393 réponses à ce sujet

[MegaSovereign]

SpamBot2000 wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Yeah. I didn't buy his argument; more of the same nonsense Spambot's been pushing.

Should have just taken it on rather than get distracted by this stuff, though.

Happy as I am to see that people get what I'm saying, I am a little disappointed to see this fan-created "nonsense" meme attributed to my Artistic Interpretation. I never talked nonsense, some BSN members misinterpreted my common sense as such.

Seriously though, what's so far out about Hudson and Walters intentionally putting a stop to the Mass Effect story? Some amateur psychologists on BSN have gone to the extreme of calling such speculation "insane". So, naturally I asked a professional psychotherapist if such a suspicion is a sure sign of tin-hatted conspiracy paranoia. From what I could gather of his response (the people in that particular racket tend to be very reluctant to be pinned down to any definitive statement), it does not in itself indicate any pathology, and is in fact broadly speaking within the realm of plausibility. I might have an occasion to come in contact with another mental health professional of my acquaintance in the coming month or so, so I might as well ask for a second opinion, should the opportunity arise.

It's not insane, just unlikely.

A sequel following the original endings would have actually been easier since so many details about it were vague. The EC put in a lot more variation and even introduced more scenarios like Refusal.

Mac Walters said we can't have post-ending DLC because the galaxy will
be a "boring wasteland". You apparently seriously think that this was an
accident that he only noticed after creating that ending. Because
everything else is just too nutty to consider, right?

Well post-ending would leave the galaxy in the worst condition because of the Reaper war. The destroyed relays certainly help but I doubt that's the only thing he was referring to when he made that statement.

[SpamBot2000]

crimzontearz wrote...

A trope is not a fan created meme, indeed many authors have torched their franchise and ran, the fact you interpreted it that way before even knowing the trope existed and is more widespread than one would think only reinforces that it might very well be the case.

Heh, I meant the "fan created meme" that I'm a nutty conspiracy theorist. When all I've said has been pure common sense.

[jstme]

commander root657 wrote...

Calibrations52 wrote...

They wrote themselves into a corner with ME3's ending. The only way out is to either set an ending as canon and pick up right where the story left off or to set it extremely far into the future where the divergent endings have less of a divergent impact.

That said, I would much prefer a sequel to anything else they've proposed. It's pretty obvious that they have no idea what to do at this point. That's the only reason Casey Hudson keeps asking fans for ideas.

you're a moron, no matter how far you go into the future synthesis will remain the same and I doubt the reapers will just fly off and disappear in control either not to mention we'll end up with another 11th hour deus ex machina if whatever possible villains you have can destroy the reapers whom not even the entire galaxy could defeat 

First of all, there is no need to offend people you disagree with unless they do it first.
Second, did you save the council or not? Destroyed the base or not? Guess - what - both choices did not matter one bit. You know why? Because it is fiction. Nothing is real, and nothing to get hung about. Retcons and rewrties forever.

How about that:
ME4 is set 100 years after events of ME3,in a remote part of terminus system that is cut off of rest the galaxy due to broken relays. All people know is that there was war with reapers, and then it ended.
No more reapers since:
Destroy - captain obvious.
Control - they all left (to dark space ,you discover during the game codex bit that Shepard told em to) 
Synthesis - they all left (to dark space,you discover during the game codex bit that they considered themslef to be no longer needed).

There are no geth or other AI around because (in all RGB) they never were in that cluster to begin with.

Everybody uses implants. 

There you go. Setting that most people would accept as a possible one. Destroyers would not let slip the dogs of war since Shepard and numerous other people already used implants prior to ME3 RGB.
Huge hordes of pro-Synthesis fans would accept it too.
Controllers would not mind it either.
P.S. - Did you pick Udina or Anderson? All the tiny differences between RGBs could be treated in ME4 exactly like that choice was treated in ME3. Handwaved with few lines of dialogue or codex. 

Modifié par jstme, 25 mai 2013 - 03:05 .

[crimzontearz]

SpamBot2000 wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

A trope is not a fan created meme, indeed many authors have torched their franchise and ran, the fact you interpreted it that way before even knowing the trope existed and is more widespread than one would think only reinforces that it might very well be the case.

Heh, I meant the "fan created meme" that I'm a nutty conspiracy theorist. When all I've said has been pure common sense.

ohhh


 
Ok then, so you agree with my breakdown on page 6?

[SpamBot2000]

MegaSovereign wrote...

