thanks for copy pasting an item out of an existing thread and making a new one airquotes.
So Collectors are clearly OP
Débuté par
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, mai 27 2013 07:36
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#127
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 09:59
Tokenusername
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Dunvi wrote...
this is why I'm not supposed to be serious about things. I always forget that normal people don't know anything about rhetoric, logic, or statistics, among other things.
never mind, don't mind me. I'm gonna go torture some pugs instead.
"Arguing with a fool proves there are two"
Wait, i'm arguing super hard right now...Damn it!
#128
Guest_Air Quotes_*
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 09:59
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Shadow of Terror wrote...
Air Quotes wrote...
Tokenusername wrote...
We aren't disagreeing that Collectors are OP, I personally believe they are. We're saying the the statistics don't "prove" it.Air Quotes wrote...
Dunvi wrote...
Bro Namath1 wrote...
This topic is taking a weird turn and there are some mixed thoughts but I have to agree with the OP, Collectors are definitely the strongest faction. Like others have said, the Scion is basically a ravager, geth bomber, and brute all in one. The Possessed Praetorian can do a ton of damage if you get anywhere near it. The seeker swarms just take your powers away and then their version of husks (abominations and possessed abominations) will either hurt you when you kill them if you're close or completely destroy you if you're close.
I know some will just say to back away but that's the point. The Husks that show up when you play the Reapers don't penalize you by blowing up. I'm kind of surprised more people aren't agreeing with the OP.
I don't know about the others, but I am resisting the urge to really tear the OP apart. Do I tihnk collectors are fairly OP? Yes. There are design and implementation issues with the collectors that make them beyond a PITA.
But do the stats prove it? Absolutely not. The only thing that these stats prove, especially as quoted in this thread, is that the vast majority of people don't understand statistics, or read carefully.
LOL.
Here's the question - why Thunderdome? Why Collectors and not Reapers or Cerberus or even Geth?
The statistics prove that they are the least popular on Gold and Platinum. And the only reason I can think of - it's because they are more difficult that others AND they pay the SAME and give LESS XP
So for most people there's absolutely no point in playing against them.
PS3 crashes are one reason not to plat against them, the other doesn't mean they're OP, just that the normal players don't like playing against them.
A lot of non BSN players I've played with think reapers are hard, but that's because they don't know how to deal with banshees. Go on BSN, and most people say reapers are the easiest. Non BSNers won't play against collectors and reapers, but it doesn't mean they're OP.
PS3 crashes won't make that much of a difference.
It's doesn;t mean that they are OP, it's just that people don't like playing vs them?
Then let me as you - WHY? What's the reason then? PS3 players at least have a reason. So why PC, and Xbox players don't like em?
Gimme reasons other than being OP.
#129
Guest_Air Quotes_*
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 10:00
Guest_Air Quotes_*
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Tokenusername wrote...
Dunvi wrote...
this is why I'm not supposed to be serious about things. I always forget that normal people don't know anything about rhetoric, logic, or statistics, among other things.
never mind, don't mind me. I'm gonna go torture some pugs instead.
"Arguing with a fool proves there are two"
Wait, i'm arguing super hard right now...Damn it!
Yeah, Imma stop now, cos you will drag me down to your level and beat me with experience.
#130
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 10:00
BridgeBurner
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I would argue collectors are the easiest faction.
Gigantic heads
Scions are about 25% less tough than they appear on paper thanks to the sac
Praetorians have a large headshot modifier and a large headshot area
Leaving, seeker swarms, plagues and abominations as the only units I really don't care for from the faction.
Gigantic heads
Scions are about 25% less tough than they appear on paper thanks to the sac
Praetorians have a large headshot modifier and a large headshot area
Leaving, seeker swarms, plagues and abominations as the only units I really don't care for from the faction.
#131
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 10:01
Malanek
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On platinum I think Collectors are the easiest. On Gold I think they are harder than Reapers but easier the Cerberus, about equal with the Geth.
I think they are a well designed faction because they are powerful and dangerous but have lots of weaknesses. Captains and troopers are easy to headshot, abominations are very easy to kill relative to the amount they deplete the spawn budget, Scions are slow and have multiple weak points, Praetorians have massive weakspots and can be continuously stunlocked. I think they are actually the easiest boss in the game.
