174 réponses à ce sujet

[Stormcutter]

So I just killed the Geth. Not because I didn't fulfill the requirements for peace (The Rally the fleet and Warn the Fleet option were sitting there high and proud), but because saving them felt pointless. I know that I'm going to choose Destroy, which will annihilate them, and I've got plenty War Assets for the best ending. And I can't stand the other endings. Either 'Reaper-Godking' or 'Transhumanism For All'? Not my cup of tea.

Saving them would have felt dirty. Like I was just using them for a bit, before wiping them out. It's like it was a species-wide Hope Spot. It's annoying, because I actually prefer the Geth to the Quarian's on a moral scale. But if they're going to die anyway, why bother? I might as well kill them when they're not true AI's, incapable of truly 'fearing' the end that comes for them.

Anybody else ever feel like this?

[Dunabar]

Just a heads up, your topic is probably about to turn into a battleground between Geth-Quarian supporters.

I do understand where you're coming from though. However, I side with the Quarians each time if peace isn't an option. I can live with machines going to the scrap yard, I cannot live knowing I played a hand in the deaths of children. First time I picked destroy was actually on a Quarian-Geth peace play through and I did feel a little bad, Not "oh my god why did I do that?!" kind of bad. More of a "Ah, well that sucks a bit."

So I guess about 50-50, maybe 30-70 (30 being feeling bad about it)

[Stormcutter]

Dunabar wrote...

Just a heads up, your topic is probably about to turn into a battleground between Geth-Quarian supporters.

I do understand where you're coming from though. However, I side with the Quarians each time if peace isn't an option. I can live with machines going to the scrap yard, I cannot live knowing I played a hand in the deaths of children. First time I picked destroy was actually on a Quarian-Geth peace play through and I did feel a little bad, Not "oh my god why did I do that?!" kind of bad. More of a "Ah, well that sucks a bit."

So I guess about 50-50, maybe 30-70 (30 being feeling bad about it)

If I'm honest, I do favour the Geth more on a moral point. I just have two things stopping me.
A) I'm a Tali fan. So anything that kills her is out of the bat. By virtue of her dedication to the fleet, this extends to them.
They all die anyway in the only ending I can deal with. 

I'd support peace, but what does that do? It just gets the Quarian's hopes up that maybe their children won't have to wear suits before the Geth all melt like a bad rendition of the Wizard of Oz.  Hell, some of them even let Geth into their suits right off the bat. What will that do when the Red Space Magic comes through? Those husks weren't looking too healthy when they got hit with it. Are a bunch of Quarians (and probably the nicest ones, who supported peace) going to get fried?

Modifié par Stormcutter, 20 mai 2013 - 12:17 .

[KiwiQuiche]

Nah, kill the suit-rats then pick Destroy

[Stormcutter]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Nah, kill the suit-rats then pick Destroy

If I was trying to cause a complete genocide of all advanced life, I'd just save time and pick Refuse.

[KiwiQuiche]

Stormcutter wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Nah, kill the suit-rats then pick Destroy

If I was trying to cause a complete genocide of all advanced life, I'd just save time and pick Refuse.

Go ahead, I always pick Refuse and in doing so leaves a good clean slate; hopefully the next cycle isn't as fcuking retarded as the current one who lost their right to live through their stupidity. Quarians included.

[Dunabar]

Stormcutter wrote...

If I'm honest, I do favour the Geth more on a moral point. I just have two things stopping me.
A) I'm a Tali fan. So anything that kills her is out of the bat. By virtue of her dedication to the fleet, this extends to them.
They all die anyway in the only ending I can deal with. 

I'd support peace, but what does that do? It just gets the Quarian's hopes up that maybe their children won't have to wear suits before the Geth all melt like a bad rendition of the Wizard of Oz.  Hell, some of them even let Geth into their suits right off the bat. What will that do when the Red Space Magic comes through? Those husks weren't looking too healthy when they got hit with it. Are a bunch of Quarians (and probably the nicest ones, who supported peace) going to get fried?

Don't know, wouldn't think it would do anything since the Geth are only software. If I had to take a random shot in the dark guess however, I would think it would possibly short out some of the Quarian suit software systems, most likely the ones the Geth software are dedicated into (IE: Jump starting the Quarian immune system and such.) But I don't know honestly, BioWare never went indepth about that stuff.

This was one of my questions though when I picked destroy, so I'm pretty much right there along with you. Once I got my main canon Shepard into ME3 however, the issue was eliminated along with the Geth over Rannoch.

