214 réponses à ce sujet

[dewayne31]

i think he'll be cameo in DA:I and remember cannt be a romance option DA:I. i have dig out the quote. doent matter to me. he4 dead. i like to think my hawke burned his body and spit ion his ashes. Yes i hate him. he had a noble goal. but in the end alot more mages die because of him.

[Azjurai]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Get over the fact that your terrorist boyfriend is a rampaging lunatic who's mental condition is deteriorating rapidly and can be killed.

If he shows up as a cameo, he better be completely under the control of Vengeance or be a gibbering animal trying to control it.

Anders isn't a lunatic. He simply opposed the millennia old slavery of mages, and sought to free his people from their shackles.

By becoming an abomination and murdering one of the few people (and likely other churchtypes, innocent civvies and children who happened to be taking refuge in the chantry) both placed well enough to peacefully start the change and who didn't see mages as all beasts needing to be locked up. Right.

[Xilizhra]

Azjurai wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Get over the fact that your terrorist boyfriend is a rampaging lunatic who's mental condition is deteriorating rapidly and can be killed.

If he shows up as a cameo, he better be completely under the control of Vengeance or be a gibbering animal trying to control it.

Anders isn't a lunatic. He simply opposed the millennia old slavery of mages, and sought to free his people from their shackles.

By becoming an abomination and murdering one of the few people (and likely other churchtypes, innocent civvies and children who happened to be taking refuge in the chantry) both placed well enough to peacefully start the change and who didn't see mages as all beasts needing to be locked up. Right.

Elthina wasn't any of those, and only other templars were seen in the building at night.

[dewayne31]

Xilizhra wrote...

Azjurai wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Get over the fact that your terrorist boyfriend is a rampaging lunatic who's mental condition is deteriorating rapidly and can be killed.

If he shows up as a cameo, he better be completely under the control of Vengeance or be a gibbering animal trying to control it.

Anders isn't a lunatic. He simply opposed the millennia old slavery of mages, and sought to free his people from their shackles.

By becoming an abomination and murdering one of the few people (and likely other churchtypes, innocent civvies and children who happened to be taking refuge in the chantry) both placed well enough to peacefully start the change and who didn't see mages as all beasts needing to be locked up. Right.

Elthina wasn't any of those, and only other templars were seen in the building at night.

ill go far as say Elthina was not inoccent as alot of people claim. her inaction was key role in the events. but she did side with templars either

Modifié par dewayne31, 12 juin 2013 - 04:25 .

[Azjurai]

Xilizhra wrote...

Elthina wasn't any of those, and only other templars were seen in the building at night.

So the Grand Cleric of the Free Marches (GC's being 2IC to the Divine) was not highly enough placed to start a change? Start being the keyword there.

I also failed while playing to see her screaming that all mages should be murdered in their sleep because they eat children and are all mages. I did see her talk that whole 'peace and tolerance'. There's a reason she tended to fall more in with the templars than mages as well (she certainly didn't hate mages, should get that from how she talks to/at/about Orsino), she's a freaking' GC, that's sort of her job, she even says as much "I can not turn on my templars, on the very words of Andraste for fear. No matter how justified that fear might be."

Modifié par Azjurai, 12 juin 2013 - 04:34 .

[Azjurai]

Double post =/

Modifié par Azjurai, 12 juin 2013 - 04:33 .

[Stella-Arc]

Elthina was a fool. A cautious fool who relied on faith to solve the problem. Ironically, it did. In a KA-BOOM kind of way. Nevertheless, Elthina is a symptom, not the disease. She was neutral, too neutral, to step in. However, that does not mean she deserved to die. Orisino does for protecting a crazy blood mage and helping with the Frankenstein experiment. Of course, there could have been a chance that Elthina knew of the atrocities being committed in the Gallows but who truly knows. She spends most of her time in the Chantry, not the Gallows. Despite it, she wasn't the only one who died.

Anders was the catalyst of change. He will be seen by some as a hero or a murderer. With that being said, Anders had his limelight. It's time for someone else (and by the looks of things, Varric would be the one).

Modifié par Stella-Arc, 12 juin 2013 - 04:39 .

[Xilizhra]

So the Grand Cleric of the Free Marches (GC's being 2IC to the Divine) was not highly enough placed to start a change? Start being the keyword there.

If she can't change her own subordinate in her own damned city, she's worse than useless. At least the Divine (**** her) started something useful.

[Azjurai]

Her subs were a power-hungry zealot (they tend to not listen to anyone) with a fairly large following (makes removing them a dicey issue) and a person who was going crazy because of a tainted(?) idol. I'm not going to argue she shouldn't probably have tried to do more or that she's blameless, I'm saying Anders was a moron for murdering her and everyone else there (and, as a result, the thousands of innocent civvies who get caught up the mage/templar war) because he said so.

