4643 réponses à ce sujet

[Medhia Nox]

@eluvianix: Yeah, but... then we've got them both battling demons in the Fade!

That's like... win - win - win.

And just think of how funny it would be for a demon to possess a mage in the Fade - but realize, damnit, I'm still in the Fade! Nooooooooo! All that worldly experience - missed, and you're still stuck in a skin sack.

Gah, are you looking for a peaceful solution you derned hippy?

[Hellion Rex]

almostinsane99 wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

I don't think that the Inquisition should suffer from helping either party at times. Full on support, yes, I could see some consequences down the line. I will probably be supporting both mages and templars during this game, and I would really hope to not have to worry about game altering consequences while I try to prevent both groups from full on warfare with each AND trying to patch the Veil back up, which to be honest, I don't think will be possible.

This. I plan on supporting sane Templars and Mages in order to brook a peace and fix the Veil so the world doesn't end.

Thing is, I am not entirely sure the game will end with the Veil being sealed. I could totally see the Veil being brought down in its entirety.
Edit: I would honestly not mind if it ends in either direction.

Modifié par eluvianix, 17 décembre 2013 - 08:23 .

[Medhia Nox]

@eluvianix: Wouldn't that suggest that the Inquisition failed?

If I have to play another failed protagonist - I will be most displeased.

[Hellion Rex]

Medhia Nox wrote...

@eluvianix: Wouldn't that suggest that the Inquisition failed?

If I have to play another failed protagonist - I will be most displeased.

I guess it kind of would be a failing of the Inquisition. Nonetheless, I would be interested to know what the world would be like with no Veil left at all.

[Medhia Nox]

@eluvianix: I wouldn't. Other people's ideas given form are not what I call a place I'd like to live.

I prefer the fact that people need to struggle to manifest their ideas in the real world - and "manifesting" in the real world doesn't involve the actual formation of a separate entity.

[Senya]

Medhia Nox wrote...

@eluvianix: Yeah, but... then we've got them both battling demons in the Fade!

That's like... win - win - win.

And just think of how funny it would be for a demon to possess a mage in the Fade - but realize, damnit, I'm still in the Fade! Nooooooooo! All that worldly experience - missed, and you're still stuck in a skin sack.

Gah, are you looking for a peaceful solution you derned hippy?

Give peace a chance, man! :innocent:

[Medhia Nox]

@almostinsane99: What am I gonna do with my ARMY then?

I asked in another thread if I could be an Orleasian cheese maker and I was hit with a resounding NO.

So... war it is.

[Hellion Rex]

Medhia Nox wrote...

@eluvianix: I wouldn't. Other people's ideas given form are not what I call a place I'd like to live.

I prefer the fact that people need to struggle to manifest their ideas in the real world - and "manifesting" in the real world doesn't involve the actual formation of a separate entity.

With the Veil breaking entirely, we have no idea what will happen. Would the Fade cease to exist, or would it mix immediately with reality? We have no clue if people will be able to manifest their dreams and ideas into the physical world at all. From what Yavanna said, there was a time before the Veil was erected, which makes me think it was a man made construction. She said that dragons ruled the skies. That is the world I wish to see.

[Medhia Nox]

@eluvianix: You want to see giant fire breathing monsters ruling the skies?

Geeze, no wonder you don't want just the Templars and Mages annihilated.

Clearly I was thinking too small for eluvianix... you want everyone wiped out.

[Hellion Rex]

Medhia Nox wrote...

@eluvianix: You want to see giant fire breathing monsters ruling the skies?

Geeze, no wonder you don't want just the Templars and Mages annihilated.

Clearly I was thinking too small for eluvianix... you want everyone wiped out.

They should all burn.

Modifié par eluvianix, 17 décembre 2013 - 08:58 .

