865 réponses à ce sujet

[Fixers0]

Very Soon.

[CrutchCricket]

AlanC9 wrote...

I'm just not convinced that this is the sort of publicity they wanted.

I'm not saying it definitely is. Despite how much I could argue to the contrary, it could be that there really is no "conspiracy" and Bioware simply messed up and tried to make the best of it, in good faith towards the fans. I'm willing to admit that's a possibility.

But the potential for other companies to try and engineer a replication of this incident for their benefit is all too plausible. And the only ones hurt will be us, the gamers.

[dreamgazer]

CrutchCricket wrote...

I don't think casuals check Amazon scores lol. 

Yeah, they do.  At the very least, they pay attention to the star rating next to the game when they're browsing the site. 

[CrutchCricket]

dreamgazer wrote...
Yeah, they do.  At the very least, they pay attention to the star rating next to the game when they're browsing the site. 

Even so what's the last game you know of that's infamous for how bad it is? What's the gaming equivalent of The Room?

I don't think that happens too much in gaming.  Good games get remembered bad games just die.

[Kia Purity]

For me, it was with the PR speak and the devs screaming at us for not understanding the ending.

Uh, yeah, I think that became clear that Bioware went so badly off rails that there was no way to save ME3 much less there being any hope of actually preordering Bioware games again. I'm still tentatively holding out hope for DA3 because the DA3 team seems LESS crazy than the ME team was/is.

But that's probably because Gaider has actually been interacting with people more and letting people know about the progress while ME team is just kind of weirdly out of touch.

[dreamgazer]

CrutchCricket wrote...

Even so what's the last game you know of that's infamous for how bad it is? What's the gaming equivalent of The Room?

Deadly Premonition, maybe?

[Nole]

 You should have lost hope once you saw the ending. Seriously, Bioware doesn't have to change it just because you didn't like it. And, honestly, I'm sick of people claiming that the game and the ending have to be changed, fixed, like they were broken, disfunctional, like when you go to see a movie and the screen goes black 10 minutes before the ending, because, you know what? they haven't. Okey, maybe the game is overall a bad game, maybe the ending is the worst piece of **** in the entire history of the videogames, maybe 9 of 10 people hated the game and the ending. But the game is not broken, it doesn't need to be repaired, as if it were a bad product, a dysfunctional product. Because, if there is one person of ten that liked the ending, then it's not broken, and it doesn't need to be "fixed".

And, seriously, if you hate the game that much, just don't buy more games from Bioware, and enjoy watching them die slowly and painfully because bad sales (?).

[CronoDragoon]

CrutchCricket wrote...
Even so what's the last game you know of that's infamous for how bad it is? What's the gaming equivalent of The Room?

Big Rig Truckers or whatever, Amy. But you are right, it happens less in games.

I don't think that happens too much in gaming.  Good games get remembered bad games just die.

Which brings us back to the question of why generate controversy in the first place. Popularity and quality correlate more strongly in gaming than any other medium, largely because of all the technical aspects of a game that a competent dev has to get right. There is no need to generate controversy when you can just make a quality game instead, which feelings of ME3 aside even most BSNers will agree they are capable of. Like most conspiracy theories, this one goes against common sense.

Kia Purity wrote...

For me, it was with the PR speak and the devs screaming at us for not understanding the ending.

Citation needed.

Modifié par CronoDragoon, 24 juin 2013 - 07:51 .

[Erez Kristal]

those casuals download pirated games, its the hardcore fans who pre order your games and buy the dlc.
i bought bg because it was a fancy rpg, i bought bg2 because of bg1, i bought neverwinter because of bg2, i bought neverwinter expansions because of neverwinter, i bought kotr because of neverwinter, i bought ma because of bg+nw+Reviews. bought da because of bg+reviews. bought da expansion because of da. da 2 despite reviews because of da1. i bought me2 because of me1. me2 dlc because of me2. and me3 because of me2.

There is a line here. and some logic. if you sell a good game you increase the chances of selling a less good game in the future. if you sell a bad game you reduce your chances.

While they have more reputation now for pitching their next me, they will need good scores(mostly players) to pitch as high as they like.
If the next da and me dont score high reputation alone wont help the sales.

[Mushashi7]

In any case I think Bioware should have made options for a better end. I don't buy games to get a bad experience. Especially not after spending several hundred hours building up my character and story.

[ADeadDiehard]

The moment I found out Buzz Aldrin was in them. There was no hope when a celebrity makes a cameo in the worst part of the ending.

