700 réponses à ce sujet

[KiwiQuiche]

sandalisthemaker wrote...

myrrhcat wrote...

 And while sexual orientation or gender identity aren't things you can tell just by looking at a person, it'd be great to represent those better in the promotional materials too. Like maybe a trailer featuring a female hero with one of the female love interests... and not just in the context of EA's "look, we have gay people!" promo video, but the actual trailer for a specific game, that includes the queerness without revolving around it.

The problem with this would be that it would be taken as forewarding the "gay agenda" and "Shoving homosexuality in my face" yada yada.
Plus Fox news and their ilk would totally flip a ****. 
I don't think Bioware needs any more PR  headaches.

Oh Fox flips their sh!t over anything, I don't even know why anyone gives a crap about them anymore.

[myrrhcat]

Some of you guys need to step back, wipe the grease off your glasses and put this into perspective.

99% of video games have men and only men on the cover, and that's totally okay... but as soon as we ask for just one particular video game to have a woman on the cover, we are fanatics.

Stop saying "political correctness" like it's a dirty word. Being respectful and inclusive of people who are not like you is not difficult or unreasonable. It's mature.

[ObserverStatus]

katiebour wrote...
I haven't played this game, so I can't speak as to who this character is.  But I watched the vid you linked, and here's what I saw.
Fem!character swears vengeance.  Male!character (who the camera has spent more time on than any other character in this preview thus far) tells her to "Get it together, darling."  Because obviously she needs man!character to call the shots, with a cute little endearment, no less.  He then leads the way, and tosses her a gun (she has no agency without him.)  And then they kiss.
Swap it around.  Have fem!character the star of the preview (with the camera spending the bulk of the time in the preview on her), finding m!character.  Maybe she tells him "Get it together, darling," and then tosses him a gun.  Then he makes googly eyes at her and they kiss.
No?

The writing really took a nose dive in StarCraft II, I liked her better in Brood War. Here are the same two characters in that game.

bit.ly/ZpedXQ

[sandalisthemaker]

I Like Cats And wrote...

I guarentee he could of kicked your ass you idiot, you got away with it because you are delicate. If a man punched you in the nose you'd expect another man to come and defend you. You're a moron. 

Excuse me sir, but I think your mysogyny is showing...

Modifié par sandalisthemaker, 04 juin 2013 - 12:51 .

[rapscallioness]

I just wanted to post this. This thread made me think of it. The delicate stuff, and the fact that we're still having the same conversation abt this kinda thing. Over a hundred years later. Sigh.

"Modern History Sourcebook:
Sojourner Truth:
"Ain't I a Woman?", December 1851

Sojourner Truth (1797-1883): Ain't I A Woman?
Delivered 1851
Women's Convention, Akron, Ohio

'Well, children, where there is so much racket there must be something out of kilter. I think that 'twixt the negroes of the South and the women at the North, all talking about rights, the white men will be in a fix pretty soon. But what's all this here talking about?

That man over there says that women need to be helped into carriages, and lifted over ditches, and to have the best place everywhere. Nobody ever helps me into carriages, or over mud-puddles, or gives me any best place! And ain't I a woman? Look at me! Look at my arm! I have ploughed and planted, and gathered into barns, and no man could head me! And ain't I a woman? I could work as much and eat as much as a man - when I could get it - and bear the lash as well! And ain't I a woman? I have borne thirteen children, and seen most all sold off to slavery, and when I cried out with my mother's grief, none but Jesus heard me! And ain't I a woman?

Then they talk about this thing in the head; what's this they call it? [member of audience whispers, "intellect"] That's it, honey. What's that got to do with women's rights or negroes' rights? If my cup won't hold but a pint, and yours holds a quart, wouldn't you be mean not to let me have my little half measure full?

Then that little man in black there, he says women can't have as much rights as men, 'cause Christ wasn't a woman! Where did your Christ come from? Where did your Christ come from? From God and a woman! Man had nothing to do with Him.