Collectors are very difficult to camp against but for a mobile team or individual they are much less of a threat.
I think they are a well designed faction because they are powerful and dangerous but have lots of weaknesses. Captains and troopers are easy to headshot, abominations are very easy to kill relative to the amount they deplete the spawn budget, Scions are slow and have multiple weak points, Praetorians have massive weakspots and can be continuously stunlocked. I think they are actually the easiest boss in the game.
Collectors are very difficult to camp against but for a mobile team or individual they are much less of a threat.
#132
Guest_Air Quotes_*
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 10:02
Guest_Air Quotes_*
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Mgamerz wrote...
thanks for copy pasting an item out of an existing thread and making a new one airquotes.
My pleasure. It's not like I'm the first one who did it. It's not like people didn't copy-paste balance changes into their topics
Don't be a dick.
#133
Guest_Air Quotes_*
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 10:03
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Annomander wrote...
I would argue collectors are the easiest faction.
Gigantic heads
Scions are about 25% less tough than they appear on paper thanks to the sac
Praetorians have a large headshot modifier and a large headshot area
Leaving, seeker swarms, plagues and abominations as the only units I really don't care for from the faction.
You don't PUG a lot do you?
#134
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 10:06
PyroByte
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Air Quotes wrote...
Annomander wrote...
I would argue collectors are the easiest faction.
Gigantic heads
Scions are about 25% less tough than they appear on paper thanks to the sac
Praetorians have a large headshot modifier and a large headshot area
Leaving, seeker swarms, plagues and abominations as the only units I really don't care for from the faction.
You don't PUG a lot do you?
Can't blame the enemy faction if you end up with bad teammates
Modifié par PyroByte, 27 mai 2013 - 10:07 .
#135
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 10:06
Tokenusername
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Air Quotes wrote...
Tokenusername wrote...
Dunvi wrote...
this is why I'm not supposed to be serious about things. I always forget that normal people don't know anything about rhetoric, logic, or statistics, among other things.
never mind, don't mind me. I'm gonna go torture some pugs instead.
"Arguing with a fool proves there are two"
Wait, i'm arguing super hard right now...Damn it!
Yeah, Imma stop now, cos you will drag me down to your level and beat me with experience.
I don't believe you, but please do.Air Quotes wrote...
[Posted 45 minutes ago]
I don't need to argue.
#136
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 10:07
Shadow of Terror
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Air Quotes wrote...
Then let me as you - WHY? What's the reason then? PS3 players at least have a reason. So why PC, and Xbox players don't like em?
Gimme reasons other than being OP.
Number 1? Praetorian Sync kills. Shove a sync kill on something, the average player won't like it, shove it on something that is hard to run past, and is extremely mobile, and you have your reason.
I was just giving you other reasons why they wouldn't be picked, other than just being "OP".
#137
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 10:07
Swan Killer
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Collectors are not OP, they don't have 3 Primes present at the same time.Ssome players are UP.
Modifié par tivesz, 27 mai 2013 - 10:11 .
#138
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 10:08
Bro Namath1
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Hey Air Quotes, the Collectors are definitely the toughest. Some will disagree but probably more won't. Don't take is personally if someone questions you, it's just their opinion.
#139
Guest_Air Quotes_*
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 10:13
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PyroByte wrote...
Air Quotes wrote...
Annomander wrote...
I would argue collectors are the easiest faction.
Gigantic heads
Scions are about 25% less tough than they appear on paper thanks to the sac
Praetorians have a large headshot modifier and a large headshot area
Leaving, seeker swarms, plagues and abominations as the only units I really don't care for from the faction.
You don't PUG a lot do you?
Can't blame the enemy faction if you end up with bad teammates
Even with bad teammates I can bust my way trough. I can solo objectives most of the time and I can clear the wave after. That's vs Reapers, Cerb or Geth. Now with Collectors it's a whole nother story. Some DB will aways blow up and abomination and take down a whole team. And the Scion crossfire and multi-nades force you to go into cover, but you can go into cover because of nades, then there's Praetorian lazor, you should go into cover, but you can't cos of the nades and abominations that force one button controls to fail.
I had a lot of bad teamates but we made to the extraction. Vs Collectors I get a 15 revives by wave 5 and I'm usually alone to extract or with 1 teammate.
