575 réponses à ce sujet

[AlanC9]

relhart wrote...


I do this often with RPG's, doesn't mean I don't get my monies worth.  I didn't finish DAO until my third or fourth character, and I had turned off of the automated data upload "feature" long befor that.  The Elder Scrolls games for example, I've gotten hundererds of hours of entertainment from those, and I've never finished any of them.

Why go out of your way to turn that off?

[hexaligned]

AlanC9 wrote...

relhart wrote...


I do this often with RPG's, doesn't mean I don't get my monies worth.  I didn't finish DAO until my third or fourth character, and I had turned off of the automated data upload "feature" long befor that.  The Elder Scrolls games for example, I've gotten hundererds of hours of entertainment from those, and I've never finished any of them.

Why go out of your way to turn that off?

Just gut reaction when I noticed it in the options menu, seemed a bit intursive to me.  That and I'm often streaming large amounts of data, and I didn't want it queuing up for bandwidth, although I'm sure it doesn't take much.

[Sylvius the Mad]

AlanC9 wrote...

Why go out of your way to turn that off?

I typically turn these things off because I value my privacy (take that, Zuckerberg!).

I did, however, intentionally leave DAO's on.  I'm well aware my prefences are not typical, so I wanted my gameplay to influence future game design as much as possible.

[Sylvianus]

DA:I just needs to look good first, and to be really good, taking into account the biggest critics. That's how bioware will bring back fans they may have lost. And many aren't really lost, they are still hoping for something, even if they are negative about the next game.

Modifié par Sylvianus, 17 mai 2013 - 07:38 .

[ArcaneJTM]

AlanC9 wrote...

relhart wrote...


I do this often with RPG's, doesn't mean I don't get my monies worth.  I didn't finish DAO until my third or fourth character, and I had turned off of the automated data upload "feature" long befor that.  The Elder Scrolls games for example, I've gotten hundererds of hours of entertainment from those, and I've never finished any of them.

Why go out of your way to turn that off?

Because it feels pretty intrusive, eats bandwidth and can sometimes cause problems such as causing the game to hang or crash.  I wouldn't even log in if it wasn't required for the DLC.

[Wickwrackscar]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Why go out of your way to turn that off?

I typically turn these things off because I value my privacy (take that, Zuckerberg!).

I did, however, intentionally leave DAO's on.  I'm well aware my prefences are not typical, so I wanted my gameplay to influence future game design as much as possible.

Ha, exactly my attitude.
I don't particularly like that feature for privacy reasons, but if it wasn't for me, Femshep players wouldn't be 18% but 17.999%.

[EpicBoot2daFace]

relhart wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

relhart wrote...


I do this often with RPG's, doesn't mean I don't get my monies worth.  I didn't finish DAO until my third or fourth character, and I had turned off of the automated data upload "feature" long befor that.  The Elder Scrolls games for example, I've gotten hundererds of hours of entertainment from those, and I've never finished any of them.

Why go out of your way to turn that off?

Just gut reaction when I noticed it in the options menu, seemed a bit intursive to me.  That and I'm often streaming large amounts of data, and I didn't want it queuing up for bandwidth, although I'm sure it doesn't take much.

Doesn't it just upload your stats to this site?

[Fast Jimmy]

I'd honestly wonder if the same people who aren't savvy enough to turn off behavior monitoring software are also not the type of people who complete games...?

Just a thought.

[Wickwrackscar]

Fast Jimmy wrote...

I'd honestly wonder if the same people who aren't savvy enough to turn off behavior monitoring software are also not the type of people who complete games...?

Just a thought.

Sadly, those people are also not savvy enough to give much thought into what games they buy. And that — from a developers perspective — is a good thing.

It makes you think: What are fans worth in relation to "mere" customers?

Modifié par General Distress, 17 mai 2013 - 08:31 .

[cJohnOne]

You're saying the 74% that didn't finish DAO aren't tech savvy? Or games in general. I was going to make a joke about agreeing with that, like that sounds right to me.


Edit: Oops that 64% ha,ha.

Modifié par cJohnOne, 17 mai 2013 - 09:30 .

[bEVEsthda]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Fernando Melo gives a breakdown here.

