[quote]IanPolaris wrote...
[quote]Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...
[quote]The Grey Nayr wrote...
[quote]Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...
That depends. Do they have a point?[/quote]
The only point they care about is that they believe that their absentee god who by their own admission doesn't give a damn about them or their world anymore wants it.[/quote]
Some of them actually care about innocent people, too.[/quote]
It does make you wonder about why those that do care about innocent people look to the Maker though. Morrigan makes this point rather pithily in the Lothering Chapel (wondering why desperate people are praying to a god that's abandoned them not once but twice).[/quote]
Okay, I'll grant this one.
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But it's a load of hypocritical BS.
They claim magic must serve man and not rule man. But by locking away all mages, they cant use their talents for the good of mankind. Which is directly betraying their own religious code. Anders may have discovered his inner terrorist near the end of DAII, but before that he was running a free clinic in Kirkwall's undercity healing people that nobody else cared about just because they were Fereldan refugees. Strike One.[/quote]
This doesn't stop Wynne from leaving to help the Wardens, or the mage army from leaving for Redcliffe and eventually Denerim. There's also a Circle ambassador at Vigil's Keep, and I think that King Meghren also had a court mage. Thus, the Circle
does release mages to do good for the world.
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Both were highly exceptional cases and both were in places where the rules for the circle were the most liberal, and Chantry control over mages perhaps the weakest (i.e. Fereldan post fifth blight). Even then it was entirely at the whim of KC Gregoire.[/quote]
I was under the impression that the Circle was legally required to send that army, actually, rather than it being something Gregoire allowed.
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They claim those who use magic to oppress "The maker's children" are evil. Yet using magic as an excuse to oppress mages, people who are as much the Maker's children as the normal people is the same crime. Thus they're betraying their code again. Strike two.[/quote]
They're doing so out of fear that the mages will oppress others, or worse, turn abomination (whether they wish it or not) and potentially solo a city. Notwithstanding that this event is rare, it has been shown in-game that abominations
can be roughly as dangerous as the Codex describes. Some Templars use this as an excuse, and the very most mercy I can see any reason to grant them is firing them and letting them bum change for illegal lyrium. Others legitimately want to protect others, and I think that they're reasonable to want that.
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That doesn't negate the inherent hypocrisy inherent in the change. Essentially the charge is that the cure is not only worse than the disease but makes the underlying disease worse, and there is at least some evidence that leads us to think this may be an accurate charge.[/quote]
Since the "disease" of magic leads mages to snap among the populace, I would argue that a more liberal Circle would probably make things better. It is meant to weed out mages likely to turn, thus making a rare phenomenon even rarer. It is also meant to isolate the problem, thus meaning that even if abominations turn more frequently, (which may be the case, but at least it still seems to be rare: none of the mages in the Circle seem to be worried about it happening) at least they turn more safely. You're worried that it might lead mages to go untrained for fear, too, if I remember correctly? That's a legitimate concern, but I don't see it cancelling out the number of mages removed from the populace, especially if the Templars have the flexibility to tolerate limited apostate activity in order to allow city hedge mages to get actual training. (Like Ser Harrith does, for instance.)
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They claim blood magic is forbidden and anybody who uses it even once deserves to die. Yet the Chantry and Templars use blood magic to power the phylacteries they use to hunt mages and for them it's okay as long as they keep it secret. By their own code, they deserve death, and have no right to persecute mages who've never used Blood magic ever. Strike three, they're out.
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While I will grant this example of hypocrisy, the fact is that being able to track escaped mages makes it much easier for the Circle to function. Besides which, the specific blood magic involved is stated in Witch Hunt, I think, to be technically legal for mages to perform anyway.[/quote]
The point is that it's hypocrisy. It's more logical to designate certain forms of magic as forbidden/restricted based on what they are (like Mind Control). The cynic in me wonders if the chantry hates bloodmagic simply because it's the one form of magic that Templars can't shut down. As for the ritual in Witch Hunt, it's legality is very much a grey area which is why Finn wants everyone to keep his use of the ritual to themselves. HE thinks it should be legal, but he's not at all sure the Templars would agree.
-Polaris[/quote]
There may be something to that, but that's not ultimately why blood magic is forbidden. Early in the Chantry's history, a Divine was asked what dark magic looks like. This is a complicated question, and yet the Divine wanted a simple answer. Ultimately, she found verses in the Chant that could be loosely interpreted to forbid Mind Control and using the blood of others (which anyone with any sense should forbid anyway, except in the most dire circumstances) and turned this into a broader ban on blood magic. They might have forbidden it anyway, for the reasons you describe, but the ban was originally because a Divine was lazy. (Just because I think the Circle is a good idea doesn't mean I like the Chantry.)
Now, I personally don't have any real opinion on whether blood magic should be forbidden. On the one hand, the Templars can't block it, and it apparently attracts demons. On the other hand, even the Templars find it handy sometimes.
Modifié par Riverdaleswhiteflash, 10 juin 2013 - 07:15 .
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