296 réponses à ce sujet

[Redbelle]

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

J. Reezy wrote...

AresKeith wrote...

I think this thread proves that Bioware should just end the ME IP and just make a new one

Preferably one that's not marketed as a role-playing game and has no romance.

Amen.

Then go to a developer who makes those sort of things and let BW do it's thing. Why spend your time and energy on BW when it's entire library stems from appreciating the days of rule books and dice rolling?

Your pointing the finger at the very thing that made BW develop the games it's made. And putting aside the ending of ME3, they have been pretty good.

[Sir DeLoria]

AresKeith wrote...

Necanor wrote...

Heretic_Hanar wrote...
You don't know whether you do or do not need a better tech expert before you start with the suicide mission. Only during the mission do you discover that a tech expert comes in handy. Same with biotics.

But sure, I'm in a generous mood today, so I'll add Tali and Samara/Jack to that list. Still my point about Thane and Kasumi still stands.

True. Kasumi, Thane and Legion were unnecessary. 

Legion is another tech expert similar to Tali if you don't recruit her

I wanna be a real boy.

[Sir DeLoria]

Redbelle wrote...

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

J. Reezy wrote...

AresKeith wrote...

I think this thread proves that Bioware should just end the ME IP and just make a new one

Preferably one that's not marketed as a role-playing game and has no romance.

Amen.

Then go to a developer who makes those sort of things and let BW do it's thing. Why spend your time and energy on BW when it's entire library stems from appreciating the days of rule books and dice rolling?

Your pointing the finger at the very thing that made BW develop the games it's made. And putting aside the ending of ME3, they have been pretty good.

Amen to that.

[BaladasDemnevanni]

Redbelle wrote...

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

J. Reezy wrote...

AresKeith wrote...

I think this thread proves that Bioware should just end the ME IP and just make a new one

Preferably one that's not marketed as a role-playing game and has no romance.

Amen.

Then go to a developer who makes those sort of things and let BW do it's thing. Why spend your time and energy on BW when it's entire library stems from appreciating the days of rule books and dice rolling?

Your pointing the finger at the very thing that made BW develop the games it's made. And putting aside the ending of ME3, they have been pretty good.

Still, if we're going the dice rolling route, Bioware has been steadily moving away from there as far back as Jade Empire, though that's not necessarily a bad thing.

[Seboist]

Redbelle wrote...

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

J. Reezy wrote...

AresKeith wrote...

I think this thread proves that Bioware should just end the ME IP and just make a new one

Preferably one that's not marketed as a role-playing game and has no romance.

Amen.

Then go to a developer who makes those sort of things and let BW do it's thing. Why spend your time and energy on BW when it's entire library stems from appreciating the days of rule books and dice rolling?

Your pointing the finger at the very thing that made BW develop the games it's made. And putting aside the ending of ME3, they have been pretty good.

ME1&2 and DA2 were pretty mediocre games. ME3 manages to be a decent shooter if one ignores the dA2 style no content fetch quests and don't take the story seriously.

[AresKeith]

Redbelle wrote...

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

J. Reezy wrote...

AresKeith wrote...

I think this thread proves that Bioware should just end the ME IP and just make a new one

Preferably one that's not marketed as a role-playing game and has no romance.

Amen.

Then go to a developer who makes those sort of things and let BW do it's thing. Why spend your time and energy on BW when it's entire library stems from appreciating the days of rule books and dice rolling?

Your pointing the finger at the very thing that made BW develop the games it's made. And putting aside the ending of ME3, they have been pretty good.

Judging from Bioware's recent actions (and not the ending) they showed that the new bioware isn't capable of making the RPG type games they used to make

They probably do wanna expand into non-RPG games, if they do then they should just end the ME IP now, and build a new IP for it

And I hope Bioware proves me wrong but that's looking unlikely

[clarkusdarkus]

EA/GEARS PRODUCER/ME3 MP TEAM......the letters RPG will be nowhere near the discussion table for the next ME......When ME2 introduced ammo and cover/linear shooting then it was the beginning of the end for ME being an rpg first and foremost. The idea for spinoffs and what not are cool, I enjoyed dirge of cerberus spin-off from ff7.

[CronoDragoon]

AresKeith wrote...

