1799 réponses à ce sujet

[dragonflight288]

Jamie9 wrote...

I think the mages are more in the right. Fair enough, have phylacteries for each mage in case they go Blood Magic or Abomination. Locking them up in a tower is a little bit too far though, and I believe encourages mages to avoid the Chantry and makes them more likely to delve into dark magic to protect themselves.

The Templars therefore need to be repurposed into a reactionary force, rather than a preventative one. They should hunt down Blood Mages and Abominations if they occur.

Of course, I do not expect DA3 to go this well. Bad things are going to happen.

I don't even know whether to trust the Seekers, nor the Inquisition.

Well, it's been confirmed that the protagonist is the Inquisitor here, so if you don't trust the Inquisition, you don't trust yourself.

[DPSSOC]

Jamie9 wrote...
The Templars therefore need to be repurposed into a reactionary force, rather than a preventative one. They should hunt down Blood Mages and Abominations if they occur.

Yeah cause that's what you want when you're dealing with people who can wipe out entire cities in at most days, somebody to show up and go, "Yeah a mage probably did this."  The phylacteries are only helpful when you already know who you're looking for.

Any system that deals with mages must be preventative in nature because when things go wrong it's cataclysmic.  Imagine Three Mile Island if it were some guy, completely indistinguishable from every other guy, walking around.  Now not every reactor is going to blow, but it's really something you need to stop before it happens.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Jamie9 wrote...

I think the mages are more in the right. Fair enough, have phylacteries for each mage in case they go Blood Magic or Abomination. Locking them up in a tower is a little bit too far though, and I believe encourages mages to avoid the Chantry and makes them more likely to delve into dark magic to protect themselves.

The Templars therefore need to be repurposed into a reactionary force, rather than a preventative one. They should hunt down Blood Mages and Abominations if they occur.

Templars as a reactionary force = thousands die before templars can react, but 100 mages are free

Templars as a preventive force = thousands saved, but 100 mages are locked up


A better world? Hardly.

[DKJaigen]

Youth4Ever wrote...

DKJaigen wrote...

Youth4Ever wrote...

DKJaigen wrote...

Youth4Ever wrote...

One thing that will be interesting to see addressed in this conflict is the impact of the fade tears-- the mages at Andoral's Reach possibly becoming beacons for the demons pouring into Thedas. There may be no choice but for mages to fight their own kind who become possessed abominations with templars. Their numbers would dwindle and the course of the conflict could drastically change.

One of the main reasons why mages are locked up in their circle is because they are portals to into the mortal world. With the fade tears they no longer need those mages and demons are just as happy to possess mundanes. Right now mundanes right now are far more vunrable to possesion (lock the mundanes up lol) then mages are because they lack traning or knowledge to defeat the demons.

So your scenario has some merit. But more likely that the templars will hve to massacre mundanes

A mage is still the best option, however. The most power to use, and they're all conviently gathered in one place.

perhaps. but demons are not discriminate. they will possess the nearest mundane if a mage is not avaible. it will most likely try to possess a mage if a mage and a mundane are in the same room. However as you said the mages are at one place. unless fade tears happen above andorhals reach your scenario is not likely.

Lesser demons will possess nearly anything but smarter demons will chase after a prize. And I certainly would not be surprised to see a fade tear over Andoral's Reach. The drama!

Then the mages will seal the fade tear. and we see plenty of pride and desire demons going after mundanes or even corpses. You make it out like demons only desire mages. thats wrong. Demons desire to be connected to the living world. That mages where a convenient portal is now irrelevant.

[DKJaigen]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Jamie9 wrote...

I think the mages are more in the right. Fair enough, have phylacteries for each mage in case they go Blood Magic or Abomination. Locking them up in a tower is a little bit too far though, and I believe encourages mages to avoid the Chantry and makes them more likely to delve into dark magic to protect themselves.

The Templars therefore need to be repurposed into a reactionary force, rather than a preventative one. They should hunt down Blood Mages and Abominations if they occur.

Templars as a reactionary force = thousands die before templars can react, but 100 mages are free

Templars as a preventive force = thousands saved, but 100 mages are locked up


A better world? Hardly.

Make me first care about those thousands. I want thedas , mage and mundane , stronger and mundanes must realise they must embrace magic before humans can survive. with a demonic invasion and the return of dragons the death toll among mundanes will be incredibly high,

[Lotion Soronarr]

DKJaigen wrote...
The chantry and its templars do not realise that when a third party arrives who embraces magic instead of fearing it they will be wiped out. look beyond templar mage conflict you see how often templars fall to demons you see how mages struggle to understand the magic around them .The chantry promotes ignorance that will destroy it and kill or enslave most of thedas. thank you but no. they need to be wiped out and a more effective system need to be put into place. and i dont care if a few people suffer they will die anyway.

Embrace magic?
Magic is to be feared, for it is beyond the realm of men.
The Chantry promotes wisdom, for sanctoned, controlled use it the only true course.

[Plaintiff]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
Magic is to be feared, for it is beyond the realm of men.

