1109 réponses à ce sujet

[Ziggeh]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...
I don't see how this is a problem, though.

That the gear is available to be purchased has value even if we don't purchase it.  It gives us an opportunity to make an in-character choice, it makes the gameworld a more credible place, and it allows different players to play differently.

Some players might not want to buy gear because that purchase will be invalidated later by a loot drop (it won't actually, but that's a much longer discussion about the nature of choice), but some players might like to spend the money they've earned buying the best things.

Just as dialogue is gameplay, shopping is gameplay, and some players might enjoy it.  We shouldn't be so willing to discard game elements simply because we don't see their value.  That their exclusion wouldn't affect us doesn't mean we can ignore the possible effect on others.

Because it does effect me. I'm not ignoring the system by not purchasing. Not buying is the choice I'm making in absence of an informed decision.

As I say, "remove it entirely" isn't exactly my position. I think the same things can be achieved (at least in game terms, I suspect most would involve some compromise at an in-character level, as it would be further abstraction) with other systems, and DA:I's focus on an organisation seems like a solid opportunity.

For example if gear came through an armoury system, that involved skills, employment and resources, so the game asked you to make more concrete management decisions. Spending "gold" is always such a wooly, open system that encompasses too much for strong decisions like that.

Modifié par Ziggeh, 08 août 2013 - 09:34 .

[Fetunche]

The old school elitists in this thread seem to think those of us against the no health regen are simple minded bad players who can't handle strategy or tactics. To me no health regen just adds an unnecessary amount of busy work.

[The Hierophant]

Realmzmaster wrote...


As I stated before I think that taking to many healing potions during a particular combat should poison the character's system causing damage or as Hierophant states have dimishing returns for each subsequent potion taken on the higher levels. Nightmare should be truly nightmarish.

Indeed

[Nerevar-as]

AlanC9 wrote...

Nerevar-as wrote...
In fact, I do. Combat loses all threat when there´s no price to pay. Get killed? You lose 1 minute at worst. Get beaten to an inch of your life for going unprepared? Doesn´t matter, you recover fully in 1 second. Anything that is even a bit uncomfortable to the player is getting removed, lets not even think of RTFMing (Witcher 2 prologue...). One of the reasons the first Alien vs Predator marine campaign was scary as hell was you couldn´t quicksave, you died, you started all over. Death and hard fights must mean something, or they have no purpose. If you don´t like the feature, play on the easiest difficulty level, which by today´s standards of difficulty will probably amount to push a button and all enemies dropping dead.

Sounds like you're making an argument against reloading.

Failing should have a bigger cost. Quicksaving threw that away. And I think if a situation can be overcome by being prepared than it´s not unfairly had (as long as you had some warning it was going to be a difficult situation). People complained you could go straight to the dragon in Witcher 2 prologue, but I think you knew there would be a dragon. Did they really expect it to be easy going there first?

[Realmzmaster]

AlanC9 wrote...

Realmzmaster wrote...
I find it fun to have the party on the brink of collaspe and being able to find that spot to rest and recuperate. Have the mage throw up a glyph of warning or have the rogue trap the doors so the party can rest. That is what I miss in the DA games which was present in older crpgs games like BG1, BG2, NWN, NWN2, Icewind Dale, Ultima and Wizardry.

You sure you want NWN on that list? Or NWN2 except for SoZ?

When compared to the DA games, yes. I know that when the companion died in NWN he/she got resurrect back at the temple, but I had to go back to get them or he/she was unavailable. Many times I left it that way and press on through the game.  You are correct I should have specified SoZ for NWN2.

[Foxhound2121]

Realmzmaster wrote...

Foxhound2121 wrote...

Dragon Age is not Dark Souls. There will be times when you take damage and it's unavoidable, unexpected, and it's RNG. It's not like you can raise shield or strafe to dodge a fireball to avoid damage all together like a pure tactical game.


All this will add to the game is busy work to backtrack and buy potions. I don't really see how anyone thinks that adds further enjoyment. None of this was sorely missed.

The only thing you will miss out with health regen is not having to walk down the same road a dozen times for nothing.

In your opinion it is busywork. In my opinion it is fun and yes I sorely missed it.

Races was sorely missed because I can recall a lot of threads asking for it back. Even though I always play human, I never understood why that can't do that anyway with one voice actor.

However, I don't remember any threads about life regen outside of combat, so in my opinion, it was not sorely missed.

Modifié par Foxhound2121, 08 août 2013 - 09:44 .

[Realmzmaster]

Fetunche wrote...

The old school elitists in this thread seem to think those of us against the no health regen are simple minded bad players who can't handle strategy or tactics. To me no health regen just adds an unnecessary amount of busy work.

