking Kill...
 - Paragon of her Kind: tough call - really not sure either way but thinking side with Bhelen and Branka...

Any thoughts or insight would be highly welcome

#2
Riverdaleswhiteflash

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Andraste was a friend of the elves. The Chantry that would profit off her ashes is not. Therefore, the amoral Dalish Elf I roleplayed more or less as you describe spared the Ashes but killed Genitivi so that the Chantry could not legitimize itself by his work.

As for Orzammar, I didn't perceive any reason that being a xenophobe Dalish would cause her to use the Anvil. I did see a reason for her to side with Harrowmont, since the Dalish are big on tradition. On the other hand, her boyfriend balked at siding with the weaker candidate, and due to her ambivalence towards the dwarves the decision was way less important to her than his opinion. (Yes, I had Zevran in the party despite my DE being a rogue. At least Zevran was dual-wield and Diana was ranged.)

As for the Circle... I didn't bother to roleplay her decision at this stage, since beating the game without Wynne is incredibly painful. However, I think given her outright hatred of the Chantry, she might actually sympathize with their mage victims. Especially since there are very few elves in the Chantry ranks, and a reasonable number of elves in the Circle. (I don't think her hatred of the Tevinter Magisters would apply, since these mages are not them, and I played her as more pragmatic than that. That's mine, though. It doesn't have to be yours.)

I must say I agree with regards to Connor and Nature Of The Beast, though in the latter case Diana gave Zathrian some crap about not telling her the relevant details.

Edit: Oh, and I made her a Ranger/Assassin. I figured it fit better with her being a huntress. I might make Bard her third spec, though. If you can still use original specs as the third, and if I bother getting Awakenings and playing it with her.

Modifié par Riverdaleswhiteflash, 16 mai 2013 - 09:29 .


#3
Pantherus

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Yeah pragmatic is definitely a good term for the attitude I'm looking at.

I like that compromise as it where of sparing the ashes but taking Gentiviti out - hadn't thought of that.

Not sure how she'll address the Dwarves as she'd be largely ambivalent towards them - I can certainly see the attraction of supporting Harrowmont's Traditional attitude though. The thought of favouring the golems I see as an extension of that pragmatic/practical attitude - golems > dwarves as it were...

I agree with the Circle too - sympathising with the Mages certainly fits. I was planning on making Morrigan a SH anyway (haven't played a Mage yet - on my to-do list as well - so haven't unlocked Blood Magic spec) so she can cover suitably.

I like the Ranger/Assassin mix - just archtyping a bit I guess - plus I've already played the Duelist/Assassin DW-Rogue so covering off the other two :)

#4
thats1evildude

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The Dalish are at times hunted by templars and the mages include elves in their ranks, so helping the Circle seems like the right choice.

On the subject of golems, Caridin will point out it is a form of slavery, which a Dalish might detest.

#5
coldwetn0se

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Take or leave any/all of the suggestions I make, but here are my thoughts...First, your party. Morrigan fits very well, and a Dalish elf would recognize (at least in my headcanon) that Morrigan is something, mmmm, different. Human/not human, something new perhaps. This makes her a fine canidate.

Next, brute force. You have four fine choices here, in Shale, Sten, Dog, and Oghren. My first pick would be Shale (but I am so very partial to her), and my next would be Sten. Both Sten and Shale have broader skills than dog (and it really does seem like they draw more aggro than Dog...maybe that is just my perception though), and both can be had fairly early in the game. From a role playing standpoint, there are good reasons to use any of the "speaking" members. Best might be to switch it up, from time to time.

Last party member...I play rogue probably 85% of the time. I bring Zevran almost ALL the time. Two DW rogues can be beastly. Of course, I am also the type of person who has hella-fun with an "all melee" party, so....*shrug*. But seriously, two DW rogues - well built - will tear enemies apart. Seriously fun, and most definately deadly. ;) And Zevran's mother was Dalish. This is a good motivating factor (RP wise) to drag him along for the party. :D

As for the plot points, I am in agreement with @Riverdaleswhiteflash assessment. I too see this type of character not supporting the use of the Anvil. Siding with Caradin seems more fitting than Branka (even though you are following a more pragmatic path). Conner dies, Ashes used and Genetivi killed.

Since you are interested in using the Ranger/Assassin mix, then I would definately suggest using Zevran, and setting him up as an Assassin/Bard (great buffs with Bard!).

