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Cassandra, one of the main villains?


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#101
LobselVith8

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Jaison1986 wrote...

I had been wondering for an while, but do you think Cassandra and her Seekers might be one of the imposing forces in Inquisition? After seeing what she is trying to do in DA 2 and remembering Morrigan words in Witch hunt:

"Change will come to the world, but some will not accept this change, and will fight it with every fiber of their being"

Makes me wonder if she was refering to people such as Cassandra, who can't accept the world is changing, and if your character is someone who approves of change, will end up clashing with her one way or another.


I suppose it depends on who you see as the good guys and the bad guys. If Cassandra is allied to Divine Justina V, then I suppose any protagonist who sees the Andrastian Chantry as an enemy would view her as an antagonist or a villain.

#102
ElitePinecone

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Gregolian wrote...

I get this feeling she will be essentially like Alistair was in DA:O and your sibling/Varric were in DAII. The first companion you get.


I was thinking this too, especially given some of the things that apparently happen around the beginning of DA3.

#103
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iOnlySignIn wrote...

She's too cute to be a villain.



#104
esper

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LobselVith8 wrote...

Jaison1986 wrote...

I had been wondering for an while, but do you think Cassandra and her Seekers might be one of the imposing forces in Inquisition? After seeing what she is trying to do in DA 2 and remembering Morrigan words in Witch hunt:

"Change will come to the world, but some will not accept this change, and will fight it with every fiber of their being"

Makes me wonder if she was refering to people such as Cassandra, who can't accept the world is changing, and if your character is someone who approves of change, will end up clashing with her one way or another.


I suppose it depends on who you see as the good guys and the bad guys. If Cassandra is allied to Divine Justina V, then I suppose any protagonist who sees the Andrastian Chantry as an enemy would view her as an antagonist or a villain.


It would be cool if we got that choice. But if we are speaking realistcally now and not just potential, I fear she will be forced onto us the same way Alistair and Varric were.

Still, I really don't want to help her... or go myth hunting. I am really thinking that I won't like da:I very much, right now.

#105
Knight of Dane

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Generally I'd still just prefer no returning characters as companions.

#106
esper

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Knight of Dane wrote...

Generally I'd still just prefer no returning characters as companions.


Yeah, that is the general rule. But it is not likely. (Though I don't mind absolutely minor characters with no personality yet to return, such as Isabella or Merrill)

#107
rockits

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If she is a companion I wonder what Cassandra would want from our protagonist, a nobody. I mean, she should have several able Seekers at her disposal. Unless they are brought together by lets say... Flemeth. She has a good eye for finding heroes after all.

#108
LobselVith8

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esper wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

I suppose it depends on who you see as the good guys and the bad guys. If Cassandra is allied to Divine Justina V, then I suppose any protagonist who sees the Andrastian Chantry as an enemy would view her as an antagonist or a villain.


It would be cool if we got that choice. But if we are speaking realistcally now and not just potential, I fear she will be forced onto us the same way Alistair and Varric were.

Still, I really don't want to help her... or go myth hunting. I am really thinking that I won't like da:I very much, right now.


Gaider did admit some companions would be mandatory in Inquisition. I really don't see why Cassandra would want to work with an anti-Chantry or pro-mage protagonist in the first place, however. Or why the protagonist would want to work with her if they are morally opposed to the goals of the other.

#109
wright1978

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esper wrote...

Knight of Dane wrote...

Generally I'd still just prefer no returning characters as companions.


Yeah, that is the general rule. But it is not likely. (Though I don't mind absolutely minor characters with no personality yet to return, such as Isabella or Merrill)


Expansion of side characters into fully fledged companions(such as Isabela/Merrill) examples is something i very much approve of.

#110
ElitePinecone

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LobselVith8 wrote...
I really don't see why Cassandra would want to work with an anti-Chantry or pro-mage protagonist in the first place, however. Or why the protagonist would want to work with her if they are morally opposed to the goals of the other.


Perhaps there are mutual goals more important to both of them than their personal views on the mage/templar issue. It wouldn't be the first time that two people were forced to put diverging opinions or personality clashes aside in pursuit of a much more urgent threat (see: practically every Bioware game, ever). If Cassandra and the protagonist feel that working together is necessary, even if they fundamentally disagree on a number of big issues, that's not unreasonable. 

It's a little contrived that the player protagonist instantly commands enough respect to (mostly) keep party members around even if their goals on various issues are totally dissimilar, but it's probably a necessary trope of the 'epic heroic journey/player power trip' style of storytelling. 

#111
ComfortablyNumb

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If she's actually a companion, I hope they change her VA. I couldn't stand it...

#112
Knight of Dane

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esper wrote...

Knight of Dane wrote...

Generally I'd still just prefer no returning characters as companions.


Yeah, that is the general rule. But it is not likely. (Though I don't mind absolutely minor characters with no personality yet to return, such as Isabella or Merrill)

I was okay with them too, but I would have preffered less. Like one or the other.
I just think Thedas becomes small when so many known faces are in the same place.
Even if it's Kirkwall and it's right next door to the Citadel, I mean, Ferelden.

