25 réponses à ce sujet

[Cainhurst Crow]

A growing movement is going on in the dragon age forums to get rid of
save imports from bioware games. They wish, from what I have seen, for
bioware to set a canon for their games and to abandon the save import
system as little more than a novelty and a failed experiment.

How
do you feel about this? Would you be in favor of knowing your choices
will be either reinforced or retconned at the start of the next game
based on where the writers decide to take the stroy. Do you feel it
would help them write a better story if they didn't focus on player
choices? Or is the save import system important enough to you to keep
around?

Vote here with what you think.

[tanisha__unknown]

Keep it. I thought the concept was awesome. I cannot recall any earlier game where the decisions you made actually carried over nad had an influence on the story of the current one (admittedly it was very minor, but still...) - the only thing that comes to mind is the BG series, and even there the only difference were the pantalons which finally gave you access to some cool stuff - but I digress.

I know it is extremely painfull to implement several decisions with totally different outcome, I guess the coding effort increses at least linearly with the amount of options, and the amount of options quickly goes up if you can combine different ones. Take EC, for example - it is 2 GB large, but only roughly 10' longer, I guess making the experience different was what took a lot of the effort.

If it is at all possible, BioWare should try to keep it up and even though it is painful, try to make things reall different. Take the rachni mission - have it there for those who saved the rachni queen and have it missing for those who killed her, that would have been an example of how to implement it cost efficiently and still have your decisions matter.

[Sir DeLoria]

Once again, no. Remove it and voila you have another standart trivial rpg.

[HellbirdIV]

Hah. **** no. Save Imports are a big part of roleplaying games like this - I personally find that re-playing KotOR suffers because Revan and the Jedi Exile have been defined as characters in the Star Wars canon (by necessity) and that takes away a lot of the experience in replaying the games as "my" story.

[Vapaa]

Either remove them or don't go mad with what carries over. It's ultimately what bited ME3 in the arse

[levyjl1988]

The problem with save imports is how Mass Effect does it. Especially with the Genesis DLC. It covers major decisions in the game but tiny things should also be made changeable in some menu of it or something. I paid money so I can avoid the frustration of playing the previous iterations again. I should be able to see that change be made. ie) Wrex's armor, etc. tiny changes as well.

[Allison_Lightning]

Save imports are why I love the Mass Effect series. There's such a compelling sense of continuity in the games, even ME3. I think with Dragon Age, its different- like playing KotOR and KotOR II with two different protagonists that the general state of the world seems less important because of the main character. But I would hate for my pro-mage decisions to be wiped because of a set canon and telling people if they play anything other than a certain Shepard, is already a pain in the neck. It'd be even worse and a step away from killing the RPG aspect of these games.

An inheritable world state give consequences in a far reaching capacity. Do I care each Shepard requires hours of careful playing-no although I wish my Renegade PC Shepard hadn't succeeded in persuading Wrex. But those real ramifications are what keeps me interested in Bioware games because it's different and adds immense replay value.

[o Ventus]

Is there a reason why this thread was made twice?

[Trentest0]

I would have to actually consider buying the game if save imports were removed.

One of the most critical parts of the game.

My first thought on completing ME1 wasn't "What a great game!", it was "I can't wait to continue this adventure in the next game and see MY Shepard's adventure continue!"

(I did think What a Great Game! afterwards, of course)

[FredLOMD]

Save imports are a good thing. What's not a good thing is allowing these choice branches to grow out of control until they become unmanageable for future games (see ME3). Save imports are a good thing but you have to plan for them the whole way through.

[DragonAgeLegend]

NO!

[Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien]

Allison_Lightning wrote...

Save imports are why I love the Mass Effect series. There's such a compelling sense of continuity in the games, even ME3. I think with Dragon Age, its different- like playing KotOR and KotOR II with two different protagonists that the general state of the world seems less important because of the main character. But I would hate for my pro-mage decisions to be wiped because of a set canon and telling people if they play anything other than a certain Shepard, is already a pain in the neck. It'd be even worse and a step away from killing the RPG aspect of these games.