[Medhia Nox]

Well then:

Inquisitor: Dear Diary, I heard tell the story of Hawke, the so called Champion of Kirkwall. Well, most of the story was about how much a tool Hawke was - was Hawke a boy or girl, the story never says, wierd! -

Anyway diary - the beginning talked about a woman named Flemeth. Flemeth's this hot old lady with big boobs - maybe it's Loghain the Ferelden war hero turned traitor in drag, I dunno - but anyway - Flemeth could also turn into a dragon.

I'd like to be a dragon so very much diary!

I'll need to go see Flemeth before this Veil thing comes totally down and dragon's rule the skies.

[Master Warder Z_]

dragonflight288 wrote...

Now if you had seen that sword of mercy on a normal templar striking down a civilian with out cause your point would have merit but the Red Templars? No they are no longer worthy of bearing the mantle of being a templar, at the very least they have been consumed by their desire to stop the mages that they have forgone the loss of their humanity and in essence the very thing they are supposed to strive keeping the common masses from being exposed to.

Ah, but there IS an example of normal templars killing non-mages, and it's in Act 3 of DA2. Ser Mettin and the Templar Death Squad, authorized by Meredith to purge mage sympathizers and supporters.

If you support the templars you have the quest The Last Holdouts, and there are these letters.

We narrowly escaped Meredith's hounds. The city just isn't safe, Bancroft. We must get five out through the gates tonight and get to the caves. It's that, or risk capture and interrogation.

-"MS"

Casualties

The hounds nabbed Franke the Cobbler tonight; no one knows where he is now. Thom Beshcal and his wife were killed three days back. They're no longer just hunting us: they're hunting our friends and family. To the Void with the consequences! We must strike back while we still can.

-"A"

I can get two out tonight. A guide on the other side will take them to the refuge. Don't pick anyone with a cold; last time, a careless sneeze almost alerted the guard.

-Bancroft

Shipping Notice

We can't trust the raiders' promise of passage - the templar's bounty on us is far too tempting. Press on every contact you have! We must leave Kirkwall before the knight-commander does something drastic. Each night, more of our brethren make it to the coast.

If the hounds sniff out your current location, the other site we discussed is clear. Be prepared to leave at a moment's notice.

-Bancroft

And then on Sundermount, Mettin pretty much demands to kill all the non-mages who supported or assisted the mages.

Wheras if you side with Orsino and get A Noble Agenda quest, where Ser Mettin is leading a Death Squad of templars killing non-mages who either support or are related to the mages, which corroborates with the letters above if you're pro-templar. who have not acted hostile to the templars. And I found out something interesting. If you haven't completed Follower's of She bandits when you go to protect Ser Marlein, you have to fight templars.

There is quite clearly a reason templars are losing popularity. They aren't targeting mages only, and they are no longer seen as defenders of the people, especially when they're slaughtering innocents in broad daylight (at least in Kirkwall) without reprisal or punishment.

Whether or not this reflects on all templars attitudes, it does reflect upon all templars in the eyes of the people. Who's more trustworthy? The men in armor using the Sword of Mercy as a crest, slaughtering them left and right as they imbibe red lyrium, or the mages who have declared their independence and are likely practicing blood magic? How many supporters do the Red Templars have among the Blue Templars (colorcoded based on their lyrium use) and vice-versa?

Fact is, templars are killing non-mages indiscriminately and seemingly without justification for the majority of people Most of them won't differentiate between a red templar and a blue one. All they'll see is the armor, just like when people look at mages, all they'll see is the possibility of blood magic or an abomination. Templars cannot be called defenders any more. Not as a group at least. There will be individuals, but as a whole they will be seen just as bad as many see the mages.

Indiscriminately and with out justification you say?

Harboring Apostates, Consorting with Blood Mages, If i am not mistaken those are CRIMES within Thedas.

You can agrue that them equating to the death sentence may be harsh to me? Espeically during War time and the Period in Kirkwall being questioned that the Templars had every right to be using the methods of execution given to them by divine right.

