443 réponses à ce sujet

[Bleachrude]

re: Liara T'soni wealth

Isn't Liara Beznenia only child and didn't Tevos mention that Benzenia was a very influential member of the Asari republics?

Given how wealthy the asari are in canon and that Tevos mentions Liara's mother is influential among the asari, I seriously doubt Liara was hurting for cash....

[crimzontearz]

cereal killer

[Hazegurl]

silverexile17s wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...

jtav wrote...

The events of Redemption happen whether you like it or not. Liara recovered Shepard's body and handed it over to Cerberus. You can't control how Liara feels about you, but you can control how Shepard feels about her.

No it didn't. It's not in my game at all so it didn't happen. I'm not telling everyone else what their canon should be. <_<

No you can't really control how Shep feels about Liara. I've seen complaints about a non romanced Shepard acting like he's attracted to her in the Citadel DLC, forced hugs in ME2. You can only control how close you want her to be to your Shep (Not confiding in her after the dreams, telling her to keep it professional)and of course you can control how you, the player, feel about her.

Well, actually, when you ask Liara what the reason she hates the Borker is - right after the second terminal-hacking quest you do for her -- she responds by giving what is basically a word-for-word recounting of Redemption -- she gives Shepard to Cerberus after taking the Commander's body back from the Broker, who was going to sell it to the Collectors. Feron sacrifices himself to ensure she escapes. Hell, Tazzik -- the burly salarian merc -- is even refrenced by name in an E-Mail between Feron and Liara in ME3.
So, according to the in-game, Redemption is a cannon occourance. It happens behind the scenes, but it's cannon.

Also, I think the fact that Liara is a romance option in ME3 is supposed to hint to her always loving Shepard and never being able to bury those feelings. A romance with her is optional, but I think they were trying to hint at her always having feelings of attachement, no matter who you were with. Even at the end of ME3, she asks to share memories with you -- something usually only done between "close friends" or bondmates. As far as I know, Liara is the only squadmate aside from the Virmire survivor that can be romanced in both ME1 and ME3, and the only one that is shown to have strong feelings of attachment to Shepard in ME2 to the point of trusting Cerberus with the Commander in exchange for a possible ressurection.

I know the dialouge is mentioned if you do the hacker quest. But I don't do it and therefore its not in my game hence why I don't count it as my canon now if she had recounted the story in ME3 when I talked to her about how she managed to become the SB, I would totally accept it. But I don't care if it's everyone elses canon. Telling me that is also my canon story based on the dialouge being attainable is like saying curing the genophage is my canon by virtue of the option being there. Well if I didn't cure the genophage then it isn't my canon.  You might as well say ALL the dialouge options is everyone's canon whether they've chosen it or not but that kinda defeats the point of having a canon story to begin with.

As for Liara's feelings. I totally get it and I don't think there is anything wrong with Liara having feelings for Shepard regardless of who he is with. That's just a natural part of life. I just don't get why the devs try to force the player Shepard to feel the same way towards her. I would actually find Liara far more enduring if she had these feelings without the devs trying to push a Shepard who doesn't feel the same way onto her. Honestly, I blame the devs far more than Liara. She's a good character and I enjoyed talking to her in ME1. I find it a shame that the devs would try to force a "cosmic connection" with her though. I guess you could say that I'm hating the devs headcanon more than anything.

[Hazegurl]

The Night Mammoth wrote...
, and whilst I'm trying to keep in mind that's it's perfectly harmless and his perogative if it makes his game better, I still can't help but think it's wierd.

I don't see how it's weird. I actually find it funny that I can mention that none of the body recovering happened in my playthrough and someone always have to go out of their way to tell me it did. If you didn't shoot Mordin Solus and I kept telling you that your Shepard did shoot him whether you like it or not. You would probably go, wth?? That's why I call it a case of the writers using different media (comics, novels, etc) to tell a story. Nothing wrong with that and I can understand it. But there comes a point where I think each player has to decide what is the writer's headcanon vs their own. I like to stick to my own as much as possible if I'm given a choice to do so. That's all. I'm actually glad BioWare gave me the choice to have a different story as it makes more sense to me to assume that a powerful organization like Cerberus recovered my body.