So there you have it...again, take or leave whatever advice you choose. Have fun!! :D

#6
Pantherus

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hmmm thanks again. i've never really explored zevran properly before and forgot the dalish mother.

shale's not currently an option as i haven't that dlc - budgeted $50 and chose rto, keep, witch hunt and l's song - felt it was more bang for my buck.

a good point about golems being slavery.

#7
Ferretinabun

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I do agree your character would probably be partial to the mages. The Templars are the military arm of the Chantry, who I am sure have committed many atrocities in stamping out your pagan gods to be replaced with Andrastrianism. Besides, all Dalish keepers know a little magic, so your elf probably doesn't see mages as the threat that other humans/Dwarves might.

The issue is your party. Morrigan and Sten both firmly think the mages should be wiped out (I don't think Oghren or Zevran care much either way). This shouldn't pose too much of an issue though - your characters don't have to agree with every decision. And even if it bugs you, you could let Wynne take you through the tower (she is familiar with it, after all, and thus, likely to be a boon) and then simply refuse to let her join your party when you've cleared out the tower. That'd allow you to leave one of them behind.

Btw, yes you can kill Wynne as soon as you meet her and still save the mages. Just don't let Uldred kill everyone, and then advice Greigor that the tower is clear.

#8
Pantherus

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Yeah I'm sure there'll be the occasional Approval issue but hey, that's the point of roleplaying - no? :)

Going through the main choices I'm thinking:

- Forest - Side with Elves and kill all the Werewolves
- Circle Tower - Side with Mages...any way you can kill Cullen? Might swap out Morri with Wynne for this part
- Redcliff - Kill Connor straight off the bat, probably kill Jowan in his cell too :D
- Ashes - Preserve Ashes but kill Brother G
- Orzammar - Side with Harrowmont and Carridin
- Landsmeet - Recruit Loghain and promptly sacrifice him - haven't decided whether Anora or Ali will rule...might marry 'em up...

#9
Riverdaleswhiteflash

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Cullen lives regardless. They might have done that to use him in the sequel, or maybe they hadn't thought that far ahead.

#10
Shadow of Light Dragon

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FWIW, you don't have to murder Genetivi to prevent the Ashes from being claimed by the Chantry. If you don't kill the High Dragon it will essentially protect the Ashes in the epilogue, and Genetivi will end up killing himself when his life's work is never realised. I know your elf hates humans, but the guy did just help you get into the temple after weeks of being held prisoner and tortured. XD

And while you're not going the defile route anymore, I think Sten objects if you try to side with the Reavers and screws that option for you.

#11
Pantherus

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Yeah but she'll certainly share Alistair's cynical "I hope that Urn is self-replenishing" reaction :)

#12
Pantherus

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Hrm - actually thinking about it - would such a character actually opt for Loghain? He's a pretty big xenophobe himself while Alastair is more accomodating...

#13
SerTabris

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I could see it both ways. On the one hand, I figure allowing Loghain to be a Warden is a pragmatic sort of decision. On the other hand, he made a deal with Caladrius to sell elves into slavery. And the Warden doesn't know about the whole sacrifice thing until after the Landsmeet. (I suppose you could think of planning to kill him after the archdemon is dealt with.)

#14
Pantherus

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yeah i'm trying not to metagame so i can't assume that i'm choosing loghain over al, nor that i can throw him to the dragon. she'd probably not be overly interested in him redeeming himself either. hmmm - late game decision so can probably leave it and see where the convos take me...

#15
Riverdaleswhiteflash

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My character told Anora she was going to spare Loghain and then let Alistair handle the duel. I wanted to have Diana facepalm and say "Damn it, he could have been useful," but the way the automatic beheading is shown its clear that the Warden approves of it. So I guess what really happened is my character lied to Anora and killed Loghain.

#16
Corker

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My Dalish was supposed to be my Loghain Redeemer ending. Then I got to Unrest in the Alienage and learned he'd been selling elves. Wasn't gonna let that stand.

(OTOH, it'd be possible to RP a Dalish who thought the city elves were just getting what they deserved - really, weren't they slaves already?)

#17
Shadow of Light Dragon

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Corker's point might work...unless your Dalish hates the Tevinter Imperium and their blood mages, which I imagine most do. That Loghain was dealing with the empire that destroyed Arlathan might be a sticking point.

