169 réponses à ce sujet

[valium]

pugs are grossly unreliable, and often more frustrating than fun.

[Dunvi]

You've manged to pick basically the 3 characters I throw out of balance discussions as completely pointlessly broken.

erezike wrote...

There are few ulities.
Heavy weapons - The turian Soldier, as a bigger damage Potential if he can maintain his fire rate.
The turian soldier has a 30% higher headshot, 20% less damage,  higher accuracy, 25% faster fire rate, 55% stability. free clip exchange, debuff mine for the good of the time
Max damage=

Two things here. (a) The TSol is top on my list of "potentially the most overbuffed character in the entire freaking game. ( Mine debuff removes the RoF, accuracy, and part of the headshot bonuses due to the cooldown interference, reducing uptime from ~60% to significantly worse.

The destroyer has better additive bonuses and a lower RoF bonus - these combine so that, before consumables, the difference in their weapon bonus is <10%. His accuracy bonus is only 10% less, and he has these bonuses 100% of the time.

With consumables and perfect headshots, TSol will pull ahead, and QMS will also pass the destroyer due to greater RoF bonus, but the QMS has some major, major defensive weaknesses to the destroyer, and the TSol is also weaker than the destroyer defensively, as well as overbuffed IMO.

they have the same mobility,

Incorrect. Without missiles, even a fully offensively specced destroyer has better combined health/shields, better shields (which are more important due to regeneration mechanics), and stagger immunity, as well as better benefit from cyclonics, than the tsol. He also has the possibility of sacrificing some of his damage for even higher shields and shield regen. After destroyer and tsol, next best defensive character is full defensive hsol, and GTrooper.

the destroyer is harder to knock,
the destroyer has omg emergency(grenades), can go glass canon for stagger. and a faster shield recovery, bigger clips, can carry two weapons of choice for better performance

Destroyer has much, much better power performance, as you even point out.

When using weapons with big clips the turian has the potential to output the destroyer.

With continuous fire (large clips) the destroyer may actually come out better due to 100% uptime on his damage bonuses and stagger immunity. I would say damagewise, both are fairly out of balance, but the destroyer has immensely better defense.

The turian ghost, a Different playstyle than the destroyer.  can spam a powerful overload,  stims packs
Goes around reviving team mates and getting objectives. has powerful burst attack.

not as good as the destroyer or the turian soldier for long term dps.
but more than makes up to it by picking his targets. and spending a lot
of time picking targets with the scope.

TGI is so broken he should go die in a crockpot. Yes, TGI is better for burst damage. TGI is one of the very, very highest potential kits in the entire game, and you cannot use him being better than the destroyer as an argument for the destroyer needing a buff, because you are ignoring the fact that the destroyer is better than >11/12ths of the kits in the game.

geth infiltrator - glass canon. highest burst dps.

GI is broken too (HM should have been a damage taken modifier instead of an additive shield penalty, Tactical Cloak is a candidate for the most broken power in the game, even after the nerfs). See above argument.

can shoot enemies through walls with proper mods.

All characters can do this, especially with the recent addition of the geth scanner.

I used to have a lot of fun with the destroyer, right now I think there a better options when it comes to shooting.

I'm not going to argue whether you find him fun, because I think he's potentially the most boring kit in the entire game. But there are few options better for pure shooting DPS - infiltrators for burst DPS, the two marksman classes if you don't mind loosing tankiness and are using consumables (negligable difference before consumables). HSol has significantly lower DPS and is all additive, GTrooper has a multiplicative bonus but significantly smaller unless you are using geth weapons, and signficantly lower base bonuses.

Firerate dependent classes takes the harder hit when you don't have consumables for better damage output. this is also an hindrance. could still play him easily on gold without consumeables if you have a low level saber and a reegar. it will just be more effective to play other classes.

On the contrary, even before consumables, the destroyer only trails infiltrators and the TSol for sheer weapons DPS, and he has better defense than most infiltrators and all soldiers, and 100% uptime on these bonuses.

And again, the TSol got ridiculously overbuffed in my opinion.


ETA: Basically, if you want to say that you don't like playing the destroyer, go ahead. I'll agree with you. I hate playing the destroyer, I'm not sure anyone on my friends list has ever seen me touch him once. But he's not even remotely weak, he is in fact one of the best kits in the game still.

Modifié par Dunvi, 20 juin 2013 - 12:53 .

[Caldari Ghost]

because they deserve worse.

[AleHanSolo]

they take too damn long and are not worth the equipment used

[121210Olivia]

AleHanSolo wrote...

they take too damn long and are not worth the equipment used

A wee tad harsh! Thinking of them as spawn space-buffers or bullet sponges sometimes helps !