If the first woman God ever made was strong enough to turn the world upside down all alone, these women together ought to be able to turn it back , and get it right side up again! And now they is asking to do it, the men better let them.

Obliged to you for hearing me, and now old Sojourner ain't got nothing more to say.' "

[Herr Uhl]

Filament wrote...

Half and half would remind me of that Dexter/Dee-Dee bot in that one episode of Dexter's Lab and probably leave a much different impression than "customizable protagonist" if I hadn't done any research.

ie SHAPESHIFTING

edit: or was it a Dexter/Mandark bot... hmm...

It could work.

[Sylvianus]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Sylvianus wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Oh look....it's this thread again.

People overacting and finding significance in insignificant stuff again. I weep for humanity.

Yup, god forbid some people want equality with gender in media.

This is still insignificant. I do not ask Bioware to put a black guy or a a black woman on the box, ( as long as I can play one ) while I''m tired of white people always on the cover. Did you ever see a black hero on the cover in Bioware's game ? No. Do you see me complaining to Bioware about how it neglected a part of its fanbase ? No . Do you see me crying like a little girl ? No.  Because, I know what is most important. They allow me to play what I want and what I am. If they do that one day, I'll be happy, If they don't, I don't care.

Now, I hope that Bioware won't put anybody on the cover, so you all, male and female gamers can shut up.

So now I'm crying like a little girl because I made a valid complain? Wow, aren't you ignorant and stereotypical.

You also missed the part where I bluntly stated I would prefer a cover that featured no protagonists over all, due to DAI being an RPG.  That was one of my main beefs about DA2, where you had normal Hawke for the covers and also for the first part of your playthrough, which I really disliked.

Reading comprehension, what is it.

I wasn't specifically talking about you. I've just read this thread and i've  seen a few ridiculous complaints. Like ( female femshep was on the back of the mass effect cover, looool ) I didn't read your other comments by the way, I read this one, where you are talking about " equality in the media ", and seemed to contradict the poster you quoted. The equality is in the game, the marketting is absolutely another matter. If they want to put a female protagonist on the cover, that is fine for example. And male gamers have nothing to say so long they can play their gender like a true rpg. ( Bioware could do that for DA:I for example, why not ) So yes, given the tone in this thread, people overreacting, it appears insignificant.

This isn't because I want to see a black hero ( or something else ) on the cover that Bioware can't do a white dude on the cover, or is forced to do another black hero on the back of the cover because of " equality ". This is basically what you are saying.  That's just nonsense to me. If this is a rpg like you said, with choices for everyone, then you are free to tell your story, to think the way you want, with the exactly same content, while the marketting is trying to sell its game as it feels it's best, and you shouldn' t be bothered by it if it does't affect your game. 

I wasn't at all bothered by default Hawk, not even with all the marketting, except the fact that the character creator happened only after the introduction. But that's it. If bioware wants a defaut protagonist, that's their right, it doesn't affect anyone.

Marketting means choices to make and limitations. This isn't mandatory to create one hero of each gender on the cover. What the hell is that way of thinking ?  What if they want to draw one protagonist on a specific cover, with a specific environment, telling a story to the players, regardless of what the hero is, why couldn't they because of customization ?  It's about being pragmatic, there. They do whatever the hell they want for specific reasons to sell their game, that's business. They showed fem protagonists gameplay, fem!protagonists trailers, some people just can't say that the  the fem! protagonists didn't exist, that's just not true.

I'm not saying you can't ask, on the contrary, I'd like that too, but acting like it was the biggest feminist battle ever, something over the issue of the cover, is just a joke. Especially after te fact that femshep was on the cover of M3...

[KiwiQuiche]

I Like Cats And wrote...

I guarentee he could of kicked your ass you idiot, you got away with it because you are delicate. If a man punched you in the nose you'd expect another man to come and defend you. You're a moron. 

And now your true colours are showing. Nice!

