360 réponses à ce sujet

[Faust1979]

Jadebaby wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

iakus wrote...

It's Bioware trolling the players:

"Don't like our endings? Frak you! Rocks fall! Everyone dies!"

This..

You getting it if you dare shoot at their starbrat is pretty telling.

Realistically speaking he flat out tells you how to kill him. Getting "SO BE IT" at you shooting at a hologram (that he can't even feel) is utterly ridculous.

Shep can be all "Yeah I'm blowing you up. Point the way plzthx." 

"Sure go that way then that way"

But shooting him is going TOO FAR.

Not to mention that the way BioWare portrayed AI's in those final minutes, an AI even having such feelings is a ridiculous notion in itself.

I wouldn't say it's ridiculous there's been countless classic sci fi stories where AI's or machines are shown to have feelings of some sort

[BansheeOwnage]

Jadebaby wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

iakus wrote...

It's Bioware trolling the players:

"Don't like our endings? Frak you! Rocks fall! Everyone dies!"

This..

You getting it if you dare shoot at their starbrat is pretty telling.

Realistically speaking he flat out tells you how to kill him. Getting "SO BE IT" at you shooting at a hologram (that he can't even feel) is utterly ridculous.

Shep can be all "Yeah I'm blowing you up. Point the way plzthx." 

"Sure go that way then that way"

But shooting him is going TOO FAR.

Not to mention that the way BioWare portrayed AI's in those final minutes, an AI even having such feelings is a ridiculous notion in itself.

Exactly. "Use the crucible to destroy us, that's a solution. But you can't do it any other way. No, don't ask me why! It just has to be my way."

Faust1979 wrote...
tied up the game, brought closure Synthesis seemed to create some kind of utopia and in the destroy ending the worlds slowly rebuilt themselves, they both ended as peacefully as they could, it gave me what I wanted in the game.

That was never the point of ME. It was to return things to the way they were, not create a utopia.

[BansheeOwnage]

Faust1979 wrote...

Jadebaby wrote...

Not to mention that the way BioWare portrayed AI's in those final minutes, an AI even having such feelings is a ridiculous notion in itself.

I wouldn't say it's ridiculous there's been countless classic sci fi stories where AI's or machines are shown to have feelings of some sort

Which is why she specified Bioware's AIs, specifically this AI, who is supposed to be coldly logical. He shouldn't have a temper tantrum because you put a bullet through a projection. Especially considering he considers his own destruction a "solution".

Modifié par BansheeOwnage, 19 mai 2013 - 07:39 .

[Cainhurst Crow]

People wanted to reject the options, they even said so, and specifically said that even if it cost them the war, they would choose it.

Once they were given it, they automatically demanded that bioware give further concession and simply make refuse an automatic victory where no identifiable npc's are killed and everyone gets to live happily ever after. And do not for a moment try to claim that that isn't what they wanted, otherwise MEHEM would not be as popular as it is.

People are just being bratty and whiny that they can't just bypass the catalyst and win the game, and have their headcanon and waifu served to them on a gold and diamond encrusted platter.

[BansheeOwnage]

Darth Brotarian wrote...

People wanted to reject the options, they even said so, and specifically said that even if it cost them the war, they would choose it.

Once they were given it, they automatically demanded that bioware give further concession and simply make refuse an automatic victory where no identifiable npc's are killed and everyone gets to live happily ever after. And do not for a moment try to claim that that isn't what they wanted, otherwise MEHEM would not be as popular as it is.

People are just being bratty and whiny that they can't just bypass the catalyst and win the game, and have their headcanon and waifu served to them on a gold and diamond encrusted platter.

People just wanted a good end, with closure. They didn't want to have the last part of a character-driven trilogy be turned into an artistic experiment. That really isn't too much to ask.

[Faust1979]

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Jadebaby wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

iakus wrote...

It's Bioware trolling the players:

"Don't like our endings? Frak you! Rocks fall! Everyone dies!"

This..

You getting it if you dare shoot at their starbrat is pretty telling.

Realistically speaking he flat out tells you how to kill him. Getting "SO BE IT" at you shooting at a hologram (that he can't even feel) is utterly ridculous.

Shep can be all "Yeah I'm blowing you up. Point the way plzthx." 

"Sure go that way then that way"

But shooting him is going TOO FAR.

Not to mention that the way BioWare portrayed AI's in those final minutes, an AI even having such feelings is a ridiculous notion in itself.

Exactly. "Use the crucible to destroy us, that's a solution. But you can't do it any other way. No, don't ask me why! It just has to be my way."

Faust1979 wrote...
tied up the game, brought closure Synthesis seemed to create some kind of utopia and in the destroy ending the worlds slowly rebuilt themselves, they both ended as peacefully as they could, it gave me what I wanted in the game.

That was never the point of ME. It was to return things to the way they were, not create a utopia.

that isn't the point of the game for me, it's to end the war whatever the cost and to save lives in whatever way possible.  That is Shepeards goal to save lives making choices the ones that no one else wants to make

[Han Shot First]

Eain wrote...

