1113 réponses à ce sujet

[Veruin]

vaire wrote...

You mean a general that caused a civil war and ignored the Blight? Caused my friend. Anyway we still do not know what is Corypheus and I'd like to be enlightened by you about the great similarities between Coripheus and Loghain....
I find far more between a Magister and Loghain, if you want to stretch it and, even in that case we are talking about people with far more power than a simple Mage. 

Considering Duncan wouldn't open his damn mouth and say that it's a blight, along with the fact that he didn't mention WHY Grey Wardens were needed to slay the archdemon..yea, I can't really blame loghain in the department.  He doesn't know it's a blight until around the landsmeet, and until then, just think's it's a darkspawn raid.

[Master Warder Z_]

vaire wrote...

Master Warder Z wrote...


The Baroness ruled over a hovel for a little bit and you compare that to a general fighting both a blight and civil war? 

Obviously the circumstances are entirely diffrent.

Why not compare Loghain idk to Cory?

You know one of the magisters that spilt an ocean of blood to cross into the fade.

You mean a general that caused a civil war and ignored the Blight? Caused my friend. Anyway we still do not know what is Corypheus and I'd like to be enlightened by you about the great similarities between Coripheus and Loghain....
I find far more between a Magister and Loghain, if you want to stretch it and, even in that case we are talking about people with far more power than a simple Mage. 

You and i have agrued that the Banns refusal to unite and their taking advantage of a precieved power vacuum at Calien's demise was more so responsble for the civil war then Loghain.

Furthermore when you have civil war within your borders its difficult to muster an army to fight darkspawn or at least that was my understanding of the situation.

And my point of this was, when you compare one character to another to somehow less or enhance a characters deeds, make them comparable, one random mage compared to Loghain isn't of conquence but a mage of the ancient imperium one that likely has a body count far exceding loghain isn't something of non conquence.

[HiroVoid]

vaire wrote...

Master Warder Z wrote...


The Baroness ruled over a hovel for a little bit and you compare that to a general fighting both a blight and civil war? 

Obviously the circumstances are entirely diffrent.

Why not compare Loghain idk to Cory?

You know one of the magisters that spilt an ocean of blood to cross into the fade.

You mean a general that caused a civil war and ignored the Blight? Caused my friend. Anyway we still do not know what is Corypheus and I'd like to be enlightened by you about the great similarities between Coripheus and Loghain....
I find far more between a Magister and Loghain, if you want to stretch it and, even in that case we are talking about people with far more power than a simple Mage. 

Last I checked, it was the bannorn and other nobles that rebelled against Loghain when he was talking about how they needed to deal with the Darkspawn incursion at the beginning of the game.

[vaire]

HiroVoid wrote...




10:43

That would be a justification?  Loghain is insane, not stupid. 

[Veruin]

vaire wrote...

That would be a justification?  Loghain is insane, not stupid. 

The only "insane" thing about him is his paranoia of Orlais.  (Also given their current track record, I wouldn't say it's not justified.  Most of it anyway.)

[HiroVoid]

vaire wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...




10:43

That would be a justification?  Loghain is insane, not stupid. 

Your post insinuated Lohgain was responsible for Uldred's actions.  Loghain promised him that he would do what he could to free mages in return for their support.  That's not him being responsible for the events at the tower.  Heck, that's what most mage supporters generally want.

[vaire]

Veruin wrote...


Considering Duncan wouldn't open his damn mouth and say that it's a blight, along with the fact that he didn't mention WHY Grey Wardens were needed to slay the archdemon..yea, I can't really blame loghain in the department.  He doesn't know it's a blight until around the landsmeet, and until then, just think's it's a darkspawn raid.

Does that make him completely blameless for the chaos that followed? No my friend, it does not. Besides he had many opportunities in between to remedy yet he did not. Besides ignorance doesn't excuse letting your own army being decimated.

[HiroVoid]

Veruin wrote...

vaire wrote...

That would be a justification?  Loghain is insane, not stupid. 

The only "insane" thing about him is his paranoia of Orlais.  (Also given their current track record, I wouldn't say it's not justified.  Most of it anyway.)

Believing the wardens to be in league with Orlais and selling elves to slavery to restock the royal treasury for more war funds are pretty much the only things I wouldn't defend along with the fact that Loghain's a crappy politician and was paranoid about Orlais (not completely unreasonable.  It helped him in The Calling, but he was too paranoid in the events in the game.)

[Master Warder Z_]

vaire wrote...

Veruin wrote...