[Zeldrik1389]

Herr Uhl wrote...

kmatthews wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

kmatthews wrote...

the last guy that called me delicate got his nose broken. He wasn't being nice about it, he asked me why I was occupying the bench press at the gym when there was "less delicate" people that needed to use it for real.

That reaction seems a bit extreme.

A bit extreme when he was loudly making fun of me in public, harrassing me after I asked him nicely to leave me alone & being an overall jerk? No one came to my help, no one came to remove him. So nope, I think breaking his nose got him away from me permanently, as I still see him around, proved my point that I wasn't "delicate", & taught him a lesson.

My stance is unchanged. Physical assault is not an acceptable reaction to ridicule.

I don't know what kind of gym was that, but it sounds like it was in imaginary land and the whole thing is just a fantasy. If you break a guy's nose (is he one of the trainers or just some guy happen to go to that gym?) you won't get away with it. Either things got ugly then police will come, and that person will charge you, which will end up with either paying him a large sum of money, or some jail time. Or some others will take care of you personally, which won't be pretty either. It's funny how people talking about physically asault others without even think about the consequences.  

[I Like Cats And]

sandalisthemaker wrote...

I Like Cats And wrote...

I guarentee he could of kicked your ass you idiot, you got away with it because you are delicate. If a man punched you in the nose you'd expect another man to come and defend you. You're a moron. 

Excuse me sir, but I think your mysogyny is showing...

RIght I'm the bigot, she physically assulted a man for making a joke....I pointed out she got special treatment because of her gender. I'll take being a misogynist over being a crazy hypocritical idiot. Thanks!

[Battlebloodmage]

Geez... at the rate this thread is going, it may get locked soon. People should learn to state their opinion without personal attacks. 

Modifié par Battlebloodmage, 04 juin 2013 - 12:59 .

[I Like Cats And]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

I Like Cats And wrote...

I guarentee he could of kicked your ass you idiot, you got away with it because you are delicate. If a man punched you in the nose you'd expect another man to come and defend you. You're a moron. 

And now your true colours are showing. Nice!

Well you exposed this whole "PC we deserve equal treatment" movement's hypocrasy. It's ok to punch a man for making a joke but god forbid there's a man on a video game box. You don't want equal treatment you want special treatment. Thank you for making this movement look bad, that's why no one respects modern day feminists. 

[sandalisthemaker]

Sylvianus wrote...

I wasn't specifically talking about you. I've just read this thread and i've  seen a few ridiculous complaints. Like ( female femshep was on the back of the mass effect cover, looool ) I didn't read your other comments by the way, I read this one, where you are talking about " equality in the media ", and seemed to contradict the poster you quoted. The equality is in the game, the marketting is absolutely another matter. If they want to put a female protagonist on the cover, that is fine for example. And male gamers have nothing to say so long they can play their gender like a true rpg. ( Bioware could do that for DA:I for example, why not ) So yes, given the tone in this thread, people overreacting, it appears insignificant.

This isn't because I want to see a black hero ( or something else ) on the cover that Bioware can't do a white dude on the cover, or is forced to do another black hero on the back of the cover because of " equality ". This is basically what you are saying.  That's just nonsense to me. If this is a rpg like you said, with choices for everyone, then you are free to tell your story, to think the way you want, with the exactly same content, while the marketting is trying to sell its game as it feels it's best, and you shouldn' t be bothered by it if it does't affect your game. 

I wasn't at all bothered by default Hawk, not even with all the marketting, except the fact that the character creator happened only after the introduction. But that's it. If bioware wants a defaut protagonist, that's their right, it doesn't affect anyone.

Marketting means choices to make and limitations. This isn't mandatory to create one hero of each gender on the cover. What the hell is that way of thinking ?  What if they want to draw one protagonist on a specific cover, with a specific environment, telling a story to the players, regardless of what the hero is, why couldn't they because of customization ?  It's about being pragmatic, there. They do whatever the hell they want for specific reasons to sell their game, that's business. They showed fem protagonists gameplay, fem!protagonists trailers, some people just can't say that the  the fem! protagonists didn't exist, that's just not true.