Lots of gullible Shepards in this thread.

There is nothing gullible about choosing not to epic fail.

Refuse is a critical mission failure by a tactically incompetent Shepard who isn't fit to lead a girl scout troop.

Modifié par Han Shot First, 19 mai 2013 - 07:45 .

[Faust1979]

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Darth Brotarian wrote...

People wanted to reject the options, they even said so, and specifically said that even if it cost them the war, they would choose it.

Once they were given it, they automatically demanded that bioware give further concession and simply make refuse an automatic victory where no identifiable npc's are killed and everyone gets to live happily ever after. And do not for a moment try to claim that that isn't what they wanted, otherwise MEHEM would not be as popular as it is.

People are just being bratty and whiny that they can't just bypass the catalyst and win the game, and have their headcanon and waifu served to them on a gold and diamond encrusted platter.

People just wanted a good end, with closure. They didn't want to have the last part of a character-driven trilogy be turned into an artistic experiment. That really isn't too much to ask.

I'm actually glad it ended with the game trying to be artistic it still brought lots of closure. To many games have the same ending. Some video gamers complain that video games hold your hand to much and don't make you think, well Bioware did something different, they brought closure to a fantastic story line and tried to make you think at the same time.

[Jadebaby]

I love it when people generalize saying "well you people wanted it"... basically unless you know exactly which people they are, you might as well shut it. Because there probably isn't one of those people talking in this thread. And even if you did know who they are, then that's for you to take up with them individually if you ever see them complain about refuse.

Overall, it really shows how desperate people were to escape those nightmare endings if they were asking for a failed refuse scenario..

Those endings were the worst thing to ever happen to Mass Effect, worst thing to happen to any game ever. In my experience.

[Ryzaki]

Han Shot First wrote...

Eain wrote...

Lots of gullible Shepards in this thread.

There is nothing gullible about choosing not to epic fail.

Refuse is a critical mission failure by a tactically incompetent Shepard who isn't fit to lead a girl scout troop.

Or a Shepard that thinks his/her enemy can't seriously hand him/her a victory on a platter. (like my refuse shep)

Sadly that Shep was wrong. The reapers are that stupid. Apparently the council weren't the only people deserving of a darwin award.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 19 mai 2013 - 07:49 .

[BansheeOwnage]

Jadebaby wrote...

I love it when people generalize saying "well you people wanted it"... basically unless you know exactly which people they are, you might as well shut it. Because there probably isn't one of those people talking in this thread. And even if you did know who they are, then that's for you to take up with them individually if you ever see them complain about refuse.

Overall, it really shows how desperate people were to escape those nightmare endings if they were asking for a failed refuse scenario..

Those endings were the worst thing to ever happen to Mass Effect, worst thing to happen to any game ever. In my experience.

+ ∞

[Liamv2]

The refusal ending is a massive **** you for not paying attention the story from bioware

[Cainhurst Crow]

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Darth Brotarian wrote...

People wanted to reject the options, they even said so, and specifically said that even if it cost them the war, they would choose it.

Once they were given it, they automatically demanded that bioware give further concession and simply make refuse an automatic victory where no identifiable npc's are killed and everyone gets to live happily ever after. And do not for a moment try to claim that that isn't what they wanted, otherwise MEHEM would not be as popular as it is.

People are just being bratty and whiny that they can't just bypass the catalyst and win the game, and have their headcanon and waifu served to them on a gold and diamond encrusted platter.

People just wanted a good end, with closure. They didn't want to have the last part of a character-driven trilogy be turned into an artistic experiment. That really isn't too much to ask.

What they wanted, from what I observed, is a happy ending where as few characters as possible or impossibly, die. And where no negative consequences occur, and where shepard defeats the reapers without any sort of interaction with them outside of "Let's blow them up" and done.

There's nothing wrong with that, but some honesty from this fanbase outside of using deceptive masking words for what they really mean would be appreciated.

[Jadebaby]

Faust1979 wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Darth Brotarian wrote...

People wanted to reject the options, they even said so, and specifically said that even if it cost them the war, they would choose it.

Once they were given it, they automatically demanded that bioware give further concession and simply make refuse an automatic victory where no identifiable npc's are killed and everyone gets to live happily ever after. And do not for a moment try to claim that that isn't what they wanted, otherwise MEHEM would not be as popular as it is.

People are just being bratty and whiny that they can't just bypass the catalyst and win the game, and have their headcanon and waifu served to them on a gold and diamond encrusted platter.

People just wanted a good end, with closure. They didn't want to have the last part of a character-driven trilogy be turned into an artistic experiment. That really isn't too much to ask.

I'm actually glad it ended with the game trying to be artistic it still brought lots of closure. To many games have the same ending. Some video gamers complain that video games hold your hand to much and don't make you think, well Bioware did something different, they brought closure to a fantastic story line and tried to make you think at the same time.

That's crap, it was sloppy in presentation with the only forshadowing being injected retroactively through a dlc you have to pay additional money for.

If they didn't abandon core themes and characters, it may have worked, as it stands... They really are bad.

