Modifié par MadCat221, 07 juillet 2013 - 06:51 .
MadCat221 wrote...
Rawgrim wrote...
LobselVith8 wrote...
Rawgrim wrote...
MadCat221 wrote...
Was it mandatory because of some fluke of birth?
Doesit last your entire life?
Is it overseen by a group of addicts too eager to overstep and abuse their authority because no repercussions happen from it, and because they've been indoctrinated to see you as a dangerous thing (and not a person)?
1. Well, yes. I was born in a coutnry that has mandatory army training for males so...I was born a healthy male. Fluke.
While templars have "dominion over mages by divine right", as the moderate Cullen stated in Act III. I take it that isn't the case in your country.Rawgrim wrote...
2. Kind of. If my country is at war with another one I would get called in and shipped out to war, yes.
That isn't the same as all mages being forced to live in servitude to the Chantry for almost a millennia in the Chantry controlled Circles.Rawgrim wrote...
3. Not all templars are eager to overstep and abuse their authority. Alot of them also see mages as a person. But of course there are some bad apples in both camps. Alot of mages just turns to blood magic by default as well, it seems. We saw plenty of that in DA2. And they did it mostly for attack, not for defence.
Which still doesn't give templars the right to control mages simply because they think the Maker gives them divine authority over mages. As for the issue of blood magic, there are some mages who turn to blood magic because templars can nulify their abilities otherwise when they use ordinary magic.
This is because religion and politics don`t mix. and I agree with that 100 percent. BUT its not all black and white. Look at the damage Connor did in Redcliffe. The danger with mages is an extreme one.
Then educate them. Don't grind their face into the dirt and then stamp a boot into their head.
Plaintiff wrote...
Yeah, you're right, I'll amend my statement.Herr Uhl wrote...
In Exile wrote...
Herr Uhl wrote...
There is no rule forbidding the use of magic for healing, the problem is accessibility. Plaintiff is one to overstate things fairly often.
That isn't a substantive distiction. That there isn't actually an explicit rule saying they can't do it, when there are a number of rules that have that effect, amounts to the same thing.
The fact that they actually do study healing magic would suggest they put it to use every now and then. If a noble falls ill or there is a huge plague, I'd assume they'd be utilized, under guard of course.
Saying that they're forbidden to do anything is an overstatement.
Mages are forbidden from using their magic to help people, except when they are forced to use their magic to help people because the Chantry has arbitrarily decided that the situation warrants it.
Plaintiff wrote...
How am I wrong? That is precisely what prison life typically involves.Rawgrim wrote...
"Fixed meal times and restricted activities sounds exactly like a prison to me"
The fact that other institutions might employ a similar structure is largely irrelevent. As I already said, the distinction between prisons and school/military is obvious. I shouldn't need to say "Oh and also you don't have a choice about whether you stay there or not", that is already clear to anyone who isn't a complete dunce.
Rawgrim wrote...
MadCat221 wrote...
Then educate them. Don't grind their face into the dirt and then stamp a boot into their head.
They get educated in the Circle. Wynne explains this in the first game. But of course: certain templars screws stuff up here and there. Given how it can get out of hand very fast with untrained mages, I am sure you would agree that the education should take place in safety (for everyone else)?
Modifié par MadCat221, 07 juillet 2013 - 06:56 .
MadCat221 wrote...
Rawgrim wrote...
MadCat221 wrote...
Then educate them. Don't grind their face into the dirt and then stamp a boot into their head.
They get educated in the Circle. Wynne explains this in the first game. But of course: certain templars screws stuff up here and there. Given how it can get out of hand very fast with untrained mages, I am sure you would agree that the education should take place in safety (for everyone else)?
Then they are stuck in the Circle, leered at (at best) by Templars, have a leash put on them called a "phylactery", and get maltreated by "bad" templars that "good" templars do nothing to curtail.
Guest_Puddi III_*
Yeah, the mages are sent there without having committed any crime.Rawgrim wrote...
To some people there is a distinction between the circle and a prison too. Despite some of the templars being complete psychos.
Filament wrote...
Yeah, the mages are sent there without having committed any crime.Rawgrim wrote...
To some people there is a distinction between the circle and a prison too. Despite some of the templars being complete psychos.
Modifié par MadCat221, 07 juillet 2013 - 07:06 .
DarkKnightHolmes wrote...
Eamon was revived with a mage.
Also Arl Howe/Loghain both kept mages around and they're some mages hanging around the Royal palace after you kill the archdemon. Even King Maric had a Wilhelm as his personal mage.
So I guess Nobles get to have the luxury of having a mage.
Rawgrim wrote...
Filament wrote...
Yeah, the mages are sent there without having committed any crime.Rawgrim wrote...
To some people there is a distinction between the circle and a prison too. Despite some of the templars being complete psychos.
Most, yes. But they run a very higher risk of being possessed than non mages.
Rawgrim wrote...
Filament wrote...
Yeah, the mages are sent there without having committed any crime.Rawgrim wrote...
