210 réponses à ce sujet

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

3DandBeyond wrote...

StreetMagic wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

Ok, what exactly did that do for you?

Just the fact I'm playing with Aria and in the terminus is almost good enough for me (I pointed out other things I like in the other thread though). Shep is basically railroaded into some square ROTC geek in the bulk of me3. I hate being the Alliance lapdog/Paragon type saluting people and living out his life for everyone else's sake. I can only take so much. Even if you're Renegade in ME3, you're still a square half of the time and having cheesy sentimental moments with Liara, listening to Garrus' weak punchlines, and having bad dreams about kids. To hell with all of that. Omega brings some things back to ME2 level.

And that's perfectly valid.  I have no issue with anyone liking it-we all like different things.

And agreed. In the bulk of ME3 Shepard seems to be tossed around like a wet noodle.  Fetch this, go here boy/girl, do this.  And brainless dialogue is brainless.

The dream sequence alone and the contrived "I must cry about some kid" sort of crap really nauseates me.  I thought ME had a better sense than this.  The dream thing would have been way more authentic even with the kid just removed.  Shepard plagued by doubts and loss-that's fine.  Haunted by the past and the oncoming future.  There's the PTSD.  Not some random kid.  I felt this from the moment the kid showed up in the game and when Shepard has that emotional moment after seeing him die.  Wow.  I needed to have false emotions forced upon me because seeing all those dead bodies in the commission's chambers didn't mean anything to me.  And those big bad reapers attacking and destroying ships, well that's cool.  So I need to understand a child will die!

They did try too hard to force everyone into one type of Shepard no matter what.  Play the game on auto-pilot where you make no decisions at all and do it on story mode (lack of combat) with a paragon type Shepard, spacer war hero.  The game keeps making renegade decisions.  Makes sense to me. 

I don't hate Omega so don't get me wrong.  I think part of my objection ends up being that no matter the DLC there is no real impact on the game at all.  And I add Citadel to this.  I did like certain things about it, but I couldn't then play through to the end after it.  And I think in many ways it didn't do enough and in other ways they tried too hard with it to make it cutesy.  They also looked at Omega and tried to create more of a reason for Shepard to stop everything and do the Citadel.  Still doesn't seem right though.

The child in the dreams was part of the indoctrination plot that was dropped. I'm certain of it, because there was no child in that vent. They did a terrible job presenting PTSD in the game. It was quite obvious no one did any research on it.

[HellbirdIV]

I thought Omega was alright. The worst thing about it was that it didn't have any connecting elements to the rest of the story.

None of your crewmates interact with any of the Omega cast. No one even mentions it when you get back to the Normandy.

You can't even go back to Omega like you could the Shadow Broker's ship - where you could also get bonuses for your mission and learn more about your various crewmates and some other people featured in ME2.

Omega just... Occurs, and then Shepard comes back to the Normandy and continues on her merry way, as if nothing happened. It just feels detached - pointless.

Lair of the Shadow Broker meant something, both to the character Shepard and to the player, because even if you didn't like Liara enough to care what happened to her, you still got access to all the aforementioned information about the rest of the cast.

[KaiserShep]

Yeah the aftermath is really where they could've done more. All you get is a chess set in your cabin. I never did this mission early, but I'm guessing that it simply doesn't exist if you acquire it before you play chess with Traynor. It would've been a nice touch if she asked about it and Shep coyly dodges the question. 

Modifié par KaiserShep, 04 août 2013 - 06:23 .

[3DandBeyond]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...



The child in the dreams was part of the indoctrination plot that was dropped. I'm certain of it, because there was no child in that vent. They did a terrible job presenting PTSD in the game. It was quite obvious no one did any research on it.

Yes, I tend to agree.  I think there was an idea to have Shepard seeing things and that the kid was a direct connection to the reapers.  As you say, probably didn't exist at all. If you think about it it does make sense.  He's the first thing you and Shepard see, first face, and ends up being the last that Shepard sees. 

The intent then seems fairly clear that the ending was this mess of nothing because they didn't know where to go with it and it's disjointed nonsense.  But the beginning is as well.  Shepard being in detention is nonsense.  The meeting with the commission a mess of dialogue nonsense.  Kid in the vent, nonsense-along with what he says.  Shepard's emotions over seeing the kid being blown up is nonsense, given all that is seen and has been seen.  Heck, it doesn't change even if half your teammates in ME2 die and crewmembers end up as goo in tubes.  But the most important image for Shepard is this kid.  And again there is a tie in with ME2 and Mouse-a vent boy.  It talks about kids in vents ending up as goo for the keepers.  So here's a vent boy who ends up as the keepers' overseer who has been turning people into goo.  Ok.

[Redbelle]

There is something I've wanted to say..... since oh, 3 days ago.

It was when I went to the library and saw the graphic novel. ME:Invasion.

The story of Oleg and Aria and how Omega came to be under cerberus control

And I have to ask........... Why???

Why was this part of the story practically torn out of the main narrative within the game?