[The Night Mammoth]

I would go 'wth', you're right, but because you're be telling me something that visibly contradictory to what actually happened in my playthrough, whereas in this case you're choosing to reject something that's basically canon for the universe on the grounds of not hearing the dialogue. I don't really have a point or the right to argue anymore, just thought it was a strange deceleration to make at the beginning.

[Hazegurl]

The Night Mammoth wrote...

I would go 'wth', you're right, but because you're be telling me something that visibly contradictory to what actually happened in my playthrough, whereas in this case you're choosing to reject something that's basically canon for the universe on the grounds of not hearing the dialogue. I don't really have a point or the right to argue anymore, just thought it was a strange deceleration to make at the beginning.

It's not canon for the universe. If it was they should have explained it again in ME3. They didn't so it wasn't important to add.

note: I also have to say that I found the Shadow Broker himself to be a cartoonish disappointment too which is why I'm glad to wipe that entire storyline from my game.

[remydat]

Hazegurl wrote...

It's not canon for the universe. If it was they should have explained it again in ME3. They didn't so it wasn't important to add.

note: I also have to say that I found the Shadow Broker himself to be a cartoonish disappointment too which is why I'm glad to wipe that entire storyline from my game.

This seems like a question of if a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it does it make a sound?

Just because you refuse to listen to dialogue that reveals that Liara recovers Shep's body does not mean she didn't.  Just means you are ignorant of the fact she did. 

This would be like saying if my wife was banging the hell out of my best friend, as long as I never find out and am ignorant of this fact that means she never screwed his brains out.  Sadly, it does not, lol.

Modifié par remydat, 17 juin 2013 - 05:30 .

[Anthadlas]

remydat wrote...

Wraith 02 wrote...

Gravity does not shrink an orbit, if an object has enough speed so that it's falling arc is shallower than the earth's curvature it will remain in orbit untill an outside force interacts with it and slows it's speed.

The Moon is not being pulled closer to the earth, that is rubbish, It is outside the atmosphere and therefore is not being slowed down and the tidal forces of the earth are actually propelling it and causing it to move further away.

As Shepards body comes into contact with the atmosphere his body would actually slow down due to the increased resistance and would only fall at terminal velocity with isn't actually that fast, a man managed to fall from 33,000 feet without a parachute and actually survived the fall.

Considering Shepard is wearing armor that protects from extreme heat and radiation, as well as kinetic barriers that protect from projectiles accelerated to a fraction of the speed of light and the fact he wasn't even alive when he hit the surface, all his armor had to do was keep his body intact.

There is no proof Shepard's armour shattered when it hit the floor, just because Liara and Legion have seperate parts doesn't mean it wasn't cut apart to remove Shepards body from it.

Also we have seen that Cerberus created a Shepard clone to use for spare parts, due to technological advances it would be possible to reconstruct Shepards body from just a fragment of it, even just a severed head so long as they had his DNA, We all know his head survived impact as Miranda tells us and the N7 helmet is found intact.

With a budget of several billion credits I don't think it would be too hard to rebuild him from whatever survived.

Yeah, we went through the whole orbit thing already.

You could drop 1 million people from space and 999,999 thousand of their bodies will probably be destoryed beyond repair and yeah maybe 1 of those people will fall just right where their body survives intact.  Of course, this is all theoretical because this experiment has never been performed but pretending like what we saw in the game was the most believable outcome is silly.  Just like sure I am sure someone has survived 2 bullets to the face before but doesn't make it any less ridiculous if Shep does it as part of a cut scene.

.

My point is not that Shepard is the one in a million to survive the fall, it's that people have survived such a fall wearing normal clothes so the fact that Shepard is wearing heavy combat armor built to survive impacts from mass accelerated weapons means he has a very good chance of surviving. Plus there is no evidence to show that Shepards kinetic barriers were not working, if they were this would help prevent blunt force trauma. 
    