#140
Guest_Air Quotes_*
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 10:15
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I will take this quote from 3xt3rmin4tus about broken enemies vs skill
Crimson256 01:13:12
See, we have tough guys who have no problems with (Insert Broken Enemies). (Insert Broken Enemies) are so afraid of them so they don't dare to use (Insert Cheap Mechanic). Those guys are so tough, they even shout on forums about it. So, I guess you just have to add them in your friend list and all the poor (Insert Broken Enemies) will just stand in the center of the room and wait for death.
No need for nerfs since we have forum pro players!
Crimson256 01:13:12
See, we have tough guys who have no problems with (Insert Broken Enemies). (Insert Broken Enemies) are so afraid of them so they don't dare to use (Insert Cheap Mechanic). Those guys are so tough, they even shout on forums about it. So, I guess you just have to add them in your friend list and all the poor (Insert Broken Enemies) will just stand in the center of the room and wait for death.
No need for nerfs since we have forum pro players!
#141
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 10:15
Jeremiah12LGeek
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I have only one statistic for Collectors on Gold/Plat that I care about, and no amount of "They're easy l2P" is going to put even the slightest dent in it.
PuGs suck at Collectors. PuGs are everyone.
If you don't suck at Collectors, congratulations! You are an exception. If you are so awesome that you can solo Collectors, and the fact that PuGs suck at them is irrelevant, that's great!
For you.
In practical terms, announcing over and over again that "Collectors are just as easy as everything else, or easier," is only ever going to apply to a tiny percentage of the player base.
Everyone else watches PuGs wipe against Collectors over... and over... and over... and over....
I can carry a team on Gold against Geth, Reapers, and (when I'm using a crutch kit) Cerberus. I can watch helplessly while 50% of all PuG teams wipe against Collectors, often in the first 4 waves.
I can solo Gold Cerberus, and I'm working on soloing Platinum Geth, with Waves 7-8 being where I am now. The only kit I use that can solo Collectors is the Batarian Soldier, and I doubt I could do it above Silver.
Collectors wreck most of the player base, and much more so than Geth do.
I PuG almost exclusively. It's a different world entirely.
PuGs suck at Collectors. PuGs are everyone.
If you don't suck at Collectors, congratulations! You are an exception. If you are so awesome that you can solo Collectors, and the fact that PuGs suck at them is irrelevant, that's great!
For you.
In practical terms, announcing over and over again that "Collectors are just as easy as everything else, or easier," is only ever going to apply to a tiny percentage of the player base.
Everyone else watches PuGs wipe against Collectors over... and over... and over... and over....
I can carry a team on Gold against Geth, Reapers, and (when I'm using a crutch kit) Cerberus. I can watch helplessly while 50% of all PuG teams wipe against Collectors, often in the first 4 waves.
I can solo Gold Cerberus, and I'm working on soloing Platinum Geth, with Waves 7-8 being where I am now. The only kit I use that can solo Collectors is the Batarian Soldier, and I doubt I could do it above Silver.
Collectors wreck most of the player base, and much more so than Geth do.
I PuG almost exclusively. It's a different world entirely.
#142
Guest_Air Quotes_*
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 10:16
Guest_Air Quotes_*
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Shadow of Terror wrote...
Air Quotes wrote...
Then let me as you - WHY? What's the reason then? PS3 players at least have a reason. So why PC, and Xbox players don't like em?
Gimme reasons other than being OP.
Number 1? Praetorian Sync kills. Shove a sync kill on something, the average player won't like it, shove it on something that is hard to run past, and is extremely mobile, and you have your reason.
I was just giving you other reasons why they wouldn't be picked, other than just being "OP".
Banshees have sync-kills with no pre-melee and they go trough walls, yet the Reapers are much more popular.
#143
Guest_Air Quotes_*
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 10:19
Guest_Air Quotes_*
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Jeremiah12LGeek wrote...
I have only one statistic for Collectors on Gold/Plat that I care about, and no amount of "They're easy l2P" is going to put even the slightest dent in it.
PuGs suck at Collectors. PuGs are everyone.
If you don't suck at Collectors, congratulations! You are an exception. If you are so awesome that you can solo Collectors, and the fact that PuGs suck at them is irrelevant, that's great!
For you.
In practical terms, announcing over and over again that "Collectors are just as easy as everything else, or easier," is only ever going to apply to a tiny percentage of the player base.
