923 réponses à ce sujet

[SiniisteR]

StreetMagic wrote...

Morrigan is such an antisocial, rugged individualist that even if she was the default romance, she still wouldn't care to initiate many conversations or show her presence, unless asked. There's a big difference in how she is as a person compared to Liara.

I've noticed that. Even if shes not your LI, Liara does seem like someone who would care about how Shepard is feeling, but that really shouldn't mean that she gets authroity to show up in Shepard's cabin between nearly every mission. I still remember after the first dream sequence when she shows up while Shepard is washing his face in the bathroom. For all Liara knows, Shepard could be taking a **** and she still decides to check in and start talking with him/her.

[David7204]

'Between nearly every mission'?

Are you kidding me?

Modifié par BioWareMod01, 07 août 2013 - 12:41 .

[wolfhowwl]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

wolfhowwl wrote...

WittingEight65 wrote...

Aren't Liara and Garrus the most popular squadmates?

I'd too give more content to the most popular squadmates, is the most logical thing to do.

Yes.

Bioware released statistics in March:

Liara and Garrus came in at 24%

Tali was a lowly 7.8%

I'm certain that's influenced by the fact that she's only in the last 1/3rd of the game, and dies if you play a mindless paragon without an import. I was surprised (well, more disappointed than surprised) to see how many didn't have Wrex but cured the genophage anyway.

Uh yeah, Wreav flat-out tells you he's going to cause a post-war bloodbath.

[Barquiel]

Necanor wrote...

wolfhowwl wrote...

WittingEight65 wrote...

Aren't Liara and Garrus the most popular squadmates?

I'd too give more content to the most popular squadmates, is the most logical thing to do.

Yes.

Bioware released statistics in March:

Liara and Garrus came in at 24%

Tali was a lowly 7.8%

The official stats are a joke, they shouldn't be used for reference. They include 1 playthrough from player A and 10 playthroughs from player B. Check every poll, every survey from 3rd party sites and you'll find completely different results.

Not really. The Mass Effect universe survey (I linked) was the the most comprehensive and largest sample size we had before Bioware released the PAX statistics...and the result was very similar. Liara and Garrus were by far the most used/popular squadmates.

And most players do not join BSN or take part in forums. Most players just buy the game and play it. Bioware's statistics are definitely more accurate than some BSN poll (with 100-200 participants).

[HellbirdIV]

SiniisteR wrote...

Even if shes not your LI, Liara does seem like someone who would care about how Shepard is feeling, but that really shouldn't mean that she gets authroity to show up in Shepard's cabin between nearly every mission.

This is another thing I don't get why people are upset by.

Liara is Shepard's friend - wether you want to or not, that's in the nature of Autodialogue Shepard, the new protagonist of ME3 - so of course she's going to show up?

It's a small ship, Shepard is going through a lot of stressful situations on a daily - hell, even hourly - basis, and Liara is the one who knows her best. Why shouldn't she come up to visit? Stepping up to be there for a friend in need is nothing unusual.

[KaiserShep]

SiniisteR wrote...

StreetMagic wrote...

Morrigan is such an antisocial, rugged individualist that even if she was the default romance, she still wouldn't care to initiate many conversations or show her presence, unless asked. There's a big difference in how she is as a person compared to Liara.

I've noticed that. Even if shes not your LI, Liara does seem like someone who would care about how Shepard is feeling, but that really shouldn't mean that she gets authroity to show up in Shepard's cabin between nearly every mission. I still remember after the first dream sequence when she shows up while Shepard is washing his face in the bathroom. For all Liara knows, Shepard could be taking a **** and she still decides to check in and start talking with him/her.

In the first scene, she knocks and waits for Shepard to open the door. In the second and last scene she does this as a non-LI, she knocks and waits for Shepard to let her in. 

[TheWerdna]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

wolfhowwl wrote...

WittingEight65 wrote...

Aren't Liara and Garrus the most popular squadmates?

