926 réponses à ce sujet

[ObserverStatus]

Yougotcarved1 wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...
Besides, Since when does DNA carries memories?

Did you not play Assassin's Creed?!

Personally, I found the idea that you can imprint the memory of a person's entire life onto the human genome preposterous. With 3.2 billion base pairs, the human genome is only capable of storing about 800 MB of data, while Assassain's Creed itself requires 9GB of hard drive space.

[Ticonderoga117]

bobobo878 wrote...

Yougotcarved1 wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...
Besides, Since when does DNA carries memories?

Did you not play Assassin's Creed?!

Personally, I found the idea that you can imprint the memory of a person's entire life onto the human genome preposterous. With 3.2 billion base pairs, the human genome is only capable of storing about 800 MB of data, while Assassain's Creed itself requires 9GB of hard drive space.

Preposterous? Sure, but that's Assassin's Creed's Eezo. Memories as DNA is not Mass Effect-y. Even Javik only got a "feeling" of the people on the Normandy, not outright memories.

[Redbelle]

Going back a bit. There is another reason why the awakened collectors are acting the way they are. The leviathans could have hijacked them after killing the Reaper who orchestrated their movements and are now using them in the same way the Reapers used them against the Galaxy. Only for the other side.

[Arcian]

Redbelle wrote...

Going back a bit. There is another reason why the awakened collectors are acting the way they are. The leviathans could have hijacked them after killing the Reaper who orchestrated their movements and are now using them in the same way the Reapers used them against the Galaxy. Only for the other side.

Buttheleviathansaregoodaccordingtoseivalslogic.exe

[Ravensword]

Redbelle wrote...

Going back a bit. There is another reason why the awakened collectors are acting the way they are. The leviathans could have hijacked them after killing the Reaper who orchestrated their movements and are now using them in the same way the Reapers used them against the Galaxy. Only for the other side.

They get a pass for being organic.

[Seival]

bobobo878 wrote...

Yougotcarved1 wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...
Besides, Since when does DNA carries memories?

Did you not play Assassin's Creed?!

Personally, I found the idea that you can imprint the memory of a person's entire life onto the human genome preposterous. With 3.2 billion base pairs, the human genome is only capable of storing about 800 MB of data, while Assassain's Creed itself requires 9GB of hard drive space.

Bad analogy. DNA and brain are not your regular hard drives, they are not for game asset's storage. We obviously do not store our memories in jpg wav wmv or other files. "800 MB of chemical memory" may store memories of all past generations in perfect detail, we don't know... yet.

[xlegionx]

Seival wrote...

bobobo878 wrote...

Yougotcarved1 wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...
Besides, Since when does DNA carries memories?

Did you not play Assassin's Creed?!

Personally, I found the idea that you can imprint the memory of a person's entire life onto the human genome preposterous. With 3.2 billion base pairs, the human genome is only capable of storing about 800 MB of data, while Assassain's Creed itself requires 9GB of hard drive space.

Bad analogy. DNA and brain are not your regular hard drives, they are not for game asset's storage. We obviously do not store our memories in jpg wav wmv or other files. "800 MB of chemical memory" may store memories of all past generations in perfect detail, we don't know... yet.

It is still far less likely than Eezo. Eezo is simply an element of extremely useful properties, which given the timeline of Mass Effect lore we wouldn't have discovered yet. But DNA is a far more concrete thing. What would happen if your DNA was mutated, an extremely common thing? The DNA is now different, but would you still have the memories of your ancestors, or would you somehow have the memories of some different person, now that your DNA is different?


EDIT: and DNA can't carry experiences. If you were to receive a scar (As Ezio has at some points) your DNA does not change. The skins cells just heal in a different way around the wound.
 

Modifié par xlegionx, 17 juin 2013 - 08:25 .

[Big Bad]

Seival wrote...

bobobo878 wrote...

Yougotcarved1 wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...
Besides, Since when does DNA carries memories?

Did you not play Assassin's Creed?!

Personally, I found the idea that you can imprint the memory of a person's entire life onto the human genome preposterous. With 3.2 billion base pairs, the human genome is only capable of storing about 800 MB of data, while Assassain's Creed itself requires 9GB of hard drive space.

Bad analogy. DNA and brain are not your regular hard drives, they are not for game asset's storage. We obviously do not store our memories in jpg wav wmv or other files. "800 MB of chemical memory" may store memories of all past generations in perfect detail, we don't know... yet.

We may not be completely sure that DNA doesn't store memories of past generations, but we have absolutey no reason to believe that it does. 

[ElSuperGecko]

Seival wrote...

Steelcan wrote...
Seival you are my favorite crazy person.

Not crazy. Just thinking differently.

..........his mother had him tested.

[Asharad Hett]

Big Bad wrote...

We may not be completely sure that DNA doesn't store memories of past generations, but we have absolutey no reason to believe that it does. 

I would argue that we are completely sure that DNA stores zero memories.