Also considering the angle he hit the floor at, head first would definately destroy his brain, but if he lands feet first most of his torso and head would be intact . The speed that you hit the floor when falling from orbit isn't actually that fast and you body is not going to explode on impact. Shepard isn't even alive when he hits the floor, and then has billions of credits and 2 years put into repairing him so the amount of trauma isn't important.
    
I'm not trying show the exact way it would have happened as it is impossible, all i'm trying to point out is that a dead body surviving impact whilst wearing armor and being rebuilt is not that far fetched and really is not considerable as plot armor when compared to something like surviving a direct shot from Harbingers weapon which is capable of killing Makos and Gunships.

Modifié par Wraith 02, 17 juin 2013 - 05:43 .

[Hazegurl]

remydat wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...

It's not canon for the universe. If it was they should have explained it again in ME3. They didn't so it wasn't important to add.

note: I also have to say that I found the Shadow Broker himself to be a cartoonish disappointment too which is why I'm glad to wipe that entire storyline from my game.

This seems like a question of if a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it does it make a sound?

Just because you refuse to listen to dialogue that reveals that Liara recovers Shep's body does not mean she didn't.  Just means you are ignorant of the fact she did. 

This would be like saying if my wife was banging the hell out of my best friend, as long as I never find out and am ignorant of this fact that means she never screwed his brains out.  Sadly, it does not, lol.

You could say the same for all the dialouge in this game. If you didn't hear Mordin sing because in your playthrough the convo that  led up to it didn't happen are you going to say Mordin sang anyway in your playthrough?

[Anthadlas]

Hazegurl wrote...

remydat wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...

It's not canon for the universe. If it was they should have explained it again in ME3. They didn't so it wasn't important to add.

note: I also have to say that I found the Shadow Broker himself to be a cartoonish disappointment too which is why I'm glad to wipe that entire storyline from my game.

This seems like a question of if a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it does it make a sound?

Just because you refuse to listen to dialogue that reveals that Liara recovers Shep's body does not mean she didn't.  Just means you are ignorant of the fact she did. 

This would be like saying if my wife was banging the hell out of my best friend, as long as I never find out and am ignorant of this fact that means she never screwed his brains out.  Sadly, it does not, lol.

You could say the same for all the dialouge in this game. If you didn't hear Mordin sing because in your playthrough the convo that  led up to it didn't happen are you going to say Mordin sang anyway in your playthrough?

But it is canon that liara recovered Shepards body, It is in the main game, It is in the LOTSB. You cannot just refuse to see content in the game and then claim it doesn't exist

Otherwise I could completely skip ME2, and claim shepard never joined Cerberus just because I didn't see it, You cannot cherry pick the sections of the game that you like and then say it isn't canon.

It wouldn't be canon if it was a choice and had multiple possibilities but it is not a choice, it is simply a section of the game's canon that you are missing.

In much the same way that Shepard destroying the alpha relay is canon but you can skip Arrival and the game will say that an alliance marine squad did it, It is still canon that Shepard destroyed it but it is said ingame to avoid continuity errors because you missed content, not because it was a selectable choice

[s-jay2676]

Hazegurl wrote...

silverexile17s wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...

jtav wrote...

The events of Redemption happen whether you like it or not. Liara recovered Shepard's body and handed it over to Cerberus. You can't control how Liara feels about you, but you can control how Shepard feels about her.

No it didn't. It's not in my game at all so it didn't happen. I'm not telling everyone else what their canon should be. <_<

No you can't really control how Shep feels about Liara. I've seen complaints about a non romanced Shepard acting like he's attracted to her in the Citadel DLC, forced hugs in ME2. You can only control how close you want her to be to your Shep (Not confiding in her after the dreams, telling her to keep it professional)and of course you can control how you, the player, feel about her.

Well, actually, when you ask Liara what the reason she hates the Borker is - right after the second terminal-hacking quest you do for her -- she responds by giving what is basically a word-for-word recounting of Redemption -- she gives Shepard to Cerberus after taking the Commander's body back from the Broker, who was going to sell it to the Collectors. Feron sacrifices himself to ensure she escapes. Hell, Tazzik -- the burly salarian merc -- is even refrenced by name in an E-Mail between Feron and Liara in ME3.
So, according to the in-game, Redemption is a cannon occourance. It happens behind the scenes, but it's cannon.

