Ce sujet est ferméFilament wrote...
Corypheus fight was one of the best designed fights in the DA series. They should keep doing things like that.
Running around in circle while Corypheus shoots annoying spinning flames is the best designed fight in DA series?!
So how is the combat going to be? Da2 style (fingers crossed) or DaO?
Débuté par
ioannisdenton
, juil. 17 2013 04:33
#126
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 01:31
DarkKnightHolmes
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Running around in circle while Corypheus shoots annoying spinning flames is the best designed fight in DA series?!
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#127
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 01:38
BellaStrega
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The biggest challenge for me in the Corypheus fight was keeping the party members I was not currently controlling from running into the persistent AOEs.
I enjoyed DAII despite its flaws, but the flaws are there. The actiony combat wasn't bad, but I did feel that it lost a certain level of tactical management that was present in DAO. It also seemed to me that the AI for characters I was not directly controlling was a bit dodgy (and I did use the "tactics" options).
I don't think DAO was perfect either, but I hope the next game is more responsive to my input during fights.
I enjoyed DAII despite its flaws, but the flaws are there. The actiony combat wasn't bad, but I did feel that it lost a certain level of tactical management that was present in DAO. It also seemed to me that the AI for characters I was not directly controlling was a bit dodgy (and I did use the "tactics" options).
I don't think DAO was perfect either, but I hope the next game is more responsive to my input during fights.
#128
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 01:45
rapscallioness
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I enjoyed the Cory fight. I did have to switch back and forth w/the comapnions to help them get the hell out the way of the fire/lightening/ice!
But it was till fun to me. One time I took Sebastian. When it was all done he says w/that great accent, "That was hard work."
Yes, Seb. Yes it was. Lol.
But it was till fun to me. One time I took Sebastian. When it was all done he says w/that great accent, "That was hard work."
Yes, Seb. Yes it was. Lol.
#129
Guest_Puddi III_*
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 02:09
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It's not like BioWare set a high bar to pass for it to achieve that title. A fight that is actually dynamic and not just whack-whack-whack-dead was very welcome. I thought the Duke and the Rock Wraith were also very well designed. However, the Arishok was arse, Meredith was nonsensical, and other fights like the High Dragon were meh, so it's depends on how the dynamic works of course. It's not just automatically good for being different. But the ones I listed were different in a good way, IMO.DarkKnightHolmes wrote...
Running around in circle while Corypheus shoots annoying spinning flames is the best designed fight in DA series?!
Granted the high dragon and Corypheus both did suffer from the slightly nonsensical situation of, parking their butts in an "inaccessible" location and being impervious to damage, despite the existence of, you know, ranged attacks.
Modifié par Filament, 20 juillet 2013 - 02:12 .
#130
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 04:00
Examurai
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Well DA:O fights wasn't any better either. One thing I extremely hated in Origins was when you were trying to escape an opponents attack and you would still get hit anyways. That use to ****** me off so much. Especially when you are a mage and you're fighting monsters like the Revenant. My worst enemy.
#131
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 04:23
Realmzmaster
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Filament wrote...
Corypheus fight was one of the best designed fights in the DA series. They should keep doing things like that.
And improve party AI if possible, because of the whiners who had a giant problem with that, even though I didn't.
This was one fight that I really enjoyed. Had no problem keeping everyone alive and never used dog since I could not control dog. I did not bring a healer on several runs. Now that was a blast.
#132
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Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 05:57
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Filament wrote...
Why would they need to be able to avoid them tactically any more than they previously could avoid the generically spherical shaped charges from previous games? I was thinking more in terms of player usage, to be honest. One of the scrapped specializations for one of these games was Archmage, which might have had a kind of "spell shaping" ability (or maybe I'm thinking D&D archmage). But I think it would be cool, if you cast a fireball near a wall for example, if the blast would flatten and spread further along the wall, or things like that. Maybe you could target anywhere in 3d space and knock down chandeliers, etc.
Wait, what? They COULD avoid them in DA:O!
#133
Guest_Puddi III_*
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 05:59
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There must be some misunderstanding about what you mean by "avoid," because I'm pretty sure there was no vanilla tactic that allowed your companions to automatically avoid a fireball, for example.
#134
Guest_EntropicAngel_*
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 06:01
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MerinTB wrote...
Sylvius the Mad wrote...
He's not dead for long. The spectral dog never seems to die for long.