It's reminiscent to me of a homeless man creating a beautiful painting, then for his final touch he tries to get really artsy and starts defecating on the canvas and using a sausage roll as a brush to paint a "masterpiece of sh**."

[Jadebaby]

Darth Brotarian wrote...

What they wanted, from what I observed, is a happy ending where as few characters as possible or impossibly, die. And where no negative consequences occur, and where shepard defeats the reapers without any sort of interaction with them outside of "Let's blow them up" and done.

Sure it would be extremely naive of me to think that no one wanted that, but if you think that was most people's problem with the ending, you're a moron.

[Cainhurst Crow]

Jadebaby wrote...

I love it when people generalize saying "well you people wanted it"... basically unless you know exactly which people they are, you might as well shut it. Because there probably isn't one of those people talking in this thread. And even if you did know who they are, then that's for you to take up with them individually if you ever see them complain about refuse.

Overall, it really shows how desperate people were to escape those nightmare endings if they were asking for a failed refuse scenario..

Those endings were the worst thing to ever happen to Mass Effect, worst thing to happen to any game ever. In my experience.

So every time someone says "People want a different ending" they should shut up?

Or "People think bioware sucks" or also "People will buy the next game"?

All I'm asking is to make sure there is equality in what you mean, and not just "anyone who doesn't dislike bioware should shut up."

Outside of that I won't argue, because what you said is pretty accurate imo, even if I don't feel the same way at all.

[BansheeOwnage]

Liamv2 wrote...

The refusal ending is a massive **** you for not paying attention the story from bioware

Says someone with a synthesis banner...

[Cainhurst Crow]

Jadebaby wrote...

Darth Brotarian wrote...

What they wanted, from what I observed, is a happy ending where as few characters as possible or impossibly, die. And where no negative consequences occur, and where shepard defeats the reapers without any sort of interaction with them outside of "Let's blow them up" and done.

Sure it would be extremely naive of me to think that no one wanted that, but if you think that was most people's problem with the ending, you're a moron.

 Do prove have a way to prove me otherwise? How is it that by adding some simple emotionally pleasing scenes, almost half the bioware denouncers on these forums gave in. How is it that the very mod you champion, which has just as little closure or logic as the other endings, is so well supported and proclaimed the true ending? How is it that every time bioware simply does something to enforce a positive emotion in it's story, suddenly a majority of the boards comes on biowares side and says that what they've done is the best thing ever?

[Seboist]

wiggles89 wrote...

So are the people who pick it.

True, "Refuse" is by far the dumbest choice in the franchise. I didn't think it was possible to create one even dumber than destroying the collector base but boy was I wrong.

[TheBlackBaron]

Of course it is. It's the ending you get if you've decided to put the last 100+ hours of gameplay from the series out of your mind and be petulant about not getting the sunshine and ponies ending you wanted.

[Liamv2]

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Liamv2 wrote...

The refusal ending is a massive **** you for not paying attention the story from bioware

Says someone with a synthesis banner...

Synthesis makes a tiny amount of sense with in the context of the story refuse makes NONE

[BansheeOwnage]

Jadebaby wrote...

Darth Brotarian wrote...

What they wanted, from what I observed, is a happy ending where as few characters as possible or impossibly, die. And where no negative consequences occur, and where shepard defeats the reapers without any sort of interaction with them outside of "Let's blow them up" and done.

Sure it would be extremely naive of me to think that no one wanted that, but if you think that was most people's problem with the ending, you're a moron.

+ ∞
People hate it for a lot of reasons, but because it wasn't a super-happy ending isn't a very common one at all. These are by no means all of them, but here are a few of the bigger ones:

- Lack of closure, which =/= ultra-happy ending.
- It came out of nowhere
- It disregards the themes and lore
- It's incredibly lame to introduce a new character that important in the last 10 minute
- Why a kid?

[Leonardo the Magnificent]

Seboist wrote...

wiggles89 wrote...

So are the people who pick it.

True, "Refuse" is by far the dumbest choice in the franchise. I didn't think it was possible to create one even dumber than destroying the collector base but boy was I wrong.

Well, the problem with saving the base is that you're saving it for TIM, who isn't exactly a trustworthy fellow. If there was an option to hand the base over to a safer, less diabolical organization, I would more wholeheartedly endorse saving it. As it stands, I simply don't trust TIM enough to give him the base.

[Faust1979]

Seboist wrote...

wiggles89 wrote...

So are the people who pick it.

True, "Refuse" is by far the dumbest choice in the franchise. I didn't think it was possible to create one even dumber than destroying the collector base but boy was I wrong.

I don't think destroying the collectors base is completely dumb I can see the reasoning behind wanting to destory it to. I've destroyed it in some and I've kept it in others just all depends on what kind of Shepard I'm playing and what I think his thoughts are at the time

[BansheeOwnage]

Seboist wrote...

wiggles89 wrote...

So are the people who pick it.

True, "Refuse" is by far the dumbest choice in the franchise. I didn't think it was possible to create one even dumber than destroying the collector base but boy was I wrong.

Holy crap Idon'teven...