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[dorktainian]

OP

you do realise the starchild doesnt really exist dont you?

[crimzontearz]

And yet, the people responsible for it all are still at the helm of the franchise

It kinda baffles me

The funny part is....EA recently went public and apologized for the mess that is Origin, their apology was worded the RIGHT way "we have heard you, you dislike Origin and it ruin your experience,we are sorry and we will do better" ...this from EA the evil faceless publisher the CEO of which stepped down for screwing things up awfully and being an all around money grubbing jerk who boasted wanting to take all the fun away from making games AND expressing the desire to charge people real real.money for ****ing reloads in FPSs.

Hell MICROSOFT angered people trying to push bull**** policies, one of their high rankers even pretty much insulted the troops AND told the complainers that maybe next Gen was not for them....MS promptly apologized, reversed the BS policies AND the region locking of the XBox one AND had the idiot step down...

Bioware basically said "we are sorry you did not like our ending and it hurts us" followed by "people just needed more time with the characters they love and more context" and proceded to basically change nothing AND give us a middle finger refuse option followed by public interviews complaining about toxic environment in their own forum which should be the ONE PLACE where the aficionados of their franchise gather to have a good time and praise them

again...it baffles me

[spirosz]

What baffles you? The fact that they have a right to do what they want?

[Ieldra]

@OP:
I see one way in which the Catalyst was a bad choice as Mr. Exposition of the endings: it makes people feel as if they're colluding with an evil god-analogue, regardless of the choice they make, and the only choice where they don't feel that way wrecks the galaxy.

Maybe that was the point, right? Maybe it was, and that is not necessarily bad, but the way the story was set up, we could reasonably expect that such a thing would't happen. ME was always rather straightforward and conventional in its story logic. To spring such a drastic change of tone on the player in the last ten minutes - that, too, is not necessarily bad, depending on what kind of reaction you want to achieve, but I very much doubt that the ending sh*tstorm was intended and anticipated.

Apart from that, I resent that this figure as well as a lot of the ending imagery is clouded in religious metaphor. That, too, is not necessarily bad. I just hate it.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 04 juillet 2013 - 01:00 .

[dorktainian]

''I am the Catalyst''

err.... no you're not sonny jim.

[crimzontearz]

spirosz wrote...

What baffles you? The fact that they have a right to do what they want?

no, the fact that faceless corps seem to....

• have less tolerance for idiocy

• try harder, and with apparently better results, to appease the fans

than a company like Bioware.

[JamesFaith]

If you want apologize for your personal problems with ME3, Crimzontearz, you should go to BW and demand it personally.

I personally don't need change.
I don't feel insulted by refuse ending.
And I agree with toxic environment on BSN last year.

So why should BW made general apologize when only part of fans demand it and even these fans have different and often contradictory problems with ME3?

[SpamBot2000]

StreetMagic wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

I want you to read this while thinking about the original ME3 ending

YES. Break your toys so other kids can't play with them.

Glad everyone already indexes this stuff - easier to just point out the trope, rather than explaining it. I was actually going to use a "break your toys" reference one time.. sort of.. it was one of my own childhood experiences, but everyone has a story like that.

What a jerk.

Odd that ME is not listed under the Video Games section. How is that site edited anyway, like a general wiki thing? If so, BW must employ several interns to keep ME off there. 

Because frankly it doesn't get much more obvious than this.

[dorktainian]

JamesFaith wrote...


I don't feel insulted by refuse ending.  

And I agree with toxic environment on BSN last year.  

  

i do think that the end of the game surprised Bioware as to how vocal it made the fans both pro-ending and ending-haters.   Nowt wrong with a happy ending.

[crimzontearz]

JamesFaith wrote...

If you want apologize for your personal problems with ME3, Crimzontearz, you should go to BW and demand it personally.

I personally don't need change.
I don't feel insulted by refuse ending.
And I agree with toxic environment on BSN last year.

So why should BW made general apologize when only part of fans demand it and even these fans have different and often contradictory problems with ME3?

 
No, I just plan to vote with my wallet TYVM.

