926 réponses à ce sujet

[IceHawk-181]

The Awakened Collector only exists in Multiplayer...and it is the only thing in game that might support his POV, therefore it must be canon.

Otherwise he knows his POV is baseless.

[mass perfection]

Seival wrote...

xlegionx wrote...

 @Seival:
Please stop ignoring the fact the only a minority of each cycle is harvested. Most are just outright killed by the Reapers or their husk armies. That is a greater genocide than killing a synthetic being made up of organic material ever could be.

Also, the Awakened collector is a bunch of crap. See conversation with Mordin: www.youtube.com/watch

Civilians are the vast majority in any modern society, and galactic civilization is not much different in that term. 

Most casualties galactic civilization suffered were among military, and it's the military job to fight and die. They got paid for that risk you know? They know what they signed for, and all possible consequences.

Also,


"When the Reaper-killer known as Leviathan fought the Collectors, it severed their connection to Harbinger with a thrall device. Most Collector forces died as a result, but a few survived. Now, these rare individuals fight for the memory of their people, a proud race broken by the Reapers."

...They are the part of game's lore now, and you can't ignore that. Awakened Collectors are not Synthesized (yet), but they are the strong proof that harvested lives can be restored. And obviously, Synthesis is much more than just awaking.

My favorite MP character.Too bad he awakened to the monster and abomination he now is.Suicide is a better option.And don't tell me that the Reapers don't kill civilians when we see them blowing up buildings like there's no tomorrow at the beginning of the game.Harvested life be restored? Genetic goo=/=Husks.

[dreamgazer]

Seival wrote...

The Earth is a giant living being, which contains millions of small living beings.
A human is a living being which contains a lot of bacteria.
You have no idea how many lives you contain right now, KaiserShep.

Makes the whole "You are bacteria" thing make sense, huh?

So, are we supposed to feel guilt when we, as humans, use antibiotics?

[AresKeith]

IceHawk-181 wrote...

The Awakened Collector only exists in Multiplayer...and it is the only thing in game that might support his POV, therefore it must be canon.

Otherwise he knows his POV is baseless.

And husks fall under the category of indoctrination decaying their minds rapidly

[Dextro Milk]

dreamgazer wrote...

Seival wrote...

The Earth is a giant living being, which contains millions of small living beings.
A human is a living being which contains a lot of bacteria.
You have no idea how many lives you contain right now, KaiserShep.

Makes the whole "You are bacteria" thing make sense, huh?

So, are we supposed to feel guilt when we, as humans, use antibiotics?

Feel bad. Feel very bad... 

[IceHawk-181]

Also, according to game mechanics, at some point between ME2 and ME3 all races in the galaxy determined a means to run for an infinite distance and a means to use credits to purchase "upgrades" that make you more powerful and increase your ability to take a railshot to the face without dying....

[Seival]

mass perfection wrote...

Seival wrote...

xlegionx wrote...

 @Seival:
Please stop ignoring the fact the only a minority of each cycle is harvested. Most are just outright killed by the Reapers or their husk armies. That is a greater genocide than killing a synthetic being made up of organic material ever could be.

Also, the Awakened collector is a bunch of crap. See conversation with Mordin: www.youtube.com/watch

Civilians are the vast majority in any modern society, and galactic civilization is not much different in that term. 

Most casualties galactic civilization suffered were among military, and it's the military job to fight and die. They got paid for that risk you know? They know what they signed for, and all possible consequences.

Also,


"When the Reaper-killer known as Leviathan fought the Collectors, it severed their connection to Harbinger with a thrall device. Most Collector forces died as a result, but a few survived. Now, these rare individuals fight for the memory of their people, a proud race broken by the Reapers."

...They are the part of game's lore now, and you can't ignore that. Awakened Collectors are not Synthesized (yet), but they are the strong proof that harvested lives can be restored. And obviously, Synthesis is much more than just awaking.

My favorite MP character.Too bad he awakened to the monster and abomination he now is.Suicide is a better option.And don't tell me that the Reapers don't kill civilians when we see them blowing up buildings like there's no tomorrow at the beginning of the game.Harvested life be restored? Genetic goo=/=Husks.

Like I said, EC Synthesis shows that ex-Reaper ships were awakened too.

How many people needed to create a Reaper ship? And considering how numerous the Reapers are, they created many such ships in each Cycle. That means the Reapers always prefer to harvest the vast majority of population (and don't forget about husks who are not parts of Reaper ships). So, mostly the military got killed while resisting the Reapers.