I couldn't be tasked with whether or not 5% is considered significant or not, however.

On this list, I would only expect ME3's number to have changed in any significant manner.

What lengths have Bioware/EA gone to, to assure that these figures are at least somewhat comparable?
And what are the theories about how they are even relevant?

The actual reasons I ask these questions are in my mind very, very good, but I know you'll be angry if I detail them, so I won't. It's not a discussion we should have anyway.

Instead I'll offer the following observations:

I've of course completed DA:O, but I've absolutely NOT completed every DA:O game I've started. I'm not even sure that was even my goal for those games.
I'm also absolutely certain that Bioware have NOT been able to record a single DA:O completion of mine, but if they had, how would my games fit into that statistics? Would I be noted as one game that has been completed? Or would I be recorded as, say, 40% completed, 60% not completed?

The degree of popularity and customer satisfaction with games, in the communities that I'm able to investigate, do not seem to correlate to completion of said games,.. at all.

This also totally reflect my own relationship with games. Some games which totally pissed me off, I have indeed completed. And I have a pretty big pile of games that I like, and which I always planned and still plan to complete, while that may actually never happen, because other games and things keep happening to life.
Finally, I can confidently state that I will never, ever  complete Morrowind or Skyrim. But I will keep playing them, and I will keep buying their sequels.

[Allan Schumacher]

What lengths have Bioware/EA gone to, to assure that these figures are at least somewhat comparable?
And what are the theories about how they are even relevant?

I don't know all the details. I don't really deal with telemetry.

The actual reasons I ask these questions are in my mind very, very good, but I know you'll be angry if I detail them, so I won't. It's not a discussion we should have anyway.

Yet you mention it which spurs my curiosity without having to actually say anything. Kind of like saying "I have a secret, but I'm not going to tell you it."  Was that on purpose?

I've of course completed DA:O, but I've absolutely NOT completed every DA:O game I've started. I'm not even sure that was even my goal for those games.
I'm also absolutely certain that Bioware have NOT been able to record a single DA:O completion of mine, but if they had, how would my games fit into that statistics? Would I be noted as one game that has been completed? Or would I be recorded as, say, 40% completed, 60% not completed?

By my understanding (which might be incorrect), you'll be flagged as "completed the game." Subsequent attempts to restart the game will increment new games started and so forth, but when I did some cursory inquiries for a DA Week project, the feedback I got from analytics was that they were able to determine if a user had completed the game at all. When looking at the median time that people played ME3, they had the outliers that had logged hundreds of hours (only in the single player), which seems to indicate that they were looking at total time spent in the single player game, regardless of playthrough 1 or playthrough 20.

This also totally reflect my own relationship with games. Some games which totally pissed me off, I have indeed completed. And I have a pretty big pile of games that I like, and which I always planned and still plan to complete, while that may actually never happen, because other games and things keep happening to life.
Finally, I can confidently state that I will never, ever complete Morrowind or Skyrim. But I will keep playing them, and I will keep buying their sequels.

Sure, but I suspect you're probably playing those games for a lot longer than, say, 9 hours or so. Am I correct?

There's a difference between our games and Bethesda's games.

Modifié par Allan Schumacher, 17 mai 2013 - 09:35 .

[Fast Jimmy]

Yet you mention it which spurs my curiosity without having to actually say anything. Kind of like saying "I have a secret, but I'm not going to tell you it." Was that on purpose?

To be fair, it could be considered a bit of reverse trolling, given how often Bioware does that to us.

EDIT:

Sure, but I suspect you're probably playing those games for a lot longer than, say, 9 hours or so. Am I correct?

There's a difference between our games and Bethesda's games.

I'm not sure I understand this. Are you saying Bioware games usually only are played for nine hours? Or it only takes nine hours to beat? 

Modifié par Fast Jimmy, 17 mai 2013 - 09:39 .

[Allan Schumacher]

My assumption is that it was done to get me to think about what those criticisms may be, but at this point that's neither here nor there for this thread.

[Fast Jimmy]

General Distress wrote...

Fast Jimmy wrote...

I'd honestly wonder if the same people who aren't savvy enough to turn off behavior monitoring software are also not the type of people who complete games...?