I don't claim to understand the spectral dog, but he's handy.
I used similar tactics to kill the Arishok.
Kiting. I'm ashamed to have to admit to resorting to it, but that fight was all about kiting.
Yup.
Horrible, horrible battle.
#135
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Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 06:05
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Filament wrote...
There must be some misunderstanding about what you mean by "avoid," because I'm pretty sure there was no vanilla tactic that allowed your companions to automatically avoid a fireball, for example.
It was in their...combat stance. I don't remember the name. The options were like "Aggressive," "Passive," etc., where the character either followed enemies to kill them, or only fought BACK, or only did what the controlled character did.
It was ABSOLUTELY a vanilla tactical option. It's on the right side of the tactics box, at the top.
#136
Guest_Puddi III_*
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 06:08
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That is referring to sustained area of effect abilities, I'm pretty sure (Inferno, etc; specifically, they will exit those areas rather than fight within them if they are not in the aggressive stance). They don't pre-emptively run out of the way of fireballs, at least, not that I've ever observed in my 10-ish playthroughs. That is what I thought you meant.
And if it it what you meant, you're probably wrong.
And if it it what you meant, you're probably wrong.
Modifié par Filament, 20 juillet 2013 - 06:09 .
#137
Guest_EntropicAngel_*
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 06:11
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I don't recall if they do that or not. I believe they do, actually--but it's irrelevant, because the Rock Wraith's AoE attack is sustained (it's several seconds long). The characters SHOULD have moved out of the way.
#138
Guest_Puddi III_*
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 06:20
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Ok, cuz I thought we were talking about my shaped charge idea in general, but all you wanna talk about is that stupid rock wraith. :'(
His attack was rather unique but yes, it would have been nice if they scripted the companions to pick up on the cue and run behind the pillars of their own volition. (while barking that intention for the player character as well)
His attack was rather unique but yes, it would have been nice if they scripted the companions to pick up on the cue and run behind the pillars of their own volition. (while barking that intention for the player character as well)
#139
Guest_EntropicAngel_*
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 06:21
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Well in all honesty I don't care that much about shaped charges and AoE attacks--I'm a rogue, we rarely use AoEs.
#140
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 02:53
MerinTB
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EntropicAngel wrote...
Yup.MerinTB wrote...
Kiting. I'm ashamed to have to admit to resorting to it, but that fight was all about kiting.Sylvius the Mad wrote...
He's not dead for long. The spectral dog never seems to die for long.
I don't claim to understand the spectral dog, but he's handy.
I used similar tactics to kill the Arishok.
Horrible, horrible battle.
Can you imagine that scene playing out in a movie?
Or that stupid other battle people are calling "the greatest BioWare has done"?
Seriously?
Anything that even gets CLOSE to that kind of crap in a film gets (rightly) called out by fans and critics alike. Say, Attack of the Clones and the platforming in the factory. Or Revenge of the Sith and the lava duel.
#141
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 04:14
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MerinTB wrote...
Anything that even gets CLOSE to that kind of crap in a film gets (rightly) called out by fans and critics alike. Say, Attack of the Clones and the platforming in the factory. Or Revenge of the Sith and the lava duel.
I liked the Lava Dual
BUt I'd happily take Corphy or the Rock Wraith over the AIrshock or just standing around hitting a boss. I prefer the DA:O High Dragon fights over the DA2 version.
#142
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 04:21
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The DA:O High Dragon fights were actually fun and they did'nt spend most of the fight on some cliff while waves of smaller dragons attacked you.If it wasn't for the Champion Armor I would skip DA2's High Dragon fight because it was so goddamn tedious and boring.addiction21 wrote...
MerinTB wrote...
Anything that even gets CLOSE to that kind of crap in a film gets (rightly) called out by fans and critics alike. Say, Attack of the Clones and the platforming in the factory. Or Revenge of the Sith and the lava duel.
I liked the Lava Dual
BUt I'd happily take Corphy or the Rock Wraith over the AIrshock or just standing around hitting a boss. I prefer the DA:O High Dragon fights over the DA2 version.
#143
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 04:42
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addiction21 wrote...
I liked the Lava DualMerinTB wrote...
Anything that even gets CLOSE to that kind of crap in a film gets (rightly) called out by fans and critics alike. Say, Attack of the Clones and the platforming in the factory. Or Revenge of the Sith and the lava duel.
"It's over, Anakin. I have the higher ground."