Well post-ending would leave the galaxy in the worst condition because of the Reaper war. The destroyed relays certainly help but I doubt that's the only thing he was referring to when he made that statement.

All I'm saying here is that the ending was meant to make the galaxy a wasteland where you couldn't have exciting adventures. To put a full stop to the story. That seems the likely reasoning behind it, as it certainly doesn't seem to follow from what takes place in the games.

The EC obviously backpedalled from this position. Unfortunately it made things even more confused, since it didn't remove the nuclear solution, just the fallout. Because they chose to try to save face by pretending the wasteland thing was a big misunderstanding by their dumb fans. Not that the evidence to the contrary doesn't exist. 

[SpamBot2000]

crimzontearz wrote...

SpamBot2000 wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

A trope is not a fan created meme, indeed many authors have torched their franchise and ran, the fact you interpreted it that way before even knowing the trope existed and is more widespread than one would think only reinforces that it might very well be the case.

Heh, I meant the "fan created meme" that I'm a nutty conspiracy theorist. When all I've said has been pure common sense.

ohhh


 
Ok then, so you agree with my breakdown on page 6?

Pretty much, yeah. Although I do have some reservations about applying a trope of fiction to the analysis of actual events. Still, it seems a perfect fit.

Modifié par SpamBot2000, 25 mai 2013 - 03:20 .

[Archonsg]

@jstme

Control- So Shepard took control of the Reapers to just leave?
Actually, that might work. If they explain *why* Shep-Reaper decided to leave as long as it satisfies both Paragon / Renegade pathos.

Synthesis- One would think that one's own skin covered in circuitry and green glowing eyes would be a "WTF?!" give away something is really amis and one that might not gel with players who did not chose synthesis as their ending.
Also, remember, its not just you, its *every living organism* that needs to be shown to have been synthesized.

Modifié par Archonsg, 25 mai 2013 - 03:26 .

[Wayning_Star]

SpamBot2000 wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

SpamBot2000 wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

A trope is not a fan created meme, indeed many authors have torched their franchise and ran, the fact you interpreted it that way before even knowing the trope existed and is more widespread than one would think only reinforces that it might very well be the case.

Heh, I meant the "fan created meme" that I'm a nutty conspiracy theorist. When all I've said has been pure common sense.

ohhh


 
Ok then, so you agree with my breakdown on page 6?

Pretty much, yeah. Although I do have some reservations about applying a trope of fiction to the analysis of actual events. Still, it seems a perfect fit.

actual events and common sense relates to fan fiction.. that does make sense.

[MegaSovereign]

SpamBot2000 wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...

Well post-ending would leave the galaxy in the worst condition because of the Reaper war. The destroyed relays certainly help but I doubt that's the only thing he was referring to when he made that statement.

All I'm saying here is that the ending was meant to make the galaxy a wasteland where you couldn't have exciting adventures. To put a full stop to the story. That seems the likely reasoning behind it, as it certainly doesn't seem to follow from what takes place in the games.

The EC obviously backpedalled from this position. Unfortunately it made things even more confused, since it didn't remove the nuclear solution, just the fallout. Because they chose to try to save face by pretending the wasteland thing was a big misunderstanding by their dumb fans. Not that the evidence to the contrary doesn't exist. 

Again, that's unlikely. The galaxy wasn't a wasteland in the original cut. It was speculated by some fans because of the alpha relay explosion in the Arrival DLC. However this was never a likely a scenario since it would have wiped out the galaxy.

Leaving so much in the air about what happened would have actually made it easier to follow up on. For example, in the original cut the Reapers were simply shown leaving the battle in the Control/Synthesis endings. If Bioware decided to base a sequel on just the original cut, they could have written out the Reapers by simply having them leave the galaxy. However, the EC clearly defined the Reaper's role in those endings and now it's harder to converge all the scenarios.

What you said about how exciting adventures can't happen post-ending is an opinion, not fact. Actually, it's an incorrect statement since they technically can happen.

[crimzontearz]

SpamBot2000 wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

SpamBot2000 wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

A trope is not a fan created meme, indeed many authors have torched their franchise and ran, the fact you interpreted it that way before even knowing the trope existed and is more widespread than one would think only reinforces that it might very well be the case.

Heh, I meant the "fan created meme" that I'm a nutty conspiracy theorist. When all I've said has been pure common sense.

ohhh


 
Ok then, so you agree with my breakdown on page 6?

