926 réponses à ce sujet

[Arcian]

HYR 2.0 wrote...

 Actually, based on emprical evidence, Destroy!Shepard as "enraged" is likely quite accurate.

Restrider conducted a little "census" on the ending: http://social.biowar.../index/14939678

ITP: Destroyers are generally not happy campers as of ME3's ending.

Shepard's temper has nothing to do with the player's temper. They're completely separate.

[KaiserShep]

HYR 2.0 wrote...
I don't think he means "brainwashed" in the literal sense of the word, but rather that his society has imbued him with their values -- which would fit the dictionary definition of "indoctrination." Which, ofc, is something Javik admits himself.

The only reason to use "brainwash" in this context is to add a pejorative so that there's negative association. That's fine and all, but it's still incorrect.  You're not going to get away with claiming that your parents, friends and society "brainwash" you and be taken seriously. It just doesn't work. 

HYR 2.0 wrote...

 Actually, based on emprical evidence, Destroy!Shepard as "enraged" is likely quite accurate.

Restrider conducted a little "census" on the ending: http://social.biowar.../index/14939678

ITP: Destroyers are generally not happy campers as of ME3's ending.

I don't see what this has to do with the characterization of Shepard. Shepard being enraged, wise or whatever has nothing to do with the player's feelings about the ending. But then, with how vague the creator of this hokey formula is, who the heck knows what that person means anymore. 

Modifié par KaiserShep, 20 juin 2013 - 05:21 .

[Redbelle]

HYR 2.0 wrote...

Jinx1720 wrote...

Seival wrote...

Well, and looks like you have limited understanding of what brainwashing really is. It can be even a simple friendly chat that changed your opinion, or strengthen it. Everything that affect your way of thinking in any way is brainwashing. Parents brainwash you, society brainwashes you. Each day. This is never ending process. Everyone and everything is connected. An individual doesn't live in vacuum and emptiness.

Let me post something from wikipedia here

Mind control (also known as brainwashing, coercive persuasion, mind abuse, menticide, thought control, or thought reform) refers to a process in which a group or individual "systematically uses unethically manipulative
methods to persuade others to conform to the wishes of the
manipulator(s), often to the detriment of the person being manipulated.

I fail to see a connection between what you state as brainwashing and what is commonly referred to as brainwashing.

I don't think he means "brainwashed" in the literal sense of the word, but rather that his society has imbued him with their values -- which would fit the dictionary definition of "indoctrination." Which, ofc, is something Javik admits himself.

Then Seiv needs to generate a better understanding of how other relate to these terms. It's clear that if he meant what you said, then he lacks a common point of reference with other BSN users..... which has been one of the issues he's had since he started posting that Synth is good. And how it would all be better if we could all understand each other............ Waaaaaaitaminuuuuuuute!

[tanisha__unknown]

HYR 2.0 wrote...

Jinx1720 wrote...

Seival wrote...

Well, and looks like you have limited understanding of what brainwashing really is. It can be even a simple friendly chat that changed your opinion, or strengthen it. Everything that affect your way of thinking in any way is brainwashing. Parents brainwash you, society brainwashes you. Each day. This is never ending process. Everyone and everything is connected. An individual doesn't live in vacuum and emptiness.

Let me post something from wikipedia here

Mind control (also known as brainwashing, coercive persuasion, mind abuse, menticide, thought control, or thought reform) refers to a process in which a group or individual "systematically uses unethically manipulative
methods to persuade others to conform to the wishes of the
manipulator(s), often to the detriment of the person being manipulated.

I fail to see a connection between what you state as brainwashing and what is commonly referred to as brainwashing.

I don't think he means "brainwashed" in the literal sense of the word, but rather that his society has imbued him with their values -- which would fit the dictionary definition of "indoctrination." Which, ofc, is something Javik admits himself.

I agree with you on that one. I also agree with Seival that we are all influenced by the society we grow up in, that other's shape the way we think and feel. Still, using the word brainwashing in this context is simply wrong and a very bad description of Javiks character.

[teh DRUMPf!!]