I'm not saying you can't ask, on the contrary, I'd like that too, but acting like it was the biggest feminist battle ever, something over the issue of the cover, is just a joke. Especially after te fact that femshep was on the cover of M3...

Excuse me sir, but I think your privilege is showing.
It is easy for someone who is a member of a group that always has representation in everything to not understand why it would be a big deal for people who are members of a group that  rarely gets any (or no) representation to want representation.

Modifié par sandalisthemaker, 04 juin 2013 - 12:58 .

[myrrhcat]

How about instead of condescendingly telling us our concerns are insignificant, you support us and help us get a woman on the cover of the game so we can all be happy? Stop acting like there's nothing that can be done about this, that the marketing team is gonna do whatever they want regardless of what we say. If the people speak up and say what they want to see, and there's enough of us, they will listen. That's the entire point of marketing.

[sandalisthemaker]

Battlebloodmage wrote...

Geez... at the rate this thread is going, it may get locked soon. People should learn to state their opinion without personal attacks. 

If it gets locked, so be it.
I will shout for equality till it does.

Modifié par sandalisthemaker, 04 juin 2013 - 01:00 .

[KiwiQuiche]

Sylvianus wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Sylvianus wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Oh look....it's this thread again.

People overacting and finding significance in insignificant stuff again. I weep for humanity.

Yup, god forbid some people want equality with gender in media.

This is still insignificant. I do not ask Bioware to put a black guy or a a black woman on the box, ( as long as I can play one ) while I''m tired of white people always on the cover. Did you ever see a black hero on the cover in Bioware's game ? No. Do you see me complaining to Bioware about how it neglected a part of its fanbase ? No . Do you see me crying like a little girl ? No.  Because, I know what is most important. They allow me to play what I want and what I am. If they do that one day, I'll be happy, If they don't, I don't care.

Now, I hope that Bioware won't put anybody on the cover, so you all, male and female gamers can shut up.

So now I'm crying like a little girl because I made a valid complain? Wow, aren't you ignorant and stereotypical.

You also missed the part where I bluntly stated I would prefer a cover that featured no protagonists over all, due to DAI being an RPG.  That was one of my main beefs about DA2, where you had normal Hawke for the covers and also for the first part of your playthrough, which I really disliked.

Reading comprehension, what is it.

I wasn't specifically talking about you. I've just read this thread and i've  seen a few ridiculous complaints. Like ( female femshep was on the back of the mass effect cover, looool ) I didn't read your other comments by the way, I read this one, where you are talking about " equality in the media ", and seemed to contradict the poster you quoted. The equality is in the game, the marketting is absolutely another matter. If they want to put a female protagonist on the cover, that is fine for example. And male gamers have nothing to say so long they can play their gender like a true rpg. ( Bioware could do that for DA:I for example, why not ) So yes, given the tone in this thread, people overreacting, it appears insignificant.

This isn't because I want to see a black hero ( or something else ) on the cover that Bioware can't do a white dude on the cover, or is forced to do another black hero on the back of the cover because of " equality ". This is basically what you are saying.  That's just nonsense to me. If this is a rpg like you said, with choices for everyone, then you are free to tell your story, to think the way you want, with the exactly same content, while the marketting is trying to sell its game as it feels it's best, and you shouldn' t be bothered by it if it does't affect your game. 

I wasn't at all bothered by default Hawk, not even with all the marketting, except the fact that the character creator happened only after the introduction. But that's it. If bioware wants a defaut protagonist, that's their right, it doesn't affect anyone.

Marketting means choices to make and limitations. This isn't mandatory to create one hero of each gender on the cover. What the hell is that way of thinking ?  What if they want to draw one protagonist on a specific cover, with a specific environment, telling a story to the players, regardless of what the hero is, why couldn't they because of customization ?  It's about being pragmatic, there. They do whatever the hell they want for specific reasons to sell their game, that's business. They showed fem protagonists gameplay, fem!protagonists trailers, some people just can't say that the  the fem! protagonists didn't exist, that's just not true.

