130 réponses à ce sujet

[Grumpy Old Wizard]

Deerber wrote...

Anyway, I wonder how many of those who say "it's because I want to play a biotic the way it's supposed to be played!" ever played ME1...

The biotics actually had decent crowd control in ME1.  AND the biotics were quite fun, what with throwing everything all over the map and launching enemies into orbit.   Now they have subpar damage comapred to shooty classes and crowd control that mostly does not control crowds. The ME1 abilities were more fun.

Modifié par Grumpy Old Wizard, 18 juin 2013 - 07:49 .

[Beerfish]

I try to max out all my biotic bonuses possible for some classes such as the huntress. Biotic amp on weapon, commando gear, power bonus IV. Only the numbers dudes/dudettes could tell me if it is worth it but I at least delude myself into thinking that my dark channel is working much faster and more effiecient. I take the power bonus builds for passives on a lot of classes.

[sobit]

Deerber wrote...

Cyonan wrote...

It's because they want to play them as a caster and don't care about being optimal.

I think it's more about the fact that they have no clue how this game mechanics work and/or didn't care to spend two minutes thinking about the numbers.

For the most of them.

Then for some, it's surely as you say.

when I started playing MP, I didn't even know about BE's. And when I got to know there was not a single line of text ingame saying that power damage doesn't affect BE's. So don't go saying we "didn't care to spend two minutes thinking about the numbers". I had to spend hours on this board to get to understand how all the damage sources work.

From that pov: It's because the game is so incredibly poorly documented from an official site.

Apart from that: TSent TA makes legit use of power damage and Kroguard with high power damage, low cooldowns and the no-cooldown-evo can do a lot of damage with charge.

Or you just want the additional cooldown boni.

[Kushiel42]

RedJohn wrote...

I don't understand why some people spec ... Krogan Shaman some other Characters that are not really power dependant. It's just out of my comprehension, can you help me to understand?

Can you explain me why?

Barrier-focused builds.
Could also try the same on the Battlemaster...hmm...

[DrasticKirbus]

Cyonan wrote...

Iz Stoik zI wrote...

Serious question from a noob here, does +power damage not increase the damage of biotic explosions? It seems like a stat that would help out the Fury quite a bit but maybe I'm wrong.

Either way my interesting weapons (i.e. PPR, Hurricane, Typhoon, Piranha etc.) are mostly around level 1-4 right now so on some classes I'd rather play around with their powers than just fire my guns all day long. Personal preference though.

Power damage does not increase any combo damage, including BEs.

Though the usefullness of weapon damage at rank 4 is being pretty overstated in this thread.

Doesn't power damage get applied after the combo, assuming the target lives?  In that case, can't you make the argument that power damage does, in fact, increase combo damage?

[Creator Limbs]

Power damage increases powers. NOT combos.

[FlowCytometry]

DrasticKirbus wrote...

Doesn't power damage get applied after the combo, assuming the target lives?
In that case, can't you make the argument that power damage does, in fact, increase combo damage?

3 parts to a combo: primer power dmg -> detonator power dmg -> combo/explosion dmg. Power bonuses would up the dmg of the primer and detonator abilities themselves, but the combo/explosion dmg would be unaffected. Since many self-comboing kits have powers with low base dmg, power bonuses don't have much an effect if the combo dmg dwarfs that of the powers used (and often it does).

(ex. base dmg of a warp->throw sequence is ~310; 15% power bonus to that is just 47 extra dmg per sequence.. or about as much as a single bullet from a Tempest 1, to put that in perspective. To compare, a biotic explosion from warp->throw, w/ both powers at rank 6 and w/ both 50% detonate evos would do ~4400 dmg on gold to armor or barrier and ~2200 to everything else)

Beerfish wrote...

I try to max out all my biotic bonuses possible for some classes such as the huntress. Biotic amp on weapon, commando gear, power bonus IV. Only the numbers dudes/dudettes could tell me if it is worth it but I at least delude myself into thinking that my dark channel is working much faster and more effiecient. I take the power bonus builds for passives on a lot of classes.

power builds are quite good for the huntress since she can get so many additive bonuses to it, that also get amped by DC's multiplicative peirce evo to barrier/armor for some massive DoT damage. She can be the bleed queen if ya want her to be.

Collector and PA_PV are also good biotic combo kits that can benefit well from power amps, since they both have a high base power ability (smash, dark sphere) in addition to BEs.

Modifié par FlowCytometry, 19 juin 2013 - 02:05 .

[OniGanon]

Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...

The ME1 abilities were utterly broken and completely trivialised the second half of the game even on Insanity.

FTFY

[Deerber]

sobit wrote...

Deerber wrote...

Cyonan wrote...

It's because they want to play them as a caster and don't care about being optimal.

I think it's more about the fact that they have no clue how this game mechanics work and/or didn't care to spend two minutes thinking about the numbers.

For the most of them.

Then for some, it's surely as you say.

when I started playing MP, I didn't even know about BE's. And when I got to know there was not a single line of text ingame saying that power damage doesn't affect BE's. So don't go saying we "didn't care to spend two minutes thinking about the numbers". I had to spend hours on this board to get to understand how all the damage sources work.

From that pov: It's because the game is so incredibly poorly documented from an official site.

Apart from that: TSent TA makes legit use of power damage and Kroguard with high power damage, low cooldowns and the no-cooldown-evo can do a lot of damage with charge.

Or you just want the additional cooldown boni.