[Stormcutter]

Dunabar wrote...

Stormcutter wrote...

If I'm honest, I do favour the Geth more on a moral point. I just have two things stopping me.
A) I'm a Tali fan. So anything that kills her is out of the bat. By virtue of her dedication to the fleet, this extends to them.
They all die anyway in the only ending I can deal with. 

I'd support peace, but what does that do? It just gets the Quarian's hopes up that maybe their children won't have to wear suits before the Geth all melt like a bad rendition of the Wizard of Oz.  Hell, some of them even let Geth into their suits right off the bat. What will that do when the Red Space Magic comes through? Those husks weren't looking too healthy when they got hit with it. Are a bunch of Quarians (and probably the nicest ones, who supported peace) going to get fried?

Don't know, wouldn't think it would do anything since the Geth are only software. If I had to take a random shot in the dark guess however, I would think it would possibly short out some of the Quarian suit software systems, most likely the ones the Geth software are dedicated into (IE: Jump starting the Quarian immune system and such.) But I don't know honestly, BioWare never went indepth about that stuff.

This was one of my questions though when I picked destroy, so I'm pretty much right there along with you. Once I got my main canon Shepard into ME3 however, the issue was eliminated along with the Geth over Rannoch.

Just out of interest, did you have the choice for peace and choose not to take it like I did, or had your playthough gone in a way that you didn't have the choice to begin with?

[justafan]

I'm in the "why are the Geth giving up their ME2 values?" Camp and I have actually considered destroying them even with peace both because of your reasons, and I figure I might as well let them die as themselves instead of being rewritten by reaper code and destroyed later on. After all, I always destroy the Heretics because I feel rewriting is more immoral, and this is Reaper code we are talking about distributing here, because nothing ever goes wrong distributing reaper code willy nilly.

[Dunabar]

Stormcutter wrote...

Dunabar wrote...

Stormcutter wrote...

If I'm honest, I do favour the Geth more on a moral point. I just have two things stopping me.
A) I'm a Tali fan. So anything that kills her is out of the bat. By virtue of her dedication to the fleet, this extends to them.
They all die anyway in the only ending I can deal with. 

I'd support peace, but what does that do? It just gets the Quarian's hopes up that maybe their children won't have to wear suits before the Geth all melt like a bad rendition of the Wizard of Oz.  Hell, some of them even let Geth into their suits right off the bat. What will that do when the Red Space Magic comes through? Those husks weren't looking too healthy when they got hit with it. Are a bunch of Quarians (and probably the nicest ones, who supported peace) going to get fried?

Don't know, wouldn't think it would do anything since the Geth are only software. If I had to take a random shot in the dark guess however, I would think it would possibly short out some of the Quarian suit software systems, most likely the ones the Geth software are dedicated into (IE: Jump starting the Quarian immune system and such.) But I don't know honestly, BioWare never went indepth about that stuff.

This was one of my questions though when I picked destroy, so I'm pretty much right there along with you. Once I got my main canon Shepard into ME3 however, the issue was eliminated along with the Geth over Rannoch.

Just out of interest, did you have the choice for peace and choose not to take it like I did, or had your playthough gone in a way that you didn't have the choice to begin with?

With my pure paragon Shepard (Soldier) I had the choice of peace. Even though I don't like the Geth, I still made peace regardless.

With my paragade canon Shepard (Infiltrator) Legion was deactivated (killed) during the suicide mission. My Canon Shepard is actually RP'ed out, so I take his choice into consideration over my own personal choices. But he was in love with Tali, so siding with her over legion just made sense with him. He ensured Tali didn't get exiled, he encouraged the Quarians to go to war, he encouraged the counter-attack, rescued Korris, etc etc etc...but ultimately peace wasn't an option because of the Geth V.I.

edit note: Had to go afk while typing, wanted to get a base response in before the full one.

Modifié par Dunabar, 20 mai 2013 - 12:51 .

[Stormcutter]

justafan wrote...

I'm in the "why are the Geth giving up their ME2 values?" Camp and I have actually considered destroying them even with peace both because of your reasons, and I figure I might as well let them die as themselves instead of being rewritten by reaper code and destroyed later on. After all, I always destroy the Heretics because I feel rewriting is more immoral, and this is Reaper code we are talking about distributing here, because nothing ever goes wrong distributing reaper code willy nilly.

Honestly, the only reason the peace option is even there at this point is the fact that I try and play more or less perfectly, disregarding things I don't want to do. That means everybody lives and pretty much all sidequests get done.