#113
Knight of Dane

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mrufka_z wrote...

If she's actually a companion, I hope they change her VA. I couldn't stand it...

Isn't she the same as Dulci De Launcet?

I know she's Varania too..

#114
Sir George Parr

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Knight of Dane wrote...

mrufka_z wrote...

If she's actually a companion, I hope they change her VA. I couldn't stand it...

Isn't she the same as Dulci De Launcet?

I know she's Varania too..

I thought miranda raison just did the voice for cassandra.

#115
Knight of Dane

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No, IMDb states she did Cassandra, Varania and additional voices.

#116
azarhal

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XM-417 wrote...

Knight of Dane wrote...

mrufka_z wrote...

If she's actually a companion, I hope they change her VA. I couldn't stand it...

Isn't she the same as Dulci De Launcet?

I know she's Varania too..

I thought miranda raison just did the voice for cassandra.


No, she voiced like 50% the female NPCs that were not companions. Only Cassandra and Varania are credited, the others fall into "aditional voices".  Like Dulci De Launcet, the hangman waitress and I'm pretty sure Lirene in the Ferelden's Import.

#117
ComfortablyNumb

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Knight of Dane wrote...

mrufka_z wrote...

If she's actually a companion, I hope they change her VA. I couldn't stand it...

Isn't she the same as Dulci De Launcet?

I know she's Varania too..


I couldn't stomach Dulci either, though I don't remember Varania ticking me in the wrong way.

But as Cassandra, she had the most lines, so maybe that's why I remember that character most.

#118
Cyberstrike nTo

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esper wrote...

StreetMagic wrote...

You're both different types of fans, I guess.

If I was sitting at a campfire with a good storyteller, I'd feel a little empty after he/she finished. I'd want to hear more. Some people are a well of entertainment. I think the same way with a good game world. I want to pick the brains of the writers, and hear whatever they have to offer. If the world as a whole they've dreamed up is cool, I don't recoil when I get the chance to hear more of it.


I have had to many movie based on books ruin both the book and the movie for me if I read the book first or saw the film first. I have had few similary experience with games, manga/cartoons/movies/books, based on games. I am very cautious when it comes to mixing medieas as an result.

I dragon age it comes down to us having a personal canon. I simply do not wish to know the writers canon. Since they claim that dragon age is still foremost a game universe, I want to see it in the game. The current number of comic worries me a lot and I am beginning to be cautious of wherever I should simply leave the franchnise after Inquistion. It depends on how they handle the comics and asunder in the game, I guess. If the game become intangible withouth having read the extra material I am out.

Edit. An none of this have anything to do with Cassandra.


For me I would say the first 2 novels (The Stolen Throne and The Calling) are part of the game's universe because they take place before the events of DA:O and deal with characters in that game that have major roles (Loghain, Duncan, and The Architect) in the game's storyline and the same with Dawn of the Seeker gives you insight to a character's history and backstory that  seems to have a major role in the future of the franchise.  

Asunder and the Dark Horse comics aren't because of characters like Wynne, Shale, Alistair, Isabela, and Varric and take place after the events the games and can contradict many of the possible fates for these characters.    

#119
Cyberstrike nTo

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mrufka_z wrote...

Knight of Dane wrote...

mrufka_z wrote...

If she's actually a companion, I hope they change her VA. I couldn't stand it...

Isn't she the same as Dulci De Launcet?

I know she's Varania too..


I couldn't stomach Dulci either, though I don't remember Varania ticking me in the wrong way.

But as Cassandra, she had the most lines, so maybe that's why I remember that character most.


And here I thought Dulci was supposed to be annoying because she's a noble nitwit. 

#120
Tinxa

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Cyberstrike nTo wrote...

mrufka_z wrote...

Knight of Dane wrote...

mrufka_z wrote...

If she's actually a companion, I hope they change her VA. I couldn't stand it...

Isn't she the same as Dulci De Launcet?

I know she's Varania too..


I couldn't stomach Dulci either, though I don't remember Varania ticking me in the wrong way.

But as Cassandra, she had the most lines, so maybe that's why I remember that character most.


And here I thought Dulci was supposed to be annoying because she's a noble nitwit. 


This. I don't understand why people hate Dulci or Isolde. They're exaggerated on purpose and are made to be cliche and annoying noble women with over the top french accents. I think they're fun characters.

#121
esper

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Cyberstrike nTo wrote...

esper wrote...

StreetMagic wrote...

You're both different types of fans, I guess.

If I was sitting at a campfire with a good storyteller, I'd feel a little empty after he/she finished. I'd want to hear more. Some people are a well of entertainment. I think the same way with a good game world. I want to pick the brains of the writers, and hear whatever they have to offer. If the world as a whole they've dreamed up is cool, I don't recoil when I get the chance to hear more of it.