Also, I think the fact that Liara is a romance option in ME3 is supposed to hint to her always loving Shepard and never being able to bury those feelings. A romance with her is optional, but I think they were trying to hint at her always having feelings of attachement, no matter who you were with. Even at the end of ME3, she asks to share memories with you -- something usually only done between "close friends" or bondmates. As far as I know, Liara is the only squadmate aside from the Virmire survivor that can be romanced in both ME1 and ME3, and the only one that is shown to have strong feelings of attachment to Shepard in ME2 to the point of trusting Cerberus with the Commander in exchange for a possible ressurection.

I know the dialouge is mentioned if you do the hacker quest. But I don't do it and therefore its not in my game hence why I don't count it as my canon now if she had recounted the story in ME3 when I talked to her about how she managed to become the SB, I would totally accept it. But I don't care if it's everyone elses canon. Telling me that is also my canon story based on the dialouge being attainable is like saying curing the genophage is my canon by virtue of the option being there. Well if I didn't cure the genophage then it isn't my canon.  You might as well say ALL the dialouge options is everyone's canon whether they've chosen it or not but that kinda defeats the point of having a canon story to begin with.

As for Liara's feelings. I totally get it and I don't think there is anything wrong with Liara having feelings for Shepard regardless of who he is with. That's just a natural part of life. I just don't get why the devs try to force the player Shepard to feel the same way towards her. I would actually find Liara far more enduring if she had these feelings without the devs trying to push a Shepard who doesn't feel the same way onto her. Honestly, I blame the devs far more than Liara. She's a good character and I enjoyed talking to her in ME1. I find it a shame that the devs would try to force a "cosmic connection" with her though. I guess you could say that I'm hating the devs headcanon more than anything.

Thanks, Hazegurl, that was nice to read.

First of all, l apologize to all BSN users, who posted in this thread. As I read through the stuff I posted, I noticed that some of my comments appear too aggresive. Let me assure you, that wasn't my intention. English is not my first language, so maybe that offers a little explanation, but I'm not going to hide behind it.

Hazegurl's post (the one quoted above) kind of opened my eyes (sometimes I don't see the wood for the trees), and I realized, that I don't even know why we are always fighting each other. Why can't the people, who like Liara (I'm using her as example, but it does apply to fans of other characters as well) accept, that others have a different opinion? And why can't the ones who hate her accept, that others like her? Why do we have to keep fighting? We should be enjoying this great universe and its characters instead. Besides, we ain't gonna change our minds anyway. So, my fellow BSN users, let's stop this madness, shall we?

I hope I didn't bore you all to death with this.

Modifié par s-jay2676, 17 juin 2013 - 06:25 .

[jtav]

No, it's not canon that Shep destroyed the Alpha relay, because a genuine alternate explanation--marines did it--is proposed. Just like I can canonically say Shepard didn't recruit Wrex, even though that's just me avoiding content. What Hazegurl wants is closer to "Anderson was never a Spectre candidate."

[Anthadlas]

jtav wrote...

No, it's not canon that Shep destroyed the Alpha relay, because a genuine alternate explanation--marines did it--is proposed. Just like I can canonically say Shepard didn't recruit Wrex, even though that's just me avoiding content. What Hazegurl wants is closer to "Anderson was never a Spectre candidate."

Agreed the Alpha relay is a bad example as it is based on optional DLC complicating things and Shepard can choose to ignore Hacketts request in which case Hackett will send an Alliance team
But the problem with Liara recovering Shepards body is that Shepard is dead and has no say in the matter, It is not a choice that he gets to make and no alternative is offered to explain ingame how Shepards body was recovered.

If people don't like this fact then you can avoid dialogue lines and then headcanon and come up with a reason why she didn't recover his body but the problem arises when you then try to use your own personal headcanon in a discussion with other people who clearly know that Liara was the one who recovered Shepard and that they then based an entire DLC around this premise.

Just because you don't ask somebody about something doesn't mean that it didn't happen, It just means you don't know about it.

