416 réponses à ce sujet

[xlegionx]

Cthulhu42 wrote...

xlegionx wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

David7204 wrote...

I'm not talking the bar. I'm not talking about points. I'm talking about much deeper things. Dialogue, music, camerawork. All of that works together to establish a tone. Such as in Mordin's sacrifice. I don't give a damn about the bar, but I sure as hell care about all the other stuff.  

.  Mordin being shot is a much more powerful scene IMO.

Tali killing Legion or Tali commiting suicide were also much more powerful scenes than the peace scene

Legion getting shanked was my favourite part of the game until Citadel came out tbh.

As long as you're not one of those monsters who did those renegade interrupts, that's fine by me

[David7204]

MEHEM is not heroism. And neither is Citadel. They're just fluff.

[DeinonSlayer]

xlegionx wrote...

Cthulhu42 wrote...

xlegionx wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

David7204 wrote...

I'm not talking the bar. I'm not talking about points. I'm talking about much deeper things. Dialogue, music, camerawork. All of that works together to establish a tone. Such as in Mordin's sacrifice. I don't give a damn about the bar, but I sure as hell care about all the other stuff.  

.  Mordin being shot is a much more powerful scene IMO.

Tali killing Legion or Tali commiting suicide were also much more powerful scenes than the peace scene

Legion getting shanked was my favourite part of the game until Citadel came out tbh.

As long as you're not one of those monsters who did those renegade interrupts, that's fine by me

I could never do the interrupts with Legion.

For the VI which replaces him, though, three isn't really enough...

[AresKeith]

David7204 wrote...

MEHEM is not heroism. And neither is Citadel. They're just fluff.

*takes a drink*

[David7204]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

It's a more compelling moral question for the player when they know blind faith won't consistently be rewarded.

Catch-22's are more interesting than floating along, confident in the knowledge that nothing bad will ever come of doing the same thing every time. One of my most interesting ME2 playthroughs had Shepard sacrifice half of the Normandy crew to prevent the Batarian bombing of Watson - stopping the immediate threat of the missiles and saving the colony took priority over an immediate rescue of the crew. Likewise, one of my most interesting ME3 playthroughs of the Genophage arc had both Wreav and Eve alive.

Both situations are avoidable, but (IMO) it's more interesting when such things happen than when they don't.

First of all, it's not 'blind faith.' It's just faith. Again, we have that irritating implication that players who want to be good are naive and stupid and 'sleepwalking.'

Second of all, let me ask you something. When was the last time you watched any kind of action movie and the main character was killed in a low-level fight with mooks 30 minutes in?

Modifié par David7204, 05 juin 2013 - 01:42 .

[Steelcan]

David7204 wrote...

MEHEM is not heroism. And neither is Citadel. They're just fluff.

.  so?  Id prefer a whole game like Citadel to the mopey forced tragedy of vanilla ME3.

[xlegionx]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

xlegionx wrote...

Cthulhu42 wrote...

xlegionx wrote...


Tali killing Legion or Tali commiting suicide were also much more powerful scenes than the peace scene

Legion getting shanked was my favourite part of the game until Citadel came out tbh.

As long as you're not one of those monsters who did those renegade interrupts, that's fine by me

I could never do the interrupts with Legion.

For the VI which replaces him, though, three isn't really enough...

Fair enough

[David7204]

Steelcan wrote...

so?  Id prefer a whole game like Citadel to the mopey forced tragedy of vanilla ME3.

Oh, but the 'mopey forced tragedy' of having your heroism count for nothing and your friends die is great when you do the right thing is great, right?

Because that's precisely what you're advocating.

Modifié par David7204, 05 juin 2013 - 01:47 .

[MassivelyEffective0730]

David7204 wrote...
Yes, I expect the ethics of the story to agree with my own. It's not about 'need,' it's about spending time with content that appeals to you. Stories do not have an obligation to please everyone. If the stories ethics clash with my own, I'm not going to consider the story well written, and I'll move on to something else.

You're basically saying that if you don't agree with the ethics of a story and the morality behind it, it's a bad story written by inept writers.

You're trying to say that people are wrong for not having the same ethics you do.

You're being very arrogant.

[AresKeith]

David7204 wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

so?  Id prefer a whole game like Citadel to the mopey forced tragedy of vanilla ME3.

Oh, but the 'mopey forced tragedy' of having your heroism count for nothing and your friends die is great when you do the right thing is great, right?

Because that's precisely what you're advocating.

What the hell are you talking about? And what are you smoking?

[David7204]

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

You're basically saying that if you don't agree with the ethics of a story and the morality behind it, it's a bad story written by inept writers.

You're trying to say that people are wrong for not having the same ethics you do.

You're being very arrogant.

Ethics are just like ice cream flavors to you, aren't they? Yours are vanilla, mine are chocolate? There's no right or wrong. Everyone is equal, and anyone who dares to say or think otherwise is 'arrogant.'

[Steelcan]

David7204 wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

so?  Id prefer a whole game like Citadel to the mopey forced tragedy of vanilla ME3.