[Benchpress610]

dreamgazer wrote...

iakus wrote...

Benchpress610 wrote...

I lost pretty much all hope when they announced the EC with their bullet points Q&A talking about clarification, closure and artistic vision. This was confirmed after the EC came out and they locked 3DandBeyond’s “One Last Plea” thread.

Yeah that was a dark day.  There were a lot of cogent reasons why the ending didn't work and should be changed.  It even stayed fairly civil. 

Alas, what we think truly didn't matter.

How long did that thread go on? Were the same things being repeated over and over? 

Actually, in that thread were the best reasoned and articulate debates by both sides. There were a coupleof trolls and a few instances of name calling, but in general it stayed civil
 http://social.biowar.../index/13909825 

[o Ventus]

CrutchCricket wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...
Yeah, they do.  At the very least, they pay attention to the star rating next to the game when they're browsing the site. 

Even so what's the last game you know of that's infamous for how bad it is? What's the gaming equivalent of The Room?

I don't think that happens too much in gaming.  Good games get remembered bad games just die.

ET
Deadly Premonition
Rogue Warrior
Kabuki Warriors
The original release of SMB2
Iron Man 2

Modifié par o Ventus, 24 juin 2013 - 07:58 .

[Kia Purity]

CronoDragoon wrote...

Kia Purity wrote...

For me, it was with the PR speak and the devs screaming at us for not understanding the ending.

Citation needed.

What, you weren't there? O_o It was all over the place on twitter and various interviews and even from community managers too. (Which I found very strange for them to lash out when they're supposed to play nice...)

God, I'm not going to even cite that because there's just too much crap to deal with and I don't want to deal with it all over again. I'm sorry I can't help you.

Modifié par Kia Purity, 24 juin 2013 - 08:00 .

[CronoDragoon]

Kia Purity wrote...

What, you weren't there? O_o It was all over the place on twitter and various interviews and even from community managers too. (Which I found very strange for them to lash out when they're supposed to play nice...)

God, I'm not going to even cite that because there's just too much crap to deal with and I don't want to deal with it all over again. I'm sorry I can't help you.

I was here the entire time, which is why I think you need to provide a source for devs screaming at fans for not understanding the ending, because I didn't see that.

[CrutchCricket]

dreamgazer wrote...
Deadly Premonition, maybe?

CronoDragoon wrote...
Big Rig Truckers or whatever, Amy.

o Ventus wrote...
ET
Deadly Premonition
Rogue Warrior
Kabuki Warriors
The original release of SMB2
Iron Man 2

Haven't heard of most of these. The only exception is SMB2. I heard of Amy but no details about it (but if it does fall into the category of "so bad it's popular" it kind of proves my point). Also lol Iron Man 2- movie game tie ins will always be ****.

WittingEight65 wrote...
But the game is not broken, it doesn't need to be repaired, as if it were a bad product, a dysfunctional product. Because, if there is one person of ten that liked the ending, then it's not broken, and it doesn't need to be "fixed".

Actually... yeah it is. When people wish the game actually crashed before the holokid, your game is broken.

CronoDragoon wrote...
Which brings us back to the question of why generate controversy in the first place. Popularity and quality correlate more strongly in gaming than any other medium, largely because of all the technical aspects of a game that a competent dev has to get right. There is no need to generate controversy when you can just make a quality game instead, which feelings of ME3 aside even most BSNers will agree they are capable of. Like most conspiracy theories, this one goes against common sense.

Ah, but I never claimed ME3 was a ****ty game or indeed the object of the scheme was to create a technically ****ty game.

DLC won't fix technical errors. But story? Characters? The things people actually get attached to? Those can take it to start the controversy. In fact they're the only things that can take that hit and be thus recoverable.

You're right in that you don't need to create controversy if you're already a strong competent developer with a solid IP. That may actually be an argument for this particular case being an accident. Though on the other hand Bioware's been wavering apparently with DA2 (which I don't know anything about but I've heard complaints). But anyway, a less secure developer with a weaker product, or perhaps a greedy publisher that makes its fortune of cookie-cutter yearly releases... that's more ambiguous wouldn't you say?

In any case the possibility of someone purposefully recreating this controversy for hype purposes is very real, and very troubling.

[Eterna]

David7204 wrote...

Worse as in grim, or worse as in worse?

Grim. 

[Cutlass Jack]

brettc893 wrote...

 By redeeming I mean, all of the brilliant fan theories that would have made everything better ending up wrong, a grand expansion never coming, things of that nature.

