364 réponses à ce sujet

[rohanks]

Fixers0 wrote...

Friends? I'm sorry but Commander TJ Shepard doesn't give a single **** about friends!

Mmmmm. "TJ". The Jerk perhaps? I take it this isn't a reference to William Shatner and his post-Star Trek exploits 

[Ranger Jack Walker]

Redbelle wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

I feel sorry for people who pass judgment on others so quickly.

Most people left on this forum played the EC as there first experience with the story. Others did not. Some people played the game perhaps one time from ME1 through ME3 maybe with the DLCs for ME2. Others played the game with all the DLC. Others may have played the story multiple times tweaking it in various different ways to see what different outcomes they could get, and they formed emotional attachements to the characters in the universe.

The OP's post is in one of the links below in my blog. I had 1200 hours invested in the game. I made one final run from ME1 through ME2 with all the DLC prior to the release of ME3. It was going to be the best game I'd ever played. Even the decision I made about the rachni was going to make a huge difference in the final battle! That's what I think Casey or was it one of the Doctors said in the pregame hype. It wasn't going to be an A, B, or C ending. I stood in line outside Gamestop on Monday night for my preorder. I never do that. It was raining. I got the game and went home and played for two hours. I used my first character ever. I was going to go through all of them in order because every decision we made in the series was supposed to make a difference. I couldn't import her face. I had to make a new face.

What was happening to the universe I grew to love? What happened to my character? And those dreams made no sense. Why were they there? Now I'm supposed to play this multi-player to get the best outcome for the story, too? Okay. I'll try it just to make sure I get the best outcome. The universe was just being destroyed. Wait a minute. Something's wrong here. Tali was never exiled. I did her pilgrimage, she was acquitted, but there she was: exiled. Legion? You want reaper code? Are you insane? No. Too many tears in the story. Too many deaths. What the reapers did to everyone, and every world, I felt nothing but rage and vengeance. Then when I got to the ending and got hit by that beam, it was like getting hit in the gut.

I saw odd things up in the Citadel. Things like my pistol didn't shoot Keepers. Was I even alive? Was this a bad dream? Then I had the confrontation with The Illusive Man and shot him; sat with Anderson and he died; then Hackett's call; then the conversation with the Catalyst.

"Releasing the energy of the Crucible will destroy the mass relays." And of course you had to release the energy of the crucible for any ending. I shot the tube. "An End Once And For All" began to play and everything was just suddenly ripped away. Arrival showed what happened when a mass relay was destroyed. I just blew up the galaxy. 3:20 a.m. 22 March 2012. ... Somehow Liara, Javik and Joker survived. I took a gasp of air.

I thought I did something wrong. I went to these forums. All the endings were the same. You died; The mass relays exploded; and the Normandy crashed. The only difference was the color on your screen. WTF? Who the hell thought this was a good idea? The ending just left me with questions. Was anyone even alive? I just wanted to see Liara again after the war. Apparently that was asking too much.

There was no closure to the story. This was the problem. They tried to make it up to us with The Citadel DLC, but they didn't make it Post-Ending, because it would have required changing the ending and possibly canonizing one ending to do it. So they made it pre-ending, and thought that would cut it, and still many people, myself included use it as "The Ending" and forget the war because the real ending sucks so bad. It still leaves an open ending -- Shepard and company go on to win the war. How? It doesn't matter. They defeat the reapers because they rested and partied.

QFT

It's just a story. I invested many years and hours into the Warcraft Universe but I feel that they've royally screwed up everything that was good about the story in the RTS games in the MMO. I was angry when they so casually disposed of Illidan. I was angry when Kael'thas was turned from a well-intentioned extremist to a power hungry lunatic. I was angry when the peace between the horde and alliance that was secured in the RTS games was set aside for gameplay reasons.

But instead of complaining about it constantly, I gave up. I occasionaly keep tabs to see if they did something right but aside from that I've moved on. I've read posts about how posters when into '2 month long depressions' or how the series geve them 'headaches and sleepless nights'. Stop it. It's just a story. It's unhealthy to not move on after more than a year.

[ShepnTali]

I don't think pretend dr. Phils are required for Julia's post.