[KaiserShep]

Yeah, I wonder what happens to the information stored on DNA, if the tissue is dissolved. I don't recall that poor colonist getting tossed into a giant Blend-Tech blender. She just seemed to melt in the chamber. Whatever process was used to do this should've destroyed or at least corrupted a great deal of the information one could glean from it. It also doesn't help that this now dead, processed tissue is tossed into the mix with hundreds of thousands of other types.

Of course, this is all ignoring the fact that DNA itself does not store any memories at all, as our physiology is specifically formed to store memories in only one portion of the body, which would be destroyed in this "ascension" process, thus obliterating the memories. 

Modifié par KaiserShep, 17 juin 2013 - 09:47 .

[mass perfection]

Seival wrote...

KaiserShep wrote...

Seival wrote...
Javik is brainwashed by his own corrupted society. That's why he is pure Renegade (even worse than Renegade Shepard or TIM). Reapers were not as dangerous to the Protheans as the Protheans themselves. And it's good there is little left of Protheans inside the Awakened Collectors.

You have a funny concept of what brainwashing actually means. Javik is not brainwahsed at all, and if anything is to blame for his conditioned sentiment against synthetics, it would actually be the reapers. After all, Javik's only experience with synthetics were the reapers themselves, and no other synthetics, because by the time he was born, the reapers were already destroying everything. Considering Sovereign's tactics in Mass Effect, it stands to reason that any remaining non-reaper synthetics left at the time could have simply been hijacked and taken over by the reapers too as they did the geth in this cycle, making it worse. 

There's absolutely nothing to indicate that the Protheans were a danger to themselves in any way to the extent that the reapers were. There's nothing indicating some massive conflict within their own species. Clearly they were alien overlords in their cycle, but here's the joke: 

If the reapers did not create the Mass Relay network, the Protheans would never have been able to facilitate their reign over the rest of the galaxy, because the other races would have developed beyond their capacity to control. 

The reapers dramatically altered the path in which these races would develop, and by accelerating this process, caused a chain reaction of events. The Protheans were just one example of the results of such a change. 

It's funny how the Protheans are maligned while the reapers are given a pass, despite killing trillions upon trillions of people, bombarding their cities with death rays. You can claim they save these people in some form or another, but this clearly does not account for the ones that got fried in their attacks, crushed underfoot and shot and left to rot by their armed ground forces. 

Did you forget about this:

Do you remember what Anderson said?  Which means everyone are to be processed. The Reapers will leave no dead bodies behind. They will harvest everyone.

Well, and looks like you have limited understanding of what brainwashing really is. It can be even a simple friendly chat that changed your opinion, or strengthen it. Everything that affect your way of thinking in any way is brainwashing. Parents brainwash you, society brainwashes you. Each day. This is never ending process. Everyone and everything is connected. An individual doesn't live in vacuum and emptiness.

Realities of Prothean society made the Javick as he is. Javik is pitiful and dangerous to current galactic society. Good thing Synthesis will fix that. Understanding is the great force, you know?

You basically just said that Synthesis is awful.

[Arcian]

mass perfection wrote...

Seival wrote...

KaiserShep wrote...

Seival wrote...
Javik is brainwashed by his own corrupted society. That's why he is pure Renegade (even worse than Renegade Shepard or TIM). Reapers were not as dangerous to the Protheans as the Protheans themselves. And it's good there is little left of Protheans inside the Awakened Collectors.

You have a funny concept of what brainwashing actually means. Javik is not brainwahsed at all, and if anything is to blame for his conditioned sentiment against synthetics, it would actually be the reapers. After all, Javik's only experience with synthetics were the reapers themselves, and no other synthetics, because by the time he was born, the reapers were already destroying everything. Considering Sovereign's tactics in Mass Effect, it stands to reason that any remaining non-reaper synthetics left at the time could have simply been hijacked and taken over by the reapers too as they did the geth in this cycle, making it worse. 

There's absolutely nothing to indicate that the Protheans were a danger to themselves in any way to the extent that the reapers were. There's nothing indicating some massive conflict within their own species. Clearly they were alien overlords in their cycle, but here's the joke: 

If the reapers did not create the Mass Relay network, the Protheans would never have been able to facilitate their reign over the rest of the galaxy, because the other races would have developed beyond their capacity to control. 

The reapers dramatically altered the path in which these races would develop, and by accelerating this process, caused a chain reaction of events. The Protheans were just one example of the results of such a change. 

It's funny how the Protheans are maligned while the reapers are given a pass, despite killing trillions upon trillions of people, bombarding their cities with death rays. You can claim they save these people in some form or another, but this clearly does not account for the ones that got fried in their attacks, crushed underfoot and shot and left to rot by their armed ground forces. 

Did you forget about this:

Do you remember what Anderson said?  Which means everyone are to be processed. The Reapers will leave no dead bodies behind. They will harvest everyone.

Well, and looks like you have limited understanding of what brainwashing really is. It can be even a simple friendly chat that changed your opinion, or strengthen it. Everything that affect your way of thinking in any way is brainwashing. Parents brainwash you, society brainwashes you. Each day. This is never ending process. Everyone and everything is connected. An individual doesn't live in vacuum and emptiness.