Everyone else watches PuGs wipe against Collectors over... and over... and over... and over....
I can carry a team on Gold against Geth, Reapers, and (when I'm using a crutch kit) Cerberus. I can watch helplessly while 50% of all PuG teams wipe against Collectors, often in the first 4 waves.
I can solo Gold Cerberus, and I'm working on soloing Platinum Geth, with Waves 7-8 being where I am now. The only kit I use that can solo Collectors is the Batarian Soldier, and I doubt I could do it above Silver.
Collectors wreck most of the player base, and much more so than Geth do.
I PuG almost exclusively. It's a different world entirely.
This Volus understands.
"falls from the sky"
#144
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 10:22
SectiplaveB4
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Malanek999 wrote...
Collectors are very difficult to camp against but for a mobile team or individual they are much less of a threat.
Yeah this sums them up pretty well, this makes them very dangerous for less experienced players as you need to have good map / spawn knowledge or you'll end up getting peppered to death by trooper/captain spam trying to retreat.
#145
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 10:24
NickSTA_Gold
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I like playing collectors... but the longer i think about it i wonder why:
-Seeker swarms hitboxes and health - why?
-Possesed scions make no sense ( Can force you in or out of cover with 2 attacks that it uses at the same time???)
-Butt lazers.
-Best mooks excluding maurauders.
But although being the toughest class, in my opinion are still the funnest simply because it turns a game into teamwork instead of just 4 people meeting up for objectives...
Problem is a lot of people still have guns they want to unlock so will play other factions so they have a better chance of success which helps explain why people dont play them as much.
-Seeker swarms hitboxes and health - why?
-Possesed scions make no sense ( Can force you in or out of cover with 2 attacks that it uses at the same time???)
-Butt lazers.
-Best mooks excluding maurauders.
But although being the toughest class, in my opinion are still the funnest simply because it turns a game into teamwork instead of just 4 people meeting up for objectives...
Problem is a lot of people still have guns they want to unlock so will play other factions so they have a better chance of success which helps explain why people dont play them as much.
Modifié par NickSTA_Gold, 27 mai 2013 - 10:26 .
#146
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 10:35
JediHarbinger
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Collectors are far from easy...
No mo scotch for dat man!!!!
*points at annomander*
No mo scotch for dat man!!!!
*points at annomander*
#147
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 11:01
Deathsaurer
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Air Quotes wrote...
I had a lot of bad teamates but we made to the extraction. Vs Collectors I get a 15 revives by wave 5 and I'm usually alone to extract or with 1 teammate.
I remember that game. You dumped the lobby when it was over and I don't blame you.
#148
Guest_Air Quotes_*
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 11:06
Guest_Air Quotes_*
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Deathsaurer wrote...
Air Quotes wrote...
I had a lot of bad teamates but we made to the extraction. Vs Collectors I get a 15 revives by wave 5 and I'm usually alone to extract or with 1 teammate.
I remember that game. You dumped the lobby when it was over and I don't blame you.
Now don't get me wrong. I have no problem with reviving or helping. But seriously - Collectors do so much AOE destruction and put so much lock on your shields that sometimes you have nowhere to got.
I mean you have a hack that spawns nothing but possessed abominations while getting sniped by 2 Scions that cluster all area with nades and 2 Praetorians firing laz0rs. You can't do anything but die at that point. With Captains cherry picking.
Modifié par Air Quotes, 27 mai 2013 - 11:08 .
#149
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 11:08
Deathsaurer
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You can only wish you had a better team
#150
Posté 27 mai 2013 - 11:18
Zjarcal
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Air Quotes wrote...
Hahahah. "You need to do 2x damage on a faction that does 2x more damage than others and have 2x more health and move 2x faster, but that doesn't prove anything"
Love it <3
She said stats about the playerbase don't prove anything, not that Collectors aren't OP.
If we are going to use the gameplay stats to prove stuff, I may as well make a thread saying the Avenger is clearly the best weapon in the game since it's the most used one on all difficulties, or make another thread saying the Drell Vanguard is obviously the worst kit in the game since it's the least used on gold and platinum.
She wasn't disagreeing with you, it's really pointless for you to try to antagonize everyone now.
And yes, I do think Collectors are OP.
Modifié par Zjarcal, 27 mai 2013 - 11:18 .