I'd too give more content to the most popular squadmates, is the most logical thing to do.

Yes.

Bioware released statistics in March:

Liara and Garrus came in at 24%

Tali was a lowly 7.8%

I'm certain that's influenced by the fact that she's only in the last 1/3rd of the game, and dies if you play a mindless paragon without an import. I was surprised (well, more disappointed than surprised) to see how many didn't have Wrex but cured the genophage anyway.

Indeed. Also, the fact that players without an inport (which make up over 50% of playthroughs) have to choose between geth and quarians, so thata another big amount where Tali is dead.

But as you said, since those numbers don't take into account the fact that several characters aren't recruited until the second half of the game. Or that Liara had 4 missions where she's a required squadmate.

[Sir DeLoria]

Barquiel wrote...
Not really. The Mass Effect universe survey (I linked) was the the most comprehensive and largest sample size we had before Bioware released the PAX statistics...and the result was very similar. Liara and Garrus were by far the most used/popular squadmates.

And most players do not join BSN or take part in forums. Most players just buy the game and play it. Bioware's statistics are definitely more accurate than some BSN poll (with 100-200 participants).

Yeah, what about multiple playthroughs? Most people I know, have made multiple playthroughs in order to see the effects of every different choice. Also, when ME3 was released lots of people had trouble with the Rannoch Arc and replayed it a few times, since it wasn't clear, that choosing the Geth would kill Tali. 

Also, most used =/= most popular

I'm not citing some BSN poll, I've done quite a bit of research on different official polls(IGN, QG, JSD etc) and am citing official critics.

[TheWerdna]

Barquiel wrote...

Necanor wrote...

wolfhowwl wrote...

WittingEight65 wrote...

Aren't Liara and Garrus the most popular squadmates?

I'd too give more content to the most popular squadmates, is the most logical thing to do.

Yes.

Bioware released statistics in March:

Liara and Garrus came in at 24%

Tali was a lowly 7.8%

The official stats are a joke, they shouldn't be used for reference. They include 1 playthrough from player A and 10 playthroughs from player B. Check every poll, every survey from 3rd party sites and you'll find completely different results.

Not really. The Mass Effect universe survey (I linked) was the the most comprehensive and largest sample size we had before Bioware released the PAX statistics...and the result was very similar. Liara and Garrus were by far the most used/popular squadmates.

And most players do not join BSN or take part in forums. Most players just buy the game and play it. Bioware's statistics are definitely more accurate than some BSN poll (with 100-200 participants).

Yes, though the lead Garrus and Liara had on everyone else was less prominent. Also, the fact that the Bioware Pax statisitcs are simply most used squadmate, which means usefullness in combat and when said character is recruited played a bit role. I don't think its by accedent that the three least used squadmates in those statistics weren't recruited until the second half of the game.

[SiniisteR]

StreetMagic wrote...

HellbirdIV wrote...

SiniisteR wrote...

Even if shes not your LI, Liara does seem like someone who would care about how Shepard is feeling, but that really shouldn't mean that she gets authroity to show up in Shepard's cabin between nearly every mission.

This is another thing I don't get why people are upset by.

Liara is Shepard's friend - wether you want to or not, that's in the nature of Autodialogue Shepard, the new protagonist of ME3 - so of course she's going to show up?

It's a small ship, Shepard is going through a lot of stressful situations on a daily - hell, even hourly - basis, and Liara is the one who knows her best. Why shouldn't she come up to visit? Stepping up to be there for a friend in need is nothing unusual.

Before this game, Shepard wasn't even necessarily "stressed". He was fighting thresher maws on foot, and punching pyjaks. That's another bad part of the autodialog. Just adding insult to injury. 1) I'm stressed. 2) I need Liara's attention

Fighting thresher maws on foot? Shepard can handle that. One kid on Earth dies, he's a wreck and needs Liara's shoulder to cry on. 