First of all I am not an old school elitist, I know what I like in a game. I am stating that opinion just as you are stating yours. I do not think it adds an unnecessary amount of buzywork. So on that point we will have to agree to disagree.

CRPGs have stripped out many of the items I considered part of my enjoyment and as you can see in this thread there are posters who agree with that point and those who disagree.

I simply want to make my concerns known as you do. I see non-regenerating health as a step in the right direction even if you do not.

[Enigmatick]

Foxhound2121 wrote...

I didn't see a thread about it so obiviously no one missed it.

What the **** am I reading.

[Foxhound2121]

Enigmatick wrote...

Foxhound2121 wrote...

I didn't see a thread about it so obiviously no one missed it.

What the **** am I reading.

Shoving words in my mouth aren't all that clever when you don't bother reading. I said in my viewpoint and therefore in my opinion, not general.

[Realmzmaster]

Foxhound2121 wrote...

Realmzmaster wrote...

Foxhound2121 wrote...

Dragon Age is not Dark Souls. There will be times when you take damage and it's unavoidable, unexpected, and it's RNG. It's not like you can raise shield or strafe to dodge a fireball to avoid damage all together like a pure tactical game.


All this will add to the game is busy work to backtrack and buy potions. I don't really see how anyone thinks that adds further enjoyment. None of this was sorely missed.

The only thing you will miss out with health regen is not having to walk down the same road a dozen times for nothing.

In your opinion it is busywork. In my opinion it is fun and yes I sorely missed it.

Races was sorely missed because I can recall a lot of threads asking for it back. Even though I always play human, I never understood why that can't do that anyway with one voice actor.

However, I don't remember any threads about life regen outside of combat, so in my opinion, it was not sorely missed.

Have you read the old BG forums and DAO fourms? It was discussed. I and other posters in this thread have brought it up in other threads in the past. It seems we have finally been heard.

[AlanC9]

Realmzmaster wrote...
As I stated before I think that taking to many healing potions during a particular combat should poison the character's system causing damage or as Hierophant states have dimishing returns for each subsequent potion taken on the higher levels. Nightmare should be truly nightmarish.

Like The Witcher's Toxicity, eh?

[Dave of Canada]

Foxhound2121 wrote...

However, I don't remember any threads about life regen outside of combat, so in my opinion, it was not sorely missed.

You've not been here much, have you?

[Enigmatick]

Foxhound2121 wrote...

Enigmatick wrote...

Foxhound2121 wrote...

I didn't see a thread about it so obiviously no one missed it.

What the **** am I reading.

Shoving words in my mouth aren't all that clever when you don't bother reading. I said in my viewpoint and therefore in my opinion, not general.

I summarized to show ridiculous that post sounded to me, just because you missed some threads asking for it and it doesn't get reposted ad nausem doesn't mean there weren't people that wanted this feature. Not to mention that BSN isn't the be all end all of Dragon Age discussion.

Modifié par Enigmatick, 08 août 2013 - 09:54 .

[Nerevar-as]

AlanC9 wrote...

Realmzmaster wrote...
As I stated before I think that taking to many healing potions during a particular combat should poison the character's system causing damage or as Hierophant states have dimishing returns for each subsequent potion taken on the higher levels. Nightmare should be truly nightmarish.

Like The Witcher's Toxicity, eh?

It did make you plan a bit. Swallow was a must, then some other potions and oils (even bombs) if you had any idea about the enemy. Even the instaheal ones had toxicity, so you couldn´t abuse. And while I could have done without going into meditation to take potions in W2, not allowing potions during combat meant you couldn´t go blind. Going back to DA:I, if some planning and forethought allow you to clear an area without backtracking then I disagree it´s false difficulty.

[AlanC9]

Realmzmaster wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

You sure you want NWN on that list? Or NWN2 except for SoZ?

When compared to the DA games, yes. I know that when the companion died in NWN he/she got resurrect back at the temple, but I had to go back to get them or he/she was unavailable. Many times I left it that way and press on through the game.  You are correct I should have specified SoZ for NWN2.

Wouldn't the Stone of Recall teleport you back to the temple?

[Realmzmaster]

AlanC9 wrote...

Realmzmaster wrote...
As I stated before I think that taking to many healing potions during a particular combat should poison the character's system causing damage or as Hierophant states have dimishing returns for each subsequent potion taken on the higher levels. Nightmare should be truly nightmarish.

Like The Witcher's Toxicity, eh?

Yes. I also want to see spells have a chance to backfire (not just interrupt)  if a mage gets hit. This can be mitigated by a combat training skill like in DAO.

[Sylvius the Mad]

AlanC9 wrote...

Realmzmaster wrote...