Pretty much, yeah. Although I do have some reservations about applying a trope of fiction to the analysis of actual events. Still, it seems a perfect fit.

oh good....so nice to find likeminded individuals


 
And that trope tho is about the reality of authors, not fiction itself so it is a perfect fit

Modifié par crimzontearz, 25 mai 2013 - 03:37 .

[Iakus]

MegaSovereign wrote...

SpamBot2000 wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...

Well post-ending would leave the galaxy in the worst condition because of the Reaper war. The destroyed relays certainly help but I doubt that's the only thing he was referring to when he made that statement.

All I'm saying here is that the ending was meant to make the galaxy a wasteland where you couldn't have exciting adventures. To put a full stop to the story. That seems the likely reasoning behind it, as it certainly doesn't seem to follow from what takes place in the games.

The EC obviously backpedalled from this position. Unfortunately it made things even more confused, since it didn't remove the nuclear solution, just the fallout. Because they chose to try to save face by pretending the wasteland thing was a big misunderstanding by their dumb fans. Not that the evidence to the contrary doesn't exist. 

Again, that's unlikely. The galaxy wasn't a wasteland in the original cut. It was speculated by some fans because of the alpha relay explosion in the Arrival DLC. However this was never a likely a scenario since it would have wiped out the galaxy.

Leaving so much in the air about what happened would have actually made it easier to follow up on. For example, in the original cut the Reapers were simply shown leaving the battle in the Control/Synthesis endings. If Bioware decided to base a sequel on just the original cut, they could have written out the Reapers by simply having them leave the galaxy. However, the EC clearly defined the Reaper's role in those endings and now it's harder to converge all the scenarios.

What you said about how exciting adventures can't happen post-ending is an opinion, not fact. Actually, it's an incorrect statement since they technically can happen.

Except Mac Walter is on record saying the galaxy is a "galactic wasteland" after ME3, thus why there could be no postgame DLC.  This is not 'speculation", this is the lead writer's own words.

Granted EC backpedaled from that, and maybe some of the darker aspects were misinterpreted in the first place.  But it's still pretty clear that a sequel was never a consideration until fairly recently. 

This isn't a case of "new stories can't happen" it's a case of "we never thought that far ahead"  Not considering the ramifications of the endings seems to be a pretty common trait with Bioware.

[jstme]

Archonsg wrote...

@jstme

Control- So Shepard took control of the Reapers to just leave?
Actually, that might work. If they explain *why* Shep-Reaper decided to leave as long as it satisfies both Paragon / Renegade pathos.

Synthesis- One would think that one's own skin covered in circuitry and green glowing eyes would be a "WTF?!" give away something is really amis and one that might not gel with players who did not chose synthesis as their ending.
Also, remember, its not just you, its *every living organism* that needs to be shown to have been synthesized.

But people that like synthesis do not like it because it changes every living organism. They like it because its reminds them about singularity ,transhumainsm and allows to save civilizations goo canned in reapers. Retcon that bit, let it slip and nobody would mind about it.
And really, who is not going to buy a game because there is no green texture on skin? Retcon that bit,let it slip and nobody would mind about it either.
At least no more then that stuff about Anderson vs Udina choice that i brought up in the end on purpose. How many people did not buy the game because that specific choice was waved with few lines in codex. There is no problem to write in vague codex line about rumors of some strange wave that caused weird things for a short time in the end of the Great Reaper War. This is remote cut off cluster in Terminus systems we are talking about,(lucky) people there do not really know anything about the nature of RGB.

[MegaSovereign]

iakus wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...

SpamBot2000 wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...

Well post-ending would leave the galaxy in the worst condition because of the Reaper war. The destroyed relays certainly help but I doubt that's the only thing he was referring to when he made that statement.

All I'm saying here is that the ending was meant to make the galaxy a wasteland where you couldn't have exciting adventures. To put a full stop to the story. That seems the likely reasoning behind it, as it certainly doesn't seem to follow from what takes place in the games.

The EC obviously backpedalled from this position. Unfortunately it made things even more confused, since it didn't remove the nuclear solution, just the fallout. Because they chose to try to save face by pretending the wasteland thing was a big misunderstanding by their dumb fans. Not that the evidence to the contrary doesn't exist. 

Again, that's unlikely. The galaxy wasn't a wasteland in the original cut. It was speculated by some fans because of the alpha relay explosion in the Arrival DLC. However this was never a likely a scenario since it would have wiped out the galaxy.