So slaughtering mages, mage colaberators and apostates will not garner any sympathy and if you recall the entire game you here of how Meridith was supported near universially by the Nobility for her acts of stability and that only began to erode when she interfered in the process of replacing the viscount not because her actions against the mages.

So if these are the best of your crimes against the templars then you already conjecture and subjective agrument loses even more steam in my eye.

You cannot declare war upon the templars and expect them not to do the same, and that was exactly what the Mage underground did when they started breaking mages out of the circle.

[SgtSteel91]

I figure harboring a Blood Mage would be a sever crime punishable with death, but would harboring an Apostate really be punishable with death? Like if the Templars found Malcom, would they execute Leiandra? Would they have killed Hawke who objects to having Bethany taken away if Beth didn't come willingly? Or would they be put in jail?

Modifié par SgtSteel91, 17 décembre 2013 - 11:35 .

[Hellion Rex]

SgtSteel91 wrote...

I figure harboring a Blood Mage would be a sever crime punishable with death, but would harboring an Apostate really be punishable with death? Like if the Templars found Malcom, would they execute Leiandra? Would they have killed Hawke who objects to having Bethany taken away if Beth didn't come willingly? Or would they be put in jail?

It does seem a tad harsh. Templars only have a standing order to kill known maleficarum on sight. Otherwise, they take Apostates to the nearest Circle. There was no reason to do anything to those who were harboring apostates.

Modifié par eluvianix, 17 décembre 2013 - 11:40 .

[Reaverwind]

SgtSteel91 wrote...

I figure harboring a Blood Mage would be a sever crime punishable with death, but would harboring an Apostate really be punishable with death? Like if the Templars found Malcom, would they execute Leiandra? Would they have killed Hawke who objects to having Bethany taken away if Beth didn't come willingly? Or would they be put in jail?

I don't know, but we are talking about a world where certain types of theft are punishable by hanging. In that light, executing collaborators isn't that extreme.

[SgtSteel91]

eluvianix wrote...

SgtSteel91 wrote...

I figure harboring a Blood Mage would be a sever crime punishable with death, but would harboring an Apostate really be punishable with death? Like if the Templars found Malcom, would they execute Leiandra? Would they have killed Hawke who objects to having Bethany taken away if Beth didn't come willingly? Or would they be put in jail?

It does seem a tad harsh. Templars only have a standing order to kill known maleficarum on sight. Otherwise, they take Apostates to the nearest Circle. There was no reason to do anything to those who were harboring apostates.

Oh so they were? Yeah, that seems really too harsh.

[SgtSteel91]

Reaverwind wrote...
I don't know, but we are talking about a world where certain types of theft are punishable by hanging. In that light, executing collaborators isn't that extreme.

Eh, I figure it's hanging if you steal from a jerkass Noble who usually makes those rules.

Modifié par SgtSteel91, 17 décembre 2013 - 11:45 .

[TEWR]

Harboring Apostates, Consorting with Blood Mages, If i am not mistaken those are CRIMES within Thedas.

Not punishable by death however, per Chantry law.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Rly if laws screw me in a** i don't see reason why i should follow that i don't see why mages should follow that as well ignoring that 85 % of mages wouldn't beat spider and are weak whiny bi** i don't see reason why strong should follow that.I doubt that many of our population would agree to live mages live when there is 1000 rules to kill you or just turn into zombie skipping that fanatics that hate you have almost absolute control over your life.I would do that what anders did just for myself and don't even bother with excuses.      

[DKJaigen]

Master Warder Z wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

SgtSteel91 wrote...

I'm just going to wait until Inquisition comes out and see how all of this plays out before I start coming up with ideas on how to bring back / change the system.

Pretty much

I have an idea on what I would do if I had complete control, but since I do not wlIm gonna wait and see what we get.

Well this is little besides speculation and headcannon at the moment, although i personally think i would be slightly disapointed if you cannot brutally put down the rebellion and drag the surviving refuse back to the various circles.