[Lulupab]

It doesn't have anything to do with Elthina eally. Destroying an empty chantry would also work pretty much.

[Dave of Canada]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Anders isn't a lunatic. He simply opposed the millennia old slavery of mages, and sought to free his people from their shackles.

By losing himself and potentially murdering a mage, viewing her as no different than the Templar.
By blackmailing his love interest/friend to fulfill his goal.
By being obsessed on the concept of "justice", turning into vengeance whenever you questioned his ideals or ideas.
By killing dozens of innocents in an attempt to make Meredith slaughter the Circle in order to provoke them to fight for his beliefs.
[Friendship] Coming to terms and embracing the voice in his head that tells him to do things.
[Rivalry] By barely being able to contain the voice in his head which is forcing him to do things.

And he's getting worse by the year.

Totally rational being.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 12 juin 2013 - 09:01 .

[Lulupab]

Dave of Canada wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

Anders isn't a lunatic. He simply opposed the millennia old slavery of mages, and sought to free his people from their shackles.

By losing himself and potentially murdering a mage, viewing her as no different than the Templar.
By blackmailing his love interest/friend to fulfill his goal.
By being obsessed on the concept of "justice", turning into vengeance whenever you questioned his ideals or ideas.
By killing dozens of innocents in an attempt to make Meredith slaughter the Circle in order to provoke them to fight for his beliefs.
[Friendship] Coming to terms and embracing the voice in his head that tells him to do things.
[Rivalry] By barely being able to contain the voice in his head which is forcing him to do things.

And he's getting worse by the year.

Totally rational being.

Potential doesn't count.

He doesn't black mail his love interest. He wans them to have nothing to do with blowing up the chantry so that it won't be linked to Hawke in anyway.

There is no real justice in the world really, there is none in Thedas either. Anders is just a reflection of what oppression can do. And the people who opressed are deserving of that Vengeance, they are far past Justice.

In the chantry's destruction scene the inside of it is shown clearly. I thank bioware for this. its ONLY Elthina and dozens of templars, none can be "innocent" really.

He does not blow up the chantry to force Meredith to kill all mages. He does that to prove a point, but he is familiar with its consequneces however. The point is he does not do this to achieve the consequneces which is meredith ordering annulment. He do it for starting a war and make mages free. Meredith does not even care if you keep Anders alive, LOL.

"Ten years, a hundred years from now, someone like me will love someone like you, and there will be no templars to tear them apart." are not words of a lunatic nor terrorists who lost his mind as you claim.

Were you sleepng during the game? When you befriend Anders during the conversations you agree with slaugheting Templars, killing them on sight etc... Befriending someone in DA2 means you support their veiws and ideas.

Rivalty is the opposite.

Modifié par Rassler, 12 juin 2013 - 09:14 .

[Dave of Canada]

Rassler wrote...

Potential doesn't count.

Yes, the fact that you have to convince him to snap out of it totally makes things better. It totally means Anders is a sane individual who is in full control of his actions, the fact that he makes blind connections to people about to be abused by Templar that they're potentially associated with the Templar totally means he won't do it again because you tapped him on the nose and said "no".

He doesn't black mail his love interest. He wans them to have nothing to do with blowing up the chantry so that it won't be linked to Hawke in anyway.

He doesn't want you to be linked but he tries to blackmail you to help him do it, extremely apparent in the romance dialogue at the mansion itself.

In the chantry's destruction scene the inside of it is shown clearly. I thank bioware for this. its ONLY Elthina and dozens of templars, none can be "innocent" really.

What's shown =/= What's reality.

We don't see clerics, we don't see affirmed, we don't see initiates and we don't see any of the priestesses. Doesn't mean three-four people live in this very large building:

He does not blow up the chantry to force Meredith to kill all mages.

He does it knowing it'll provoke Meredith which might stir the mages to action. That's the entire point of him blowing up the Chantry, the whole "no compromise" shtick which he spouts because he wants irrational people to act irrationally.

"Ten years, a hundred years from now, someone like me will love someone like you, and there will be no templars to tear them apart." are not words of a lunatic nor terrorists who lost his mind as you claim.

Jesus christ, terrorists and lunatics don't wake up and think to themselves "I'M GOING BAT**** INSANE TODAY, KILL EVERYONE FOR NO REASON AT ALL".

Were you sleepng during the game? When you befriend Anders during the conversations you agree with slaugheting Templars, killing them on sight etc... Befriending someone in DA2 means you support their veiws and ideas.