Considering Duncan wouldn't open his damn mouth and say that it's a blight, along with the fact that he didn't mention WHY Grey Wardens were needed to slay the archdemon..yea, I can't really blame loghain in the department.  He doesn't know it's a blight until around the landsmeet, and until then, just think's it's a darkspawn raid.

Does that make him completely blameless for the chaos that followed? No my friend, it does not. Besides he had many opportunities in between to remedy yet he did not. Besides ignorance doesn't excuse letting your own army being decimated.

As i recall he saved the majority of it at Ostagar.

[HiroVoid]

vaire wrote...

Veruin wrote...


Considering Duncan wouldn't open his damn mouth and say that it's a blight, along with the fact that he didn't mention WHY Grey Wardens were needed to slay the archdemon..yea, I can't really blame loghain in the department.  He doesn't know it's a blight until around the landsmeet, and until then, just think's it's a darkspawn raid.

Does that make him completely blameless for the chaos that followed? No my friend, it does not. Besides he had many opportunities in between to remedy yet he did not. Besides ignorance doesn't excuse letting your own army being decimated.

He should have charged and lost the whole army?  Things didn't go as planned at Ostagar.  Sometimes crap like that happens.

[vaire]

Master Warder Z wrote...


As i recall he saved the majority of it at Ostagar.

Saved he majority? How? He escaped with his troops. XD

[SgtSteel91]

He also did try to get Callin out of the fighting before it started.

vaire wrote...

Saved he majority? How? He escaped with his troops. XD

It's still better than none or less trying to get Callin out of the fight.

Modifié par SgtSteel91, 18 décembre 2013 - 05:33 .

[HiroVoid]

Obligatory KnightOfPhoenix blog.

http://social.biowar...308/blog/10285/

[vaire]

Master Warder Z wrote...

You and i have agrued that the Banns refusal to unite and their taking advantage of a precieved power vacuum at Calien's demise was more so responsble for the civil war then Loghain.

Furthermore when you have civil war within your borders its difficult to muster an army to fight darkspawn or at least that was my understanding of the situation.

And my point of this was, when you compare one character to another to somehow less or enhance a characters deeds, make them comparable, one random mage compared to Loghain isn't of conquence but a mage of the ancient imperium one that likely has a body count far exceding loghain isn't something of non conquence.

first of all I have never argued with you before XD anyway:, yes it takes two to make war, that is not the question. The question is how he poorly handled the situation putting salt on a wound with his behavior towards the bannorn. 
As for your point I happen to agree, make them comparable. Hint: Loghain is hardly comparable with a magister, the Baroness is the only other Mage I know of with political power and enough might to slay a High Dragon.

[Jaison1986]

Didn't the return to Ostagar DLC stated that even with Loghain forces they would be overwhelmed eventually? Loghain only crime was allowing Howe to sell elves to slavery. The troubles at the circle started because Wynne opened her big mouth and at Redcliffe because of Connor recklessness.

[Veruin]

vaire wrote...

first of all I have never argued with you before XD anyway:, yes it takes two to make war, that is not the question. The question is how he poorly handled the situation putting salt on a wound with his behavior towards the bannorn. 
As for your point I happen to agree, make them comparable. Hint: Loghain is hardly comparable with a magister, the Baroness is the only other Mage I know of with political power and enough might to slay a High Dragon.

Wasn't the baroness also possessed/was a pride demon?

[vaire]

HiroVoid wrote...
He should have charged and lost the whole army?  Things didn't go as planned at Ostagar.  Sometimes crap like that happens.

Must I remind you be left well before knowing that was a Blight. Quite the contrary actually. **** didn't happen, he left them to die willingly. While I agree that Cailan was an idiot ther were better ( and less destructive) ways to replace him.

[HiroVoid]

vaire wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...
He should have charged and lost the whole army?  Things didn't go as planned at Ostagar.  Sometimes crap like that happens.

Must I remind you be left well before knowing that was a Blight. Quite the contrary actually. **** didn't happen, he left them to die willingly. While I agree that Cailan was an idiot ther were better ( and less destructive) ways to replace him.

Except he didn't do all of that to kill Cailan.  In an earlier script, he did because Cailan was going to abandon Anora and marry Celene, but in the current game, he no longer has that motivation.

[vaire]

Veruin wrote...

vaire wrote...

first of all I have never argued with you before XD anyway:, yes it takes two to make war, that is not the question. The question is how he poorly handled the situation putting salt on a wound with his behavior towards the bannorn. 
As for your point I happen to agree, make them comparable. Hint: Loghain is hardly comparable with a magister, the Baroness is the only other Mage I know of with political power and enough might to slay a High Dragon.

Wasn't the baroness also possessed/was a pride demon?