Realities of Prothean society made the Javick as he is. Javik is pitiful and dangerous to current galactic society. Good thing Synthesis will fix that. Understanding is the great force, you know?

You basically just said that Synthesis is awful.

He got you good there, Seival.

[Seival]

I suppose everyone on BSN know that I see Synthesis only as the very positive change of the galaxy.

Some other people may have another vision of positivity - like killing your allies and friends to kill even more people afterwards for no real reason... Pitiful.

[The Night Mammoth]

I suppose everyone on BSN knows that there are a lot of people who see Destroy as a very positive change in the galaxy.

Some other people may have another vision of positivity - like deliberately and forcefully changing their friends and allies ways of thinking so it matches with the already pretty disconnected and morally abhorrent beliefs of their enemy to impose uniformity to stop a conflict no one had heard about until two minutes before the choice is given without even anything close to a convincing argument as to why anyone should care or accept it as important and without really knowing what their choice is actually going to do besides some vague psuedo-science jargon statements anyone who can tie their shoe-laces and is even mildly concerned with the ramifications of what they're about to do would dismiss as pointless before asking or more information.

All I'll say is that I hope sometime in the future they receive a phone call from an obviously legitimate Nigerian general informing them that they've won the Nigerian lottery and all they need to do is tell him their sort code and bank account details so they can spread their positivity around the world, like Shepard spread her messianic body parts.

Modifié par The Night Mammoth, 18 juin 2013 - 09:21 .

[Ticonderoga117]

Seival wrote...

I suppose everyone on BSN know that I see Synthesis only as the very positive change of the galaxy.

Some other people may have another vision of positivity - like killing your allies and friends to kill even more people afterwards for no real reason... Pitiful.

Yes, because becoming a better version of a husk is oh so positive.

[Asharad Hett]

Seival wrote...

I suppose everyone on BSN know that I see Synthesis only as the very positive change of the galaxy.

Because it's what the Catalyst wants.  And what the Catalyst wants is always best.

[xlegionx]

The Night Mammoth wrote...

I suppose everyone on BSN knows that there are a lot of people who see Destroy as a very positive change in the galaxy.

Some other people may have another vision of positivity - like deliberately and forcefully changing their friends and allies ways of thinking so it matches with the already pretty disconnected and morally abhorrent beliefs of their enemy to impose uniformity to stop a conflict no one had heard about until two minutes before the choice is given without even anything close to a convincing argument as to why anyone should care or accept it as important and without really knowing what their choice is actually going to do besides some vague psuedo-science jargon statements anyone who can tie their shoe-laces and is even mildly concerned with the ramifications of what they're about to do would dismiss as pointless before asking or more information.

All I'll say is that I hope sometime in the future they receive a phone call from an obviously legitimate Nigerian general informing them that they've won the Nigerian lottery and all they need to do is tell him their sort code and bank account details so they can spread their positivity around the world, like Shepard spread her messianic body parts.

Hey, Hey, those Nigerian General e-mails are a bunch of scams.

Everyone knows its the e-mails from Nigerian princes that are where the real money's at.

[PerhapsDeadMaybeNot]

Want to know what is really pitiful?

Forcing a change on every speck of life in the galaxy without their consent or input, oh, yeah.....that is just fine...i believe there is a saying about "playing god"?

[Astartes Marine]

Seival wrote...
I suppose everyone on BSN know that I see Synthesis only as the very positive change of the galaxy.

Some other people may have another vision of positivity - like killing your allies and friends to kill even more people afterwards for no real reason... Pitiful.

You're wandering close into Wulf territory, got him banned.


What I think is pitiful is you talking down about anyone who doesn't share your "unique" view of the world and what's best for it.  On top of that you either can't or simply refuse to understand why others don't see it as you do.<_<

[KaiserShep]

Seival wrote...

I suppose everyone on BSN know that I see Synthesis only as the very positive change of the galaxy.

Some other people may have another vision of positivity - like killing your allies and friends to kill even more people afterwards for no real reason... Pitiful.

That's where you're mistaken. All of the choices are awful. It essentially boils down to which evil comes closest to what you believe to be the most sensible. 

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Seival wrote...

I suppose everyone on BSN know that I see Synthesis only as the very positive change of the galaxy.

Some other people may have another vision of positivity - like killing your allies and friends to kill even more people afterwards for no real reason... Pitiful.

But you don't have to kill your allies and friends in Destroy either. It's not like that. Things changed. You don't understand. You don't need the reapers anymore.

How I learned how to save EDI and the Geth in Destroy

It's this simple. I didn't write those three words. Bioware did. They changed everything.

[PerhapsDeadMaybeNot]

^ we never needed the reapers in the first place...

[fchopin]

Seival wrote...

"If the essence of life is information carried in DNA, then society and civilization are just colossal memory systems and a metropolis like this one, simply a sprawling external memory."

Life is much more than a hard drive to store information.
To store information you first have to experience an event think on the event and deduct some kind of explanation on what you experienced and store the data so it can be reused.
It does not mean that the data is correct but that it is what each individual has formulated at the time and may need to be changed at another time with more experiences.
The data is not the life but a database that will keep changing by what individuals experience and formulate.