Leaving so much in the air about what happened would have actually made it easier to follow up on. For example, in the original cut the Reapers were simply shown leaving the battle in the Control/Synthesis endings. If Bioware decided to base a sequel on just the original cut, they could have written out the Reapers by simply having them leave the galaxy. However, the EC clearly defined the Reaper's role in those endings and now it's harder to converge all the scenarios.

What you said about how exciting adventures can't happen post-ending is an opinion, not fact. Actually, it's an incorrect statement since they technically can happen.

Except Mac Walter is on record saying the galaxy is a "galactic wasteland" after ME3, thus why there could be no postgame DLC.  This is not 'speculation", this is the lead writer's own words.

Granted EC backpedaled from that, and maybe some of the darker aspects were misinterpreted in the first place.  But it's still pretty clear that a sequel was never a consideration until fairly recently. 

This isn't a case of "new stories can't happen" it's a case of "we never thought that far ahead"  Not considering the ramifications of the endings seems to be a pretty common trait with Bioware.

I addressed that statement earlier.

Yes, it's complete and utter speculation. A "motive" put in place to further antagonize Bioware for a poorly written ending.

[Wayning_Star]

I get this weird sensation that Bioware kind of cops that joking attitude like in Portal, where the 'machine' is out to get you, but you really shouldn't mind, it's perfectly natural..

[SpamBot2000]

iakus wrote...

Except Mac Walter is on record saying the galaxy is a "galactic wasteland" after ME3, thus why there could be no postgame DLC.  This is not 'speculation", this is the lead writer's own words.

This is correct. I just tried to find the right interview on Youtube so everyone could see for themselves, but the first likely looking option wanted me to open an account because it "might not be suitable for all ages". 

Not starting any accounts just for that, but you should be able to find it. It's dated slightly before ME3 release, I think.

[Wayning_Star]

MegaSovereign wrote...

iakus wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...

SpamBot2000 wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...

Well post-ending would leave the galaxy in the worst condition because of the Reaper war. The destroyed relays certainly help but I doubt that's the only thing he was referring to when he made that statement.

All I'm saying here is that the ending was meant to make the galaxy a wasteland where you couldn't have exciting adventures. To put a full stop to the story. That seems the likely reasoning behind it, as it certainly doesn't seem to follow from what takes place in the games.

The EC obviously backpedalled from this position. Unfortunately it made things even more confused, since it didn't remove the nuclear solution, just the fallout. Because they chose to try to save face by pretending the wasteland thing was a big misunderstanding by their dumb fans. Not that the evidence to the contrary doesn't exist. 

Again, that's unlikely. The galaxy wasn't a wasteland in the original cut. It was speculated by some fans because of the alpha relay explosion in the Arrival DLC. However this was never a likely a scenario since it would have wiped out the galaxy.

Leaving so much in the air about what happened would have actually made it easier to follow up on. For example, in the original cut the Reapers were simply shown leaving the battle in the Control/Synthesis endings. If Bioware decided to base a sequel on just the original cut, they could have written out the Reapers by simply having them leave the galaxy. However, the EC clearly defined the Reaper's role in those endings and now it's harder to converge all the scenarios.

What you said about how exciting adventures can't happen post-ending is an opinion, not fact. Actually, it's an incorrect statement since they technically can happen.

Except Mac Walter is on record saying the galaxy is a "galactic wasteland" after ME3, thus why there could be no postgame DLC.  This is not 'speculation", this is the lead writer's own words.

Granted EC backpedaled from that, and maybe some of the darker aspects were misinterpreted in the first place.  But it's still pretty clear that a sequel was never a consideration until fairly recently. 

This isn't a case of "new stories can't happen" it's a case of "we never thought that far ahead"  Not considering the ramifications of the endings seems to be a pretty common trait with Bioware.

I addressed that statement earlier.

Yes, it's complete and utter speculation. A "motive" put in place to further antagonize Bioware for a poorly written ending.

should fans really work this hard?

[SpamBot2000]

MegaSovereign wrote...

I addressed that statement earlier.

Yes, it's complete and utter speculation. A "motive" put in place to further antagonize Bioware for a poorly written ending.

To "antagonize" BioWare? Why would I want to provoke the hostility of BioWare? Care to fill me in on these speculations?

Modifié par SpamBot2000, 25 mai 2013 - 03:51 .

[Wayning_Star]

SpamBot2000 wrote...

iakus wrote...