To some people there is a distinction between the circle and a prison too. Despite some of the templars being complete psychos.
Most, yes. But they run a very higher risk of being possessed than non mages.
Rawgrim wrote...
This is because religion and politics don`t mix. and I agree with that 100 percent. BUT its not all black and white. Look at the damage Connor did in Redcliffe. The danger with mages is an extreme one.
MadCat221 wrote...
Un-edited and posted since other posts were made after the edit and it'd get lost...
The whole Redcliffe fiasco can be laid at the feet of Isolde... at first. But the more one thinks about it, the more likely one is to realize that she did it because... wait for it... wait for it...
...the way the Chantry (mis)handles mages. She didn't want to lose her son to that system.
dragondreamer wrote...
MadCat221 wrote...
Un-edited and posted since other posts were made after the edit and it'd get lost...
The whole Redcliffe fiasco can be laid at the feet of Isolde... at first. But the more one thinks about it, the more likely one is to realize that she did it because... wait for it... wait for it...
...the way the Chantry (mis)handles mages. She didn't want to lose her son to that system.
If Connor lives, Eamon later insists that Connor transfer to the Circle in Tevinter. Which says a lot, I think.
dragondreamer wrote...
MadCat221 wrote...
Un-edited and posted since other posts were made after the edit and it'd get lost...
The whole Redcliffe fiasco can be laid at the feet of Isolde... at first. But the more one thinks about it, the more likely one is to realize that she did it because... wait for it... wait for it...
...the way the Chantry (mis)handles mages. She didn't want to lose her son to that system.
If Connor lives, Eamon later insists that Connor transfer to the Circle in Tevinter. Which says a lot, I think.
Mikoto8472 wrote...
So, I've been playing DAO and DA2 and watching the plight of the mages. And I've been wondering...
The mages that were called to Ostagar to serve in the army.
The mage that used his magic and the ashes of Andraste to heal Eamon.
The personal mages of Loghain and Howe.
And of course all the times in history when mages have been taken out of the Circle and fought in wars. Notably against the Qunari with whom without them the Qunari would have won....
Were they paid to do any of this? Or compensated for their services in any way? If they weren't paid then between being imprisoned in the tower, leashed by phylacteries, unable to go anywhere without Templar guards, being unable to marry unless in exceptional circumstances, having their babies stolen from them at birth........ the Circle mages are slaves of the Chantry.
Slaves.
duckley wrote...
Just a simple question... I may be missing something in Dragon Age Lore, but what role do Mages play in every day life?
It seems to be most are living in Circles and are used as weapons in times of war.
Are healers ever available to serve towns and villages - aside from Anders' underground clinic?
Do they not have spells that could be used to help build roads, buildings, machinery, get rid of pesky locust that might destroy crops, etc. etc.?
Just curious....
MadCat221 wrote...
dragondreamer wrote...
MadCat221 wrote...
Un-edited and posted since other posts were made after the edit and it'd get lost...
The whole Redcliffe fiasco can be laid at the feet of Isolde... at first. But the more one thinks about it, the more likely one is to realize that she did it because... wait for it... wait for it...
...the way the Chantry (mis)handles mages. She didn't want to lose her son to that system.
If Connor lives, Eamon later insists that Connor transfer to the Circle in Tevinter. Which says a lot, I think.
IMO, the Tevinter system is the pendulum swinging too far in the other direction.
Abraham_uk wrote...
duckley wrote...
Just a simple question... I may be missing something in Dragon Age Lore, but what role do Mages play in every day life?
It seems to be most are living in Circles and are used as weapons in times of war.
Are healers ever available to serve towns and villages - aside from Anders' underground clinic?
Do they not have spells that could be used to help build roads, buildings, machinery, get rid of pesky locust that might destroy crops, etc. etc.?
Just curious....
It would be interesting to see mages being able to use their skills to help society.
dragondreamer wrote...
MadCat221 wrote...
dragondreamer wrote...
MadCat221 wrote...
Un-edited and posted since other posts were made after the edit and it'd get lost...
The whole Redcliffe fiasco can be laid at the feet of Isolde... at first. But the more one thinks about it, the more likely one is to realize that she did it because... wait for it... wait for it...
...the way the Chantry (mis)handles mages. She didn't want to lose her son to that system.
If Connor lives, Eamon later insists that Connor transfer to the Circle in Tevinter. Which says a lot, I think.
IMO, the Tevinter system is the pendulum swinging too far in the other direction.
True, but someone who wants their mage child to have a life with more freedom could see it as a better alternative.
Modifié par Qistina, 08 juillet 2013 - 01:43 .
Plaintiff wrote...
How am I wrong? That is precisely what prison life typically involves.Rawgrim wrote...
"Fixed meal times and restricted activities sounds exactly like a prison to me"
The fact that other institutions might employ a similar structure is largely irrelevent. As I already said, the distinction between prisons and school/military is obvious. I shouldn't need to say "Oh and also you don't have a choice about whether you stay there or not", that is already clear to anyone who isn't a complete dunce.
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