Modifié par Wraith 02, 17 juin 2013 - 06:53 .

[o Ventus]

Liara recovering your body is canon, whether of not you do anything at all.

Saying otherwise is objectively, factually incorrect.

Are we done now?

Modifié par o Ventus, 17 juin 2013 - 07:11 .

[Hazegurl]

s-jay2676 wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...

silverexile17s wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...

jtav wrote...

The events of Redemption happen whether you like it or not. Liara recovered Shepard's body and handed it over to Cerberus. You can't control how Liara feels about you, but you can control how Shepard feels about her.

No it didn't. It's not in my game at all so it didn't happen. I'm not telling everyone else what their canon should be. <_<

No you can't really control how Shep feels about Liara. I've seen complaints about a non romanced Shepard acting like he's attracted to her in the Citadel DLC, forced hugs in ME2. You can only control how close you want her to be to your Shep (Not confiding in her after the dreams, telling her to keep it professional)and of course you can control how you, the player, feel about her.

Well, actually, when you ask Liara what the reason she hates the Borker is - right after the second terminal-hacking quest you do for her -- she responds by giving what is basically a word-for-word recounting of Redemption -- she gives Shepard to Cerberus after taking the Commander's body back from the Broker, who was going to sell it to the Collectors. Feron sacrifices himself to ensure she escapes. Hell, Tazzik -- the burly salarian merc -- is even refrenced by name in an E-Mail between Feron and Liara in ME3.
So, according to the in-game, Redemption is a cannon occourance. It happens behind the scenes, but it's cannon.

Also, I think the fact that Liara is a romance option in ME3 is supposed to hint to her always loving Shepard and never being able to bury those feelings. A romance with her is optional, but I think they were trying to hint at her always having feelings of attachement, no matter who you were with. Even at the end of ME3, she asks to share memories with you -- something usually only done between "close friends" or bondmates. As far as I know, Liara is the only squadmate aside from the Virmire survivor that can be romanced in both ME1 and ME3, and the only one that is shown to have strong feelings of attachment to Shepard in ME2 to the point of trusting Cerberus with the Commander in exchange for a possible ressurection.

I know the dialouge is mentioned if you do the hacker quest. But I don't do it and therefore its not in my game hence why I don't count it as my canon now if she had recounted the story in ME3 when I talked to her about how she managed to become the SB, I would totally accept it. But I don't care if it's everyone elses canon. Telling me that is also my canon story based on the dialouge being attainable is like saying curing the genophage is my canon by virtue of the option being there. Well if I didn't cure the genophage then it isn't my canon.  You might as well say ALL the dialouge options is everyone's canon whether they've chosen it or not but that kinda defeats the point of having a canon story to begin with.

As for Liara's feelings. I totally get it and I don't think there is anything wrong with Liara having feelings for Shepard regardless of who he is with. That's just a natural part of life. I just don't get why the devs try to force the player Shepard to feel the same way towards her. I would actually find Liara far more enduring if she had these feelings without the devs trying to push a Shepard who doesn't feel the same way onto her. Honestly, I blame the devs far more than Liara. She's a good character and I enjoyed talking to her in ME1. I find it a shame that the devs would try to force a "cosmic connection" with her though. I guess you could say that I'm hating the devs headcanon more than anything.

Thanks, Hazegurl, that was nice to read.

First of all, l apologize to all BSN users, who posted in this thread. As I read through the stuff I posted, I noticed that some of my comments appear too aggresive. Let me assure you, that wasn't my intention. English is not my first language, so maybe that offers a little explanation, but I'm not going to hide behind it.

Hazegurl's post (the one quoted above) kind of opened my eyes (sometimes I don't see the wood for the trees), and I realized, that I don't even know why we are always fighting each other. Why can't the people, who like Liara (I'm using her as example, but it does apply to fans of other characters as well) accept, that others have a different opinion? And why can't the ones who hate her accept, that others like her? Why do we have to keep fighting? We should be enjoying this great universe and its characters instead. Besides, we ain't gonna change our minds anyway. So, my fellow BSN users, let's stop this madness, shall we?