#18
Smashmouth

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Actually believe it or not on my first playthru as a Dalish I sided with the Lady of the forest over the Dalish dude. A tough choice but after betraying me and thinking about how he deceived his people into thinking he discovered the immortality of the ancients I didn't view him as a true Dalish leader

#19
Riverdaleswhiteflash

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Okay, but then you're still wiping out an entire Dalish clan through the fault of their keeper. I'm not saying that no Dalish would do it, I'm just saying its hard to roleplay.

#20
lyriumaddict104

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An earlier Dalish warrior I had sided with the Lady of the Forest against Zathrian but cured the werewolves and didn't wipe out the clan. I think it's possible to disapprove of Zathrian's actions, I think she even called him out on it, and still not have the werewolves kill them all.

#21
Riverdaleswhiteflash

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Oh. If that's he meant then yeah. Yeah, my first Dalish did that.

#22
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Pantherus wrote...

I'm looking to make my next play through a Dalish Rogue Archer (Ranger/Bard Build) and am considering key decisions to make throught the storylines in the main quests.

The character I'm looking to role-play is that of a very patriotic Dalish and borderline Xenophobic of everyone NOT Dalish - especially Humans.  To that end I'm looking to setup the party as "No Humans Allowed" or at least "No Loyal Ferelden Humans Allowed" - specifically Morrigan, Sten & Dog (possibly switch to Ogren later) with the idea that she wouldn't side with the Humans but will settle for a Qunari, Hermit-Witch and Puppy :)  Zevran would fit better for roleplaying but at this point I put my meta-gaming cap on and don't want to double-up my rogues...This would also fit with some alignment-related decisions made as her attitude torwards helping humans (i.e. DON'T) would largely coincide with the attitudes of Morrigan and Sten.

Anyway - to the main quest decisions:

 - Nature of the Beast: Will obviously side with the Dalish against the Werewolves but will probably take the "Kill em all" tact rather than curing them - "Shoot first and ask questions later" will largely be the attitude...
 - Broken Circle: Little harder - who would such a Dalish prefer to side with - the origin of Human Corruption in the Mages, or an Oppressive band like the Templars?  I'm thinking of sticking with the Mages as a lesser of two evils as it were...not sure Morrigan or Sten would agree but you never know...not sure yet whether I'll switch Wynne in for Morri or Dog during the Tower...or can you kill her and her allies yet still ultimately side with the Mages?
 - Sacred Ashes: Tough call - Desecrating the ashes seems to fit the attitude and allies (plus ticking off the humans) yet Andrastre helped free the Elves (for a while) and so desecrating her ashes seems to go against that
 - Connor - Kill or go into the Fade - I'm thinking Kill...
 - Paragon of her Kind: tough call - really not sure either way but thinking side with Bhelen and Branka...

Any thoughts or insight would be highly welcome


Nature of the Beast: I would cure them if I'm a Dalish. The first thing I do is help Elora with the Halla, and then I go talk to the Dales that are all gathered around the campfire and ask them about the werewolves and the forest. They say that the werewolves ambushed them, and if you ask how mindless creatures can plan an ambush, they say that they were wondering this as well. Apparently when they asked Zathrian, he had insisted that the werewolves were mindless beasts. However, the Dales know that they can't be mindless if they ambushed them, and are extremely suspicious of the Keeper and suspect that he is lying. The question is why. Knowing this, my Warden had enough information - especially when found out that the werewolves could talk - to start looking for answers. Therefore, she wouldn't simply "shoot first and ask questions later". After finding out that killing Witherfang would help the Dalish, but not the werewolves, she knew that it would only further provoke the werewolves and that they'd keep attacking the Dalish. So she convinced Zathrian to end the curse, saying, "Would you really let your clan die for this?"

Broken Circle: Merrill is a mage, and while my Warden was slightly angered that Merrill wanted to give up searching, she still loves her, and the same goes for the Keeper. Being a mage is looked at as a gift among the Dalish. All my elf Wardens are simpathetic to mages, since they can relate to the cruelty and discrimination they face.

Sacred Ashes: desecrate the Ashes and ****** off the humans? Umm, no thanks. For this one I had more of a "shoot first and ask questions later" outlook. They tried to kill me, they killed Redcliffe knights, Weylon, tried to kill Genitivi, threatened the guy at the inn in Lake Calenhad. I don't really give a damn about what they have to say. I don't want them to keep hurting people.

