12 réponses à ce sujet

[Gabbenator8787]

This game honestly holds up to the test of time very well.How many of you simply choose to end the ME series with ME 2? Going back to this game recently, I find it far surperior to ME 3 in all aspects except for the central story. This was clearly the last game Bioware put in real thought and passion into rather than something made for the sole purpose of making quick  money. 

In all retrospec Ide rather headcannon my own ending then suffer through the crap of ME3 and whatever sequals are currently being planned for the future. 

Modifié par Gabbenator8787, 09 juin 2013 - 06:44 .

[caradoc2000]

I chose to end the ME series with ME1, before they turned the series into a shooter.

[CrystalCircuit]

I agree, but I don't play it along with ME1, since I'm not sure ME2 is very good as a sequel to the first game, so I just view them as standalone instead.

[brad2240]

I love ME3 and I don't think its crap.

But I do agree that ME2 is the better game overall.

[LoneSpektre]

ME2 is the best over all IMO, just imported a new ME1 file into 2 today. And how was ME1 not a shooter? You use guns primary and biotics secondary cuz I find that biotics recharge quicker in ME2-3 than 1.

[Dark_Enclave33]

I think they are all great...enjoyed the story and characters throughout the series....

[ToiletBomber]

I just went back and played from the beginning, on up through 2, getting ready to start on 3 after work.

I loved the first one, flaws and all, the inventory system, customization, overpowered Adept class (first time I ever played and had fun with a "magic" class), the obvious enthusiasm put into developing a new IP at the time, etc,

I thought calling ME2 an RPG was a bad joke, but the story and Miranda's behind more than saved it.

[Kenshen]

I enjoy the combat in ME series and it only got better with each game. I still don't like how ME2 restricts gun use depending on class and I like how they did it in ME3. ME2 would be my favorite of the 3 if it wasn't for planet scanning but then I discovered Gibbed editor.

[panjshirlion]

Gabbenator8787 wrote...

This game honestly holds up to the test of time very well.How many of you simply choose to end the ME series with ME 2? Going back to this game recently, I find it far surperior to ME 3 in all aspects except for the central story. This was clearly the last game Bioware put in real thought and passion into rather than something made for the sole purpose of making quick  money. 

In all retrospec Ide rather headcannon my own ending then suffer through the crap of ME3 and whatever sequals are currently being planned for the future. 

I disagree with the general sentiment of this post but agree wholeheartedly with the bolded text. I think ME2 is a masterpiece in many ways except for one element: the central story. Unfortunately, the central story of a cinematic space opera is pretty important, and if it stinks, the game suffers quite a bit. There were three main things that bugged me about the story in ME2:

1. It's fairly inconsequential. ME2 is somewhat of a holding pattern in the game's overarching plotline, similar to (though not as bad as) Dragon Age 2. ME1 introduces the Reapers and their first attempt to enter galactic space. ME3 resolves their invasion. All we really see in ME2 are some of the Reapers' lackeys trying to get enough spare parts to build one of their masters (more on that later). Since the Reapers' numbers are already limitless, there isn't much drama here.

2. 90% of the game is assembling the party, 10% is actually doing what the party is assembled for. I understand that this is an excuse to do the intimate, character-driven subplots that Bioware does best, but it does come across as a bit silly to me that the overwhelming majority of the game's content is the acquisition of party members and the resolution of their personal issues. The personal plotlines for the team are all fantastic, but these are meant to run parallel to an overarching plot, not become the plot entirely. It also comes across as a little Disneyesque ("you have to believe") the way we're constantly told that the personal commitment and attitudes of these 10 specific people are the deciding factor for the mission's success. Cerberus could probably have just handed Shepard a squad of competent Cerberus commandos and been done with it.

3. The big ending reveal doesn't make a whole lot of sense and is kind of silly. The human reaper actually made me cringe the first time I saw it, and not a good cringe. The Reapers are introduced in ME1 as being the perfect synthetic killing machines, full of hatred and disdain for organics, which they consider an evolutionary accident. Having them all of the sudden be hybrids kind of breaks a lot of what made them so terrifying. The fact that they need us diminishes their callous regard for organic life. Furthermore, it doesn't even answer the question of why they periodically annihilate the galaxy; one could already assume that they simply view themselves as perfection and choose to wipe out organic life simply because it is not them. Or, perhaps they return to ensure that organics do not become sufficiently advanced to challenge them. The mass kidnapping is also rather stupid. Given Reaper technology, one would imagine that they should only need a human DNA sample to "grow" a human hybrid. Organisms aren't like playdough. You don't need a particular volume to mush together to make something else.