I hope I didn't bore you all to death with this.

Thanks!

I totally agree with you! I don't even know why we have to fight about everything but then again I will be the first to admit that I contribute to it cause it's so hard to back down.

We are playing a universe with so many different variables to the point where it's only natural that we would all walk away from it with a different pov. The characters may appear differently for us based on what we have chosen dialouge wise and based on whether we have romanced them or not. I get why players love Liara or Jack, even though I personally don't care too much for them and I get why some players don't like Kaidan or Miranda although I love them. I guess we can't really complain that much about lack of variables in dialouge or player perception that's for sure. lol!!

[Hazegurl]

Wraith 02 wrote...

If people don't like this fact then you can avoid dialogue lines and then headcanon and come up with a reason why she didn't recover his body but the problem arises when you then try to use your own personal headcanon in a discussion with other people who clearly know that Liara was the one who recovered Shepard and that they then based an entire DLC around this premise.

Just because you don't ask somebody about something doesn't mean that it didn't happen, It just means you don't know about it.

Wrong buddy. I simply mentioned that it didn't happen FOR ME and everyone else got a bug up their ass about it  I have never once stated that it should be that way for everyone else nor have I made points to how it shouldn't be that way for other players, I have simply defended why I don't consider it as a part of my canon storyline. Considering the fact that it's never once mentioned again and the story does in fact change in game in ME3 it doesn't take much headcanon to say "That didn't happen for me". Besides, at the end of the day LOTSB is just an excuse to give Liara fans extra content because they didn't include her in ME2 as a companion and to set her up in the writer's canon as the main LI. The whole story is contrived anyway. Yeah the Collectors are suddenly too lazy to retrieve Shep's body, never mind the fact that they were there when he fell to that planet and should have been able to track him (ya know cause it was said in ME2 that they could track humans). Instead they decided to leave and hire the mysterious SB to get it for them.

Modifié par Hazegurl, 17 juin 2013 - 08:12 .

[remydat]

Wraith 02 wrote...

My point is not that Shepard is the one in a million to survive the fall, it's that people have survived such a fall wearing normal clothes so the fact that Shepard is wearing heavy combat armor built to survive impacts from mass accelerated weapons means he has a very good chance of surviving. Plus there is no evidence to show that Shepards kinetic barriers were not working, if they were this would help prevent blunt force trauma. 
    
Also considering the angle he hit the floor at, head first would definately destroy his brain, but if he lands feet first most of his torso and head would be intact . The speed that you hit the floor when falling from orbit isn't actually that fast and you body is not going to explode on impact. Shepard isn't even alive when he hits the floor, and then has billions of credits and 2 years put into repairing him so the amount of trauma isn't important.
    
I'm not trying show the exact way it would have happened as it is impossible, all i'm trying to point out is that a dead body surviving impact whilst wearing armor and being rebuilt is not that far fetched and really is not considerable as plot armor when compared to something like surviving a direct shot from Harbingers weapon which is capable of killing Makos and Gunships.

Somone has survived falling from space?  Nope don't think that has every happened.  And again, someone surviving a fall once that kills people 99.99999999% of the time is not proof that plot armor does not exist..  I mean the majority of humans falling from anything more than say 5 stories die so holding out some miracle instance of someone surviving a fall from 33k feet as evidence of no pot armor is silly.  It's a f**king miracle that person survived dude.  A mircale.  So if your story is relying on a miracle to work it is plot armor period.

Show me evidence that the majority of people would survive falls from space or from 33 thousand feet.  

Modifié par remydat, 17 juin 2013 - 08:48 .

[remydat]

Hazegurl wrote...

You could say the same for all the dialouge in this game. If you didn't hear Mordin sing because in your playthrough the convo that  led up to it didn't happen are you going to say Mordin sang anyway in your playthrough?

No I wouldn't because in that scenario Mordin does not sing.  Mordin singing is a future event.  You have to trigger dialogue to ensure that future event happens just like in real life I can avoid a future event by doing something to prevent that future event happenning.