[Redbelle]

Seival wrote...

xlegionx wrote...

 @Seival:
Please stop ignoring the fact the only a minority of each cycle is harvested. Most are just outright killed by the Reapers or their husk armies. That is a greater genocide than killing a synthetic being made up of organic material ever could be.

Also, the Awakened collector is a bunch of crap. See conversation with Mordin: www.youtube.com/watch

Civilians are the vast majority in any modern society, and galactic civilization is not much different in that term. 

Most casualties galactic civilization suffered were among military, and it's the military job to fight and die. They got paid for that risk you know? They know what they signed for, and all possible consequences.

Also,


"When the Reaper-killer known as Leviathan fought the Collectors, it severed their connection to Harbinger with a thrall device. Most Collector forces died as a result, but a few survived. Now, these rare individuals fight for the memory of their people, a proud race broken by the Reapers."

...They are the part of game's lore now, and you can't ignore that. Awakened Collectors are not Synthesized (yet), but they are the strong proof that harvested lives can be restored. And obviously, Synthesis is much more than just awaking.

Ok..... WTH?!?!

Soldier's jobs are not to 'fight and die' as you put it. Who the heck put that idea into your head that a soldiers reason for being is to fight and get themselves killed?

A soldiers job is to be ready to be called on to tackle extreme situations, When All Other Measures Fail!

Be it breaking out a green goddess fleet of outdated fire engines because the fire brigade went on strike and acting as firemen. Or delivering water to parts of the country when the water allocation infrastructure of the country broke down. Or rescuing people from flash flood events etc.......

Soldiers are not paid to fight and die. No soldier in their right mind would walk into a battlefield with no hope for survival. That's largely a myth perpetuated by Hollywood and writers who want to make someone look heroic. Soldier's are paid and trained to do dangerous work. That is true. But they are supported throughout that work to give them the best chance of coming back out again. For a civilian to simply, expect death, in the career of a soldier signals a fundamental disconnect between the armed services and the above poster.

And I think you have answered your own question. Only a few of the collector's survived being disconnected, lending credance to the concept that they are so heavily enthralled that they cannot live without the Reapers.......

Yet......

The ones that survived have little description to let us know what of them survived. Or even if they could be reabsorbed into the galactic community.

They could be memory receptacles with the skill set the Reapers gave them. Angry at what happened to them. Made to fight for the memory of their people to which they are suited thanks to the Reaper's..... and then........

Then what?

Flip burger's? Go on reality TV shows? Interviewed by Opera?

That is assuming they are even capable of doing anything other than wage war.

The awakened collectors do not have enough information about them to suggest what their place could be in the world after a cycle of being in the Reapers mitts.

And let us not forget. They don't even have a place in the aftermath of the SP campaign given that they were made for MP mode activities. Making sweeping statements about the SP ending based on MP mode where gameplay, not narrative rules, is a fallacy of logic.

Frankly, when the endings came about, the Reapers...... Cerberus...... The Collectors. They were all airbrushed out with no mention of what happened to these ground forces. The one example we saw was the solider and the husk. No slideshow to see if Shields survived his encounter with Shepard and went on to sign a lucrative book deal on 'How I learned to stop worrying and love the Shepard'.

As for that luvly shade of green being modeled by the collector...... Javiks Biotics were green even when he was not synthesised. It's a part of their heritage. But no one can say if it was reclaimed, or a throwback. The information needed to make that distinction just isn't there. As such, suggesting the awakened collectors could be anything other than an MP unit cannot be substantiated and is a flight of fancy.

Modifié par Redbelle, 09 juin 2013 - 04:34 .

[Redbelle]

Dextro Milk wrote...

Seival wrote...

Now... Did you stop Quarinas and the Geth from killing each other? Did you cure the Genophage? Did you save Rachni? If you did, then I'm afraid that you applied the double standards to you judgement of the Reapers.

Except in order to stop those conflicts, I didn't change everyones DNA on the grounds of a fallacy.

Not to mention that you convinced all those people to stop fighting, and they went along with it. Without firing green light that changed their DNA and thoguht processes. They all agreed to stop the fighting when the reason for fighting was removed.

Not so the Reapers. They don't stop if you construct an argument. They just give you a 'Talk tothe tentacle cause the eye pod ain't listening...... and besides, you wouldn't understand'.