Omega DLC. In game. Oleg was meant to be the Grand Admiral Thrawn of Cerberus. Yet he scarcely shows up and when he does he's playing the part of the mustache twiddling villain. He's apparently a good soldier who has an above average regard for this troop's. (Though that doesn't stop him from sending hundred's of them to their death's against Shepard).

My point is this. The Oleg in the comic needed to come out in the dlc because his character is more firmly established in the comic. Event's notwithstanding. My stance on the comic and the dlc is this.

They should not depend on an in game narrative to be supported to such a large degree by a $17 comic. If the comic story had been one of Aria and Oleg meeting before Cerberus tried to take the station and offered a unique and individual adventure I'd have no grounds to point this out.

Because getting the full narrative relies on information from a comic instead of the information being presented in game. I view this as a similar ruse as Day1 DLC where EA try to turn a $40 transaction into a $60 one. It's not exactly the same as the comic is not a day1 deal but still, the principle of splitting the story apart. In this case, into a different medium, and then packaging and selling it does not imply that BW care's that it's narrative's to the degree that I for one would prefer.

If they wanted to do an Aria and Oleg comic fine. Just don't divide a narrative in two and sell as two different items. I like my stories whole. Not halved.

The Dragon age books and ME books don't have this problem as the info contained in them is not essential to any active plot strand of the core gameplay.

Oleg was just another mook by the time I let Aria get her hands on him. Reading the comic I now see how Oleg's second in command was the chief ass while he really was as noble....er than most Cerberus agent's. It's regrettable that this aspect of him was barely given the narrative room it needed to breath.

[jtav]

@Redbelle

I think there was some deliberate "evilization" of Oleg going on, not an attempt to nake more money. At one point in development, Cerberus was a bit grayer, with Leng being more professional and trying to defend Cerberus and Kelly having good memories of TIM. I think Oleg was a casualty of the decision to remove any ambiguity and to not want to punish players for killing him, which would have been made after Invasion. But you're right: the better angels of his nature should have been more prominent. I defend him and spare him, but it's because I'm going by the comic, which occasionally makes me sound like a lunatic.

[Kataphrut94]

^ Having never read that comic, I didn't have any problem with how Petrovsky was depicted. Maybe he is nicer in the comic, but he's still a cut above board in the DLC. He's your enemy, so that limits the amount of leeway you can give him, but he at least tried to minimise casualties and knew where to draw the line, which is more than you can say for the rest of the idiots in Cerberus.

[Andrew Lucas]

I dont agree with the price,1200 mp(my case )for shoot anyone that breaths.

[Redbelle]

Kataphrut94 wrote...

^ Having never read that comic, I didn't have any problem with how Petrovsky was depicted. Maybe he is nicer in the comic, but he's still a cut above board in the DLC. He's your enemy, so that limits the amount of leeway you can give him, but he at least tried to minimise casualties and knew where to draw the line, which is more than you can say for the rest of the idiots in Cerberus.

My point is your judging him on half of his story.

And the event's that Aria depict's are misleading. There were more people involved on the Cerberus side of things than just Oleg.

And frankly, Oleg has no motivation. He's seen as being 'the guy' in the DLC. But in the comic, he does challenge TIM as to his motive's and comes away with a pretty good idea that TIM pretty much ordered the death's of his own soldier's in the way Omega was taken.

All this is pretty important stuff.

Yet, like the Catalyst, the fact that Oleg let Aria go, which is pretty important as it speaks of his character, is buried.

Basically, his virtue's are buried in a comic. So when it comes to making a decision on whether to save him or let him die. Your operating on incomplete data.

And for the sake of the narrative that info should be presented as part of the DLC narrative. Not divided out and packaged and sold as extra. ME works best when it gives the player all the facts and then says pick an option. Those who have never read ME:invasion will most likely never know the context to the invasion they missed out on. How Aria and Oleg worked together. And how Oleg only betrayed Aria when he ordered to by TIM.

[Kataphrut94]

^The fact that he let her go does come up in the DLC- he brings it up when Aria is choking him. If you encouraged her to be more Paragon-esque, that's what does her in and encourages her to let him go. His moral code is an important part of his character despite the fact that you're opposing him - he attempts to be merciful toward Aria on multiple occasions, and only tries to kill her because she repeatedly gives him no other choice. Even if you don't know the precise circumstances (which I did not) of the original invasion, the game still gives you enough to go on to make a decision about him by the end of it.

I would say Omega works better as a DLC because it's a side-story. I'm personally not a fan of restricting important storyline aspects to downloadable content because it's limiting people who don't have access to the DLC. It also means that those seemingly important missions become optional and have to have an alternative for people who didn't get the DLC. Arrival, Shadow Broker and Leviathan all had this problem - From Ashes avoided it because they didn't try to make Javik important and focused on his character traits instead.

The point I'm trying to make is that DLC should be detached from the rest of the game to a certain degree. Shadow Broker or Arrival or any other DLC having an 'impact' on the plot of the games are not point in their favour to me, because a better game would have included that content on the disc. Whereas, a standalone DLC like Omega or Citadel is fine, because it's just extra content that rewards you for playing.

Modifié par Kataphrut94, 05 août 2013 - 12:44 .