When compared to the DA games, yes. I know that when the companion died in NWN he/she got resurrect back at the temple, but I had to go back to get them or he/she was unavailable. Many times I left it that way and press on through the game.  You are correct I should have specified SoZ for NWN2.

Wouldn't the Stone of Recall teleport you back to the temple?

Indeed it would have.  You just teleport back, collect your henchman, and then with the Retum Portal to go right back where you were.

[xnode]

Fetunche wrote...

The old school elitists in this thread seem to think those of us against the no health regen are simple minded bad players who can't handle strategy or tactics. To me no health regen just adds an unnecessary amount of busy work.

I wouldn't put a title on a group of people actually, being that I am definitly old school (being 46 in rl) but never consider myself an elitest because of such. I agree with you as well thou , so there you go  ... my personal thought on regen is optional. It should be a setting in game for those that choose so. Unless the gameplay would suffer from it, (which could be an emerision thing the devs are trying to protray) , as long as there is some kind of camping feature I am for it. Thou , I did love it DA2 how after combat, I could move on and not sit buring time for no reason.

My hope here is that indeed there is an emerision factor they are going for in which case I am fine with. But if not, make it an option.

[LPPrince]

I like the lack of auto-heal because it makes me look for other sources to heal up, or prepare accordingly.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Foxhound2121 wrote...

Races was sorely missed because I can recall a lot of threads asking for it back. Even though I always play human, I never understood why that can't do that anyway with one voice actor.

However, I don't remember any threads about life regen outside of combat, so in my opinion, it was not sorely missed.

Where you here before DAO's release?  No one has complained about regenerating health recently because it was taken away many years ago.  It was probably 2008 when BioWare told us that DAO was eliminating all strategic play in order to maximise tactical play.

[Realmzmaster]

AlanC9 wrote...

Realmzmaster wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

You sure you want NWN on that list? Or NWN2 except for SoZ?

When compared to the DA games, yes. I know that when the companion died in NWN he/she got resurrect back at the temple, but I had to go back to get them or he/she was unavailable. Many times I left it that way and press on through the game.  You are correct I should have specified SoZ for NWN2.

Wouldn't the Stone of Recall teleport you back to the temple?

Yes, it would, but it was easier to finish what the character was doing. I played mostly without a companion. I usually played as a rogue or paladin. You could bash chests in NWN. There was breakage of fragile items, but it was acceptable. It was part of the way I roleplayed.

Modifié par Realmzmaster, 08 août 2013 - 10:07 .

[Sylvius the Mad]

Fetunche wrote...

The old school elitists in this thread seem to think those of us against the no health regen are simple minded bad players who can't handle strategy or tactics. To me no health regen just adds an unnecessary amount of busy work.

Actually, simply eliminating health regen likely reduces the need for tactical gameplay, as encounters now cannot all be tactically challenging.  Since strategic concerns would be everpresent, combat would be a process of on-going resource management (hit points being one of those resources) rather than a challenging tactical experience.

[Foxhound2121]

Enigmatick wrote...


I summarized to show ridiculous that post sounded to me, just because you missed some threads asking for it and it doesn't get reposted ad nausem doesn't mean there weren't people that wanted this feature. Not to mention that BSN isn't the be all end all of Dragon Age discussion.

I wasn't even disagreeing with him. I was clarifying why I see something that conflicts his viewpoint. An opinion is not to something to personally jab or ridicule nor is it a statement of truth or fact.

Dave of Canada wrote...

You've not been here much, have you?

The elitist insults are hardly amusing.

Modifié par Foxhound2121, 08 août 2013 - 10:14 .

[Nerevar-as]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

Fetunche wrote...

The old school elitists in this thread seem to think those of us against the no health regen are simple minded bad players who can't handle strategy or tactics. To me no health regen just adds an unnecessary amount of busy work.

Actually, simply eliminating health regen likely reduces the need for tactical gameplay, as encounters now cannot all be tactically challenging.  Since strategic concerns would be everpresent, combat would be a process of on-going resource management (hit points being one of those resources) rather than a challenging tactical experience.

I´d say winning fights with the less possible health loss would be more tactically demanding, as you can no longer do so many suicidal things.

[Nerevar-as]

Realmzmaster wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Realmzmaster wrote...
As I stated before I think that taking to many healing potions during a particular combat should poison the character's system causing damage or as Hierophant states have dimishing returns for each subsequent potion taken on the higher levels. Nightmare should be truly nightmarish.

Like The Witcher's Toxicity, eh?

Yes. I also want to see spells have a chance to backfire (not just interrupt)  if a mage gets hit. This can be mitigated by a combat training skill like in DAO.

Failing complicated spells in DA PnP RPG could result in demon possession. Very unlikely to make it´s way into the game, but it did give an idea about how dangerous magic was that both games failed to show.