Even if Shepard did need someone to help get him through it, I'd much rather wait for Tali to show up then talking with her about it rather than Liara just because she's the only one there from the start. Shepard doesn't even ask for Liara's comfort, she just walts in and asks if Shepards ok, and it has to auto-dialogue so that he HAS to talk to her about it. 

[Barquiel]

wolfhowwl wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

wolfhowwl wrote...

WittingEight65 wrote...

Aren't Liara and Garrus the most popular squadmates?

I'd too give more content to the most popular squadmates, is the most logical thing to do.

Yes.

Bioware released statistics in March:

Liara and Garrus came in at 24%

Tali was a lowly 7.8%

I'm certain that's influenced by the fact that she's only in the last 1/3rd of the game, and dies if you play a mindless paragon without an import. I was surprised (well, more disappointed than surprised) to see how many didn't have Wrex but cured the genophage anyway.

Uh yeah, Wreav flat-out tells you he's going to cause a post-war bloodbath.

We still have Eve who makes the player see the krogan in a more sympathetic light (probably enough to say no to the salarian dalatrass...a very unsympathetic character ). I didn't cure the genophage with Wreav, but I understand why many people chose it (especially if Eve survives and Mordin doesn't agree to sabotage the cure /you have to shoot him).

Modifié par Barquiel, 06 août 2013 - 11:59 .

[wolfhowwl]

Is it so hard to believe that you might just be part of a vocal minority?

For example on the Internet Femshep has a huge following but is actually chosen by fewer than 1 in 5 players.

Barquiel wrote...
We still have Eve who makes the player see
the krogan in a more sympathetic light (probably enough to say no to the
salarian dalatrass...a very unsympathetic character [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/joyful.png[/smilie]).
I didn't cure the genophage with Wreav, but I understand why many
people chose it (especially if Eve survives and Mordin doesn't agree to
sabotage the cure and you have to shoot him).

The Dalatrass is written to be as obnoxious as possible. Instead of arguing logically for the Genophage she is just a strawman for players to hate.

I am not surprised that 92% of players cured the Genophage, the game strongly pushes you towards that decision.

Modifié par wolfhowwl, 07 août 2013 - 12:03 .

[Steelcan]

HellbirdIV wrote...

SiniisteR wrote...

Even if shes not your LI, Liara does seem like someone who would care about how Shepard is feeling, but that really shouldn't mean that she gets authroity to show up in Shepard's cabin between nearly every mission.

This is another thing I don't get why people are upset by.

Liara is Shepard's friend - wether you want to or not, that's in the nature of Autodialogue Shepard, the new protagonist of ME3 - so of course she's going to show up?

It's a small ship, Shepard is going through a lot of stressful situations on a daily - hell, even hourly - basis, and Liara is the one who knows her best. Why shouldn't she come up to visit? Stepping up to be there for a friend in need is nothing unusual.

I can't hear you over your own bias

[DeinonSlayer]

wolfhowwl wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

wolfhowwl wrote...

WittingEight65 wrote...

Aren't Liara and Garrus the most popular squadmates?

I'd too give more content to the most popular squadmates, is the most logical thing to do.

Yes.

Bioware released statistics in March:

Liara and Garrus came in at 24%

Tali was a lowly 7.8%

I'm certain that's influenced by the fact that she's only in the last 1/3rd of the game, and dies if you play a mindless paragon without an import. I was surprised (well, more disappointed than surprised) to see how many didn't have Wrex but cured the genophage anyway.

Uh yeah, Wreav flat-out tells you he's going to cause a post-war bloodbath.

But you get 15 paragon points for telling him about the sabotage! 

At which point there is no option to go through with stopping the cure...

[DeinonSlayer]

wolfhowwl wrote...

Is it so hard to believe that you might just be part of a vocal minority?

For example on the Internet Femshep has a huge following but is actually chosen by fewer than 1 in 5 players.