Judging from Bioware's recent actions (and not the ending) they showed that the new bioware isn't capable of making the RPG type games they used to make

And exactly who is that makes games for consoles?

Modifié par CronoDragoon, 08 juillet 2013 - 06:01 .

[Bleachrude]

Strange.

Is there something in the RPG purity guide that says you can't use TPS as your combat element?

Most of you guiys sound like the pre 3e crew from r.g.f.d aka "they're making combat more interesting, WOTC is obviously trying to mainstream it".

I truly did not realize that for a RPG one of its defining characteristics is to to have a crappy combat system....anything that improves that must mean the designers are leaving their RPG roots around....


BTW, in ME1, DA:O could you tell me what were the bad choices a la the Rannoch arc? Maybe tell me where in ME1, DAO where the same situation would get different responses from the same person based on their choices made from before?

I mean, those two should obviously have those type of choices reflected in game and NOT just on some ending cutscene pages....

EDIT: As an aside, do remember that ME1 was first and foremost a Xbox exclusive...yeah, of course the series is designed for the consoles, it was because ME put up the initial seed money I believe.

Modifié par Bleachrude, 08 juillet 2013 - 06:04 .

[Kel Riever]

Video games, from seeming consumer demand, have taken what were once very upfront, aboveboard decisions, and buried them behind the scenes. Inventory is an example of that. But that's what you get when people complain about the ME1 inventory system. Eventually, I think video game companies just ask themselves why they are doing so much work behind the scenes with variety because once it is behind the scenes, people just don't care anymore. Then they stop doing anything creative behind the scenes and pretty soon Falcon Assault Rifle and Crusader Shotgun and Widow sniper rifle turn into ROCKET LAUNCHER (number 0 on your keyboard)

'Streamlining' is the modern word for that. And it sounds good, right? 'Dumbing down' is the negative connotation of that. In the end, though, if your product isn't unique, you better be the best selling version of it or you'll lose. Conversely, you go about 'being unique' enough and you'll have 3 foggy eyed fans who dote on your every move and you'll still fail because nobody cares about your game.

Until ME3, I would say the balance was being corrected. Too much inventory turned into too little,f or example, from ME1 to 2 and then improved again in 3. The problem was the main point, which was STORY, not inventory, shooting, or multiplayer, as much as people enjoyed them, totally failed. That was the unique aspect of ME3. So to continue down the road of less story and more pew pew just seems absurd.

[CronoDragoon]

Bleachrude wrote...

Strange.

Is there something in the RPG purity guide that says you can't use TPS as your combat element?

Even if there was, RPG purists should realize that making something more of an RPG doesn't necessarily make it a better game.

[N7recruit]

I'm glad you Enjoyed the last of us Seival, I agree that it was the most immerse game I have ever played. The thing is just drenched in atmosphere, so brutal & unforgiving but beautiful in it's own way.

The TLOU is superior to ME in many ways, the Gameplay/Combat is MILES better. Graphics are better & it's story (While being on a smaller scale than ME) is told A LOT better.

It was nice as well for a triple A game to have a some what realistic depiction of how horrible violence is & how it affects/changes people rather than having characters completely unfazed (Shepard) or even Joke (Garrus) about the lives they have taken.

Anyway I personally think ME3 would have benefited from having tone similar to the last of us considering what's happening in ME3 is probably 100 times worse. None of this Citadel party when billions are dying BS. But to show, not tell us the horrors that are occurring rather than being in Shepard's Normandy/Citadel Bubble.

Now as to Bioware not making RPG's anymore, well I'd have to disagree with you there Seival. I would like for Bioware to improve on their vision of making Cinematic RPG's with branching narrative's & without sacrificing player avatar control. Don't get me wrong I would love if Bioware could improve their gameplay to that of Naughty Dog's level (I don't see it happening Lol) & to have their multiple narratives told with the strength of a linear game but at the moment there would have to be some give & take. And I think the industry needs a wider variety of games for everyone of any taste.

As you said to make a game of ME's scope with the overall quality of a game like TLOU would be a mammoth undertaking, unreasonable given the current triple A market. One Can Dream tho..

