12 réponses à ce sujet

[henesua]

I really like the Sea Cave tileset, but I felt that it needed a roof. The only version I was aware of with roofs was NWNCQ's, but I did not like the muddy textures. Today I was thinking: what if I take the NWNCQ version of Sea Caves, but eliminate the NWNCQ textures? I tried it and it looked good. One texture however was missing, the one on the roof and the boulders Chico dropped in the water.

I made a new texture for the roof and boulders. I also applied the same texture as an override on the existing wall texture so it all flowed together. I tried several variations until I finally settled on one. I think it fits in with the other textures. Let me know what you think. I am rusty at art assets as I spend most of my time programming. Constructive criticism is more than welcome.

The tileset and four of the textures I experimented with are available for download on my Sea Cave Project page. I think this is just a first stab at improving this tileset. Other than the roofs, I don't like Chico's work on this one. The texture mapping is bad, the choice of light shafts through a roof is a bad one, and so on. Much can be done with this. I'd love it if someone picks this up and runs with it.

Enjoy.

Modifié par henesua, 21 juillet 2013 - 07:52 .

[Master Jax]

That's basically how I started modding the tilesets, Henesua. Chico's additions (those in the original version) seemed great to me, but I just never liked his choice of textures, so I started working with other projects which appealed more to me in the aesthetic department, while still using NWNCQ as a model basis. It's great you've decided to work along the same vein.

Also, a little out of topic, but something that I feel needs to be addressed, I haven't ignored your friend request. You see, for some reason, out of every other website I am in everyday, the Bioware Social Forums is the only one giving me trouble. I can't accept or send friend requests, and I can't send messages to new people; I can only reply to already existing messages. So, as you can tell, I can't either add you as a friend, nor privately let you know about this issue, because the moderators and webmaster have made it so we can't PM people who isn't already a friend. Again, it wasn't me being dismissive or anything.

[henesua]

No offense was taken, Master Jax. I appreciate all of that consideration on your part.

[Zwerkules]

I think the main problem with Chico's work is that he clutters the tilesets with objects like mushrooms, rocks, trees and so on which could far better be added as placeables if the builder chose so, which personally I wouldn't because his additions often don't make sense like hundreds of red mushrooms in the burrows tileset. Some additions like in the evil dungeon tileset look good, but destroy the versatility of the tileset. People might have used it in their modules for something else than what Chico imagined when he made those additions.
I think an override shouldn't remove anything where the walkmesh defines the terrain as not walkable nor should it add something where you can walk and the walkmesh of a tile should be untouched except for bug fixes.
Something else an override shouldn't do is change the 'spirit' of a tileset. If you want your caves tileset to be crystal caves, make it a new tileset, not an override because most people don't use the caves tileset for crytal caves but for perfectly normal caves.

[henesua]

Hey Zwerkules. Thanks for chiming in.

I haven't looked at how much was added by Chico.

The boulders that I know he added however are in the water, and so while I prefer to have that open visually for users of a dimension door spell I can live with that.

What I need to find out is if whether there are other additions I'd rather not have in there. I might get to that eventually, but I'm on to the next task right now.

[Master Jax]

I agree with Zwerk from a bulder's point of view, but as I have always stated, most of us AREN'T builders, and can't benefit from the builder's perspective.

Consider how many modules are already released in the Vault. Those aren't being actively modified to include newer content, or worked their tilesets in a "correct" manner. The vast majority of modules available won't be further modified, so, as a player, and not a builder, the best we can do is find overrides that do what the original author couldn't or wouldn't do. I believe this is what Chico intended with his NWNCQ project. Granted, it was sort of... over-enthusiastic!... but I can get behind the general idea.

As a builder, different tilesets, ambiance-creation, placeable-laying,... they all sound great, but as a player, none of that means anything if the author can't or won't use the content.

As for the Sea Cave Tileset Henesua, I believe you chose the one tileset Chico touched the least! ^,^ If I recall correctly, this one had only rocks and branches added here and there.

[henesua]

So let me just ask.

Is the texture I did alright? Does it work? You two are very good at textures. Give me some criticism so I can improve.

I did also upload the texture variants as a secondary download. The texture I chose in that archive is "c" I think.

Modifié par henesua, 21 juillet 2013 - 06:14 .

[Master Jax]

I like the rock "4e" variant. Mostly because it seems to bring a more... "aquatic" feel to the caves. There's not much difference between the variants though, so it is mostly a matter of color taste!

Also, I like sharp images best, so of course I would like 4b and 4e!

Modifié par Master Jax, 21 juillet 2013 - 07:01 .

[Zwerkules]

I think the colour isn't quite right in 4e. I like 4b best. But that's just from looking at the textures. I don't know what it looks like in game. The colour you chose in your screenshots blends very well with the other textures of that tileset.

[Zwerkules]

Master Jax wrote...

I agree with Zwerk from a bulder's point of view, but as I have always stated, most of us AREN'T builders, and can't benefit from the builder's perspective.

Consider how many modules are already released in the Vault. Those aren't being actively modified to include newer content, or worked their tilesets in a "correct" manner. The vast majority of modules available won't be further modified, so, as a player, and not a builder, the best we can do is find overrides that do what the original author couldn't or wouldn't do. I believe this is what Chico intended with his NWNCQ project. Granted, it was sort of... over-enthusiastic!... but I can get behind the general idea.

You misunderstood me. I wasn't talking about builders building modules now, who shouldn't use the old Bioware tilesets anyway because there are better newer ones. I was talking about hundreds of builders who already built modules using a certain tileset for a certain setting which Chico's work will destroy in many, many cases.
A good example are the statues he added. Many people may have used a tileset (which didn't have those statues) for let's say a dwarven stronghold. Now Chico's override adds lots of human statues in a dwarven stronghold.
The evil dungeon tileset will also destroy a lot of ambience a builder worked hard to achieve because it has so many elements that will look totally out of place in that setting.
And hundreds of fly agarics in a burrow don't make sense, no matter what kind of look the builder was trying to achieve.
What I am saying here is that if you have to add stuff to a tileset that has been used many, many times already, it has to be very generic and not nearly as specific as what Chico added.

Modifié par Zwerkules, 21 juillet 2013 - 07:34 .

[henesua]

thanks zwerk and Jax. I guess the general take away is that I just need to keep working at it, and develop my eye again.

I've been coding too long....

[henesua]

Zwerkules wrote...
What I am saying here is that if you have to add stuff to a tileset that has been used many, many times already, it has to be very generic and not nearly as specific as what Chico added.

Fully agree. Less is more in my mind.

Modifié par henesua, 21 juillet 2013 - 07:36 .

[henesua]

UPDATE:
lightshafts removed.