Oh, but the 'mopey forced tragedy' of having your heroism count for nothing and your friends die is great when you do the right thing is great, right?

Because that's precisely what you're advocating.

When it is the result of a stupid decision, yep.

[David7204]

Thankfully, the Paragon decisions in Mass Effect aren't stupid.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

David7204 wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

You're basically saying that if you don't agree with the ethics of a story and the morality behind it, it's a bad story written by inept writers.

You're trying to say that people are wrong for not having the same ethics you do.

You're being very arrogant.

Ethics are just like ice cream flavors to you, aren't they? Yours are vanilla, mine are chocolate? There's no right or wrong. Everyone is equal, and anyone who dares to say or think otherwise is 'arrogant.'

Yes, everyone has the capacity for an equal opinion. You're being very arrogant and might I say stupid if you believe otherwise to that. 

You have an ego problem.

[Dextro Milk]

David7204 wrote...

Thankfully, the Paragon decisions in Mass Effect aren't stupid.

Keep saying that to yourself... 

[Steelcan]

David7204 wrote...

Thankfully, the Paragon decisions in Mass Effect aren't stupid.

.  Letting a terrorist walk away scott free? How about curing the genophage under a bllodthirsty lunatic?  How about destroying what is potentially a gold mine of technology?  What about letting an alien capable of starting galactic wars with no oversight, twice? 

[David7204]

Maybe someone should shoot you in the face and take all your money because they believe it's right to do so. Everyone's opinion is equal, so you'd be very arrogant and might I say stupid if you object to that.

[David7204]

Steelcan wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Thankfully, the Paragon decisions in Mass Effect aren't stupid.

.  Letting a terrorist walk away scott free? How about curing the genophage under a bllodthirsty lunatic?  How about destroying what is potentially a gold mine of technology?  What about letting an alien capable of starting galactic wars with no oversight, twice? 

A 'terrorist' who was in the right place at the right time and got lucky. Not a deadly criminal mastermind. Saving the crew is more important.

Whatever the Rachni did a thousand years ago is no justifiction for their extinction now when they're a negliable threat compared to the rest of the galaxy.

Never cured the genophage with Wreav, so I'd had to see how the game treats it.

As for the Collector base decision, that could have been done better yes, but the solution is doing the damn thing better.

Modifié par David7204, 05 juin 2013 - 02:04 .

[dreamgazer]

David7204 wrote...

Maybe someone should shoot you in the face and take all your money because they believe it's right to do so. Everyone's opinion is equal, so you'd be very arrogant and might I say stupid if you object to that.

Let's not create false equivalencies. 

[teh DRUMPf!!]

 LOL... this is a funny thread.

[Jarl Johnnie Walker]

David7204 wrote...

Maybe someone should shoot you in the face and take all your money because they believe it's right to do so. Everyone's opinion is equal, so you'd be very arrogant and might I say stupid if you object to that.

If everyone's opinion is equal, then you should have no problem when I make your mother my slave. Pray that she's good enough for me. Her objectives are as follows: Fabricate the ultimate sammich, deposit non-freezer brunt ice in my scotch, and not complain about it. Because that's how she should be treated. It is my right to believe so. Just as it's also my right to send her back to you in pieces should she fail deplorably.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

David7204 wrote...

Maybe someone should shoot you in the face and take all your money because they believe it's right to do so. Everyone's opinion is equal, so you'd be very arrogant and might I say stupid if you object to that.

You've invoked a fallacy. You're now equating action to an opinion. That's false.

Not every action is reconcilable with those of others. But that doesn't make the idea behind it any less valid. There's a lot of variables to account for in determining a person's ideals and opinions.

Of course, there is a way to make ones opinions and ideals invalid, and that is by objectively claiming them to be inherently better than anyone elses and degrading other opinions because they are not your own.

Which you demonstrate in nearly every post you've ever made here.

And I will say it does seem your opinions are regularly different in an irreconcilable manner from everybody else (that word being hyperbole). And from your own state too it seems. 

Modifié par MassivelyEffective0730, 05 juin 2013 - 02:07 .

[AresKeith]

dreamgazer wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Maybe someone should shoot you in the face and take all your money because they believe it's right to do so. Everyone's opinion is equal, so you'd be very arrogant and might I say stupid if you object to that.

Let's not create false equivalencies. 

That's what he does

[The Don's Hound]

Johnnie Walker wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Maybe someone should shoot you in the face and take all your money because they believe it's right to do so. Everyone's opinion is equal, so you'd be very arrogant and might I say stupid if you object to that.

If everyone's opinion is equal, then you should have no problem when I make your mother my slave. Pray that she's good enough for me. Her objectives are as follows: Fabricate the ultimate sammich, deposit non-freezer brunt ice in my scotch, and not complain about it. Because that's how she should be treated. It is my right to believe so. Just as it's also my right to send her back to you in pieces should she fail deplorably.

https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTf8m9nEzctPwfE_cTxvS0nA-8iwihpGeIUjtbKHtA2Z0e2pv5sGg