Liara recovering your body is a PAST EVENT.  It has already occurred.  The only thing your dialogue option does is determine whether your Shep hears from Liara that she performed this past event.  As the event is past it cannot be changed.

You are pretending there is an alternate reality in which Liara did not recover the body and someone else did.  This is simply not true.  There are other events in the game that represent alternate realities depending on your choice but this is not one of them.  It is 100% that Liara recovers your body in all scenarios whether you choose to learn of this fact or not.

Modifié par remydat, 17 juin 2013 - 08:49 .

[Anthadlas]

remydat wrote...

Wraith 02 wrote...

My point is not that Shepard is the one in a million to survive the fall, it's that people have survived such a fall wearing normal clothes so the fact that Shepard is wearing heavy combat armor built to survive impacts from mass accelerated weapons means he has a very good chance of surviving. Plus there is no evidence to show that Shepards kinetic barriers were not working, if they were this would help prevent blunt force trauma. 
    
Also considering the angle he hit the floor at, head first would definately destroy his brain, but if he lands feet first most of his torso and head would be intact . The speed that you hit the floor when falling from orbit isn't actually that fast and you body is not going to explode on impact. Shepard isn't even alive when he hits the floor, and then has billions of credits and 2 years put into repairing him so the amount of trauma isn't important.
    
I'm not trying show the exact way it would have happened as it is impossible, all i'm trying to point out is that a dead body surviving impact whilst wearing armor and being rebuilt is not that far fetched and really is not considerable as plot armor when compared to something like surviving a direct shot from Harbingers weapon which is capable of killing Makos and Gunships.

Somone has survived falling from space?  Nope don't think that has every happened.  And again, someone surviving a fall once that kills people 99.99999999% of the time is not proof that plot armor does not exist..  I mean 99% of humans falling from anything more than say 5 stories die so holding out some miracle instance of someone surviving a fall from 33k feet as evidence of no pot armor is silly.  It's a f**king miracle that person survived dude.  A mircale.  So if your story is relying on a miracle to work it is plot armor period.

Show me evidence that the majority of people would survive falls from space or from 33 thousand feet.  

Surviving a fall from space would be the same as surviving a fall from an aeroplane, both would reach terminal velocity and be going the same speed.

And yet again, the 0.00001% chance person who survived is not being used to prove Shepard is that person, It is being used to show it is possible to survive a fall from that height without high tech armor or kinetic barriers, and Shepard had both so his chances are much higher.

remydat wrote...
Show me evidence that the majority of people would survive falls from space or from 33 thousand feet.  

No I don't need to as Shepard didn't survive the fall, he was already dead.

You cannot dismiss my claims by using evidence that nodoby has survived falling from space and most people die from a 5 story drop when Shepard was dead.

You need to show evidence that dead bodies apparantly explode on impact and are completely unsalvagable even with all the advances in technology within the Mass Effect universe. Otherwise your claim is baseless.

Modifié par Wraith 02, 17 juin 2013 - 09:01 .

[remydat]

Entering the atmosphere of planet is different than falling from within the atmosphere of a planet.

And who said anything about exploding. I am saying his internal organs would be turned to mush because of the concussive force. When you throw mercs off of buildings and such they die. This is a fact. Clone Shep dies. Mercs with helmets that fall from high places die. All of them have similar tech.

Internal organcs are soft. They don't fare well when hit with concussive force. Bomb victims develop a white butterfly effect so called because when you look at their X-Rays, their internal organs are basically splatterred and look like a white butterfly on the X-ray.

So this idea that you could fall from space using the same tech that mercs have who routinely die when thrown from high places and survive more often than not is make believe.

[KaiserShep]

remydat wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...

You could say the same for all the dialouge in this game. If you didn't hear Mordin sing because in your playthrough the convo that  led up to it didn't happen are you going to say Mordin sang anyway in your playthrough?

No I wouldn't because in that scenario Mordin does not sing.  Mordin singing is a future event.  You have to trigger dialogue to ensure that future event happens just like in real life I can avoid a future event by doing something to prevent that future event happenning.