Connor: this one really isn't as simple as "Because of my Origin, I am going to do this." In the case of a Dalish Warden, I think that there could be a wide variety of outlooks they might have on it. Mine saved Connor, but that's her character. It really depends on how you plan on shaping your Warden

Paragon of Her Kind: being a Dalish elf, and having more of a "traditional" outlook on things (the Dalish sure do love their traditions) my Dalish Warden sided with Harrowmont. She didn't side with Branka, since, if she supported enslaving living souls, how is she any better than the humans who had enslaved the elves?

As for party, relations with humans, et cetera, my Dalish Warden kind of just said to herself, "Remember, the Keeper told you to do this, so try not to make any rude comments to the humans at Ostagar." Not insulting Cailan was indeed very difficult, but she managed to suppress any rude or angsty comments. If you're Warden would recruit Zevran, then you should do it, even if it means you have another rogue. He says he was sold as a child, so my Warden sympathized (the whole elf-slavery thing again) and let him come along. She ended up getting along with him pretty well, considering his Dalish heritage.

The Dalish outlook on humans also depends on the outlook on Duncan. And we all know that there are a million ways to look at Duncan: he helped protect Bryce Cousland, but he drags away the Noble Origin character whether they want to go or not; he gives Sorris and you a sword so that you can go save the women, but he doesn't bother doing anything except sitting back and watching to see how it all turns out; he helps save you from the taint, but he tells you to give up searching for your friend and doesn't care about whether you would rather die than become a Warden. If you like Duncan, then I think you'd be willing to give humans a chance; if you hate him - not so much.

Not to mention it's kind of easy to determine where a human stands when it comes to elves. There's the armorer at Ostagar who yells at you and treats you like dirt because he mistook you for a red-headed elf, because apparently all elves look alike to him, and then there's Alistair, who doesn't mention that you're an elf even once.

#23
Whitering

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One of my few complaints about DAO is that it does not allow you to be as racist as you should be, especially as a City Elf. Okay, in the Origin you can kill 3 humans (Dalish origin), and you can walk away from Redcliffe, but you can't really be racist throughout the game. It's too bad, it's an RPG and the Elves have good reason to dislike humans in the modern era (forget what you know about the lore).

I side with the mages all the time, only once did I take the kill them route, and only once did I let them live but ask for Templar support; just to see what would happen. I also side with the apostates as my Elf. It's not Flemmeth or Morrigan oppressing the Elves, they themselves are oppressed.

I side with Bhelen, agonize over the ashes. I mean, Andraste and her followers were good to us, but the Chantry was horrible...what to do...

I don't care if Howe got the King killed but I am mad as hell about him shipping Elves off to slavery, so he dies and Alistair will make a decent King if there must be a human King at all, even though I rarely speak to him over the course of the game as an elf. I let humans die, be as racist as the game lets me, but it's not quite enough.

Don't get me wrong, I've played the other side of that once as a Chantry dedicated Templar and there you can wipe out the only elves you spend any time with, and you can sell elves into slavery and kill every mage you meet more or less.

So, it's a bit imbalanced.

#24
Pantherus

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Well I finally finished my last playthrough (Dwarf Noble) and kicked off my Dalish Archer. She's started off well - basically called Cailan a Tool, killed the prisoner for the key, called Jory a coward, Alistair and Morrigan seem nice enough and largely respectful so been nice to them (approval meta-gaming), told the priest arguing with the dodgy seller to sod off and threatened the Revered mother for Sten's key...hehehe...

#25
Pantherus

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I've still been thinking about Sten v Oghren in this playthrough...

I'm sticking with Morrigan (I guess switch to Wynne during Circle Tower), will use Dog until I get Zevran (coldwetn0se convinced me ;)) and have just switched Alistair out for Sten.

After Lothering I'll probably run through the DLC missions (Warden's Keep & RtO) then hit the Dalish Elves, then start Orzammar (for Key of the City and some other equipment) but stop short of hitting the Deep Roads.

The question is - switch Sten to Oghren or not at this point...

I haven't really used either so not sure on relative ability though I know Oghren gets the extra spec but is picked up later so will less optimised skills...what's Oghren's attitude in the main quest decisions...?

I'm also wary of having to duel Sten at Haven (haven't done it before but read about it happening) as an Archer...