I'm not saying you can't ask, on the contrary, I'd like that too, but acting like it was the biggest feminist battle ever, something over the issue of the cover, is just a joke. Especially after te fact that femshep was on the cover of M3...

Ah, my apologies for that mix up; though if you were addressing the thread as a whole you shouldn't have quoted me, that's why I thought it was directed at me XD

People are 'overreacting' on both sides, though most of it seems to be the ones treating this request like some hilarious woman joke and hurling out the stereotypes. I doubt they even realize just how often women get hit with these, over and over and over ever damn day, which is why a lot of the women in this thread are getting angry over the disrespectful and misgoynist attitudes from some (note I said SOME) men in this thread.

I want varience in my heroes; it's, the majority of the time, a white guy. And frankly I'm bored with it, as are many others. I'm not saying Bioware is sexist or racist, far from it. They have some of the best representation of gender, race and sexual orientation I've seen in games. Yet they never show that varience with their advertising. It's fairly...ugh what's the word? Disapointing? A shame? Because Bioware does have this wonderful diversity, yet so many people don't know they do, due to the markecting being kept solely focused on the 'white guy' angle.

As I said, it's a RPG with strong customization roots. Therefore I think it best to do a cover like Skyrim, where you see the symbol, or the trailers which have the character mostly covered, with a helmet as well, so they are easilly seen as a possible 'anyone.'

What? Who's acting like it's that massive battle? And Femshep was quite a victory with ME.

[myrrhcat]

I hope all the dudes making blatantly sexist kitchen jokes get banned. It does say right in the forum rules that you're not supposed to be sexist.

Hopefully this isn't the kind of forum where I would also be banned for pointing out other people's sexism (as if that somehow counts as a personal attack). But if I were, I'd take it with pride.

[KiwiQuiche]

I Like Cats And wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

I Like Cats And wrote...

I guarentee he could of kicked your ass you idiot, you got away with it because you are delicate. If a man punched you in the nose you'd expect another man to come and defend you. You're a moron. 

And now your true colours are showing. Nice!

Well you exposed this whole "PC we deserve equal treatment" movement's hypocrasy. It's ok to punch a man for making a joke but god forbid there's a man on a video game box. You don't want equal treatment you want special treatment. Thank you for making this movement look bad, that's why no one respects modern day feminists. 

...Okay, I can't deal with your misogynistic stupidity, so I'm just going to ignore you from now on.

[CS420]

sandalisthemaker wrote...

Battlebloodmage wrote...
Geez... at the rate this thread is going, it may get locked soon. People should learn to state their opinion without personal attacks. 

If it gets locked, so be it.
I will shout for equality till it does.

Than fight on, brave internet warrior.

[Herr Uhl]

Filament wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

Filament wrote...

Half and half would remind me of that Dexter/Dee-Dee bot in that one episode of Dexter's Lab and probably leave a much different impression than "customizable protagonist" if I hadn't done any research.

ie SHAPESHIFTING

edit: or was it a Dexter/Mandark bot... hmm...

It could work.

Can't see the link.

Supposed to link an image of this poster.

[I Like Cats And]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

I Like Cats And wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

I Like Cats And wrote...

I guarentee he could of kicked your ass you idiot, you got away with it because you are delicate. If a man punched you in the nose you'd expect another man to come and defend you. You're a moron. 

And now your true colours are showing. Nice!

Well you exposed this whole "PC we deserve equal treatment" movement's hypocrasy. It's ok to punch a man for making a joke but god forbid there's a man on a video game box. You don't want equal treatment you want special treatment. Thank you for making this movement look bad, that's why no one respects modern day feminists. 

...Okay, I can't deal with your misogynistic stupidity, so I'm just going to ignore you from now on.

Right stop talking once you know you have no ground to stand on. Sorry honey.

Modifié par I Like Cats And, 04 juin 2013 - 01:08 .