[DeathScepter]

Your friend needs help. So I am sending a group of men in white coats to help him.*sends a team of Cerberus phantoms to OP's friend and send him to a Mental health hosptial*

[SlottsMachine]

Morocco Mole wrote...

"One Year Later | I Realize Why The Endings [Still] Hurt

Oh grow up and get over yourself. It's a mediocore videogame ending. It isn't like coming home and finding your spouse in bed with another person.

You've been smooching with my brother, haven't you! In fact you've been smooching with everyone....

[IntelligentME3Fanboy]

 sigh.. months..depression...a videogame...

www.youtube.com/watch

top comment:your friend,sorry

Modifié par IntelligentME3Fanboy, 27 juillet 2013 - 10:35 .

[Ranger Jack Walker]

ShepnTali wrote...

I don't think pretend dr. Phils are required for Julia's post.

But snide remarks are required, apparently.

[Redbelle]

Ranger Jack Walker wrote...

Redbelle wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

I feel sorry for people who pass judgment on others so quickly.

Most people left on this forum played the EC as there first experience with the story. Others did not. Some people played the game perhaps one time from ME1 through ME3 maybe with the DLCs for ME2. Others played the game with all the DLC. Others may have played the story multiple times tweaking it in various different ways to see what different outcomes they could get, and they formed emotional attachements to the characters in the universe.

The OP's post is in one of the links below in my blog. I had 1200 hours invested in the game. I made one final run from ME1 through ME2 with all the DLC prior to the release of ME3. It was going to be the best game I'd ever played. Even the decision I made about the rachni was going to make a huge difference in the final battle! That's what I think Casey or was it one of the Doctors said in the pregame hype. It wasn't going to be an A, B, or C ending. I stood in line outside Gamestop on Monday night for my preorder. I never do that. It was raining. I got the game and went home and played for two hours. I used my first character ever. I was going to go through all of them in order because every decision we made in the series was supposed to make a difference. I couldn't import her face. I had to make a new face.

What was happening to the universe I grew to love? What happened to my character? And those dreams made no sense. Why were they there? Now I'm supposed to play this multi-player to get the best outcome for the story, too? Okay. I'll try it just to make sure I get the best outcome. The universe was just being destroyed. Wait a minute. Something's wrong here. Tali was never exiled. I did her pilgrimage, she was acquitted, but there she was: exiled. Legion? You want reaper code? Are you insane? No. Too many tears in the story. Too many deaths. What the reapers did to everyone, and every world, I felt nothing but rage and vengeance. Then when I got to the ending and got hit by that beam, it was like getting hit in the gut.

I saw odd things up in the Citadel. Things like my pistol didn't shoot Keepers. Was I even alive? Was this a bad dream? Then I had the confrontation with The Illusive Man and shot him; sat with Anderson and he died; then Hackett's call; then the conversation with the Catalyst.

"Releasing the energy of the Crucible will destroy the mass relays." And of course you had to release the energy of the crucible for any ending. I shot the tube. "An End Once And For All" began to play and everything was just suddenly ripped away. Arrival showed what happened when a mass relay was destroyed. I just blew up the galaxy. 3:20 a.m. 22 March 2012. ... Somehow Liara, Javik and Joker survived. I took a gasp of air.

I thought I did something wrong. I went to these forums. All the endings were the same. You died; The mass relays exploded; and the Normandy crashed. The only difference was the color on your screen. WTF? Who the hell thought this was a good idea? The ending just left me with questions. Was anyone even alive? I just wanted to see Liara again after the war. Apparently that was asking too much.

There was no closure to the story. This was the problem. They tried to make it up to us with The Citadel DLC, but they didn't make it Post-Ending, because it would have required changing the ending and possibly canonizing one ending to do it. So they made it pre-ending, and thought that would cut it, and still many people, myself included use it as "The Ending" and forget the war because the real ending sucks so bad. It still leaves an open ending -- Shepard and company go on to win the war. How? It doesn't matter. They defeat the reapers because they rested and partied.

QFT

It's just a story. I invested many years and hours into the Warcraft Universe but I feel that they've royally screwed up everything that was good about the story in the RTS games in the MMO. I was angry when they so casually disposed of Illidan. I was angry when Kael'thas was turned from a well-intentioned extremist to a power hungry lunatic. I was angry when the peace between the horde and alliance that was secured in the RTS games was set aside for gameplay reasons.