 Sevial is not from a native English-speaking country. I'm sure at least some of you are well aware of that. It's not an easy language to master as a #2, so give the word-choice nitpicking a rest (... so much for great "understanding"). It's not hard to figure out brainwashing means in that context, either. I can do it. Why can't you?

And let's not act like people around here (many of whom probably know English as a first language) don't frequently and consciously use dramatic and over-the-top word choice to give their own ideas shock value, either!

As for "what Shepard feels"... Shepard is basically a brick w/o player projection. Obvious pedantry is obvious.


... 'outta here 'til ~6. Can't wait to see what I'll come back to ITT.

[Nightwriter]

Kel Riever wrote...

I don't understand why Destroyers are supposed to be enraged when it is the only ending that saves the Geth, EDI, and Shepard lives.

That's right, you heard correctly.

I'm almost sure I didn't.

[Kel Riever]

Nightwriter wrote...

Kel Riever wrote...

I don't understand why Destroyers are supposed to be enraged when it is the only ending that saves the Geth, EDI, and Shepard lives.

That's right, you heard correctly.

I'm almost sure I didn't.

No, you did.  You just have to use, 'Your imagination.'  And a few basic facts about what code is and what breathing is that you learned in high school.

Modifié par Kel Riever, 20 juin 2013 - 07:14 .

[Redbelle]

Kel Riever wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

Kel Riever wrote...

I don't understand why Destroyers are supposed to be enraged when it is the only ending that saves the Geth, EDI, and Shepard lives.

That's right, you heard correctly.

I'm almost sure I didn't.

No, you did.  You just have to use, 'Your imagination.'  And a few basic facts about what code is and what breathing is that you learned in high school.

Care to explain why EDI is on the wall of the dead after destroy?

I mean, it's a wall for the dead. Not the, dead, but we'll cure her of that.

[KaiserShep]

HYR 2.0 wrote...

 Sevial is not from a native English-speaking country. I'm sure at least some of you are well aware of that. It's not an easy language to master as a #2, so give the word-choice nitpicking a rest (... so much for great "understanding"). It's not hard to figure out brainwashing means in that context, either. I can do it. Why can't you?

I was not aware of this, but it makes no real difference to me. The nitpicking of words will continue, because I can't assume to know the person's backstory or understanding of a second language. The only thing I have to work with is the phrasing as I see it. As far as context is concerned, judging from a lot of the misanthropic musings I've read from this person, I'm inclined to assume the very worst in what's meant to be said instead. 

And let's not act like people around here (many of whom probably know English as a first language) don't frequently and consciously use dramatic and over-the-top word choice to give their own ideas shock value, either!

If someone else does it, then that person can be called out too. Others doing it doesn't mean that it should never be pointed out at all. 

Modifié par KaiserShep, 20 juin 2013 - 07:48 .

[Nightwriter]

Kel Riever wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

Kel Riever wrote...

I don't understand why Destroyers are supposed to be enraged when it is the only ending that saves the Geth, EDI, and Shepard lives.

That's right, you heard correctly.

I'm almost sure I didn't.

No, you did.  You just have to use, 'Your imagination.'  And a few basic facts about what code is and what breathing is that you learned in high school.

SHUT UP. That sounds like hope. Get it away from me. Hope is a LIE. Why does it tricks us... what has it got in its nasty little pocketses...

Besides, I am sick unto death of using my imagination as spackle to fill in all the ending holes. Sounds good in theory but by the time you're done there's more spackle there than wall.

[KaiserShep]

C'mon. We all know EDI is dead. Engineer Adams failed us, once again.

[Kel Riever]

Nightwriter wrote...

Kel Riever wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

Kel Riever wrote...

I don't understand why Destroyers are supposed to be enraged when it is the only ending that saves the Geth, EDI, and Shepard lives.

That's right, you heard correctly.

I'm almost sure I didn't.

No, you did.  You just have to use, 'Your imagination.'  And a few basic facts about what code is and what breathing is that you learned in high school.

SHUT UP. That sounds like hope. Get it away from me. Hope is a LIE. Why does it tricks us... what has it got in its nasty little pocketses...

