216 réponses à ce sujet

[brushyourteeth]

I really thought this topic was going to be about Alistair's cooking.

I am disappoint.

[Boycott Bioware]

Rape can be willingly or forcibly

Your country is invaded, there are renegade soldiers breaching into your house, they pointing their gun to your family, if you don't want to have sex with them, they shoot your family. It is a kind of bully. You must willingly having sex with them, or your family dead. So you willingly having sex with them to save your family, and it is a rape.

Similar with Hawke, Hawke must work for a year for someone who will pay to the guard, or else his/her family cannot get into Kirkwal. Hawke is willingly or forced into labor, it is slavery.

In DA2, there is Elf woman who willingly become your slave, because in her life she only know become a slave.

That is relity...like today, most people are slaves to the bank, willingly. They are owned by banks. The house they live in are bank property, the car they drive is bank property. They must work for years to pay back their dstudy debt...we are the slaves of the system, willingly

Modifié par Qistina, 02 juin 2013 - 04:01 .

[Boycott Bioware]

EntropicAngel wrote...
I think you're talking more about a servant than a slave.

A slave is servant, servant serve, a slave serve

It just servant is nicer sound than slave

I am a servant of God, it actually mean i am a slave of God

[brushyourteeth]

Qistina wrote...

Rape can be willingly or forcibly

Your country is invaded, there are renegade soldiers breaching into your house, they pointing their gun to your family, if you don't want to have sex with them, they shoot your family. It is a kind of bully. You must willingly having sex with them, or your family dead. So you willingly having sex with them to save your family, and it is a rape.

Similar with Hawke, Hawke must work for a year for someone who will pay to the guard, or else his/her family cannot get into Kirkwal. Hawke is willingly or forced into labor, it is slavery.

No, no no. Just no. NO.

Forcing someone to have sex under any condition is rape. The only "willing rape" is statutory rape, (even then, the only government I know of for sure that acknowledges it is here in the United States) in which one participant is underaged.

Also, Hawke is never forced to do anything. She has the choice to move on to another city, or stay in Kirkwall and take one of those two jobs for a year to take care of her family. She only has two options of jobs with one year contracts, but that's not the same as slavery. She doesn't have to take either of them, and once she takes them, she could leave them and risk getting attacked or exposed to the Templars (for herself or in Bethany's case). That's called blackmail, not slavery.

[Drone696]

Stop it.

[brushyourteeth]

Qistina wrote...

EntropicAngel wrote...
I think you're talking more about a servant than a slave.

A slave is servant, servant serve, a slave serve

It just servant is nicer sound than slave

I am a servant of God, it actually mean i am a slave of God

The difference (at least in Western cultures, so you'll have this information in the future) is that a servant serves willingly and is respected by their lord and has certain rights and priviledges that are protected under law. A slave is property. They serve because their only other choice is to be killed, or to flee (and maybe be killed).

Modifié par brushyourteeth, 02 juin 2013 - 04:21 .

[Ravensword]

Qistina wrote...

EntropicAngel wrote...
I think you're talking more about a servant than a slave.

A slave is servant, servant serve, a slave serve

It just servant is nicer sound than slave

I am a servant of God, it actually mean i am a slave of God

That part is definitely true.

[TEWR]

Nefla wrote...

Filament wrote...

I think the slave scenario is an interesting one. If there's no functioning justice system and death is too harsh, would you be willing to sell them to slavers instead?

Problem of course is the corrupting financial motive, and it being cruel and unusual... though not necessarily especially for the women, as male rape in that kind of situation is a thing too (*cough* Fenris), if no one tends to care as much.

Was it ever confirmed that Fenris had been raped? Danarius says "he is rather skilled" with his trollface but Fenris himself says he's a virgin, when Isabella implies he was a sex slave he says he was a bodyguard and she is making up her own fantasy, etc...I've always wondered because so many people seem certain(and hoped he wasn't, I came from an anime background and am sick to death of the yaoi-rape thing)

DG confirmed in an interview that there was that element in Fenris' past to Danarius.

brushyourteeth wrote...

The difference (at least in Western cultures, so you'll have this information in the future) is that a slave serves willingly and is respected by their lord and has certain rights and priviledges that are protected under law. A slave is property. They serve because their only other choice is to be killed, or to flee (and maybe be killed).

Beyond the bolded, which isn't really important but I figured I'd highlight anyway, it's pretty much this. The difference between a slave and a servant is that slaves have no freedoms. Servants do. 

Really no sense in me repeating what BYT said, as it's straightforward and... well... nothing more need be said (that I can think of anyway).

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 02 juin 2013 - 04:17 .

[BlueMagitek]

Unsavory? Dwarf Noble commits fratricide, sleeps with multiple dusters (at once), deals drugs and kicks casteless in the street.

I mean, Papa/Momma Aeducan does whatever, whenever.

[Hazegurl]

Qistina wrote...

Rape can be willingly or forcibly

[brushyourteeth]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

brushyourteeth wrote...

