426 réponses à ce sujet

[bEVEsthda]

Nefla wrote...

All signs point to yes, we will always be forced to play as the most boring race:humans. Then one day we will be forced to play one gender: male, (because just as "most people" played as humans, "most people"also play male and warrior) and before you know it we can't customize our character at all and we suddenly have a fixed protagonist.

I think it's pointless to bitterly dwell on such speculations now. It falls into the cathegory of imagined wrongs.

I also think that if Bioware actually takes a route with the DA franchise, where they are making games where that sort of fixed content makes sense to them, then DA is already irrelevant, and so is Bioware. And while it's not certain, I'd guess we will also see them buried then.

Relax, and let's just see what happens to DA.

For the rest, I think the choice of race will depend upon the framework for the story. If it's suitable, to have an experience in the same plot, for a character of a different race, we'll get it. I don't think Bioware are as insensitive to their fans, as to rule out that.

[Plaintiff]

bEVEsthda wrote...
And while it's not certain, I'd guess we will also see them buried then.

LOL, like every other game company that made fixed human protagonists?

[PinkShoes]

Plaintiff wrote...

PinkShoes wrote...

Its sad because its so boring to play a human all the time. Like think about it usually when playing d&d you wanna play other races because its fun to.

I find this argument fairly absurd. If playing other races is "more fun", then how come so few games have black, Asian, or Middle Eastern protagonists? Would the white majority not flock to the novelty of playing another race?

Why are elves and dwarves special? What function do they actually perform that could not be fulfilled by humans?

Because whats the difference between a white and black person?  Nothing apart form the colour of their skin. When you play a different race like an elf you got to see what their lives are like, from a roleplay point of view its way more fun to play as a dalish elf because what do we know about them? Humans are so easy to relate to because we are humans thats why when you play a fantsay game its FUN to be something you arent.

[bEVEsthda]

Plaintiff wrote...

bEVEsthda wrote...
And while it's not certain, I'd guess we will also see them buried then.

LOL, like every other game company that made fixed human protagonists?

I have often thought that you could do well, with carefully reading the posts you comment, and try to understand the context and the message.

There are many games with a fixed human protagonist, yes. But you have no point. Bioware would have to build up a completely new foundation, if, for example, they're serious to do some FPS that competes with CoD and Half Life.
They can possibly do that. But they can't use DA for it. DA would ensure a failure, as the emergent game would be received as a scandal, with very poor reputation.

[Jonata]

It is the second game in the series that force on you a Human protagonist, but I think it's pretty safe to assume that it's simply their way of doing things right now and it's not going to change anytime soon. They have this typical mix of canon PC (with VA and all) customizable on the edges since the first Mass Effect and probably right now that is becoming the "BioWare way" of making RPGs.

It does make me sad, but it's not like we can do something about it. It was pretty great to enjoy other races in DA:O but after all it's not like there are many fantasy RPGs out there that let's you play another race after all.

[Plaintiff]

Ponendus wrote...
I think its about roleplaying, not about 'function'. I don't know many people expect to have an exclusively elven or dwarven protagonist, that would be silly because the statistics tell us the majority of the playerbase play a human even when they have the option. That doesn't make the option pointless though.

Also quite a few games (particularly MMO's) allow you to customise your skin colour and features to create a character that appears of black, assian or middle easter descent as you suggest. How popular this is, I'm not sure.

I find it fun to play other races in a fantasy setting, mainly because there is often a backstory quite far removed from what we experience as humans in the real world. However, I acknowledge not everybody roleplays that way, or at all really!

My point is that the assertion that elves and dwarves are "more fun" or "more interesting" than humans is pretty narrow-minded. It blatantly ignores the fact that, in both Dragon Age and real life, "humanity" covers many distinct cultures that are just as capable of offering "different perspectives" as Elves and Dwarves are, if not more so.

Elves and dwarves only differ from humans in a purely cosmetic sense. There is no substantial narrative reason for them to exist as species distinct from humanity. The "Dalish" could just as easily be a group of disenfranchised humans who've been reduced to a nomadic lifestyle, Orzammar could just as easily be populated by a culture of isolationist humans who employ a strict class system. Nothing about either of these cultures says that they must be a wholly alien species.

Personally, I find dwarves and elves more boring than humans, because, thanks to laziness and lack of imagination on the part of writers, they're in every single fantasy franchise, and they never differ in any substantial way from the standards laid down by Tolkien and Norse mythology. It has reached the point where I'll immediatly pass over any fantasy that includes elves or dwarves. I only barely tolerate them in Dragon Age, and even then, the elves and dwarves are ridiculously bland and homogenous compared to the many distinct cultures that comprise the supposedly "boring" humans of Thedas.