I hope you can. and then the game over cutscenes should roll as the templar and mundanes armies are simply overwhelmed by demons. And then at the  execution of your inquisitor the one that orchestrated the events will mock you for being such an usefull tool for him. By default i cannot support the templars because they are idiots who are likely manipulated,

[TheKomandorShepard]

DKJaigen wrote...

Master Warder Z wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

SgtSteel91 wrote...

I'm just going to wait until Inquisition comes out and see how all of this plays out before I start coming up with ideas on how to bring back / change the system.

Pretty much

I have an idea on what I would do if I had complete control, but since I do not wlIm gonna wait and see what we get.

Well this is little besides speculation and headcannon at the moment, although i personally think i would be slightly disapointed if you cannot brutally put down the rebellion and drag the surviving refuse back to the various circles.

I hope you can. and then the game over cutscenes should roll as the templar and mundanes armies are simply overwhelmed by demons. And then at the  execution of your inquisitor the one that orchestrated the events will mock you for being such an usefull tool for him. By default i cannot support the templars because they are idiots who are likely manipulated,

I don't see how few hundreds of mages that lost every their battle would help not mentioning that they would be first who start turn into abomnation.Templars are trained to fight demons (well but they aren't very competent) but still better to fight with them than mages and well yes they are idiot but going that way it will be always loose-loose scenario so i guess realism in that case will be pushed under the bed.   

Modifié par TheKomandorShepard, 17 décembre 2013 - 11:56 .

[Master Warder Z_]

DKJaigen wrote...

Master Warder Z wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

SgtSteel91 wrote...

I'm just going to wait until Inquisition comes out and see how all of this plays out before I start coming up with ideas on how to bring back / change the system.

Pretty much

I have an idea on what I would do if I had complete control, but since I do not wlIm gonna wait and see what we get.

Well this is little besides speculation and headcannon at the moment, although i personally think i would be slightly disapointed if you cannot brutally put down the rebellion and drag the surviving refuse back to the various circles.

I hope you can. and then the game over cutscenes should roll as the templar and mundanes armies are simply overwhelmed by demons. And then at the  execution of your inquisitor the one that orchestrated the events will mock you for being such an usefull tool for him. By default i cannot support the templars because they are idiots who are likely manipulated,

That's pure lunancy and your usage of the racial slur "Mundane" tells where your own personal alleigance lies.

Let me guess you think an army of soft robes that lack combat expreince and tactical awareness would do better? espeically fighting against opponents that can possess them hrm?

I do believe this is one of those situations where speaking your own opinion merely resulted in the person just ignoring it.

And i could agrue the same for the mages considering Anders was Possessed and Justice very easily could have been taking orders once it become a demon.

:/

Circular logic is a two edged sword.

[SgtSteel91]

I'm going to wait until Inquisition comes out before saying if Mages or Templars are going to get crushed by the other side.

[Hazegurl]

Random topic:

If there was a Genophage like shroud planted in Thedas that would take away the magic of everyone in the world would you use it? If so why? If not why?

If the side effects of "curing" magic was that former mages develop shorter life spans would you still do it?

The same question in reverse.

If there was a Genophage like shroud planted in Thedas that would give magic to everyone in the world would you use it? If so why? If not why?

If the side effects of "curing" mundanes was that former mundanes develop shorter life spans would you still do it?

If you had to choose, which one is the better option?

Ideally I would never want to make such a choice but if left with no choice but to choose then I think the world would be better off long term if magic was taken away. At least the world would be able to focus on advancing without it. The part of me that loves playing mages would choose to give magic to everyone and say screw the mundanes.

[SgtSteel91]

Everyone being at risk of demon possession would be a pretty big point against turing everyone into mages. Maybe it would force everyone to research demonic possession preventions that are beyond tranquility. Maybe we get an apocalypse were abominations rule Thedas.

Modifié par SgtSteel91, 18 décembre 2013 - 12:09 .