Except Mac Walter is on record saying the galaxy is a "galactic wasteland" after ME3, thus why there could be no postgame DLC.  This is not 'speculation", this is the lead writer's own words.

This is correct. I just tried to find the right interview on Youtube so everyone could see for themselves, but the first likely looking option wanted me to open an account because it "might not be suitable for all ages". 

Not starting any accounts just for that, but you should be able to find it. It's dated slightly before ME3 release, I think.

but wasn't that statement taken out of context of one aspect of the destroy choice with low EMS or something. There was a long post thread about it a while back.

[MegaSovereign]

SpamBot2000 wrote...

iakus wrote...

Except Mac Walter is on record saying the galaxy is a "galactic wasteland" after ME3, thus why there could be no postgame DLC.  This is not 'speculation", this is the lead writer's own words.

This is correct. I just tried to find the right interview on Youtube so everyone could see for themselves, but the first likely looking option wanted me to open an account because it "might not be suitable for all ages". 

Not starting any accounts just for that, but you should be able to find it. It's dated slightly before ME3 release, I think.

The galaxy was basically a wasteland before the Crucible went off. If all the Crucible did was kill the Reapers and leave everything else intact then you still have the destroyed homeworlds that need rebuilding.

Why is this point overlooked? And why is it so hard to see that Bioware wouldn't spoil anything other than the obvious in a preview/interview?

[AlanC9]

Remind me again.... what's Mac's motivation here? If he doesn't want to do more ME games, why not just not do them? Is he supposed to be some sort of indentured servant?

[SpamBot2000]

MegaSovereign wrote...

The galaxy was basically a wasteland before the Crucible went off. If all the Crucible did was kill the Reapers and leave everything else intact then you still have the destroyed homeworlds that need rebuilding.

Why is this point overlooked? And why is it so hard to see that Bioware wouldn't spoil anything other than the obvious in a preview/interview?

Once again, the point is that "There can be nothing happening post-end, because of the state the ending leaves the setting." It's not just that it is a wasteland, it is a boring wasteland. That is a direct quote. There is nothing of interest happening. That is what they meant to leave us with.

[SpamBot2000]

AlanC9 wrote...

Remind me again.... what's Mac's motivation here? If he doesn't want to do more ME games, why not just not do them? Is he supposed to be some sort of indentured servant?

He probably likes having a job. EA have no reason to keep him on the payroll if he's not gonna do what he's told.

[Iakus]

Wayning_Star wrote...

SpamBot2000 wrote...

iakus wrote...

Except Mac Walter is on record saying the galaxy is a "galactic wasteland" after ME3, thus why there could be no postgame DLC.  This is not 'speculation", this is the lead writer's own words.

This is correct. I just tried to find the right interview on Youtube so everyone could see for themselves, but the first likely looking option wanted me to open an account because it "might not be suitable for all ages". 

Not starting any accounts just for that, but you should be able to find it. It's dated slightly before ME3 release, I think.

but wasn't that statement taken out of context of one aspect of the destroy choice with low EMS or something. There was a long post thread about it a while back.

Nope, the context was postgame DLC.  EMS wasn't brought up at all, it was simply the general possibility of revisiting the galaxy after teh war

As to motivation:  I don't know.  maybe it was a botched attempt to torch the franchise.  Maybe it was simply poor planning.  Perhaps there was originally no intention to make Mass Effect an ongoing series past the trilogy.  Who knows?

[crimzontearz]

AlanC9 wrote...

Remind me again.... what's Mac's motivation here? If he doesn't want to do more ME games, why not just not do them? Is he supposed to be some sort of indentured servant?

if you bothered to read back you would know.


 
Also he is a writer for BiowEAre, if he wants to get paid, and they commission more ME games it's not like he has a choice outside of quitting

[MegaSovereign]

SpamBot2000 wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...

The galaxy was basically a wasteland before the Crucible went off. If all the Crucible did was kill the Reapers and leave everything else intact then you still have the destroyed homeworlds that need rebuilding.

Why is this point overlooked? And why is it so hard to see that Bioware wouldn't spoil anything other than the obvious in a preview/interview?

Once again, the point is that "There can be nothing happening post-end, because of the state the ending leaves the setting." It's not just that it is a wasteland, it is a boring wasteland. That is a direct quote. There is nothing of interest happening. That is what they meant to leave us with.

Wastelands are supposed to be interesting?

The word "boring" isn't an operative word in terms of a permanent setting. It's ridiculous to judge their motivations on this alone.