But instead of complaining about it constantly, I gave up. I occasionaly keep tabs to see if they did something right but aside from that I've moved on. I've read posts about how posters when into '2 month long depressions' or how the series geve them 'headaches and sleepless nights'. Stop it. It's just a story. It's unhealthy to not move on after more than a year.

Ooooooh, but if only it vas over!

Their going to make a 4? Right? And they thought they could get away with not balancing the story with gameplay in 3? So they might do it again..... because they've already done it in the past.

Until they release their next game the adage, your only as good as your last release holds true.

Sure, we've moved on. But BW's latest game release schedule hasn't.

Which is not to say fast track DA or ME. They need to spend the time they need polishing those up for the video game playing audience. Because the next time they make a release it has to not do what ME3 did.

Besides. For the creative people on BSN ME3's ending is a very good study of how not to write. On principal. What narrative traps you can fall into etc.

Modifié par Redbelle, 28 juillet 2013 - 12:05 .

[Jadebaby]

Not to mention the completely contrived "goodbye scenes" on priority earth and then the cheesy "2nd goodbye" with LI on Beam Run.

That's why I love mehem. It gives us back this reign of our personal universe *without* being too overly happy.

It really brings into light the sacrifices made along the way; Legion, Thane, Mordin, Anderson.

Due to the inherent problems with the Original ending, and the arbitrarily forced "feel sad dammit!" feeling from BioWare, I never shed another tear for these guys after their respective death scenes.

But mehem gives you an opportunity to look back through your playthrough and feel for these guys another time. It makes you think about them not being able to see a tomorrow after the Reaper War. I shed another tear for them then and that's when I realized mehem wasn't just an ending fix or patch, it was a different ending, a better ending.

Modifié par Jadebaby, 28 juillet 2013 - 12:41 .

[AlanC9]

So having less sadness in the game let you feel more sadness?

[mopotter]

frostajulie wrote...

iakus wrote...

Valhart wrote...

That's the point. They didn't get Shepard spending the rest of his or her days with his or her LI among other things. They argue that they didn't like the ending because it made no thematic sense with the rest of the series, yet those same people claim that Citadel DLC is their ending to the game, that it made them OK with the endings of ME3. Do you see my point? If the party was the end of ME3 I'm fairly positive that the backlash from the endings would of been much smaller, because it was a happy ending.

Don't get my wrong, while I might be fine with the endings, I know that they are a far cry from what they should have been at launch, and I mostly put that down to the time constraints they worked under, and I do believe Bioware or EA or whoever is in charge is under no illusions now if they put out a half done ending like ME3 had that they are going to be done as a company, DA:I getting another year of development is a pretty good indicator of this.

The sentiments are not mutually exclusive.  

I mean, DA2 didnt' really make a whole lot of sense.  Story-wise, it was a complete mess.  But in the end, things can work out (more or less) for Hawke.  A happy ending can do wonders to mollify people.  It's the silver lining, payoff, the final emotion you take away form an experience, "The story sucked, but at least..."

This is why people adopt Citadel as their personal endings.  Because even though ME3 was a thematic mess, a contradiction to the rest of the trilogy, and a railroaded tragedy for a lot of people.  At least with Citadel, you can smile and enjoy the characters we've all come to know and love over five years.

"The story sucked, but at least..."

yeah I despise the endings for multiple reasons, I do not have to pick just one.  But this is my biggest.  after all that time invested I want the emotional payout I have come to expect from a video game.  Any ****ing videogame.  In Mario I save the princess, In Zelda I defeat Gannon I don't collaborate with him to commit a warcrime against Hyrule and in ME I defeat the big bad and stride from whatever rubble with confidence.

ME3's ending was a choice of how to lose.

Yes.  All that time, all those years and for what.   It's not that I wanted just  the ME1 and ME2 ending emotional high, Shepard and some friends survived, a moment of reflection on those who passed, but i did expect one to give me that joy feeling on some of the play throughs that I would have played if it had been there.