It's clearly not.

If it exists in the natural world, then it's not beyond the "realm" of anybody, it can be studied and understood.

Modifié par Plaintiff, 27 juin 2013 - 07:25 .

[TTTX]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Embrace magic?
Magic is to be feared, for it is beyond the realm of men.
The Chantry promotes wisdom, for sanctoned, controlled use it the only true course.

It should be studied more then be feared, after all the more you know the bigger chance you can prevent something.

See the Quniary for eksesample they fear magic believing it comes only from demons and nothing else, this is why their mages have little to no control over magic, fear is not a good thing, it can cause more harm then good, history have proven this again and again.

[Hey]

with the slaves. i will always fight oppression. consequences of the freedom could change the shape of the enemy but ultimately it will strengthen the resolve of the greater kingdom. we fight for you my lord.

[Kaiser Arian XVII]

WE WANT THOSE SUPERPOWERS!

WE MAGES ARE SO SPESHOL!

FREEDOM IS NON-NEGOTIABLE!

WE USE AND SEE MAGIC, SO IT BELONGS TO THIS REALM, NO MATTER THAT DEMONS THEMSELVES COME TO THIS REALM FROM ANOTHER REALM USING OUR MAGIC!

MAGIC SHOULD NOT BE FEARED. AS IT IS PROVEN BY HISTORY THAT MAGIC IS CONTROLLABLE JUST LIKE A FIRE OR TORNADO!

DEATH TO EVERYONE WHO OPPOSES THAT WE ROAM AND USE OUR POWER TO SUMMON GREAT ANGELS [ABOMINATIONS]!

DEATH TO THE TEMPLAR ZEALOTS, SPECIALLY DEATH TO THOSE PEOPLE WHO HAVE TAKEN SHELTER BEHIND THEM FOR THE FEAR OF DEMONS!

[wolfhowwl]

Legatus Arianus wrote...

WE WANT THOSE SUPERPOWERS!

WE MAGES ARE SO SPESHOL!

FREEDOM IS NON-NEGOTIABLE!

WE USE AND SEE MAGIC, SO IT BELONGS TO THIS REALM, NO MATTER THAT DEMONS THEMSELVES COME TO THIS REALM FROM ANOTHER REALM USING OUR MAGIC!

MAGIC SHOULD NOT BE FEARED. AS IT IS PROVEN BY HISTORY THAT MAGIC IS CONTROLLABLE JUST LIKE A FIRE OR TORNADO!

DEATH TO EVERYONE WHO OPPOSES THAT WE ROAM AND USE OUR POWER TO SUMMON GREAT ANGELS [ABOMINATIONS]!

DEATH TO THE TEMPLAR ZEALOTS, SPECIALLY DEATH TO THOSE PEOPLE WHO HAVE TAKEN SHELTER BEHIND THEM FOR THE FEAR OF DEMONS!

Check your privilege, you mundane scum. Do you really think your right to not be horrifically murdered by abominatons or blood mages is more important than me being able to do whatever I feel like?

Freedom!!!

[TheKomandorShepard]

wolfhowwl wrote...

Legatus Arianus wrote...

WE WANT THOSE SUPERPOWERS!

WE MAGES ARE SO SPESHOL!

FREEDOM IS NON-NEGOTIABLE!

WE USE AND SEE MAGIC, SO IT BELONGS TO THIS REALM, NO MATTER THAT DEMONS THEMSELVES COME TO THIS REALM FROM ANOTHER REALM USING OUR MAGIC!

MAGIC SHOULD NOT BE FEARED. AS IT IS PROVEN BY HISTORY THAT MAGIC IS CONTROLLABLE JUST LIKE A FIRE OR TORNADO!

DEATH TO EVERYONE WHO OPPOSES THAT WE ROAM AND USE OUR POWER TO SUMMON GREAT ANGELS [ABOMINATIONS]!

DEATH TO THE TEMPLAR ZEALOTS, SPECIALLY DEATH TO THOSE PEOPLE WHO HAVE TAKEN SHELTER BEHIND THEM FOR THE FEAR OF DEMONS!

Check your privilege, you mundane scum. Do you really think your right to not be horrifically murdered by abominatons or blood mages is more important than me being able to do whatever I feel like?

Freedom!!!

Yey you are true freedom fighter you have my support and his too .

Modifié par TheKomandorShepard, 27 juin 2013 - 10:04 .

[Lotion Soronarr]

TTTX wrote...
It should be studied more then be feared, after all the more you know the bigger chance you can prevent something.

See the Quniary for eksesample they fear magic believing it comes only from demons and nothing else, this is why their mages have little to no control over magic, fear is not a good thing, it can cause more harm then good, history have proven this again and again.

It should be studied AND feared. Only a fool doesn't fear that which is dangerous.
Magic does come for a different realm. It defies reality. There is a big question how much of it can be truly understood.

And if you look at qunari, they are technologicly advanced exactly because they shun magic.

[Xilizhra]

And if you look at qunari, they are technologicly advanced exactly because they shun magic.