I have had to many movie based on books ruin both the book and the movie for me if I read the book first or saw the film first. I have had few similary experience with games, manga/cartoons/movies/books, based on games. I am very cautious when it comes to mixing medieas as an result.

I dragon age it comes down to us having a personal canon. I simply do not wish to know the writers canon. Since they claim that dragon age is still foremost a game universe, I want to see it in the game. The current number of comic worries me a lot and I am beginning to be cautious of wherever I should simply leave the franchnise after Inquistion. It depends on how they handle the comics and asunder in the game, I guess. If the game become intangible withouth having read the extra material I am out.

Edit. An none of this have anything to do with Cassandra.


For me I would say the first 2 novels (The Stolen Throne and The Calling) are part of the game's universe because they take place before the events of DA:O and deal with characters in that game that have major roles (Loghain, Duncan, and The Architect) in the game's storyline and the same with Dawn of the Seeker gives you insight to a character's history and backstory that  seems to have a major role in the future of the franchise.  

Asunder and the Dark Horse comics aren't because of characters like Wynne, Shale, Alistair, Isabela, and Varric and take place after the events the games and can contradict many of the possible fates for these characters.    


Wow. Can't believe that I have to say this again. I will try once more. I must not have been clear.

It is not about canon. (That is an issue with the later books, but that is not about this). It is not about characterization in iteself

I don't do cross-media because the transition between the medias is often bad. Books, movies, games are different medias and have very different strenghts and unfortunately weaknessess.

As an example. Stohlen Throne might give and an eccellent characterzation of Loghain. Unfortunately in its very nature that same characterzation might just highlight the game's weaknesses in writing. Retro-perspective making the book annyoing to read because you can't let go of the nagging thought of 'I know how ruined this character become' and the game is destroyed by 'the writing is simply not good enough'.

I am not saying this is the actual case as I have not read Stohlen Throne, but I have had such transitions ruin both experiences for me enough time in the past that I simply just don't do cross-media anymore if I love the first example of the narrative I get.

#122
LobselVith8

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ElitePinecone wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

I really don't see why Cassandra would want to work with an anti-Chantry or pro-mage protagonist in the first place, however. Or why the protagonist would want to work with her if they are morally opposed to the goals of the other.


Perhaps there are mutual goals more important to both of them than their personal views on the mage/templar issue. It wouldn't be the first time that two people were forced to put diverging opinions or personality clashes aside in pursuit of a much more urgent threat (see: practically every Bioware game, ever). If Cassandra and the protagonist feel that working together is necessary, even if they fundamentally disagree on a number of big issues, that's not unreasonable.


Shouldn't that choice be with the player - to have Cassandra has a companion?

ElitePinecone wrote...

It's a little contrived that the player protagonist instantly commands enough respect to (mostly) keep party members around even if their goals on various issues are totally dissimilar, but it's probably a necessary trope of the 'epic heroic journey/player power trip' style of storytelling. 


Not that I dispute what you're saying, but my problem with it is that it doesn't make sense at times, like when Fenris continues to remain at the side of Hawke if he endorses slavery and has his own slave. It feels more like a game mechanic than an actual part of the narrative.

#123
ElitePinecone

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LobselVith8 wrote...

Shouldn't that choice be with the player - to have Cassandra has a companion?


I don't think player choice can - or should - be the priority in every aspect of the game. If Cassandra is a companion - even the starting companion - perhaps she's immensely important to the plot of the game. Perhaps a lot of the story elements hinge on having her around, or perhaps the dramatic tension in some storylines depends on her reaction to the player's decisions. 

Point being: the discomfort felt by some players about the companion is less important than the (hypothetical) necessity of having the character present, assuming that''s the path they've chosen to go down - and we don't know if it is. Complete freedom to determine the party composition just because you disagree with certain characters might be an interesting player choice, but it's also costly and probably difficult to implement for the developers. At some point, their vision of the game is going to limit what the player is allowed to do.

#124
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ElitePinecone wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

Shouldn't that choice be with the player - to have Cassandra has a companion?


I don't think player choice can - or should - be the priority in every aspect of the game. If Cassandra is a companion - even the starting companion - perhaps she's immensely important to the plot of the game. Perhaps a lot of the story elements hinge on having her around, or perhaps the dramatic tension in some storylines depends on her reaction to the player's decisions. 

Point being: the discomfort felt by some players about the companion is less important than the (hypothetical) necessity of having the character present, assuming that''s the path they've chosen to go down - and we don't know if it is. Complete freedom to determine the party composition just because you disagree with certain characters might be an interesting player choice, but it's also costly and probably difficult to implement for the developers. At some point, their vision of the game is going to limit what the player is allowed to do.



Don't even bother. Some players think they're an integral part of the game experience. I don't think there will ever be a resolution to that subject.

Modifié par StreetMagic, 17 mai 2013 - 03:57 .


#125
74 Wrex

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Cassandra being a villian is completely out of the question for me
She should be a companion in DA 3