An inheritable world state give consequences in a far reaching capacity. Do I care each Shepard requires hours of careful playing-no although I wish my Renegade PC Shepard hadn't succeeded in persuading Wrex. But those real ramifications are what keeps me interested in Bioware games because it's different and adds immense replay value.

Pretty much sums up my views on this. Having seen things play out through the ME games due to my choices from previous ones, I just love seeing the variations of scenes due to such things. I've got 16 Shepards and they are all different from one another in overall choices made. It still is a hell of a ride going through the ones I've not finished yet.

[Malanek]

I think the save import system was really good in theory but hasn't ever really been implemented well.

From ME1 to ME3 I think it was worth having although I don't know how much extra work it added. It added a little extra immersion but was largely cosmetic.

DA2 was even worse, I didn't take anything positive at all from the import while Leliana and Zeveran were alive when they shouldn't have been. I even went to the effort of going for an additional play through to set up as interesting of a world as I could imagine,

I would drop it for ME4 if that is a sequel and I would drop it from DA altogether. I don't think Destroy, Synthesis, Control and Refuse can be hand waved into one story.

[MrFob]

FredLOMD wrote...

Save imports are a good thing. What's not a good thing is allowing these choice branches to grow out of control until they become unmanageable for future games (see ME3). Save imports are a good thing but you have to plan for them the whole way through.

I think this right here is the critical issue. If you want to have a feaure like this, you cannot just make things up as you go along. You need to have at least a broad idea from the start as where your different story arcs are going.
I think, given the situation BW was in when they started the development of ME3, they id an admirable job - maybe even an outstanding job - in putting all these consequences in. Unfortunately, because there was no definite plan for the main story arc from the beginning of the trilogy, they had to keep most of them in the side stories though. If they could manage to really integrate the multi-game C&C into the main story, we'd be in for something really special.

On a side note, I think BW could also be a bit more brave when it comes to content decision. I do understand that they kept the consequences of a certain ME1 decision (cough, Rachni, cough) to a minimum for the sake of new player as to not deprive those new players of content. However, if they want to go with this feature again in a future set of games (say another trilogy for the next gen console generation) I think it would be best for the games if they went all in and assumed that players will eventually play the entire trilogy. Now, I am not saying they shouldn't allow or  ake it hard for people to jump in in the middle (that would be bad business) but they should not focus on these new player but on the trilogy as a whole and market it that way. It worked perfectly for other franchises (Assassins Creed, Batman, etc. so why not for BW? It would give them a bit more freedom with the ave import features.

[Sanunes]

I don't mind save imports for adding flavor to the game or non-important conversations to add the feeling of continuity. The problem to me is the gap between what is expected and what is possible. I think the biggest problem with the continuation of events that if one option is picked its the end of the path and those are the choices people want to continue forward, but its also would be the hardest choice to carry forward for they are either going to have to develop parts of the game for people that made a choice and other parts for those that didn't and look what happened with the character cameos in Mass Effect 3.

[Modius Prime]

 Mass Effect got too side-tracked with the balance between new players and the established fan base. Most of the stuff that made fans, like me, like the game (high customization, exploration, non-linear game, a lot of choices that mattered) were thrown out in favor of the new players that were racking in most of the profits for BioWare (only 40% actually beat the trilogy and only 34% actually had Wrex in ME3). ME3 became sort of a mixed bag: it was more of like a tug-a-war between the established fans and the casuals that are, most likely, unaware that this forum even exists. For me, personally, it is the import-save feature that is what makes this game truly genuine; it allows you to have an even deeper relationship with the characters due to past decisions. Logically, you would assume that players would only play the second or third game if they would have completed the previous games, but most of the players did not complete all 3. BioWare should focus on what makes their games unique: their amazing ability to tell a story. The story should be the most integral feature of the game and should not be side-lined for new players because it should already be assumed that they had beaten the previous game. BioWares increased focus on the new players is what lead to a lot of the linear features of the game that detracted from the RPG experience; It is so different that when I play ME1 after playing ME3 for a while, that I sometimes believe that it was an entirely new developer that made the game - that's how much it changed. I didn't really like how in ME3 how I had to remind people that I still loved them, or how a lot of the dialogue was shared between non-romance and romance. I missed having hundreds of different ways to make my character unique, but now there are, like, only 5 costumes with only color changing options and little gear variation. 