I strongly suspect that the reason elves and dwarves are seen as "more interesting" is because there is an underlying assumption that "human" means "straight white male".

[Plaintiff]

PinkShoes wrote...
Because whats the difference between a white and black person?

You seriously need to ask how the lives of black and white people are different? Seriously?

Nothing apart form the colour of their skin. When you play a different race like an elf you got to see what their lives are like, from a roleplay point of view its way more fun to play as a dalish elf because what do we know about them? Humans are so easy to relate to because we are humans thats why when you play a fantsay game its FUN to be something you arent.

The minute I see any elf in any fantasy, I know exactly what they're like. It's not fun, it's boring and it sucks.

What would be fun is a fantasy that doesn't shamelessly rip of Tolkien's work and takes its inspiration from something other than Norse myhtology and Arthurian legend. Or better yet, it could try to create some original creatures to populate its world.

At the very, very least, they could at least call the elves something else.

Modifié par Plaintiff, 23 juin 2013 - 11:56 .

[Plaintiff]

bEVEsthda wrote...
I have often thought that you could do well, with carefully reading the posts you comment, and try to understand the context and the message.

I could've picked any other sentence in your post, they all expressed the same sentiment.

There are many games with a fixed human protagonist, yes. But you have no point. Bioware would have to build up a completely new foundation, if, for example, they're serious to do some FPS that competes with CoD and Half Life.

Because FPS and RPG are the only videogame genres that exist, and removing race selection means Dragon Age can't possibly be an RPG.

They can possibly do that. But they can't use DA for it. DA would ensure a failure, as the emergent game would be received as a scandal, with very poor reputation.

Since nothing they've done indicates any such change in direction, this is all moot.

[Urazz]

Ser Bard wrote...

IMO yes, other races will only be available in multiplayer.

That's if they do multiplayer.

Sadly, I don't think they are going to allow people to pick different races anymore unless they decide to stop doing a voiced protagonist or if they somehow get a ton of money for doing 6 kinds of voices for the protagonist for the entire game.

[bEVEsthda]

Plaintiff wrote...

bEVEsthda wrote...
I have often thought that you could do well, with carefully reading the posts you comment, and try to understand the context and the message.

I could've picked any other sentence in your post, they all expressed the same sentiment.

"I also think that if  Bioware actually takes a route with the DA franchise, where they are making games where that sort of fixed content makes sense to them..."

There are many games with a fixed human protagonist, yes. But you have no point. Bioware would have to build up a completely new foundation, if, for example, they're serious to do some FPS that competes with CoD and Half Life.

Because FPS and RPG are the only videogame genres that exist, and removing race selection means Dragon Age can't possibly be an RPG.

An example, chosen for clarity.

Race selection is already removed for DA:I. My point was that nothing sofar indicates that DA will be the kind of games where this will always be a necessary feature.

They can possibly do that. But they can't use DA for it. DA would ensure a failure, as the emergent game would be received as a scandal, with very poor reputation.

Since nothing they've done indicates any such change in direction, this is all moot.

See how you hack everything up. Into little pieces of a few words, where you then make irrelevant comments, which don't concern the context.
And yes, it is moot, which was the point of my original post. Maybe it'll be clear to you if you reread it.

Modifié par bEVEsthda, 23 juin 2013 - 11:57 .

[Jerrybnsn]

That would be great again, but, like many other things that we want, it won't happen. So long as they are sticking with the voiced PC (which is all but confirmed that they will never go back to a silent protagonist), and so long as they would adhere to their own rules on what certain races sound like, then I can't see it happening.

[Little Princess Peach]

mp will get all the attention and the main game will suffer for it

[bEVEsthda]

Tharja wrote...

mp will get all the attention and the main game will suffer for it

They have publicly stated the opposite at E3. The focus is/will be heavily on the single player experience.

Modifié par bEVEsthda, 23 juin 2013 - 12:11 .

[Plaintiff]

Yes, multiplayer is getting so much attention that they've told us nothing at all about it.

[Jerrybnsn]

A multiplayer of mages against templars?  Can dwarves and elves be templars?

Modifié par Jerrybnsn, 23 juin 2013 - 12:11 .