Yes, yet she did cause less victims than him... Wonder about the dangers of magic, people...
This would only prove that political power is far more dangerous than magic. XD 

[Beerfish]

cjones91 wrote...

Beerfish wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

Beerfish wrote...

I support mages too. Support em from a tree with a rope round their necks I say. My sis in law, Linny was her name. She gets a fine job as a charlady at Redcliffe castle. After years a strugglin on the farm. The bother and her and the kids av some income. Lie ain't so hard as twas it was afor.

Then the mages and demons come about and kill em all. We never saw Linny again but only heard she'd been buried with the rest of the people all ripped up there.

After that we hear about the ole village where I was born some kind of battle there they say Templars and mages that had escaped, wrecked the place, the old town hall burnt ta the ground. My old home burned.

Then we heard the other day that mage has gone and blown up the chantry in that city kirkwall killin our holy mother and a lot of others.

Yes indeed if i had it my way they'd not only lock em all away which is too kind for em. they outta hang em all. I'll tell ya one thing, if one of them ever comes around these parts the town milita has agreed to kill 1st and worry about what else helps after.

One could say the same thing for all of those mage haters....

Mage haters?  I was talkin to old Brutus tother day at the inn.  We all agreed twas a bad lot in life to be a mage.  Why his sisters kid was one and had to be taken away as a youngin.  Tears all around.  We both agreed though that they can't be trusted on their own.  They come into our village looking for help and they'll find nutthin but trouble they will.

Yet all you do is blame your own failures on magic.One could make the argument that maybe you should stop trying to find a scapegoat for your troubles.

What ya be talking about lad?  I blame magic on the deaths of Linny and all tothers in redcliffe.  Mages are nuthin but trouble.  Ever see a mage come into a village or town and not cause trouble n terror?  Thought not.  You can keep yer nasty mages to yerself and if they want to be prancin round the country on their own they git what they deserve, a rope or the stake.

[vaire]

HiroVoid wrote...

vaire wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...
He should have charged and lost the whole army?  Things didn't go as planned at Ostagar.  Sometimes crap like that happens.

Must I remind you be left well before knowing that was a Blight. Quite the contrary actually. **** didn't happen, he left them to die willingly. While I agree that Cailan was an idiot ther were better ( and less destructive) ways to replace him.

Except he didn't do all of that to kill Cailan.  In an earlier script, he did because Cailan was going to abandon Anora and marry Celene, but in the current game, he no longer has that motivation.

. Even in that case he would still have wanted Cailan dead, not concussed. XD

[Veruin]

vaire wrote...
Yes, yet she did cause less victims than him... Wonder about the dangers of magic, people...
This would only prove that political power is far more dangerous than magic. XD 

Yet, you continue to ignore the fact that she couldn't do harm to more people, because she was trapped in the fade.

[vaire]

Veruin wrote...

vaire wrote...
Yes, yet she did cause less victims than him... Wonder about the dangers of magic, people...
This would only prove that political power is far more dangerous than magic. XD 

Yet, you continue to ignore the fact that she couldn't do harm to more people, because she was trapped in the fade.

because a mob of villagers killed her.... That makes her so more dangerous! XD

[Master Warder Z_]

vaire wrote...

Master Warder Z wrote...

You and i have agrued that the Banns refusal to unite and their taking advantage of a precieved power vacuum at Calien's demise was more so responsble for the civil war then Loghain.

Furthermore when you have civil war within your borders its difficult to muster an army to fight darkspawn or at least that was my understanding of the situation.

And my point of this was, when you compare one character to another to somehow less or enhance a characters deeds, make them comparable, one random mage compared to Loghain isn't of conquence but a mage of the ancient imperium one that likely has a body count far exceding loghain isn't something of non conquence.

first of all I have never argued with you before XD anyway:, yes it takes two to make war, that is not the question. The question is how he poorly handled the situation putting salt on a wound with his behavior towards the bannorn. 
As for your point I happen to agree, make them comparable. Hint: Loghain is hardly comparable with a magister, the Baroness is the only other Mage I know of with political power and enough might to slay a High Dragon.

It was a simple mispelling.

My intent was "You can agrue and i have agrued" Not what came out which was "You and i have agrued." Funny how the removal of a single word can effect the sentence.

[Veruin]

vaire wrote...

because a mob of villagers killed her.... That makes her so more dangerous! XD

Yes.. the villagers burned her mansion to the ground (probably after being fed up with her luring young women to her house to "restore" her beauty") and with her dying breath she cast a spell to pull their spirits in the fade so she can rule over them until the end of time.  Yea, that's not at all dangerous. <_<

Modifié par Veruin, 18 décembre 2013 - 06:03 .