Liara recovering your body is a PAST EVENT.  It has already occurred.  The only thing your dialogue option does is determine whether your Shep hears from Liara that she performed this past event.  As the event is past it cannot be changed.

You are pretending there is an alternate reality in which Liara did not recover the body and someone else did.  This is simply not true.  There are other events in the game that represent alternate realities depending on your choice but this is not one of them.  It is 100% that Liara recovers your body in all scenarios whether you choose to learn of this fact or not.

It's like skipping the pages of a book, then claiming that the content of those pages don't exist. 

[Anthadlas]

remydat wrote...

Entering the atmosphere of planet is different than falling from within the atmosphere of a planet.

No It is not, the impact with the floor would be exactly the same, Shepards suit is built to survive in space and can land on planets with extreme temperatures, re-entry wouldn't affect it.

remydat wrote...

And who said anything about exploding. I am saying his internal organs would be turned to mush because of the concussive force.

And several billion credits spent on advanced technology and 2 years spent rebuilding him seems to make that not much of an issue. Whether it is technically possible is irrelevent, it makes sense within the plot and is therefore not plot armor.

remydat wrote...

So this idea that you could fall from space using the same tech that
mercs have who routinely die when thrown from high places and survive
more often than not is make believe.

YET AGAIN do I really need to point out that Shepard didn't survive the fall? He was dead and his corpse hit the floor. I'm not even saying he survived it, I'm saying his body would remain intact and you can't prove otherwise.

[Hazegurl]

remydat wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...

You could say the same for all the dialouge in this game. If you didn't hear Mordin sing because in your playthrough the convo that  led up to it didn't happen are you going to say Mordin sang anyway in your playthrough?

No I wouldn't because in that scenario Mordin does not sing.  Mordin singing is a future event.  You have to trigger dialogue to ensure that future event happens just like in real life I can avoid a future event by doing something to prevent that future event happenning.

Liara recovering your body is a PAST EVENT.  It has already occurred.  The only thing your dialogue option does is determine whether your Shep hears from Liara that she performed this past event.  As the event is past it cannot be changed.

You are pretending there is an alternate reality in which Liara did not recover the body and someone else did.  This is simply not true.  There are other events in the game that represent alternate realities depending on your choice but this is not one of them.  It is 100% that Liara recovers your body in all scenarios whether you choose to learn of this fact or not.

Stop whining and deal with it. It's not my fault the devs didn't care enough to put it in ME3. Or how about they add it the first time you talk to Liara instead of after an optional side mission or in optional DLC.

The keyword here is optional content and I am simply opting not to have it in my story. To those comparing it to a book, Don't compare it to a book. Books don't have optional content where you can pick and choose multiple dialouge between characters. (Unless it's a choose your own adventure book) If a past event happened in a book, it happened because the characters or narrator said so. Not "They said it or did it if you(the reader) pick this option here"

Modifié par Hazegurl, 17 juin 2013 - 09:15 .

[Anthadlas]

Hazegurl wrote...

remydat wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...

You could say the same for all the dialouge in this game. If you didn't hear Mordin sing because in your playthrough the convo that  led up to it didn't happen are you going to say Mordin sang anyway in your playthrough?

No I wouldn't because in that scenario Mordin does not sing.  Mordin singing is a future event.  You have to trigger dialogue to ensure that future event happens just like in real life I can avoid a future event by doing something to prevent that future event happenning.

Liara recovering your body is a PAST EVENT.  It has already occurred.  The only thing your dialogue option does is determine whether your Shep hears from Liara that she performed this past event.  As the event is past it cannot be changed.

You are pretending there is an alternate reality in which Liara did not recover the body and someone else did.  This is simply not true.  There are other events in the game that represent alternate realities depending on your choice but this is not one of them.  It is 100% that Liara recovers your body in all scenarios whether you choose to learn of this fact or not.

Stop whining and deal with it. It's not my fault the devs didn't care enough to put it in ME3. Or how about they add it the first time you talk to Liara instead of after an optional side mission or in optional DLC.

Pretty much everything in Mass Effect is optional, Even playing the game is optional

That doesn't mean you should ignore facts about a game that you are currently having a debate about