Bioware decided to cone out and make a public statement meant to be an apology and worded it like it was our faultmfor not understanding, back then 2 years ago the complains were entirely homogeneous and so was the feedback on what people desired. But hey, you can keep kneeling at the altar of Bioware and blindly swallow what is spoonfed to you, hopefully EA will assert more control next time


 
God it is SAD I am even hoping for that but it is better than this crap


 
Either that or, so far, CDPR has not failed me yet AND they are coming out with a sci-fi RPG too

[crimzontearz]

SpamBot2000 wrote...

StreetMagic wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

I want you to read this while thinking about the original ME3 ending

YES. Break your toys so other kids can't play with them.

Glad everyone already indexes this stuff - easier to just point out the trope, rather than explaining it. I was actually going to use a "break your toys" reference one time.. sort of.. it was one of my own childhood experiences, but everyone has a story like that.

What a jerk.

Odd that ME is not listed under the Video Games section. How is that site edited anyway, like a general wiki thing? If so, BW must employ several interns to keep ME off there. 

Because frankly it doesn't get much more obvious than this.

I added it personally...TWICE

[JamesFaith]

crimzontearz wrote...

No, I just plan to vote with my wallet TYVM.

Bioware decided to cone out and make a public statement meant to be an apology and worded it like it was our faultmfor not understanding, back then 2 years ago the complains were entirely homogeneous and so was the feedback on what people desired. But hey, you can keep kneeling at the altar of Bioware and blindly swallow what is spoonfed to you, hopefully EA will assert more control next time


God it is SAD I am even hoping for that but it is better than this crap
 
Either that or, so far, CDPR has not failed me yet AND they are coming out with a sci-fi RPG too

So don't demand apologize and vote with your wallet. Simple, just not so dramatic like current post.

And no, demands weren't homogenic, I'm here from day one so I know it. Just look on demands about Catalyst - people demand complete erasing / longer explanation dialog / modification of choices/ replacing child Catalyst with Harbinger / Vigil-like hologam / Virmire nonsurvivor / your love interest / Avina / Anderson / TIM and maybe more I can't remember them all.

There were even many people demanding option "Refusing Catalyst's options even if it mean lost the war." And when BW who never listen to fans (your words in many different thread) listened to fans, it suddenly become "middlefinger to all (you) fans". 

And liking different game then you meaning kneeling to altar of developer? Sure, mistr paragon-of-world-taste.

[crimzontearz]

LOL actually I have been here longer than you James and in the previous forums too. Look at the old polls and you will see the overwhelming majority wanted certain things that obviously SuperMac and CHud decided were not worthy of having (mostly superMac tho). The EC changed nothing but the bits that Mac, in his hurry, did not foresee...or maybe he did, you know with the whole torch the franchise and run outlook, I am not demanding an apology, far from it because anything coming from Bioware (minus a couple of exceptions) would be utterly insincere at this point. I merely find it VERY interesting how faceless corps did it right and Bioware did not.

Also, differently from what you think I DO like ME3, what I DON'T like is Bioware's attitude and their handling of criticism and the squandering of an opportunity for a second, third and FOURTH throw at it.

[JamesFaith]

Did I spoke about about time before ME3 release? No, because it was invalid to matter of homogenic demands on change of ME3. Time before is irrelevant.

And old polls really aren't good source of info because majority of them hadn't contradictory options in "demanding change" part. BSN was able to find relative concensus only on one thing - we want change. And then started clashes about conventional victory, IT, boss fightes, Crucibel functions and so on.

And I don't see anything strange about apology problematic. There is quite difference between apologize for problems with technology (Origin, XBOX) and disliking story elements.

[crimzontearz]

JamesFaith wrote...

Did I spoke about about time before ME3 release? No, because it was invalid to matter of homogenic demands on change of ME3. Time before is irrelevant.

And old polls really aren't good source of info because majority of them hadn't contradictory options in "demanding change" part. BSN was able to find relative concensus only on one thing - we want change. And then started clashes about conventional victory, IT, boss fightes, Crucibel functions and so on.

And I don't see anything strange about apology problematic. There is quite difference between apologize for problems with technology (Origin, XBOX) and disliking story elements.

no, it is the same concept, listen to people and give them what they want and not what you think they should want. Simple as that really. MANY more options should have been given, Bioware had a chance to make many more people happy but chose not to, again VERY simple.