I'd almost prefer the option isn't there, just so I don't have to put up with the vague guilt of not picking it, even though I know that in the end, it'll do nothing at all for the Geth as they are all going to die. Maybe I'll do a Citadel DLC runthrough to distract myself for a bit.

And thanks for the explanation, Dunabar.

Modifié par Stormcutter, 20 mai 2013 - 12:54 .

[Phatose]

Does it not strike you as odd that using them causes you guilt, while annihilating them does not?

[Stormcutter]

Phatose wrote...

Does it not strike you as odd that using them causes you guilt, while annihilating them does not?

Every ending causes me some guilt. It's just that Destroy causes me less than the others. If I'm going to end up annihilating them one way or another, giving their whole species true sapience, just to annihilate seems worse to me.

But shackling the universe to Reaper-King Shepard's ideals or forcibly altering all life seems worse than even that. I'm not going to even give Refuse the time of day.

[Phatose]

Who's perspective are you making this analysis from? If it's from Shepard's viewpoint, then he has no idea what's going to happen in the ending. Which means you're looking at it from your own view point, as a player....and really, you're enforcing a heck of a lot more then morals on the game world.

[Stormcutter]

Phatose wrote...

Who's perspective are you making this analysis from? If it's from Shepard's viewpoint, then he has no idea what's going to happen in the ending. Which means you're looking at it from your own view point, as a player....and really, you're enforcing a heck of a lot more then morals on the game world.

From my meta-perspective, I know what's going to happen and have laid out my viewpoints on why I do what I did.

Of course, Shepard can't see the glowy button in the top left of his viewpoint. This means that he doesn't know that talking down the Quarian's will work.

Also, let's be honest. There's good reason to distrust the ability of the Geth to keep themselves independent, even if they want to. They were enslaved by a Destroyer-class Reaper. There's no solid, definite reason to believe, in-universe, that Harbinger won't be able to break them into submission.

In universe, it's easy to see even a Paragon Shepard make the hard call that has to be made and betting on the Quarians.

[Phatose]

Yeah, but from your meta-perspective, why even worry? None of them actually even exist.

[Khelish]

I personally play the game as if I were Shepard, I don't use my knowledge of other future events to change the story in my canon game.

That said, I saved them both on Rannoch, and picked Destroy.

[Stormcutter]

Phatose wrote...

Yeah, but from your meta-perspective, why even worry? None of them actually even exist.

Oh, come on. That's not a fair argument. It's easy to get attached to characters, even if they don't exist. That's the mark of good, emotive writing.

In-universe, I RP my Paragon Shepard in the way I described.

Modifié par Stormcutter, 20 mai 2013 - 01:28 .

[Ryzaki]

Nope picked the Geth without any regrets then sighed when I saw the only choice to destroy the Reapers involved killing the Geth.

Can't win em all.

[Phatose]

Look man, all I'm saying is if you're gonna metagame, go the whole way.

[Stormcutter]

Phatose wrote...

Look man, all I'm saying is if you're gonna metagame, go the whole way.

But I did. That was the whole point of my first post. There's no reason the meta-gaming can't affect the RP'ing though.

In the end, with the choices I intend to make, the choice Shepard made would have been for the best.

[Shaftell]

I kill the Geth everytime, same reason as you OP. The other endings are nonsensical for my Shepard's. I also kill them because they have Reaper Code. I would have let them live if Legion wasn't in such a hurry in uploading the code to all Geth. If they decided to stay the way they were before i'd have spared them.

[Argolas]

Lagion: Blablabla REAPER CODE beepbeep UPLOAD NOW! bububeep ALL GETH!
Shepard: No, Legion.
Legion: beepbububeep UPLOAD OR DIE!
Shepard: Good night, Legion...

[Auld Wulf]

Well, it's not just the Geth you're killing, but the Reapers too. The Reapers are just slaves of the Catalyst, and as such innocent of all crimes committed. Then you're killing EDI, who's been completely loyal to you for two games. Oh! And Joker, Joker's likely going to suicide.

See? I can't be responsible for that. So I'd choose Control or Synthesis.

[Auld Wulf]

Argolas wrote...

Lagion: Blablabla REAPER CODE beepbeep UPLOAD NOW! bububeep ALL GETH!
Shepard: No, Legion.
Legion: beepbububeep UPLOAD OR DIE!
Shepard: Good night, Legion...

Bitter and angry. A big ol' ball of hate. Such is the way of the Geth-hater.

I actually pity you.