865 réponses à ce sujet

[wolfhowwl]

When I played through the lackluster plot leading up to the endings.

Non-stop Cerberus buffoonery, indoctrination, and what happened with Udina left me shaking my head.

The big choices from previous games were rendered irrelevant. The Crucible thing wasn't too good either.

All of that was a warning sign of what was waiting for everyone.

Modifié par wolfhowwl, 29 juin 2013 - 07:13 .

[Jadebaby]

What are you talking about OP?

BioWare redeemed the game for me in brilliant fashion! Thank you for helping my Shepard reunite with my crew BioWare! I love you.

[o Ventus]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Gears 3 had a better ending.

On the surface, sure.

The imulsion is all gone, so the problem of the Lambent is done with.  Only now Marcus and co. have to figure out how to leave Azura and return to the mainland. Imulsion was what powered their vehicles. For some reason, I don't think they can rebuild society on a small island that was only meant to house the most valuable people for the species.

Modifié par o Ventus, 29 juin 2013 - 07:27 .

[Jadebaby]

o Ventus wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Gears 3 had a better ending.

On the surface, sure.

The imulsion is all gone, so the problem of the Lambent is done with.  Only now Marcus and co. have to figure out how to leave Azura and return to the mainland. Imulsion was what powered their vehicles. For some reason, I don't think they can rebuild society on a small island that was only meant to house the most valuable people for the species.

pretty sure the man made storm was lifted when they beat myrrah.

[o Ventus]

Jadebaby wrote...

pretty sure the man made storm was lifted when they beat myrrah.

How does this solve the whole "we just immolated all of our fuel" problem?

[Jadebaby]

o Ventus wrote...

Jadebaby wrote...

pretty sure the man made storm was lifted when they beat myrrah.

How does this solve the whole "we just immolated all of our fuel" problem?

cut down some trees and build some row boats...? Those gears could paddle as fast as any motorised propeller.

[TheProtheans]

Gears of war 3 had terrible ending, Myrrah was looking extremely frustrated and hot and some idiot just stabbed her to death,she was more human than locust(lots lambent cells) as she would have died in the cleansing otherwise.
Not the way I would have gotten inside her.
And plus she was an innocent victim in all of this imulsion business.

[Reorte]

StreetMagic wrote...

I can think of many motivations for why Udina went down that path, but the game didn't do a good job of showing them. It was just implicit. At the beginning of the game, I think he was sincerely saddened by the condition of Earth, frustrated with the council, felt like he had to do anything to keep things in tact, and might have even justified a deal with Cerberus by thinking "Well, Shepard did it once." It was a stupid miscalculation on his part, not outright villainy.

The way it comes off though is shallow villain behavior. They don't show any progression. It comes out of nowhere.

Udina before the coup was actually showing some signs of character development and depth instead of being a useless stuck-up self-absorbed idiot. I found it rather sad that that got thrown away. It could've worked if his motivation had been explored as you say but it came across as him just being a straightforward power-hungry villain after all.

[AsheraII]

brettc893 wrote...

 By redeeming I mean, all of the brilliant fan theories that would have made everything better ending up wrong, a grand expansion never coming, things of that nature.

I'm gonna have to go with as soon as Omega came out.  

Brilliant fan theories? Sorry, I don't recall any of those.
The ME3 ending was not as good as the rest of the series, that much is true.
The ME3 ending wasn't bad though.
If you want to see something truely bad, then just google indoctrination theory. THAT is bad.

[Sunnyhat1]

At what point did it become clear to you that there was no hope for redeeming the endings?

When i came up with my own theory about the ending. I figure the eggheads at BW sat down discussing what to make of the ending and it went something like this:

"So we got a huge following from the first 2 games. And they'll all buy our third one. But how can we get even more people to buy that haven't been in touch with ME yet? ...
....
I KNOW! Lets finish the game up to earth our regular way and then we f*** up the ending so badly that all the old fans will go nuts on the forums. Maybe we'll even get hacked, or people start funny fundraising projects for the cause.
We'll get loads of media attention and then all the other Whats-ME?-kinda-people will come wondering what the fuzz is all about.
And we'll sell even more copies!
Let's do that thing!!"