[Jadebaby]

In a way yes. Because it was sadness done right. Technically no however, because I was more frustrated and mad at the originals which voided any proper feeling I could have had for these sacrifices made along the way. It made it feel like TWD. Like I didn't want it to happen, but it was done so well I couldn't help but applaud.

[Taboo]

You must always face the curtain with a bow.

You should always try to look on the bright side of life.

Modifié par Taboo-XX, 28 juillet 2013 - 05:14 .

[rafhoffmann2013]

I na relate to your experience.

after I finished ME3 I hated the ending with all my gut.
I tought it was because of the loopholes in the story, or because it was poorly written.

Now I understand that, like many others, I also came to "know and love" the characters of the ME universe. Tali, Grunt, Miranda, Samara, Garrus......

I guess the ending hurt because a part of me didn't want it to end.... no more adventures, no further bonding with Tali, or Liara, or Vakarian.

The end hurt because it was the end.

Even if Shepard had survived, and Edi and the Geth had survived the destruction of the reapers, and Shepard and Tali got married and built a house on Rannoch.... even then I would feel bittersweet when the credits started to roll.

ME 1, 2 and 3 were a hell of a ride. Parting ways with sheppard and his friends, if you're really into the ME universe and didn't simply push buttons around for 200 hours, was probably a very sad goodbye. It was so for me, at least.

[rafhoffmann2013]

PS: when I finished ME3 I even published a very agressive post trashing the end of the trlogy - that's how frustrated I was.

But that sentimento was not true, thanks to mass effect I can't play other games, theiy're just not fun anymore. I own very good games, from other publishers, which I'll not mention here, but compared to ME( the greatest gamees i've ever played), they lose their colors.

[Redbelle]

rafhoffmann2013 wrote...

PS: when I finished ME3 I even published a very agressive post trashing the end of the trlogy - that's how frustrated I was.

But that sentimento was not true, thanks to mass effect I can't play other games, theiy're just not fun anymore. I own very good games, from other publishers, which I'll not mention here, but compared to ME( the greatest gamees i've ever played), they lose their colors.

Playing and finishing any game that sucks you in is has an element of sadness. You enjoy the experience. The experience ends.

It's the typical childhood "Again Again"! moment that we all tell ourselves we grow out of. But in reality, get's buried beneath adult expectation.

But seriously. Adults? Playing video games? That's pretty childish........ and the thing that people have trouble adjusting to is that it's perfectly ok to enjoy life in that child mindset. It's the unbridled joy of doing something. Being invested in it. And hoping the feeling goes on forever.

Of course there is a niggling feeling at the back of everyone's mind that says what begins must one day end. But hitting ending's is always a sad experience. Tempered by the accomplishment.

By the end of ME3 I expected to have taken the fight TO the Reaper's. The game didn't let me.

I expected Shepard could die. And by the same token, not die. Depending on my decision's because BE and ME are about making choice's that can lead to different outcomes and the ME2 suicide mission showed just how far BW could push that philosophy. You can, after all, kill Shepard in ME2 and have that be the end of his story. Several times in different ways. It was brave of BW to take those choices and made the game break out of it's mold to a degree............... ME3 did none of these things.

The reason why this opinion about ME3 keeps cropping up?

I really, really don't want BW to pull the same thing with any of it's future titles. I like BW as a developer who made the push from ME1 to ME2. The level of development from ME2 to ME3 feel's like watching a friend fade away with Alzeimer's. It looks like ME on the surface, but there is something important missing.

And coming back to what I was talking about at the start. If you have a sad ending, and then blow the story out a porthole to go on a wild fantasy of non cohesive, speculative indulgence that does nothing to bring element's of the journey along with you..........

That's just not BW. Before ME3 they just didn't do that to this extent.  And I'd rather see them develop games that play like the old BW. Evolving and developing. But knowing how to put together and develop a release.

Because I really want to enjoy more BW games in the future. Not see them pull another ME3 which, looking outside the box, generated all this faff.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Jadebaby wrote...

In a way yes. Because it was sadness done right. Technically no however, because I was more frustrated and mad at the originals which voided any proper feeling I could have had for these sacrifices made along the way. It made it feel like TWD. Like I didn't want it to happen, but it was done so well I couldn't help but applaud.