Underlined the part relevant to you  Not necessarily your fault, I totally agree on the documantation being very bad.

Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...

Deerber wrote...

Anyway, I wonder how many of those who say "it's because I want to play a biotic the way it's supposed to be played!" ever played ME1...

The biotics actually had decent crowd control in ME1.  AND the biotics were quite fun, what with throwing everything all over the map and launching enemies into orbit. [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/wizard.png[/smilie]  Now they have subpar damage comapred to shooty classes and crowd control that mostly does not control crowds. The ME1 abilities were more fun.

I don't agree on them having subpar damage at all. I do agree on them having lost some crowd control and I, too, would like to see a change of them back towards how they worked in ME1, cause you're right, they were fun as hell. Only... They would be OP. They would need a lot of working on them.

[Danimals847]

OniGanon wrote...

Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...

The ME1 abilities were utterly broken and completely trivialised the second half of the game even on Insanity.

FTFY

Seriously, with Singularity in ME1 you could walk through Insanity hardly firing a shot or taking any damage. Plus being able to stack Warp from your squad mates on a Singularity + Lifted target then shooting, even the final boss' health dropped like a rock.

[Deerber]

Danimals847 wrote...

OniGanon wrote...

Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...

The ME1 abilities were utterly broken and completely trivialised the second half of the game even on Insanity.

FTFY

Seriously, with Singularity in ME1 you could walk through Insanity hardly firing a shot or taking any damage. Plus being able to stack Warp from your squad mates on a Singularity + Lifted target then shooting, even the final boss' health dropped like a rock.

Well, to be honest, the entire ME1 combat was pretty much unchallening, even on insanity. Biotics, non biotics... Didn't matter much.

[Zero132132]

Rank 4, it's usually more about the weight capacity boost than actual power damage. Rank 5, it's because I suck at headshots anyways, so on most characters, it's more useful to do very slightly more damage with powers than it is to gain essentially nothing from the headshot modifier. And sometimes, it is about force more than power damage.

[UnknownMercenary]

there are plenty of consumables to boost weapon damage, none that boost force thresholds

[Ronnie Blastoff]

UnknownMercenary wrote...

there are plenty of consumables to boost weapon damage, none that boost force thresholds

 Power amplifier mod.

Modifié par Ronnie Blastoff, 19 juin 2013 - 06:13 .

[cato potato]

Ronnie Blastoff wrote...

UnknownMercenary wrote...

there are plenty of consumables to boost weapon damage, none that boost force thresholds

 Power amplifier mod.

Power amp only increases damage not force as far as I know.

[UnknownMercenary]

cato_84 wrote...

Ronnie Blastoff wrote...

UnknownMercenary wrote...

there are plenty of consumables to boost weapon damage, none that boost force thresholds

 Power amplifier mod.

Power amp only increases damage not force as far as I know.

you are correct, it only boosts power damage not force

e: actually I'm probably wrong but I don't care

Modifié par UnknownMercenary, 19 juin 2013 - 08:20 .

[InstaShark]

I'm a seasoned ME3 player and I can honestly say that I prefer power damage evolutions because of the cooldown and force bonuses when it comes to powers like Shockwave, Throw, Biotic Charge, etc.

inb4200%cooldownisnotnecessary

Modifié par InstaShark, 19 juin 2013 - 08:29 .

[corporal doody]

power bonus %s stack. and i can go a whole match without firing my weapon while playing as certain characters. weapon % is a waste.

cranked out DC and Warp can do some serious damage on their own and you cant always get off a BE thanks to jackholes blocking your boomboom....

Modifié par corporal doody, 20 juin 2013 - 04:59 .

[Muhkida]

I usually spec into 4b and 6b for the passive race traits of the majority of my kits, with the exception of those weapons-based classes (like my TSol and Destroyer off the top of my head). 7.5% extra weapon dmg is just insignificant IMO.

Carrying capacity+force > meager weapon dmg. And you can always compensate for that missing 7.5% with consumables and gear. I don't think Force can be adjusted outside of the passive power tree.

[Creator Limbs]

That 7.5% can be the difference between you dead and you alive, though.

[Muhkida]

prostheticlimbs wrote...

That 7.5% can be the difference between you dead and you alive, though.

Not really, at least for me that is.  I'm not trying to go off as being arrogant either.

[Kushiel42]

prostheticlimbs wrote...

That 7.5% can be the difference between you dead and you alive, though.

So can the difference in cooldown times.

[Creator Limbs]

Kushiel42 wrote...

prostheticlimbs wrote...

That 7.5% can be the difference between you dead and you alive, though.

So can the difference in cooldown times.

But the increased carrying capacity isn't in question. The increase in power damage is.

[Kushiel42]

prostheticlimbs wrote...

But the increased carrying capacity isn't in question. The increase in power damage is.

They're not separable, but I'll argue the point anyway.

As Cyonan pointed out upthread using actual numbers which I don't remember and am too lazy to go looking for, the weapon damage probably isn't going to make much of a difference (it was something like 70 dps). So, yes, you're right that it might make the difference between being put down and not, but it's really unlikely to do so...about as likely as the power damage increase is to actually affect gameplay in anything like a consistent manner. Ie, it won't matter enough to worry about.

[BeauRB1229]

Passive tree just isn't that much of a boost on most classes, so largely irrelevant what you choose. The caster classes with good passives mostly either have grenades or rely on explosions, again making it a moot point which evolutions are chosen.