[Plaintiff]

DA:I's "multiplayer" will consist solely of a group voice chat where we can all log on and physically yell at each other in real time about the same things we "discuss" here.

"Operation: 'Retake Elven Lands?' starts in..."

Modifié par Plaintiff, 23 juin 2013 - 12:11 .

[Jerrybnsn]

Plaintiff wrote...

DA:I's "multiplayer" will consist solely of a group voice chat where we can all log on and physically yell at each other in real time about the same things we "discuss" here.

"Operation: 'Retake Elven Lands?' starts in..."

I thought this was multiplayer?

[Thetford]

Jerrybnsn wrote...

That would be great again, but, like many other things that we want, it won't happen. So long as they are sticking with the voiced PC (which is all but confirmed that they will never go back to a silent protagonist), and so long as they would adhere to their own rules on what certain races sound like, then I can't see it happening.

The races don't have any unique accents, it's the locations, it's just that the locations we have witnessed so far tended to play host to one race exclusively. Migration and interaction between the masses of Ferelden and Orzammar, the the accents remain as separate to each other as it would between Ferelden and Orlais.

Likewise, the Dalish Elves live in seclusion and remain in a sort of cultural quarantine, knowing only mutual hostility with humans, which has some vague similarities (whether intentional or not) with modern Irish travellers, who like the Dalish, live a somewhat nomadic life in Britain, facing tensions among the local resident population with limited contact, which has helped even the children keep their Irish(-ish) accents.

This is further evidenced by elves, dwarves and humans who have each others accents, and accents from other lands (Zephran of Antiva being the most notable example) and Kate Mulgrew doesn't even bother to put on an accent (it is a work of fiction guys). I'd like to see it that surface dwarves and city elves (at least from second or third generation onwards) gain the accent of the surrounding human populace.

So what accent the protagnist has means diddly squat what race they are, just where they are from. Provided that all three (or more if they decide to add any) are stated to come from the same area, whether it's Ferelden, Orlais or the knicker drawer of the Black Divine, it doesn't matter if the same voice actor is used for three races - you are only going to be playing one at a time. Instead, the issue of voiced protagonists is just a scapegoat reason for their issues with a lack of racial choices (or vice versa, as the case may be).

[Jerrybnsn]

Bodahn is the only dwarf I can recalled that had an British accent. Yet he only just recently left Orzammar because of a noble house being upset with him and his wares he found in the Deep Roads (where he also found Sandal). And Sandal had a British accent in Origins, but not in DA2?

[Angrywolves]

Frank Gibeau EAVP requires mutiplayer. Not true to hint otherwise.
They claim to be busy on sp but they'll get around to mp eventually.
Obvious we will be stuck as humans in sp from now on. Much cheaper for Bioware.

[Harle Cerulean]

As others have said, devs have stated that multiple races is still a possibility for future games, but I strongly suspect "possibility" means exactly the same thing as it meant for DA:I - they'll "consider" it briefly and decide against it, for "story reasons."

[Teddie Sage]

They could always include some RPG-like co-op like the SWTOR mmo and allow other players to join in as their own character, switching dimensions to go help their friends or whatever... Bad idea. Would be fun, but nah. I'm just getting random ideas as I think about a co-op DA.

[Black Jimmy]

 Possibly. Any race is possible except Dwarf which can't be a mage.
Of course, they could switch out Mage with a Dwarf related Class.
Despite all the yes responses you've seem to get, this hasn't be confirmed and probably won't be out outright stated.
I imagine they haven't dedcided themselves and woin't because they want to decide on what race they'll be when they get to the game.

[Tarek]

meh its a costs/time thing its up to bioware honestly

[PinkShoes]

Plaintiff wrote...

PinkShoes wrote...
Because whats the difference between a white and black person?

You seriously need to ask how the lives of black and white people are different? Seriously?

Nothing apart form the colour of their skin. When you play a different race like an elf you got to see what their lives are like, from a roleplay point of view its way more fun to play as a dalish elf because what do we know about them? Humans are so easy to relate to because we are humans thats why when you play a fantsay game its FUN to be something you arent.

The minute I see any elf in any fantasy, I know exactly what they're like. It's not fun, it's boring and it sucks.

What would be fun is a fantasy that doesn't shamelessly rip of Tolkien's work and takes its inspiration from something other than Norse myhtology and Arthurian legend. Or better yet, it could try to create some original creatures to populate its world.

At the very, very least, they could at least call the elves something else.

Im sorry, im black. I didnt know i live my life differently to other people.