[parico]

because lately pugs are either terrible, leaching, or playing a difficulty they can't handle so I have to solo half the game.

[Moby]

Cirvante wrote...

MofuggerX wrote...

erezike wrote...

It seems to me that those who are dissapointed with not finishing a gold match or it taking too long have a different view on things from the casual pug player.

While the casual player plays mostly for the fun, comradery and to enjoy the mass effect universe a bit more.

those who simply play to gain new weapons, new equipment and more n7 points and have no fun with the random factor and the harder challange which comes with playing with players you do not know should stick to the safe familiar options of fixed matches.

Exactly.

I don't get how OP thinks that all PUGs are "casual gamers" playing for fun, when over ninety percent of PUGs are in fact playing to gain better equipment.  Which are the players OP claims don't have fun with this game.

I'm starting to think this is just a troll thread, particularly after reading Dunvi getting egged on.

[SeaSquared]

 I dunno bout the PC neo-**** skinheads but on xbox I find that at this point in the games life cycle most PUGs are fairly competent and a fairly good % are actually rather skilled and cooperative.

silver and bronze are mostly either total noobs or casuals who dont like/can't handle challenge but by now have good enough gear that they can play the lower difficulties decently. ironically I have an easier time in gold than silver/bronze (played for a few rounds after a fresh promotion) due to higer quality teammates.

[Titus Thongger]

pc pugs have been pretty decent of late I find.

[JaimasOfRaxis]

On platinum, 65% of the Pugs I run into are leeches.

[FuriousFelicia]

Noooo
We are all pugs after all...BSN pugs culd be considered better than others but that is not tbe general rule

[mybudgee]

I loves me some PuGs

[TheTechnoTurian]

I don't hate pugs, but I'll admit I'm more of a cat person.

Ok, someone's probably already made that crappy joke

I have no strong opinions one way or another on playing with randoms. I think more of my games have failed due to terrible lag than terrible team mates, though.

Modifié par ReaperRed, 20 juin 2013 - 08:03 .

[Samerandomscreennameidontcareabout]

erezike wrote...

 Its rare to see a pug gold/silver game which doesnt end in extraction if you have at least two decent players in the game.

I agree. Also, you ended up in a PUG with me yesterday. You played the Turian Ghost, if I remember right. Also, we don´t hate PUGs. We do hate stupid PUGs. Big difference.

[LoneWolf3905]

phunkeybuddha wrote...



ME3 pugs - you will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious.

I lol'ed.

[Daforth]

BSN hate on PUGs is hypocrate. In reality, BSN loooves PUGs, because without PUGs there were no reason to brag, showooff, epeen, post score pictures, open a lot of threads about bad PUGs to entertain themselves.

[LoneWolf3905]

OPs. Some days, PUGs are so bad, I question why I even play MP.

[Erez Kristal]

ReaperRed wrote...

I don't hate pugs, but I'll admit I'm more of a cat person.

its still a funny joke :happy:

Dunvi wrote...

You've manged to pick basically the 3 characters I throw out of balance discussions as completely pointlessly broken.

Does that mean i picked well? :-)

Thanks for making valid points about the destroyer. that other post  i made never got that far.
I compared the ghost and geth inft, because they are both good with guns. and playing with fun guns is what the destroyer is all about.

the turian ghost is a mixer, has more dps potential but less survivability, it depends on how you want to play. i feel his ability to have a better dps output with good gear due to faster fire rate, stability and accuracy has higher potential. 
But i prefer the infiltrators to the turian soldier since they have more cool factor.

Just like the destroyer has a more cool factor than the regular soldier.

Pugs are fun, sure sometimes you will have a hard match.  not knowing what you are getting yourself into is part of what is so interesting about a coop pug. 

I like to play against the reapers the most because its the most immersive-war related. and if you are at war not everyone are going to be great heroes like wrex or grunt.

Modifié par erezike, 20 juin 2013 - 02:16 .

[Jeremiah12LGeek]

erezike wrote...

It seems to me that those who are dissapointed with not finishing a gold match or it taking too long have a different view on things from the casual pug player.
While the casual player plays mostly for the fun, comradery and to enjoy the mass effect universe a bit more.

Uh.... Why is the casual player in your example going into Gold, before they're ready, then? 

That's not something someone who "plays mostly for the fun, comradery and to enjoy the mass effect universe a bit more," should be doing.

[MichaelFinnegan]

erezike wrote...

 Its rare to see a pug gold/silver game which doesnt end in extraction if you have at least two decent players in the game.

I've exclusively PUG'ed till now. Probably a thousand or two PUG Gold games later, I can only say that running with PUGs isn't bad, if I choose wisely which ones I want to join (noting of course that that is not always an option). Nowadays I take it as they come - extraction rate isn't that bad.