Modifié par Modius Prime, 09 juillet 2013 - 02:09 .

[Eamon696]

I don't think Bioware should.  Importing saves is one of Mass Effects defining characteristics, and as a player I feel that they are important and should stay.

Unlike many here on this forum, and across the internet, I feel that the choices and decisions we made do make a difference, and keep things fresh in new playthroughs.  Playing with a default commander shepard in ME3 is pretty different than using an imported one.  While the main missions and story don't drastically change, many character, race, and mission outcomes change and/or become unavailable to you if you don't import or make certain choices.

[Jay-Em]

i'd say keep'm. They lead to interesting story results. For me they were even too limited. I would have liked even more detailed results from attitudes, snubbings etc. shown to other characters in former games.

However, if they -say, for financial reasons- would cut it down to bare-boned imports of standard perks or running jokes, then, no.

I do understand that plotting a cohesive new story with myriads of possible former decisions is quite the nightmare, let alone the herculean programming effort with all possible branchings *shiver*

So, I could understand it when BW decided to not implement it for ME4

[Han Shot First]

I prefer carrying save imports over.

But if they continue to roll with a sytem where your save imports carry over, they also have to keep the limitations of that sytem in mind when writing the next game. Part of the problem with ME3's endings was that it was almost a torch the franchise move. Its really hard to envision how they could possibily carry over all three endings choices over into a sequel.

[WarChicken78]

I think, it depends very strongly on the game / series.

In Dragon age, where the story lines are only very loosely connected and the only thing a save import decides is what character will make a cameo appearance, I'd not be sorry if it's ditched completely.

In the Mass Effect series this is a very different thing. The sequels not only carried over what the player archived and what storyline capeos may appear, but also whoose of the main characters best friends and nearest allies (both squaddies and NPCs) survived or perished and even what kind of relationships there were (even that didn't always work the way it was meant - see Conrad Verner or Garrus in ME2 not importing the descisions right made in ME1). To ditch save imports in a game like this would be a horrendeous idea I'd not want to play ME3 without an import from ME2.

So this is a question that can't be Answered by a yes/no. If I have to, I'll say No, keep the save import just to not loose it on possible ME-style game stories in the future.

[Paragon Soldier]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

(inhales)

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

It is what makes this game unique.

[Thundajo]

No they should not. It was one of the main reasons I love the Mass Effect series. It made sense with the storyline in this series, perhaps not in other series as others have mentioned.

[BigEvil]

I'd rather they keep it. It's the small things which make the save imports worth it to me, although the big ones are important as well. For example, seeing Conrad Verner show up to try and save Shep from a Cerberus agent, failing, and having Jenna show up and save both was great. It made me feel like my character had an impact (however small or large) on the game world.

With DA, it's, again, the little things. Comments from some companions, such as Isabela, Anders or Merrill about meeting the Warden brought a wry smile to my face. Seeing Hawke meet a fleeing survivor of Bhelan's purge of Harrowmont's family line was great. Meanwhile, doing an Awakening playthrough with an Orlesian Warden to follow an Ultimate Sacrifice Warden was kind of hollow with no way of importing what said US Warden did (or what Origin they were, etc).

I'm more than willing to put up with some bugs in the import system to get various side quests, banter, etc.

[rashie]

Keep it.

If its the same character being the main Protagonist in all games, it only adds to the experience seeing actions and decisions you took in earlier games have an effect on how the following games play out.

What needs to be done more properly on the other hand however is to put the default character in a decent spot, ME3 default Shepard is a good example of it done wrong.

[dekkerd]

Not sure what this has to do with ME. The two franchises use imports very differently.

ME was all bout Shepard their choices big and small.

A simple comic/checklist could handle the handful of events that matter from to game to the next in DA. Face import to DA has been irrelevant so far, since its a new hero every game with no onscreen appearances of the old hero.