You don't have to agree with Anders at all to be his friend. Even then, questioning him makes him go full-blown Vengeance on your ass and telling you to get out because he can't tolerate anyone who questions him.

He isn't being rational, his entire mindset is one-track. That's one of the themes behind the character.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 12 juin 2013 - 09:37 .

[Big I]

I rivaled Anders and kept him alive, and was dissapointed that when supporting mages he still went on about leading the rebellion despite being rivaled.


I never want to see Anders again. In game he's a lunatic who bombed a church and betrayed everything Hawke and the Warden tried to do for him. Out of game he represents a design choice I disliked about DA2 (the powerlessness of the protagonist in certain scripted events) and a character evolution I despised (taking two characters I liked in DA:A and turning them into one I hated in DA2). No more Anders.

[Ridwan]

Ehmmm.. Anders would qualify as a murderer and a terrorist, but some of you guys are ok with that it seems.

Modifié par M25105, 12 juin 2013 - 09:33 .

[quickthorn]

Anders hater here. He's dead in all my DA2 savegames.

That said. I'm not opposed to him coming back for players who feel otherwise - as a cameo. I suspect it would be a huge waste of resources to have companions whom only some of the playerbase are going to see. Plus he's already risen from the dead before for some Awakenings players. Let's not make it a common occurence.

[JobacNoor]

I fully expect Anders to return. As a skin suit for Justice/Vengeance. Anders the person is dead, either by Hawke's hand or by becoming fully possessed and the spirit permanently taking the wheel. I see Justice/Vengeance being a central and active figure for the mage rebellion.

Also, while I usually went the friendship path with Anders, I never recall actually agreeing with him in any shape or form with slaughtering Templars on sight or anything close to that extreme. I was nice to him, and agreed that the Templars in Kirkwall were taking things too far.

I can't see how one can think Anders is in full possession of his mental faculties by the end of the game, Justice/Vengeance is IMO quite obviously twisting him more and more throughout the game simply by being in his body. By the time he does what he does in the end, I see him as a very broken man and killing him is not just ironically justice, but mercy.

[NRieh]

As much as I'd love to see the "frostbitten" Anders (so far I love what they did to Varric and Morrigan) - I'm afraid I'd rather keep him off screen. They'd better leave Hawke+Anders alone, for whichever "everafer" they have (not much room for "happy", I'm afraid). But if they do intend to use him for any sort of plot moves - it'd better make some sense. I don't need a cameo for the sake of cameo, and they will have to invent a good reason for Hawke not being around (or to show myHawke without importing her face) .

I can recall one good example of LI-cameo - that's KOTOR2. Carth Onasi and his arc, was, probably, the only good thing about that "game". If they pull off something similar for Hawke (not only for Anders-mancres) - I could be satisfied. But no "Alistair-King: DAI edition", please!

But, once again, I'm not that eager to see him in DAI, because I doubt that they can show me something that I'd enjoy. Short references without seeing him at all - fine by me. And, may be, an artifact called "Anders manifesto vol.X" with some sort of codex entry ))

[wright1978]

If there's a story reason for a cameo from Anders(if alive in import) i'd be fine with that, otherwise just differences in dialogue when talking about Mage rebels would be fine with me.

[Little Princess Peach]

The haters can hate but I liked Anders to a point and I did do his romance arc on multiple saves, and it would be a great way to bring in some hawkedom so I agree with op more Anders, and kitties!

If Bioware can't bring Hawke back for this game, maybe Anders can comment on the romance or somthing...

[AstraDrakkar]

Yes bring him back....but only if I can murder knife him again.

[Little Princess Peach]

AstraDrakkar wrote...

Yes bring him back....but only if I can murder knife him again.

Tell me somthing if Hawke blew up the chantery instead of Anders would you be pissed off at her or just shrug it off?

[BackdoorPaco]

Karlone123 wrote...

I kept imagining Anders narrating over the trailer and taking Morrigan's place at the end of the trailer. How would that have made you feel?

Don't think Anders has the curves to fill that dress.

[AstraDrakkar]

Double post.....

Modifié par AstraDrakkar, 12 juin 2013 - 10:41 .

[AstraDrakkar]

AstraDrakkar wrote...

Tharja wrote...

AstraDrakkar wrote...

Yes bring him back....but only if I can murder knife him again.

Tell me somthing if Hawke blew up the chantery instead of Anders would you be pissed off at her or just shrug it off?

 Actually yes, I would love the opportunity to murder knife Hawk too, but then i never really liked Hawke anyway.

BTW, I loved the original Anders in the DAO expansion. Can't stand the DA2  Justice/Anders.