[Iakus]

When teh designers are leaving behind such concepts as dialogue, continuity, character development in favor of combat, combat, and more combat, yeah, I'd say they're leaving their RPG roots behind.

Back in the ME2 days, I was convinced a game could be fully shooter and fully rpg, that such a hybrid was possible. It was all a matter of balancing proportions. Now, I'm not so sure. All these shooting mechanics, so few dialogue options, and people are still complaining that it's too talky...

[CronoDragoon]

iakus wrote...

When teh designers are leaving behind such concepts as dialogue, continuity, character development in favor of combat, combat, and more combat, yeah, I'd say they're leaving their RPG roots behind.

It's a good thing this doesn't apply to BioWare, then. ME3 has more dialogue than ME1 or ME2, and starting with ME2 the characters start to receive more development and focus than they did in ME1.

[The Heretic of Time]

iakus wrote...

When teh designers are leaving behind such concepts as dialogue, continuity, character development in favor of combat, combat, and more combat, yeah, I'd say they're leaving their RPG roots behind.

Back in the ME2 days, I was convinced a game could be fully shooter and fully rpg, that such a hybrid was possible. It was all a matter of balancing proportions. Now, I'm not so sure. All these shooting mechanics, so few dialogue options, and people are still complaining that it's too talky...

The best solution would be to combine the shooty and the talky stuff together, like Gears of War managed to do. Why not have your squad have a fun conversation while shooting up baddies at the same time? It worked fine in Gears of War.

[CronoDragoon]

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

The best solution would be to combine the shooty and the talky stuff together, like Gears of War managed to do. Why not have your squad have a fun conversation while shooting up baddies at the same time? It worked fine in Gears of War.

Hey, it worked in LotSB and Citadel, if fan feedback is any indication.

Modifié par CronoDragoon, 08 juillet 2013 - 06:23 .

[CronoDragoon]

laecraft wrote...

Shepard: Teaches us futility and randomness of the universe.

And here comes the hyperbole train.

[Iakus]

Not really.

The one time I tried playing after EC and before MEHEM, I literally could not get into the game. Everything felt like an exercise in futility. Shepard's fate was predestined. I ended up turning off the game at Rannoch, I simply could not be bothered to go on.

[IntelligentME3Fanboy]

laecraft wrote...

BaladasDemnevanni wrote...

Fun as they are, games like Super Mario will never say anything profound about anything.

I present you: Mario vs Shepard in terms of story.

Why Mario qualifies: the game has a plot, namely "Mario overcomes enemy after enemy and finally faces a deadly dragon in a decisive battle in order to save the Princess".

When you have a PC with a compelling desire to overcome all his increasingly difficult obstacles in order to achieve
his final goal, you have a foundation of a story.

If you take out the story, there will be nothing but level after level. The concept of a final boss is a story concept.

Mario: faces final boss.

Shepard: doesn't face a final boss (too video gamey).

Mario: Shepard (1:0)

Mario: stays true to his goals (saves the princess, rather than feeding her to the dragon for the good of humankind) in all endings.

Shepard: turns on their goals for no priory foreshadowed reason in three endings out of four.

Mario: Shepard (2:0)

Mario: achieves his final goal due to his superior skill of jumping, running, firing, and persistent skill of defying death level after level.

Shepard: achieves their final goal due to either all previous species defeating the Reapers by suddenly dropping a mysterious device on Shepard's lap (in original endings) or the future species defeating the Reapers (in Refuse ending).

Mario: Shepard (3:0)

The score isn't looking so good, how about the message the games are sending...

Mario: Teaches us that persistance, skill, courage, and staying true to yourself will get you your true love.

Shepard: Teaches us futility and randomness of the universe.

and if Shepard faced Mario he would kill him before you say "Reapers"

[CronoDragoon]

iakus wrote...

Not really.

The one time I tried playing after EC and before MEHEM, I literally could not get into the game. Everything felt like an exercise in futility. Shepard's fate was predestined. I ended up turning off the game at Rannoch, I simply could not be bothered to go on.

How you feel and what is actually the case are different things. You save the galaxy, which by definition means it was not futile. Now, there are interesting criticisms for why ME3 made you feel like everything is futile.

Modifié par CronoDragoon, 08 juillet 2013 - 06:55 .