239 réponses à ce sujet

[Sylvius the Mad]

devSin wrote...

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

I'm not even sure how console games would work without a mouse, in some cases. Is it possible, for example, to select multiple party members at the same time in DA2 on consoles? How do you do it?

I don't think there's any micro movement (you just move if the button is held down), which would make selecting multiple characters mostly useless anyway?

The only way to make party members not act on their own is to have them selected.  So if you want 2 party members to go do something, and the rest to stay out of trouble, you could give two party members instructions to go do something (like attack something), and then select the rest of the party, even just to have them stand still.

I still say we're going to lose mouse control outside the interface with the new engine.

That would be a travesty.  I typically use the mouse for everything except camera control (which I map to the WASD area) and pausing (spacebar).

[Fast Jimmy]

The only way to make party members not act on their own is to have them selected. So if you want 2 party members to go do something, and the rest to stay out of trouble, you could give two party members instructions to go do something (like attack something), and then select the rest of the party, even just to have them stand still.

There is no way to select two members of the party at the same time on the console. You could use the shoulder bars to select the entire party, but not just certain multiple individuals.

What you would need to do is select the single individual, tell them to go somewhere/attack something, select the other individual, tell them to go to the same somewhere/ attack something.

All of this done with the radial menu up (which is nice, along with the XBox button, which pauses gameplay completely at any time, including cutscenes mid-dialogue), so no a film is going on I. The meantime. It is an extra step in the process, though.

Still possible to get

[devSin]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

The only way to make party members not act on their own is to have them selected.  So if you want 2 party members to go do something, and the rest to stay out of trouble, you could give two party members instructions to go do something (like attack something), and then select the rest of the party, even just to have them stand still.

Ah, yes, AI only runs for unselected characters.

I'm not sure the console version offers enough control to make that worthwhile behavior (though I think DA2 doesn't have as many concessions as Origins, where I think they basically hit the entire game with the nerf bat just to make it playable).

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

That would be a travesty.  I typically use the mouse for everything except camera control (which I map to the WASD area) and pausing (spacebar).

I just don't see them adding a bunch of that stuff into the engine (unlike Eclipse, Frostbite is undoubtedly built from the ground up for consoles).

My money would be on something like Mass Effect, where you have to aim the reticle and give static commands. That seems the most console-centric solution.

Needless to say, I'm very much awaiting the gameplay videos.

Modifié par devSin, 02 août 2013 - 07:18 .

[Sylvius the Mad]

Fast Jimmy wrote...

The only way to make party members not act on their own is to have them selected. So if you want 2 party members to go do something, and the rest to stay out of trouble, you could give two party members instructions to go do something (like attack something), and then select the rest of the party, even just to have them stand still.

There is no way to select two members of the party at the same time on the console. You could use the shoulder bars to select the entire party, but not just certain multiple individuals.

What you would need to do is select the single individual, tell them to go somewhere/attack something, select the other individual, tell them to go to the same somewhere/ attack something.

All of this done with the radial menu up (which is nice, along with the XBox button, which pauses gameplay completely at any time, including cutscenes mid-dialogue), so no a film is going on I. The meantime. It is an extra step in the process, though.

Still possible to get

I used it for pulling enemies.  I'd attack from range with those characters who could, while the others would have to stand and wait (or get into a flanking position, but usually just wait) until the enemies closed the distance.

It was less important in DAO, because everyone could use ranged weapons, but without that in DA2 I needed some way to keep the melee characters from engaging the enemy before the enemy had reached the ground I'd chosen.

[devSin]

Would it have been as necessary if the hold button weren't completely useless?

[devSin]

Filament wrote...

If you can't command a character to perform movement actions independently while paused on the console, that itself would seem antithetical to the party-based gameplay that we were discussing before. That is, if you're required to effectively use WASD in console form (the joysticks to move), you have to be possessing the character all the way from point A to B, precluding your commanding other characters at the same time...

I think maybe it's like Mass Effect.

There's a wheel, and you can send characters to where you point the camera (or have them attack the target under the reticle, etc.).

You just have to do it individually, and it has to be somewhere you can point the camera (vertical terrain must suck on consoles, since the targeting in Eclipse is still pretty crappy).

That's what it sounds like, at any rate.

Modifié par devSin, 02 août 2013 - 07:31 .

[esper]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

I'm not even sure how console games would work without a mouse, in some cases. Is it possible, for example, to select multiple party members at the same time in DA2 on consoles? How do you do it?

On PC, you just drag a box around the characters you want to select.

I should go ask this question on the DA2 forum. I'm genuinely interested.

I am not sure if it was answered, but on PS3 you press r1 + l1.

No idea for x-box, but I guess it was the same.


Completely different, but I would be very sad if it became battle as in dragon's dogma. It always drove me crazy that I could not take direct control of my party members there and that lack was always what lessened the experience off Mass Effect for me. 

There is a reason I prefer the PSP version of persona 3 over the original. Direct control beats being forced to issue tactics a lot.

[esper]

devSin wrote...

Filament wrote...

If you can't command a character to perform movement actions independently while paused on the console, that itself would seem antithetical to the party-based gameplay that we were discussing before. That is, if you're required to effectively use WASD in console form (the joysticks to move), you have to be possessing the character all the way from point A to B, precluding your commanding other characters at the same time...

I think maybe it's like Mass Effect.

There's a wheel, and you can send characters to where you point the camera (or have them attack the target under the reticle, etc.).

You just have to do it individually, and it has to be somewhere you can point the camera (vertical terrain must suck on consoles, since the targeting in Eclipse is still pretty crappy).

That's what it sounds like, at any rate.

As a console gamer I will say it as it is. You can command characters to perform actions indepently.