It's something that was missing from the game's ending -- closure. There was no closure to the original ending or with the Extended cut ending -- Well Control and Synthesis got closure -- Shepard was dead. High EMS Destroy never got closure with a survival and reunion with the LI, few would pick control or synthesis on a replay and that's why they never gave it.

Modifié par sH0tgUn jUliA, 28 juillet 2013 - 09:35 .

[voteDC]

My Shepard had defeated the impossible at every turn, I wanted that to happen one more time.

Now when I play I use the MEHEM. This to me is what high EMS destroy should have been. Save the world and get the girl.

[DirtyPhoenix]

IntelligentME3Fanboy wrote...

 sigh.. months..depression...a videogame...

www.youtube.com/watch

top comment:your friend,sorry

lol!!

[AlanC9]

Redbelle wrote...

I expected Shepard could die. And by the same token, not die. Depending on my decision's because BE and ME are about making choice's that can lead to different outcomes and the ME2 suicide mission showed just how far BW could push that philosophy. You can, after all, kill Shepard in ME2 and have that be the end of his story. Several times in different ways. It was brave of BW to take those choices and made the game break out of it's mold to a degree............... ME3 did none of these things.

ME3 broke out of its mold too. It just didn't do it in a way you liked. 

[KaiserShep]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Jadebaby wrote...

In a way yes. Because it was sadness done right. Technically no however, because I was more frustrated and mad at the originals which voided any proper feeling I could have had for these sacrifices made along the way. It made it feel like TWD. Like I didn't want it to happen, but it was done so well I couldn't help but applaud.

It's something that was missing from the game's ending -- closure. There was no closure to the original ending or with the Extended cut ending -- Well Control and Synthesis got closure -- Shepard was dead. High EMS Destroy never got closure with a survival and reunion with the LI, few would pick control or synthesis on a replay and that's why they never gave it.

Even something simple like an open-ended rescue scene would've worked. Look at the ending of Children of Men. The overall source of the conflict is not yet resolved, yet the audience is given imagery that makes the possibilities significantly more hopeful. Of course, in the case of Mass Effect, it would be something like a spotlight shining over the rubble Shepard's body is in. While I can rightly assume that the rescue happens, assumptions just don't provide the same kind of catharsis as the imagery to back it up.

Modifié par KaiserShep, 28 juillet 2013 - 04:03 .

[Redbelle]

AlanC9 wrote...

Redbelle wrote...

I expected Shepard could die. And by the same token, not die. Depending on my decision's because BE and ME are about making choice's that can lead to different outcomes and the ME2 suicide mission showed just how far BW could push that philosophy. You can, after all, kill Shepard in ME2 and have that be the end of his story. Several times in different ways. It was brave of BW to take those choices and made the game break out of it's mold to a degree............... ME3 did none of these things.

ME3 broke out of its mold too. It just didn't do it in a way you liked. 

No. ME3 did not break out of the mold.

ME3 remained within the mold.

ME1's was in the mold. ME2's ending was out of the mold when it introduced variable end outcomes that relied on multiple decision's made throughout the game to have an end effect on how the variable sliding outcome of the suicide mission,

ME3 essentially went back to ME1's mold where nothing you do makes a huge difference. As opposed to ME2's anyone can die in a variety of way's, unless you've done X.

ME3 slipped back into the mold of ME1.

It did not expand on the nature of ME2's take on how a decision making RPG ending can be influenced to such a huge degree.

[chemiclord]

Redbelle wrote...

No. ME3 did not break out of the mold.

ME3 remained within the mold.

ME1's was in the mold. ME2's ending was out of the mold when it introduced variable end outcomes that relied on multiple decision's made throughout the game to have an end effect on how the variable sliding outcome of the suicide mission,

ME3 essentially went back to ME1's mold where nothing you do makes a huge difference. As opposed to ME2's anyone can die in a variety of way's, unless you've done X.

ME3 slipped back into the mold of ME1.

It did not expand on the nature of ME2's take on how a decision making RPG ending can be influenced to such a huge degree.

I would argue that the number of permutations created by ME2 "breaking the mold" made it practically impossible for ME3 to do anything BUT narrow the narrative to a point.