Barquiel wrote...
We still have Eve who makes the player see
the krogan in a more sympathetic light (probably enough to say no to the
salarian dalatrass...a very unsympathetic character [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/joyful.png[/smilie]).
I didn't cure the genophage with Wreav, but I understand why many
people chose it (especially if Eve survives and Mordin doesn't agree to
sabotage the cure and you have to shoot him).

The Dalatrass is written to be as obnoxious as possible. Instead of arguing logically for the Genophage she is just a strawman for players to hate.

I am not surprised that 92% of players cured the Genophage, the game strongly pushes you towards that decision.

Same with the Geth... but I'd rather not take the thread in that direction.

I don't think I have to mention Cerberus...

[MassivelyEffective0730]

David7204 wrote...

Necanor wrote...

According to most polls, Liara is in fact the most popular romance, with Tali usually in second. However, what bothers most people, is the way she was forced on everyone. Even if you don't romance her and pick every possible rude answer throughout the series, she's your best friend. 

That's a shame. They're just going to have to find a way to live with that.

All stories have characters. You aren't going to like every character in every story. That's really the end of it.

Stripping every friendly action from the main story because players might not like a certain character is absurd and would be a terrible shame.

DA:O did it perfectly. And with every other character except Liara. It's possible for everyone to more or less hate you except for Liara.

[Barquiel]

SiniisteR wrote...

StreetMagic wrote...

HellbirdIV wrote...

SiniisteR wrote...

Even if shes not your LI, Liara does seem like someone who would care about how Shepard is feeling, but that really shouldn't mean that she gets authroity to show up in Shepard's cabin between nearly every mission.

This is another thing I don't get why people are upset by.

Liara is Shepard's friend - wether you want to or not, that's in the nature of Autodialogue Shepard, the new protagonist of ME3 - so of course she's going to show up?

It's a small ship, Shepard is going through a lot of stressful situations on a daily - hell, even hourly - basis, and Liara is the one who knows her best. Why shouldn't she come up to visit? Stepping up to be there for a friend in need is nothing unusual.

Before this game, Shepard wasn't even necessarily "stressed". He was fighting thresher maws on foot, and punching pyjaks. That's another bad part of the autodialog. Just adding insult to injury. 1) I'm stressed. 2) I need Liara's attention

Fighting thresher maws on foot? Shepard can handle that. One kid on Earth dies, he's a wreck and needs Liara's shoulder to cry on. 

Even if Shepard did need someone to help get him through it, I'd much rather wait for Tali to show up then talking with her about it rather than Liara just because she's the only one there from the start. Shepard doesn't even ask for Liara's comfort, she just walts in and asks if Shepards ok, and it has to auto-dialogue so that he HAS to talk to her about it. 

That is simply not true.



35:10 Liara knocks on Shepards door
35:24 Liara asks if this a bad time. You have two options to respond...
    - Just remembering the lost
    - No, let's get to buisness (-> you don't talk to her about the dreams)

Modifié par Barquiel, 07 août 2013 - 12:11 .

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Cthulhu42 wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

It's possible for everyone to more or less hate you except for Liara.

How do you get Garrus to hate you?

Ok, and Garrus. Which kind of sucks too. He's not my bro. He's a valued and trusted subordinate, but he's not my bro.

*Edit*

In ME1, you can be a total racist ass and tell him to ****** of instead of recruiting him. Not what I do, and it doesn't carry through, but there it is.

Modifié par MassivelyEffective0730, 07 août 2013 - 12:12 .

[Steelcan]

Cthulhu42 wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

It's possible for everyone to more or less hate you except for Liara.

How do you get Garrus to hate you?

Kill him

[DeinonSlayer]

Barquiel has a fair point. I've seen people complain about the length of those chats with Liara, citing video... where the player clicks the top of the wheel every single time. Those conversations can be cut short by picking the option at the bottom.

Paragon and renegade need to go, if only to encourage people to think for themselves again.