I simply paused. Take full controll of the whole party for a group command (such attack on an enemy) or swap between members while paused and selected the talents and targets.

You aim with the cross hair in the middle of the veil or run there while fully controll the character. If you want to move all characters you simply have them all selected and then either run with the one you are controlling or use the move symbol (on the veil).

If you want to say move three and have one standing back as bait you select all. Choose the move symbol, select where you want it moved and then select a single and chose those amongst your companions that you want to move to indiviual places, indiviually.

[devSin]

esper wrote...

Completely different, but I would be very sad if it became battle as in dragon's dogma. It always drove me crazy that I could not take direct control of my party members there and that lack was always what lessened the experience off Mass Effect for me.

They've said it's going to be party-based, and I assume that means we'll be able to control each of the companions.

The parallel I was trying to draw with ME was with how the controls operate (since there's no mouse control even on the PC version, except for the platform-specific UI).

[esper]

devSin wrote...

esper wrote...

Completely different, but I would be very sad if it became battle as in dragon's dogma. It always drove me crazy that I could not take direct control of my party members there and that lack was always what lessened the experience off Mass Effect for me.

They've said it's going to be party-based, and I assume that means we'll be able to control each of the companions.

The parallel I was trying to draw with ME was with how the controls operate (since there's no mouse control even on the PC version, except for the platform-specific UI).

Yeah I know. That was more to answer the general topic of 'please make it to dragon's dogma'. Hence the completely different in my intro.

As for the ME comparision:

If you picked the move when all companions were selected simply you could aim with the cross hair in the radial menu. (Four white I think it was circles represented the positions appeared and then you simply moved them across the map.) If you wanted to target enemies you had to use the cross hair in the radial menu. I don't remember how it was in ME I gave up on using me companions there.

[esper]

Filament wrote...

This move symbol on the "veil" (radial menu?) sounds like the solution I was looking for. You can point the character to move to a specific spot with the camera and then control another character as they do so? I stand corrected, then.

I don't know what you mean with the camera perse, but you move them across the map with you joystick once the 'move symbol' has been selected. And you can at anytime as long as the game is paused select move all and then jump between individual and either select a new 'move' or direct control. The only thing important was that 'hold position' was active, so they ai didn't get its own idea.

As I remember it was lacking in da:o. (So irritating), but in da2 I used it alot. Espically since I was found off the three mage + ranged rouge combination.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Filament wrote...

If you can't command a character to perform movement actions independently while paused on the console, that itself would seem antithetical to the party-based gameplay that we were discussing before. That is, if you're required to effectively use WASD in console form (the joysticks to move), you have to be possessing the character all the way from point A to B, precluding your commanding other characters at the same time...

That's how KotOR worked.

That was the biggest thing wrong with KotOR.

[Sylvius the Mad]

esper wrote...

I am not sure if it was answered, but on PS3 you press r1 + l1.

That selects all of them, not just some of them.

It was answered.  You can't do it.  You can select one or all, but those are your only options.

[Jonata]

I'd like to see them take a hint or two from Dragon's Dogma character creation but when it comes to gameplay Dark Souls is king. Realistic to a certain extent, visceral and very powerful without ever falling in that silly JRPG style that is definitely not appropriate for a medieval fantasy setting.

Obviously DA:I doesn't need to be as hard as DS, but since they're looking to change how the gameplay works, DS is definitely something to look at.

[Bionuts]

Dark Souls is great, but sort of easy. Not sure why people say it's hard. Play a Sorcerer and farm 9000 thousand souls per minute, one shotting Sentinels with Soul Spear.

[Jonata]

Bionuts wrote...

Dark Souls is great, but sort of easy. Not sure why people say it's hard. Play a Sorcerer and farm 9000 thousand souls per minute, one shotting Sentinels with Soul Spear.

Well the fact that there is a way to go around the obstacle (specific builds, for example, like Sorcerer or Pyromancer with specific stats) does not invalidate the fact that Dark Souls is generally a very though experience and that the entire game it's built around the concept of dying a LOT to reach your goal. 

I would not like a Dragon Age with this kind of structure, but Dark Souls also has one of the best melee combat I've ever seen in a fantasy game, at least when it comes to Warriors. 

Modifié par Jonata, 03 août 2013 - 10:47 .

[MarchWaltz]

If you want good character creation take it from APB (All Points Bulletin)

That is the best character creation tool I have ever seen in a game.

[SeismicGravy]

Bionuts wrote...

Dark Souls is great, but sort of easy. Not sure why people say it's hard.

Unless you are Chuck Norris on acid, it's damn well impossible.

[Jonata]

MarchWaltz wrote...

If you want good character creation take it from APB (All Points Bulletin)

That is the best character creation tool I have ever seen in a game.

Y'know that's a pretty good call. APB was not that great but the CCT was incredible. Almost at Saint's Row 2 levels of customization but with way more graphical complexity and satisfactory results. 

[KiwiQuiche]

Oh look, another person trying to act hardcore by being "omg dark souls was so easy for me hurr". :| Give it a rest.

And seriously, how many people in here even read the bloody OP? Trista is talking about the CHARACTER CREATION. Not the combat, not the difficulty, not the pawn system, just the character creation. She clarifies that in her first bloody sentence.

Reading comprehension, what is it.



In regards to said OP, yup I would love the CC from Dragon's Dogma. Dragon Age's CC are kinda lousy. Not to mention the lighting is crap, so you think it looks okay in the CC only to be horrid in the actual game. And they should let us see the PC in profile. Also, I wouldn't mind it being able to edit the PC whenever, or even be like Fallout where after the beginning of the game it'll ask if you wanna edit your character.

Modifié par KiwiQuiche, 04 août 2013 - 04:39 .