Yeah BW is dead to me... they' wont see a cent of my money anymore no matter what they come up with.

[AlanC9]

Sunnyhat1 wrote...
"So we got a huge following from the first 2 games. And they'll all buy our third one. But how can we get even more people to buy that haven't been in touch with ME yet? ...
....
I KNOW! Lets finish the game up to earth our regular way and then we f*** up the ending so badly that all the old fans will go nuts on the forums. Maybe we'll even get hacked, or people start funny fundraising projects for the cause.
We'll get loads of media attention and then all the other Whats-ME?-kinda-people will come wondering what the fuzz is all about.
And we'll sell even more copies!
Let's do that thing!!"

This is what you think the plan was?

Really?

[StarcloudSWG]

It was one intended outcome. Yes, INTENDED. Mac Walters said he expected the endings would provoke discussion and debate, and thus draw more attention to the series.

The difference is, Mac Walters thought the original ending was perfectly fine and that there was nothing wrong with it at all. He grossly overestimated his ability as a writer to deliver a 'high concept' ending at the finale of an action-oriented military space opera.

And he was completely blindsided by the fan reaction, because he didn't allow his work to be peer-reviewed.

[o Ventus]

TheProtheans wrote...

Gears of war 3 had terrible ending, Myrrah was looking extremely frustrated and hot and some idiot just stabbed her to death,she was more human than locust(lots lambent cells) as she would have died in the cleansing otherwise.
Not the way I would have gotten inside her.
And plus she was an innocent victim in all of this imulsion business.

She was so innocent that she decided that attacking humanity and igniting a two-front war was a good idea.

All this without the slightest attempt to cordially ask humanity for help.

[Alien Number Six]

The ending was good but too short. EC fleshed it all out and made it even better. BioWare put out three great games that I love to play.

[Reorte]

StarcloudSWG wrote...

It was one intended outcome. Yes, INTENDED. Mac Walters said he expected the endings would provoke discussion and debate, and thus draw more attention to the series.

The difference is, Mac Walters thought the original ending was perfectly fine and that there was nothing wrong with it at all. He grossly overestimated his ability as a writer to deliver a 'high concept' ending at the finale of an action-oriented military space opera.

And he was completely blindsided by the fan reaction, because he didn't allow his work to be peer-reviewed.

It's simply the result of trying to sound clever without actually being clever. Unfortunately for him it backfired because a lot of people were cleverer than what was written and saw straight through it. You can't be deep without depth and everything about the endings shouted "Trying to be deep!" but fell flat when diving through the surface only to find yourself smashing your head on the bottom of the shallow end of a paddling pool.

[Tron Mega]

2 things.

1. before ME3 came out i read a topic started by admiral cheese talking about her findings with the leaked story. ive always thought i fell along her line of thinking so it worried me greatly that she wasnt impressed with MEs story, more that she thought it was a nonsenical WTF story, which it turned out to be. but that was the very first time i actually thought "ive been right all along, bioware DOES suck." still bought the game on pre order anyways even though i very much disfavor ME2, i mean who the hell can ME3 turn out to be bad, right?!?!? how was that possible?!?!?

2. chris preistly sticked a topic stating "first playthrough DONT PLAY AS YOUR SHEPARD." as if anyone here isnt going to be using their primo playthrough theyve spent 7 years perfecting over hours and hours of getting the choices they wanted. what a fool. im suprised preistly isnt involved more with biowares awful PR team.

*honorable mention: when the BSN had that warning note maybe 3 days before release stating something like "we know the game will suck, but please dont post those findings here."

***also when liara said "we found a device on mars" thats truely the moment i thought "oh god, so this right here, this is why ME3 is a bad game. well , lets see if bioware can make it interesting." which they did, if you think space magic nonsense is interesting.

[Reorte]

Tron Mega wrote...

2. chris preistly sticked a topic stating "first playthrough DONT PLAY AS YOUR SHEPARD."

Don't recall that one, bloody hell that's awful. The first playthrough is the key one that shapes your experience of the game, the one when you can truly roleplay because you're as free as possible from metagaming, and the one that has the real emotional impact.