Just a thought.

Sadly, those people are also not savvy enough to give much thought into what games they buy. And that — from a developers perspective — is a good thing.

It makes you think: What are fans worth in relation to "mere" customers?
 

Fans (should) mean a ton to a developer.

Because the kind of consumer who picks up a game for $60 just as a way to waste some time is also likely to be pretty easily influenced by the opinions of other gamers. After all, they don't care all that much, but if this dude at GameStop is ranting about how terrible a game is and how it has pretty much destroyed the series and ruined their outlook on gaming as a whole... chances are that customer is going to put that game down. This goes for similar fan fare on the Internet.

If a cursory search on your game results in people complaining about it, I'll read a few paragraphs and write it off. I've done it wih numerous games that I thought looked interesting, but had bad responses from fans. 

[Uccio]

Enigmatick wrote...

^Wait I don't get it. Did he have trouble turning the camera? You're supposed to rebind move left and move right to A and D and use the right mouse button to free form control the camera, no one uses the keys to turn.(I seriously hope no one does at least.)

Exactly, its very smooth to use buttons and mouse together.

[Merci357]

Fast Jimmy wrote...

If a cursory search on your game results in people complaining about it, I'll read a few paragraphs and write it off. I've done it wih numerous games that I thought looked interesting, but had bad responses from fans. 

But why would you do that? If I'd listen to bad "fan" feedback, I'd missed a few games I really enjoyed, Alpha Protocol, for example.
Not buying at launch, sure. I might wait until a Steam or Amazon sale a few month down the line, but for 5-15 bucks (depending on the game in question) I'm willing to take a shot and try it for myself. There are very few games per year that I buy at release, but at lower price points I'm open to try some more. And the added bonus is, maybe some issues people complained are patched by then as well.
And, to be honest, of course I picked up some awful experiences that way, but there are underrated gems out there as well - from my personal POV.

[Fast Jimmy]

StreetMagic wrote...

Fans should obviously mean a lot to a developer. "Fans" who show time and again that they don't actually like the games anymore, and behave more like competitors, and care more about their own game design ideas than anyone else's.. Well, they really shouldn't mean that much. These people are ready to graduate towards making their own game. Instead, they still sit around and latch on to other people's stuff.

True. These "fans" could also realize they don't have the tools, skills or know how to make their own game but found a great number of indie developers who share their similar view on game design and helped crowd source them. They could then be killing time until those games come out, seeing if Bioware will still be a contender for their free time once half a dozen of so games will be coming out in 2014.

If such "fans" were to exist, that is. 

[Fast Jimmy]

StreetMagic wrote...

And I say more power to them. Crowdsourcing is far more productive than banging one's head into a wall.

Why not both?

[Dave of Canada]

I've been known from a rabid fan to rabid hater, I'm often times throwing my own ideas out there because they are things I'd like to see introduced and presented in the game.

Some are unrealistic and I know when I'm writing them down but it doesn't stop me form throwing the idea out, I don't know what guidelines which the Dragon Age team follows or how they'd want me to construct my criticism / desires.

I just do it and hope somewhere out there, someone reads it and understands my position. They might not agree with it but hopefully understand it.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 17 mai 2013 - 11:46 .

[hitenchi]

Plaintiff wrote...

BasilKarlo wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...
I'm not saying that nobody liked Origins, unlike you, claiming that everybody loved it.

I'm not going to have a discussion with someone who can't stop himself from telling lies to put words in my mouth.

But it's perfectly okay for you to put lies in anyone else's mouth! It's only hypocrisy when other people do it, right?

Or maybe I'm giving you too much credit and you just didn't have any idea what I was actually saying.

Something that i think is worth mentioning is that Da:O was a slow seller. It sold very well however the sales increased (unlike most games) after the first month and te continued selling not mazingly but DA::2 which sold a lot better within the first month but than had very few sales afterwards.

[Fast Jimmy]

^

<shrug> Cheaper than an MMA fight ticket?

EDIT: And, in my experience, complaints don't pit fans against each other. If anything, complaints ABOUT fans complaining are the start of SO many more forum p!ssing matches.

Modifié par Fast Jimmy, 18 mai 2013 - 12:32 .