Besides, I am sick unto death of using my imagination as spackle to fill in all the ending holes. Sounds good in theory but by the time you're done there's more spackle there than wall.

lol, thank you for the sense of humor.

Basically, what I'm doing is actually making fun of the BioWare (failed) attempt at logic here.  The way Code works, in real life, is you can target the specific parts of it you want.  Particularly, if you would imagine, the millenia old creator of such code.....therefore there is no reason you couldn't destroy the reapers and save the geth and EDI.  Other than by pure denial of anything that makes sense.  Which is, of course, what the grimdark emo writer wants you to believe.

Nor would Shepard be dead under any reason after the breath scene.  Let us not forget you could rebuild Shep anyway, just like you did in ME2.  But farsensical cloning ability aside, breathing in means Shep lives and that's that.  According to simple biology.

So, it isn't about hope.  It is about facts.  SuperMac telling you the Geth and EDI are dead is like SuperMac telling you your computer or console doesn't really work at all.  You know, the one you are playing Mass Effect on.  The irony of a video game company not understanding how the video game works and is patched is just...one of the best jokes ever!

[Nightwriter]

You're saying the Catalyst should be able to differentiate between the Reaper code that EDI and the geth possess, and the Reaper code that the actual Reapers possess?

[Seival]

Thanks, HYR 2.0. Your understanding means a lot to me

[Kel Riever]

Nightwriter wrote...

You're saying the Catalyst should be able to differentiate between the Reaper code that EDI and the geth possess, and the Reaper code that the actual Reapers possess?

I'M not saying it.  That's how code works.

If you want a grimdark kill EDI and the Geth ending, you don't use code as the silly reason.  Of course, then SuperMac would have struggled for a reason that made sense.  But better that than simply state some reason that not only makes no sense, but flies in the face of common fact.

Of course, the issue really is the ending(s) just suck.  It is a pretentious nonsense babble from the Glowjob in the first place.  Destroy is simply the best of a list of dumb options.  The inability to use any sense of coherency stems from the Glowjob showing up in the first place.  It speaks volumes that if you simply cut the game after "The best seats in the house" line and rolled credits, the game would have made more sense.  Not because the ending was happy.  But because the ending wouldn't have something stupid show up.  And all you had to do if you wanted Shepard to die is...let Shepard die after saying that line.

You could have done your slideshow then.  Without the dumbness.

[Nightwriter]

Did you find any other examples in the series of technology not operating the way it should in reality, or is this the only time they fudged it?

[Kel Riever]

Nightwriter wrote...

Did you find any other examples in the series of technology not operating the way it should in reality, or is this the only time they fudged it?

"Fudging," is twisting something to make it fit a story.  That is different from "not in any way factual."  Which is what this is.  If the Catalyst said, "We can't save the Geth because there are no stars in the galaxy," it would have been just as factually stupid. 

[Arcian]

Seival wrote...

Thanks, HYR 2.0. Your understanding means a lot to me

Of course he's supportive of you, you're both subscribing to MADness Magazine.

[Ravensword]

Glad to see we're starting to get along.

[mass perfection]

The Catalyst said synthetics are also harvested.How does that work?

[mass perfection]

Seival wrote...

I suppose everyone on BSN know that I see Synthesis only as the very positive change of the galaxy.

Some other people may have another vision of positivity - like killing your allies and friends to kill even more people afterwards for no real reason... Pitiful.

Synthesis creates a fantastical and exotic galaxy,sure.But at a very great cost.

[teh DRUMPf!!]

Seival wrote...

Thanks, HYR 2.0. Your understanding means a lot to me

No worries, my good man! I don't take crap and I stand up for my friends in kind. 

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Oh Seival you have such a marvelously depressing view on humanity.

I'm sure the cuttlefish would love to have a willing Quisling like you leading the charge for ascension.

[Arcian]

mass perfection wrote...

The Catalyst said synthetics are also harvested.How does that work?

Stick em in the dirt, hope for rain, wait a few months and hope something crops up before winter.