How can you stop a war with the Reapers when the Reapers genuinely believe that they are doing the right thing?

All those other races harboured doubts. Grief and regret over their actions.

Not so the Reapers.

And so it is not a double standard. Try to talk to Bob on Rannoch about stopping the war and he'll tell you 'You don't understand. You really need us to kill you'.

The Reapers are the root cause of the problem. All the other races whose problems are resolved peacefully gave Shep the option to do so by accepting his resolution to the problem. The Reapers refuse to do this.

Modifié par Redbelle, 09 juin 2013 - 04:26 .

[Seival]

dreamgazer wrote...

Seival wrote...

The Earth is a giant living being, which contains millions of small living beings.
A human is a living being which contains a lot of bacteria.
You have no idea how many lives you contain right now, KaiserShep.

Makes the whole "You are bacteria" thing make sense, huh?

So, are we supposed to feel guilt when we, as humans, use antibiotics?

Antibiotics can kill both beneficial and non-beneficial bacteria. If you will use antibiotics without doctor's consult, you may die.

Human can't exist without beneficial bacteria inside him.
Human immune system can't have enough readiness without non-beneficial bacteria.
If you don't feel bad about using antibiotics, then you are very short-sighted.

[The Night Mammoth]

Seival wrote...

Like I said, EC Synthesis shows that ex-Reaper ships were awakened too.

The EC shows the Reapers standing around not killing people. You infer that they're 'awakened', but it's not fact, and you haven't clarified what 'awakened' actually means. 

How many people needed to create a Reaper ship? And considering how numerous the Reapers are, they created many such ships in each Cycle.

'Millions'. 

Though the second sentence is just conjecture. 

That means the Reapers always prefer to harvest the vast majority of population (and don't forget about husks who are not parts of Reaper ships). So, mostly the military got killed while resisting the Reapers.

More conjecture. 

Is there a single thing you've said on this topic not just conjecture, or that you've properly explained? 

Modifié par The Night Mammoth, 09 juin 2013 - 04:33 .

[Dextro Milk]

Seival wrote...

If you don't feel bad about using antibiotics, then you are very short-sighted.

OMGOMG

HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA 

[AresKeith]

Seival wrote...

If you don't feel bad about using antibiotics, then you are very short-sighted.

I am now 100% certain that you are a troll

Since Wulf is gone, I still ship you with David

[mass perfection]

Seival wrote...

mass perfection wrote...

Seival wrote...

xlegionx wrote...

 @Seival:
Please stop ignoring the fact the only a minority of each cycle is harvested. Most are just outright killed by the Reapers or their husk armies. That is a greater genocide than killing a synthetic being made up of organic material ever could be.

Also, the Awakened collector is a bunch of crap. See conversation with Mordin: www.youtube.com/watch

Civilians are the vast majority in any modern society, and galactic civilization is not much different in that term. 

Most casualties galactic civilization suffered were among military, and it's the military job to fight and die. They got paid for that risk you know? They know what they signed for, and all possible consequences.

Also,


"When the Reaper-killer known as Leviathan fought the Collectors, it severed their connection to Harbinger with a thrall device. Most Collector forces died as a result, but a few survived. Now, these rare individuals fight for the memory of their people, a proud race broken by the Reapers."

...They are the part of game's lore now, and you can't ignore that. Awakened Collectors are not Synthesized (yet), but they are the strong proof that harvested lives can be restored. And obviously, Synthesis is much more than just awaking.

My favorite MP character.Too bad he awakened to the monster and abomination he now is.Suicide is a better option.And don't tell me that the Reapers don't kill civilians when we see them blowing up buildings like there's no tomorrow at the beginning of the game.Harvested life be restored? Genetic goo=/=Husks.

Like I said, EC Synthesis shows that ex-Reaper ships were awakened too.

How many people needed to create a Reaper ship? And considering how numerous the Reapers are, they created many such ships in each Cycle. That means the Reapers always prefer to harvest the vast majority of population (and don't forget about husks who are not parts of Reaper ships). So, mostly the military got killed while resisting the Reapers.

And what are going to do when they're all awakened to the monster they now are?Fly into the sun?Do they each get turns to use the eaper to talk one by one?Do they sit and do nothing and explode from boredom?How does genetic past come back to life as the inividual it once was?How are Husks similar to goo in any way at all when it comes to being awakened?