Correlation does not equal causation.

[Oasis_JS]

haha.. the war is going to be crazy, i did not want to read all 40 pages but yeah i got the idea of people choices..I will have to say freedom..not like picking the mages..it just this no longer about mage or templar..this about countries fighting all over..because the build of how the chantry has political religion control all of them..their taxes,magic, drugging the templar with lyrium,controlling the lyrium market control and so on.

it's all out battle now.. hm..where do i stand..that the chantry stays a church.. and is in no longer has there crazy power control..it's time for a republic, =D I guess the mage side. FREEDOM! =D

[Plaintiff]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
And if you look at qunari, they are technologicly advanced exactly because they shun magic.

They haven't come up with anything new in the 300 years since they arrived in Thedas. Clearly, shunning magic does not guarantee progress in other areas.

Modifié par Plaintiff, 27 juin 2013 - 11:16 .

[TTTX]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

It should be studied AND feared. Only a fool doesn't fear that which is dangerous.
Magic does come for a different realm. It defies reality. There is a big question how much of it can be truly understood.

And if you look at qunari, they are technologicly advanced exactly because they shun magic.

And only a fool let fear stear ones life (Merredith).
A lot if there is done prober studies of it.

I don't think that's why they are so advance in technology and Thedas doesn't releay soly on Magic you know.

[Xilizhra]

Plaintiff wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
And if you look at qunari, they are technologicly advanced exactly because they shun magic.

They haven't come up with anything new in the 300 years since they arrived in Thedas. Clearly, shunning magic does not guarantee progress in other areas.

What would be fun is if it was the pre-qunari culture that came up with everything and the qunari themselves had stagnated.

[Ieldra]

Xilizhra wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
And if you look at qunari, they are technologicly advanced exactly because they shun magic.

They haven't come up with anything new in the 300 years since they arrived in Thedas. Clearly, shunning magic does not guarantee progress in other areas.

What would be fun is if it was the pre-qunari culture that came up with everything and the qunari themselves had stagnated.

It would be even more funny if that original culture - they must come from somewhere - had embraced magic and the qunari was the faction that went somewhere else because they didn't like that.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 27 juin 2013 - 11:48 .

[LobselVith8]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Templars as a reactionary force = thousands die before templars can react, but 100 mages are free

Templars as a preventive force = thousands saved, but 100 mages are locked up


A better world? Hardly. 

Your 'preventative force' lead to the Circles completely seperating from the Chantry, and Lambert leading the Seekers and the templars to hunt down the mages. Perhaps an alternative might avoid a continental war next time.

[Medhia Nox]

It's amazing how only the Templars are to blame.

This lack of accountability is another reason I'd never side with the rebellion.

Tevinter - the most magically progressive country in Thedas has the Right of Annulment (and likely a Harrowing and Tranquility).

Modifié par Medhia Nox, 27 juin 2013 - 12:40 .

[Xilizhra]

Medhia Nox wrote...

It's amazing how only the Templars are to blame.

This lack of accountability is another reason I'd never side with the rebellion.

Tevinter - the most magically progressive country in Thedas has the Right of Annulment (and likely a Harrowing and Tranquility).

Tevinter's also evil and I wouldn't want to emulate them there.

[Uccio]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
And if you look at qunari, they are technologicly advanced exactly because they shun magic.

They haven't come up with anything new in the 300 years since they arrived in Thedas. Clearly, shunning magic does not guarantee progress in other areas.

What would be fun is if it was the pre-qunari culture that came up with everything and the qunari themselves had stagnated.

It would be even more funny if that original culture - they must come from somewhere - had embraced magic and the qunari was the faction that went somewhere else because they didn't like that.

Qunari = puritans in Mayflower?

[Medhia Nox]

@Xilizhra: The point is that Tevinter wouldn't do it if they didn't think it was necessary to control mages. As a progressive mage society - systems of control would only be necessary not frivolous or driven by dogma.

The Tevinter believe in building the best mages - to that end, at LEAST the Right of Annulment is still possible (and, though I have no proof, probably the Harrowing and Tranquility). You keep insisting that the best mage empire in the world of Thedas hasn't figured out what you have.

That's a blatant and total ignoring of the world you're being presented for some fantasy you seem insistent upon.

I'm very curious - why are you so obsessed with totally innocent mages who can live in a peaceful utopia with no danger of ever being dangerous?  It seems so very personal to you - when it couldn't possibly be - unless you're our worlds first Thedas styled mage.

The games show VERY clearly that the Dragon Age universe is not like Harry Potter (or most D&D worlds or any number of generic fantasy settings).

Modifié par Medhia Nox, 27 juin 2013 - 02:00 .

[Ieldra]

@Medhia Nox:
The point is that the Tevinter mages likely care about their fellow mages as little as the Chantry does. If someone loses control and has to be killed, that's their own fault. You can even see it as weeding out the incompetent.

Apart from that: where does it say that Tevinter has the Right of Annulment? Also, if they have it to appease the Chantry but never use it it doesn't count.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 27 juin 2013 - 02:53 .