[ToiletBomber]

panjshirlion wrote...


1. It's fairly inconsequential. ME2 is somewhat of a holding pattern in the game's overarching plotline, similar to (though not as bad as) Dragon Age 2. ME1 introduces the Reapers and their first attempt to enter galactic space. ME3 resolves their invasion. All we really see in ME2 are some of the Reapers' lackeys trying to get enough spare parts to build one of their masters (more on that later). Since the Reapers' numbers are already limitless, there isn't much drama here.

Holding pattern? Hardly. The story was a vehicle for setting up Cerberus as the villain's of ME3, and their exploitation of Shepherd to set it up.

panjshirlion wrote...

2. 90% of the game is assembling the party, 10% is actually doing what the party is assembled for. I understand that this is an excuse to do the intimate, character-driven subplots that Bioware does best, but it does come across as a bit silly to me that the overwhelming majority of the game's content is the acquisition of party members and the resolution of their personal issues. The personal plotlines for the team are all fantastic, but these are meant to run parallel to an overarching plot, not become the plot entirely.

Given it was in pursuit of Cerberus' goals, and the coup attempt in ME3, there was nothing parallel about it.

panjshirlion wrote...

It also comes across as a little Disneyesque ("you have to believe") the way we're constantly told that the personal commitment and attitudes of these 10 specific people are the deciding factor for the mission's success. Cerberus could probably have just handed Shepard a squad of competent Cerberus commandos and been done with it.

If the Cerberus military was any indication in ME3....hell no, they wouldn't have been able to find their own lunch, let alone accomplish was the Illusive Man had in mind.

Besides, Shepherd "is a hero, a bloody icon". The I-Man wants to commit a coup, remember? He needs all that Reaper junk in ME2 to knock off the council and Alliance, but he can't just advertise his goals.

panjshirlion wrote...

3. The big ending reveal doesn't make a whole lot of sense and is kind of silly. The human reaper actually made me cringe the first time I saw it, and not a good cringe. The Reapers are introduced in ME1 as being the perfect synthetic killing machines, full of hatred and disdain for organics, which they consider an evolutionary accident. Having them all of the sudden be hybrids kind of breaks a lot of what made them so terrifying. The fact that they need us diminishes their callous regard for organic life. Furthermore, it doesn't even answer the question of why they periodically annihilate the galaxy; one could already assume that they simply view themselves as perfection and choose to wipe out organic life simply because it is not them. Or, perhaps they return to ensure that organics do not become sufficiently advanced to challenge them. The mass kidnapping is also rather stupid. Given Reaper technology, one would imagine that they should only need a human DNA sample to "grow" a human hybrid. Organisms aren't like playdough. You don't need a particular volume to mush together to make something else.

I actually agree with you.

[cap and gown]

As far as game mechanics and user interface, ME3 is the best (none of the stupid mini-games, gotta love the combo's, can choose your own weapons, increasing the difficulty does not mean playing Calvin-ball where all the rules suddenly change, better movement commands, etc.) As far as story goes, ME2 is the best, IMO.

The reason I like ME2's story the best is the same reason I dislike the ME1 and ME3 story.

For ME1, the story is idiotic from the start: find an artifact that will let you travel to the citadel. Gee, gang, we could do that (and do do that) right from the start. Why did the Protheans build a mini-mass relay to do that? Why not build a space ship? Why didn't Saren just go find the control panel before attacking Eden Prime? Sovereign should have just told him to turn on the Citadel from the get go.

But my biggest issue is with the scope of the threat, and that effects both ME1 and ME3. Once ME1 set up this galaxy wide threat that happens every 50,000 years, the ending in ME3 was pretty much set in stone. They left themselves almost no wiggle room in explaining, with any kind of coherence, why this cycle should exist.

I am really just tired of games where the entire Universe/Galaxy/World is threatened with destruction. It just doesn't fit into a series. How often is the Universe/Galaxy/World supposed to be threatened?