[dreamgazer]

I'd like to read that pinned thread. Anyone have a link?

[AlanC9]

Reorte wrote...

Tron Mega wrote...

2. chris preistly sticked a topic stating "first playthrough DONT PLAY AS YOUR SHEPARD."

Don't recall that one, bloody hell that's awful. The first playthrough is the key one that shapes your experience of the game, the one when you can truly roleplay because you're as free as possible from metagaming, and the one that has the real emotional impact.

I don't recall the quote that way. It would have been impossible for most of us in any event, sonce he posted it months after ME3 came out

[HellbirdIV]

brettc893 wrote...

By redeeming I mean, all of the brilliant fan theories that would have made everything better ending up wrong, a grand expansion never coming, things of that nature.

Extended Cut, more or less. I held out a tiny hope up until Citadel, as it's the last singleplayer DLC, and even before the EC I was pretty much resigned to "These endings are irredeemably retarded" - the EC didn't help, because they changed nothing about the endings that wasn't insignificant, minor plotholes/better left to the imagination.

StarcloudSWG wrote...

Mac Walters thought the original ending was perfectly
fine and that there was nothing wrong with it at all. He grossly
overestimated his ability as a writer to deliver a 'high concept' ending
at the finale of an action-oriented military space opera.

I feel I should butt in and say that that's not what "High concept" means. Basically, a high concept story is a story in which the basic concept can be summarized very simply, and the focus of the story tends to be the implications of that concept and the character actions that come from it; Jaws, for example, is a high concept story, "What if a Shark was attacking swimmers at a beach?", and War of the Worlds, "What if aliens invaded?".

Mass Effect has never been a high-concept story, and I think I get what you really mean; A story that deals more strictly with philosophy, perceptions and metaconcepts. And you're right, of course, Walters had no idea how to write that - and the fact he tried to attach it to Mass Effect, which had always been more of a big sprawling space opera, was absolutely idiotic.

Modifié par HellbirdIV, 30 juin 2013 - 04:59 .

[Iakus]

AlanC9 wrote...

Reorte wrote...

Tron Mega wrote...

2. chris preistly sticked a topic stating "first playthrough DONT PLAY AS YOUR SHEPARD."

Don't recall that one, bloody hell that's awful. The first playthrough is the key one that shapes your experience of the game, the one when you can truly roleplay because you're as free as possible from metagaming, and the one that has the real emotional impact.

I don't recall the quote that way. It would have been impossible for most of us in any event, sonce he posted it months after ME3 came out

He did, in fact, post a suggestion of doing a nonimport Shepard first, so we can see the differences.  I don't think he stickied it, though.

[PMC65]

iakus wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Reorte wrote...

Tron Mega wrote...

2. chris preistly sticked a topic stating "first playthrough DONT PLAY AS YOUR SHEPARD."

Don't recall that one, bloody hell that's awful. The first playthrough is the key one that shapes your experience of the game, the one when you can truly roleplay because you're as free as possible from metagaming, and the one that has the real emotional impact.

I don't recall the quote that way. It would have been impossible for most of us in any event, sonce he posted it months after ME3 came out

He did, in fact, post a suggestion of doing a nonimport Shepard first, so we can see the differences.  I don't think he stickied it, though.

Here it is ... http://social.biowar...3/index/9293402

[Dean_the_Young]

iakus wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Reorte wrote...

Tron Mega wrote...

2. chris preistly sticked a topic stating "first playthrough DONT PLAY AS YOUR SHEPARD."

Don't recall that one, bloody hell that's awful. The first playthrough is the key one that shapes your experience of the game, the one when you can truly roleplay because you're as free as possible from metagaming, and the one that has the real emotional impact.

I don't recall the quote that way. It would have been impossible for most of us in any event, sonce he posted it months after ME3 came out

He did, in fact, post a suggestion of doing a nonimport Shepard first, so we can see the differences.  I don't think he stickied it, though.

And the controversial part of this is... anything?

Never mind that he actually posted that before the release, and the ending uproar. It's not even about the ending: it's just a case for how to better appreciate the import feature and carryover effects.