Alrighty then...
addiction21 wrote...
BUt I'd happily take Corphy or the Rock Wraith over the AIrshock or just standing around hitting a boss. I prefer the DA:O High Dragon fights over the DA2 version.
For the first part - no, I'd take the boss battles of DA:O ("standing around and hitting them, I guess") to the twitchy / pattern-memorization that is those other battles. I'd even take *shudder* kiting over "he flashes, then he spins, you block, then he twirls, you hide behind the crates, then he yawns, you have to shoot him in the mouth - rinse, repeat."
That said, yes, I absolutley agree with the latter part. DA:O High Dragon fights (and Archdemon fight) are far superior to the borefest, time-consuming Dragon fights in DA2 (that last bone-pit dragon fight isn't hard, even on Nightmare, it just takes FOREVER... the difficulty is in not slashing your wrists to just relieve the boredom!)
#144
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Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 06:12
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Why would I want to? Video games need not be compared to movies, books or real life. They are their own medium with their own strengths and weaknesses. If comparing videogames to how they'd play out in a movie, conventional RPG combat would also be laughable.MerinTB wrote...
Can you imagine that scene playing out in a movie?
Or that stupid other battle people are calling "the greatest BioWare has done"?
Seriously?
I have no problem with adding twitch elements personally, I happen to love twitchy attack pattern-style bosses whether in games like Megaman or action RPGs like Bastion or Ys. So maybe you can see where the difference of perspective stems from.
(Actually I'd rather object to calling it twitchy. It's rather the opposite of twitching, twitching is a reflex, patterns are about prediction and not relying on reflexes.)
Modifié par Filament, 20 juillet 2013 - 06:14 .
#145
Guest_EntropicAngel_*
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 06:48
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Filament wrote...
Why would I want to? Video games need not be compared to movies, books or real life. They are their own medium with their own strengths and weaknesses. If comparing videogames to how they'd play out in a movie, conventional RPG combat would also be laughable.
I have no problem with adding twitch elements personally, I happen to love twitchy attack pattern-style bosses whether in games like Megaman or action RPGs like Bastion or Ys. So maybe you can see where the difference of perspective stems from.
(Actually I'd rather object to calling it twitchy. It's rather the opposite of twitching, twitching is a reflex, patterns are about prediction and not relying on reflexes.)
I like twitch combat when appropriate too. I enjoy plenty of twitch games. I enjoyed Devil May Cry 4, a hack-n-slash that's all about twitch. I enjoy the Sonic games, which are pretty much the definition of twitch.
But just because I like it doesn't mean I think it belongs in an RPG.
#146
Guest_Puddi III_*
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 06:55
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Yes, we've all been over your "definition" of RPG ad nauseam.
Nonetheless, "action RPGs."
Nonetheless, "action RPGs."
#147
Guest_EntropicAngel_*
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 07:12
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What does "my 'definition' of RPG" have to do with it?
That sounds like you're making a dig to redirect my comment.
Regardless, DA has never been an Action RPG--why should it be? There are plenty--there are more Action RPGs than non-twitch ones these days. I don't see the need to dilute everything into one genre.
That sounds like you're making a dig to redirect my comment.
Regardless, DA has never been an Action RPG--why should it be? There are plenty--there are more Action RPGs than non-twitch ones these days. I don't see the need to dilute everything into one genre.
Modifié par EntropicAngel, 20 juillet 2013 - 07:13 .
#148
Guest_Puddi III_*
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 07:16
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"[So-called] twitch elements don't belong in RPGs"EntropicAngel wrote...
What does "my 'definition' of RPG" have to do with it?
Regardless, DA has never been an Action RPG
"Explore a vast, fantasy world at the brink of catastrophe in Dragon Age™: Inquisition, a next-generation action RPG"
Ok. :innocent:
#149
Guest_EntropicAngel_*
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 07:27
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...I did not know what at all.
That's disturbing--but, I stand corrected.
That's disturbing--but, I stand corrected.
#150
Guest_Puddi III_*
Posté 20 juillet 2013 - 07:33
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To be fair, you could justifiably rationalize it as meaningless from your perspective, as they've officially described every DA installment as an action RPG. But I don't think it's that inaccurate, and wouldn't have a problem with them making it "more actiony" so-to-speak. (or like other RPG genres; MMOs tend to have more engaging boss battles as well)
Modifié par Filament, 20 juillet 2013 - 07:34 .