 
Also, an apology is properly worded this way "I am sorry I did something that offended/hurt/wronged you" and not "I am sorry YOU PERCEIVE something as bad because you are not understanding it right"....rule #1 of apologizing, imagine your mother is listening to you

[remydat]

Nightwriter wrote...

I think the problem is that BioWare painted itself into a corner, yeah.

Throughout the course of the series the writers had been stacking brick after brick into the "Reapers are bad" side of the scales. Then at the last minute they threw a very small paperweight into the "Reapers are good" side of the scales and expected it to outweigh the enormous stack of bricks in the other dish.

I think it's natural for fans to want the outcome that has had the most buildup by a landslide. If BioWare wanted me to see the Reapers in a good enough light that I could trust the Catalyst, they should not have put so many bricks in the wrong dish.

Not sure they went with the Reapers are good but more the Reapers are simply just doing what they were programmed to do.

In any event I don't really mind the change as I like movies like that anyways.  The Usual Suspects had me feeling sympathetic towards the cripple Verbal Kint (Kevin Spacey) until you find out he basically trolled everyone and was in the fact Keyser Soze.

[remydat]

KaiserShep wrote...

And this goes to show the failing on the part of the writers. If you're going to lead the audience along for an entire trilogy, your twist had better make sense. No amount of afterthought DLC's will correct it once you goof up. 

To each his own.  Twist made sense to me.  I never bought the Reapers as just big evil meanies killing things for no real reason.

[JamesFaith]

crimzontearz wrote...
 
Also, an apology is properly worded this way "I am sorry I did something that offended/hurt/wronged you" and not "I am sorry YOU PERCEIVE something as bad because you are not understanding it right"....rule #1 of apologizing, imagine your mother is listening to you

Well, in that case would apology have to be:

"I'm sorry I wrote something that offended/hurt/wronged SOME of fans from many SUBJECTIVE reasons when other have no problem with it and some people like same thing which you were offendend by. I would normally say that problems with story is based on different subjective perception of every human, but Rule n.1 of apology forbidding words based on PERCEIVE."

[crimzontearz]

Which would be even worse, hell EA and MS could have done the sane right? Some people LIKE origin, some people LIKE the idea of always online consoles, but did they? No, they apologized and promised to do better/immediately reversed the issue. And THAT is what spurs by hope that EA is more hands on next time, crazy as it might sound.

[remydat]

o Ventus wrote...

The effect of the kid's death on Shepard is so unbelievable because it's baseless and takes strange mental precedence over every other death that Shepard has witnessed, with those other deaths almost always involving people whom Shepard is more emotionally involved in.

Sole Survivor? Shepard's entire platoon was eaten by a thresher maw.

Colonist? Shepard's family was slaughtered before his eyes.

Virmire? Shepard just left behind Kaidan or Ashley, whom s/he may or may not be romancing at this point in time.

ME2 Shepard may have been romancing Tali, only for her to be taken and killed by the Seeker swarms on the Collector base.

ME3 Shepard may be involved with Miranda, only to see her killed by her father on Horizon.

All of these potentially heart-wrenching things, but some f**king kid who only dies because he's too stupid to listen to me is supposed to make me "sad"? No, to hell with that. That's borderline exploitative.

There is always a breaking point.  After experiencing a life of loss and tragedy, the kid was his breaking point.  It's like people are so mad at the game that suddenly they pretend like the human mind is easily predictable.  This idea that because Shep lost someone before he can't be traumatized by the loss of a kid right in front of him is psychological non-sense.  It has absolutely no basis in reality.  

Sure Shep lost people closer to him.  All adults and all soldiers or mercs who signed up for dangerous missions.  There is always an expectation among comrades of war that some will not make it.  That is a far cry from watching a kid who moments ago was scarred sh*tless looking at you through a vent being torched to a crisp basically because the kid decided to get on the wrong transport.

But sure let's all pretend that there is no possible way for a human to be tramautized by a kid dying in front of him just because they have witnessed tragedy before.