The difference (at least in Western cultures, so you'll have this information in the future) is that a servant serves willingly and is respected by their lord and has certain rights and priviledges that are protected under law. A slave is property. They serve because their only other choice is to be killed, or to flee (and maybe be killed).

Beyond the bolded, which isn't really important but I figured I'd highlight anyway, it's pretty much this. The difference between a slave and a servant is that slaves have no freedoms. Servants do. 

Really no sense in me repeating what BYT said, as it's straightforward and... well... nothing more need be said (that I can think of anyway).

Went back and fixed it. THANK YOU!!! I seriously wouldn't have caught that humongo mistake without your post!

[Ryzaki]

Qistina wrote...

Rape can be willingly or forcibly

Rape's very definition means it's not willingly. someone holding a gun to your head doesn't make you willing.


Statutory rape is a hole nother can of worms.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 02 juin 2013 - 04:35 .

[LobselVith8]

brushyourteeth wrote...

No, no no. Just no. NO.

Forcing someone to have sex under any condition is rape. The only "willing rape" is statutory rape, (even then, the only government I know of for sure that acknowledges it is here in the United States) in which one participant is underaged.

It's sad that this even needs to be said.

[Boycott Bioware]

brushyourteeth wrote...
No, no no. Just no. NO.

Forcing someone to have sex under any condition is rape. The only "willing rape" is statutory rape, (even then, the only government I know of for sure that acknowledges it is here in the United States) in which one participant is underaged.

I give you another example

You drunk husband losing gambling, he cannot pay, the gamblers say you must have sex with them as payment, or else they harm your family and children and taking everything in your home

So you are willingly having sex with them to pay your debt to save your family from being harmed. You are willingly but it still rape

brushyourteeth wrote...
She doesn't have to take either of them, and once she takes them, she could leave them and risk getting attacked or exposed to the Templars (for herself or in Bethany's case). That's called blackmail, not slavery.

"Your uncle say your sister is a Mage", "Your uncle say you are a Mage", the smuggler also mention the same thing.

See, that is some kind of "pushing", the bargaining chip is you work with them for a year for a protection from Templars and paying your debt.

Hawke family because of being dumb, refuse to go anywhere else forcing Hawke to make the decision, in favor for his/her family safety and his/her own safety, Hawke sold him/her self to the debtor, willingly become their slave

Similar with raped willingly

[KiwiQuiche]

Qistina, could you please just stop. Rape, by it's very definition, cannot be willing. And it's fairly distressing that you think it can be.

[Boycott Bioware]

EntropicAngel wrote...
That isn't true at all. A servant, by definition, is one who serves. A slave, by definition, is one controlled by another (Miriam-Webster references chattel, which is actually property. A servant is not property).

Leandra dialogue to Gamlen, "you sold them for a year in servitude, SERVITUDE"

change it to, "you sold them for a year in slavery, SLAVERY!"

Servitude--->Service--->Serve--->Servant--->Slave

Hawke is Red Iron or Ethenril property for a year, because of the debt.

[Boycott Bioware]

KiwiQuiche wrote...
Qistina, could you please just stop. Rape, by it's very definition, cannot be willing. And it's fairly distressing that you think it can be.

No, rape can be willingly in certain condition, just ask any lawyers

[daaaav]

Qistina wrote...

I don't know what...

Why are you doing this? 

I think you need to re-examine your definition of willingness....

Without repeating the jist of the senarios... Forced willingness is an oxymoron.

[Harle Cerulean]

Guys, unless I'm misunderstanding, Qistina isn't saying those situations aren't rape, they're just misusing the word 'willingly'.

Qistina, 'under duress' isn't 'willingly'. All the situations you're describing are coerced; you're misusing the word 'willingly'. 'Willingly' means 'of your own free will.' If you're being forced or coerced into something, it's not of your own free will,

[Boycott Bioware]

In the court, if you say "yes i am willingly having sex with them because of *any life threatening scenarios*", that can be contested in rape case

You are willingly in certain condition

[ElitePinecone]

Qistina wrote...

I give you another example

You drunk husband losing gambling, he cannot pay, the gamblers say you must have sex with them as payment, or else they harm your family and children and taking everything in your home

So you are willingly having sex with them to pay your debt to save your family from being harmed. You are willingly but it still rape

This is still COERCION. It is *not* willing. 

[Harle Cerulean]

Qistina wrote...

In the court, if you say "yes i am willingly having sex with them because of *any life threatening scenarios*", that can be contested in rape case

You are willingly in certain condition

Maybe in your country, but not here.  That's called coercion.  It's not willing, and no, it doesn't make it less rape in the eyes of the court.

[Boycott Bioware]

ElitePinecone wrote...
This is still COERCION. It is *not* willing.

There are many case of incest, not underage one, but mature incest where the victim never report to the authorities for years until they cannot hold it anymore...for those years they are willingly cooperate with the rapist, because of thinking they are family members, don't want shame and so on...they are willingly raped

Modifié par Qistina, 02 juin 2013 - 06:03 .