  They need millions to make a Sovereign class.Let's say.....100 million.Let's make a guess that they make five Destroyers in a cycle and each one takes 15 million.We know that only one Soveriegn class is made each cycle.Do the math.100,000,000+15,000,000(5)=175,000,000.There's trillions of lives in a cycle.175,000,000 are not killed according to you.The trillions are still killed.

[Redbelle]

Dextro Milk wrote...

Seival wrote...

If you don't feel bad about using antibiotics, then you are very short-sighted.

OMGOMG

HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA 

Don't forget Aerobic bacteria and Anaerobic bacteria in compost heaps......

When you turn your compost, your killing anaerobic bacteria.

When YOU DON'T turn your compost, your killing aerobic bacteria.

And think of all the poor little bacteria that will never be because you did or didn't do one or the either!!!!!!

[mass perfection]

Dextro Milk wrote...

Seival wrote...

If you don't feel bad about using antibiotics, then you are very short-sighted.

OMGOMG

HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA 

[Dextro Milk]

Redbelle wrote...

Dextro Milk wrote...

Seival wrote...

If you don't feel bad about using antibiotics, then you are very short-sighted.

OMGOMG

HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA 

Don't forget Aerobic bacteria and Anaerobic bacteria in compost heaps......

When you turn your compost, your killing anaerobic bacteria.

When YOU DON'T turn your compost, your killing aerobic bacteria.

And think of all the poor little bacteria that will never be because you did or didn't do one or the either!!!!!!

Mmm... I'm such a badass renegade... 

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

AresKeith wrote...

Seival wrote...

If you don't feel bad about using antibiotics, then you are very short-sighted.

I am now 100% certain that you are a troll

Since Wulf is gone, I still ship you with David

This human understands!!

[Asharad Hett]

Is this how the essence is retained?

[The Night Mammoth]

Asharad Hett wrote...

Is this how the essence is retained?

Yes, can someone explain to me how a person who goes through this process is supposed to be okay afterward?

Modifié par The Night Mammoth, 09 juin 2013 - 04:58 .

[mass perfection]

Asharad Hett wrote...

Is this how the essence is retained?

She's still alive.Well,until you kill the baby Reaper.

[Redbelle]

The Night Mammoth wrote...

Asharad Hett wrote...

Is this how the essence is retained?

Yes, can someone explain to me how a person who goes through this process is supposed to be okay afterward?

......... moisturiser?

[Kel Riever]

Screaming means you are okay. Right?

[Astartes Marine]

Seival wrote...
Most casualties galactic civilization suffered were among military

HOW DO YOU KNOW THIS?  The Reapers are seen killing indiscriminately, did you even play the game?  Most of Palaven was burning, Earth was getting blasted to bits and we even see the Reapers actively target and shoot down civilians.  People all over the place were dying both civilian and military.

And no, none of those people were "saved" contrary to whatever silly headcanon you believe.  Riddled with mass effect shots, pulverized by Reaper capital ship weapons, beaten to death by Brutes, not one of those souls survives.  Your beloved Reapers are committing genocide whether you want to believe it or not.

Seival wrote...
and it's the military job to fight and die.

*twitch*
It's asinine statements like these that make me want to reach through the monitor and give you a proper Gibbs slap.
That is NOT the job of the military.  It is NOT the job of any soldier to "fight and die".  They'll fight yes, when all other diplomatic avenues are exhausted but not one man or woman in uniform has the goal of death. 

If you really think they sign up to be paid to die, then you are a frakking idiot and I'll have no pity for you.

[Gewehr_fr]

Seival wrote...

How many people needed to create a Reaper ship? And considering how numerous the Reapers are, they created many such ships in each Cycle. That means the Reapers always prefer to harvest the vast majority of population (and don't forget about husks who are not parts of Reaper ships). So, mostly the military got killed while resisting the Reapers.

The people inside Vancouver's buildings were not militaries trying to resist the reapers... the kid whose shuttle got destroyed was not a soldier.... people running on the streets and burned by red lasers were civilians... the people in those colonies, research outposts and gas stations which got bombed from orbit were not harvested in any way. They ALL died.

The catalyst doesn't care about individuals. All it does is harvesting a great sample of us, with what it considers to be the essence of our life saved in some twisted reaper form, to be used as war machines in the next cycle so its solution can work forever.

And again stop saying a krogan and a turian changed into a single brute, will recover post synthesis and live happily in a monster body like nothing ever happened. Seriously...