Instead, a more limited threat that our hero can overcome seems better from a story telling and continuity perspective. So, while the Reapers threaten total annihilation of all organic civilizations, the Collectors are raiding human colonies and abducting the populations. Here is clearly defined threat that is limited in scope with a clear solution: defeat the Collectors and return home if possible. After that, our hero (Sheppard in this case) is free to deal with the next threat to humans/turians/salarians/whatever.

To the poster who complained about the human Reaper, I agree. I wish the Reapers hadn't been involved at all. Come up with some other reason for abducting humans. Like mass scale genetic experimentation, looking to find new biotic capabilities or something.

The Reapers are just too big and all-consuming a threat to make much sense.

Plus, when ME3 ends, one cannot really imagine Sheppard doing anything afterwords. Game over. Who cares if the whole Galaxy was destroyed because your EMS is too low? The game is done. In ME2, OTOH, anyone you lose will not be around for later games so you have more incentive to actually do their quests and prepare for the mission instead of just speeding through to the conclusion.

In the end, I still love playing ME2, but I wish it had the ME3 interface and game mechanics. ME3 is enjoyable, but I can't get as invested with it as with ME2. And playing ME1 is like swallowing a razor blade and then drinking acid, in the immortal words of Commander Sheppard.

[Yezdigerd]

cap and gown wrote...
For ME1, the story is idiotic from the start: find an artifact that will let you travel to the citadel.Gee, gang, we could do that (and do do that) right from the start.

because the story from the start was bringing in a rogue spectre with vague supernatural connections, which it would be until you complete Noveria. It's actually an excellent story and paced for allowing you to do the mundane quests in random locations.

Why did the Protheans build a mini-mass relay to do that? Why not build a space ship?

Because building mass relays was was the purpose of the Ilos research facility, it certainy would have the element of surprise, when you somehow can open them inside installations.

Why didn't Saren just go find the control panel before attacking Eden Prime? Sovereign should have just told him to turn on the Citadel from the get go.

Because it resided inside citadel control, presumable the area with the galaxy's most draconian security protocols. Granted I would think there were other things he could have tried then gating in a geth army to gain control of it but still.

But my biggest issue is with the scope of the threat, and that effects both ME1 and ME3. Once ME1 set up this galaxy wide threat that happens every 50,000 years, the ending in ME3 was pretty much set in stone. They left themselves almost no wiggle room in explaining, with any kind of coherence, why this cycle should exist.

The reapers only became stupid invincible in ME3, nothing in ME1 required it. In fact the ME3:s invincible reapers invalidates the plot of ME1 and the backstory. Why would Sovereign plot and seek allies for centuries, when he can just make a 4 year roundtrip to dark space? the mass relay system was a clever, terryifying and malicious design, allowing a small elite to control an entire galaxy. When Vigil speaks of hope thwarting,  it I thought it meant that instead of the reapers shooting fish in a barrel they would actually have to fight the galaxy now. Yet in Me3 we find out that the mass relay trap was something the reapers created when they were bored for no reason whatsoever. It wasn't required for domination and isn't even convinient method for control since they never bother to conquer the citadel until the end.

So, while the Reapers threaten total annihilation of all organic civilizations, the Collectors are raiding human colonies and abducting the populations. Here is clearly defined threat that is limited in scope with a clear solution: defeat the Collectors and return home if possible. After that, our hero (Sheppard in this case) is free to deal with the next threat to humans/turians/salarians/whatever.

Me3 also make the plot of Me2 pointless. If the reapers are coming and are invincible whats the point of saving some colonists that will die anyway?  It's only when Liara discover the Catalyst in Me3 anything but advocating suicide is a viable plan. Only when we assume Shepard and Tim are ignorant of the reapers true power Me2:s plot can even be justified. Next time you play Me2 remember that everything Shepard does is founded in gross misjudgment and only gets to have any value due to chance.

To the poster who complained about the human Reaper, I agree. I wish the Reapers hadn't been involved at all. Come up with some other reason for abducting humans. Like mass scale genetic experimentation, looking to find new biotic capabilities or something.

Yep, it's kinda baffeling how weak and senseless the overarching plots and continuity are in the last 2 games. When they get so many other harder things right.

[ToiletBomber]

@Yezdigerd - Yeah...you really need to replay Mass Effect 2 again. Just do it, then you'll see my points in perfect clarity.