I'm gonna have to go with as soon as Omega came out.  

It was clear to me the moment I finished the game. The endings were the endings. I wasn't required to like them. Nor would I expect them to change them because I didn't care for it.

Wasn't the first game I greatly enjoyed but disliked the ending of. Nor was it the last. But I'm more of a journey than the destination sort of person. And I had a great journey.

Modifié par Cutlass Jack, 24 juin 2013 - 08:36 .

[o Ventus]

CrutchCricket wrote...

Haven't heard of most of these.

I don't know how prevalent a gamer you are or how much time you spend on the Internet, but you can google each of those games.

I heard of Amy but no details about it (but if it does fall into the category of "so bad it's popular" it kind of proves my point).

Amy isn't one of those "so bad it's popular" things, it's "so bad that people tell other people about it so they can avoid it". Deadly Premonition and The Room are so bad they're popular. They have some form of appeal despite being god-awful.

Also lol Iron Man 2- movie game tie ins will always be ****.

Iron Man 2 somehow manages to sink below the already low standards set by movie tie-in games. Not all movie tie-in games are bad. Some are kind of decent (the recent Captain America game) and some are fan-goddamn-tastic (Spider-Man 2).
 

[Eterna]

o Ventus wrote...

Iron Man 2 somehow manages to sink below the already low standards set by movie tie-in games. Not all movie tie-in games are bad. Some are kind of decent (the recent Captain America game) and some are fan-goddamn-tastic (Spider-Man 2).
 

I still remember the game for King Kong on the Ps2, it was actually pretty good. I played the **** out of it. 

[Nole]

CrutchCricket wrote...

WittingEight65 wrote...
But the game is not broken, it doesn't need to be repaired, as if it were a bad product, a dysfunctional product. Because, if there is one person of ten that liked the ending, then it's not broken, and it doesn't need to be "fixed".

Actually... yeah it is. When people wish the game actually crashed before the holokid, your game is broken.

Again, that is only your opinion. If the 100% of the people that play the game don't think the game is broken, then it really isn't.

[o Ventus]

WittingEight65 wrote...

CrutchCricket wrote...

WittingEight65 wrote...
But the game is not broken, it doesn't need to be repaired, as if it were a bad product, a dysfunctional product. Because, if there is one person of ten that liked the ending, then it's not broken, and it doesn't need to be "fixed".

Actually... yeah it is. When people wish the game actually crashed before the holokid, your game is broken.

Again, that is only your opinion. If the 100% of the people that play the game don't think the game is broken, then it really isn't.

100% don't think anything.

[David7204]

Kia Purity wrote...

What, you weren't there? O_o It was all over the place on twitter and various interviews and even from community managers too. (Which I found very strange for them to lash out when they're supposed to play nice...)

God, I'm not going to even cite that because there's just too much crap to deal with and I don't want to deal with it all over again. I'm sorry I can't help you.

[Erez Kristal]

WittingEight65 wrote...

CrutchCricket wrote...

WittingEight65 wrote...
But the game is not broken, it doesn't need to be repaired, as if it were a bad product, a dysfunctional product. Because, if there is one person of ten that liked the ending, then it's not broken, and it doesn't need to be "fixed".

Actually... yeah it is. When people wish the game actually crashed before the holokid, your game is broken.

Again, that is only your opinion. If the 100% of the people that play the game don't think the game is broken, then it really isn't.

The cute kitten wrote " The only good thing about this game is the amount of weapons and customization for your skills. The voice acting is brilliant apart from Jessica Chobot. That's it. The story is full of plotholes, contradiction, retcons and downright nonsensical at times. The enemies and AI behaviour is subpar. Everything just bumrushes you and and do not use strategy of any sort. There is too little gameplay and too much cutscenes which makes the game feels like an interactive movie. There is also almost no RP element in the game apart from power customization. Your choices do not matter. The ending introduces new concepts altogether. Unnecessary inclusion of children to create emotions. So yeah, a botched job from Biower."
this is from 27.3.2013

There are others who agree with. but most people who didnt like the game moved on. while those who didnt who have hard time departing havent

I should go.

[Arcian]

David7204 wrote...

Kia Purity wrote...

What, you weren't there? O_o It was all over the place on twitter and various interviews and even from community managers too. (Which I found very strange for them to lash out when they're supposed to play nice...)

God, I'm not going to even cite that because there's just too much crap to deal with and I don't want to deal with it all over again. I'm sorry I can't help you.

Wow, look at this. David using memes. Never thought I'd see the day.