304 réponses à ce sujet

[Flatrid]

I've never played the ME3 multiplayer and I will never play the DAI multiplayer.

[BouncyFrag]

Flatrid wrote...

I've never played the ME3 multiplayer and I will never play the DAI multiplayer.

The ME3 MP is still active with a good community if you ever want to give it a go.

[leaguer of one]

Ziggeh wrote...

leaguer of one wrote...
The difference from MP and SP is that you are dependent on onother to micromanage another character and react to the events on hand.

That micromanagement is literally the gameplay of party based combat. You're saying that the only difference is that you're operating in a completely different manner.

No, it not a completley differenent manner. This is not night and day.  Management is still done but as a team. As long as management is part of the game play the sp and mp systems will be simular. Any more is just an issue of control.

This is just splitting hairs over who is in control. That is all micromanagement is,  a form of control.

[Bleachrude]

Ziggeh wrote...

leaguer of one wrote...
The difference from MP and SP is that you are dependent on onother to micromanage another character and react to the events on hand.

That micromanagement is literally the gameplay of party based combat. You're saying that the only difference is that you're operating in a completely different manner.

I would say that Mass Effect on the higher difficulties ALSO dependen on micromanagement (try getting the last achievement legitimately in ME3 - "one and only" without pausing every 2 seconds is impossible).

As well, I'm not sure DA actually NEEDs that micromanagement...if you did a 4 person non-mage party on a lower difficulty, it was quite easy to simply ignore your companions and simply do whatever you wanted.

EDIT: Separate MP and SP content.
Don't think this is possible...remember, anything that EA/Bioware puts up on either PSN+ or Xbox Gold, you get charged for it...a patch for example has a cost of 40k IIRC and the DLCs for ME3 MP were only free because the MPteam was able to show the revenue stream from the initial game that was on disc.

Modifié par Bleachrude, 11 août 2013 - 08:39 .

[ziloe]

BouncyFrag wrote...

Flatrid wrote...

I've never played the ME3 multiplayer and I will never play the DAI multiplayer.

The ME3 MP is still active with a good community if you ever want to give it a go.

Yeah, definitely worth it.

[Ziggeh]

leaguer of one wrote...
No, it not a completley differenent manner. This is not night and day.  Management is still done but as a team. As long as management is part of the game play the sp and mp systems will be simular. Any more is just an issue of control.

This is just splitting hairs over who is in control. That is all micromanagement is,  a form of control.

When gameplay consists of that control the matter of who is conducting it is not splitting hairs, it's not a quibble and it's not semantics.

[Blessed Silence]

I think Sten says it so well ...

NO

NO

NO

ME3 was so crap with MP stuck on it like a leech, and it made the main game feel wasted. If they add it to DA:I, I will be really annoyed. Especially if they place good content in MP which SHOULD belong in the main game.

I'm not saying MP in games is a bad idea in general. If a game is originally made with it in mind, like Gears of War, that's awesome as it fits it.

Dragon Age isn't. It is an RPG with single player elements. So tacking MP on this late in the series just feels wrong. And if they put things in there that one can't get in the single game, that is going to tick many people off, as they want it for the single player experience.

Not everyone has Xbox Live in order to play games online (multiplayer wise I mean). Or do they have a really good stable internet connection to not flat out crash in MP games ... *glares at ISP*

If they make it a totally separate entity people can forget about and not be worried something they REALLY need in there to beat the main game, I'm cool with it.

[leaguer of one]

Ziggeh wrote...

leaguer of one wrote...
No, it not a completley differenent manner. This is not night and day.  Management is still done but as a team. As long as management is part of the game play the sp and mp systems will be simular. Any more is just an issue of control.

This is just splitting hairs over who is in control. That is all micromanagement is,  a form of control.

When gameplay consists of that control the matter of who is conducting it is not splitting hairs, it's not a quibble and it's not semantics.

Yes, it is. Especial when we  get the same results reguardless. Even more when DAO and DA2 are based off and has the same foundation of mmo combate.
It 'sjust an issue of control. It sounds more that you are afraid of using someone else as a safety net.

[leaguer of one]

Blessed Silence wrote...

I think Sten says it so well ...

NO

NO

NO

ME3 was so crap with MP stuck on it like a leech, and it made the main game feel wasted. If they add it to DA:I, I will be really annoyed. Especially if they place good content in MP which SHOULD belong in the main game.

I'm not saying MP in games is a bad idea in general. If a game is originally made with it in mind, like Gears of War, that's awesome as it fits it.

Dragon Age isn't. It is an RPG with single player elements. So tacking MP on this late in the series just feels wrong. And if they put things in there that one can't get in the single game, that is going to tick many people off, as they want it for the single player experience.

Not everyone has Xbox Live in order to play games online (multiplayer wise I mean). Or do they have a really good stable internet connection to not flat out crash in MP games ... *glares at ISP*

If they make it a totally separate entity people can forget about and not be worried something they REALLY need in there to beat the main game, I'm cool with it.

Wrong. MP in ME3 barely effected it. In fact you don't even need it to get the best end. The fact that it is popular and still active mean that it's no just some mp tack on.

Any reasonable person can see mp is not an issue. If you don't like it don't play it. It matter not if it was orginally a sp game or not. Added mp does not devalue the game just by being there.

[leaguer of one]

Bleachrude wrote...



(try getting the last achievement legitimately in ME3 - "one and only" without pausing every 2 seconds is impossible).

Damn those vanguade Sheps and there charge/nova  combos.

[Malanek]

ME3 MP was wildly successful and very popular. I have played it more than any other game ever before. I was pretty skeptical before it was released as well.

I think the future gameplay of ME has benefited greatly from it, because the devs got to see exactly how people play and how all the new powers were received. They got to experiment with new powers and did it very well. The gameplay in the single player part is now simplistic and boring in comparison.

I don't think DA naturally lends itself as well to MP as ME does, but I would still be interested to see what they could come up with. I do think they would want to keep the tactical aspect in SP so you wouldn't want to make it too much more like a MMO.

[Rawgrim]

leaguer of one wrote...

Blessed Silence wrote...

I think Sten says it so well ...

NO

NO

NO

ME3 was so crap with MP stuck on it like a leech, and it made the main game feel wasted. If they add it to DA:I, I will be really annoyed. Especially if they place good content in MP which SHOULD belong in the main game.

I'm not saying MP in games is a bad idea in general. If a game is originally made with it in mind, like Gears of War, that's awesome as it fits it.

Dragon Age isn't. It is an RPG with single player elements. So tacking MP on this late in the series just feels wrong. And if they put things in there that one can't get in the single game, that is going to tick many people off, as they want it for the single player experience.

Not everyone has Xbox Live in order to play games online (multiplayer wise I mean). Or do they have a really good stable internet connection to not flat out crash in MP games ... *glares at ISP*

If they make it a totally separate entity people can forget about and not be worried something they REALLY need in there to beat the main game, I'm cool with it.

Wrong. MP in ME3 barely effected it. In fact you don't even need it to get the best end. The fact that it is popular and still active mean that it's no just some mp tack on.

Any reasonable person can see mp is not an issue. If you don't like it don't play it. It matter not if it was orginally a sp game or not. Added mp does not devalue the game just by being there.

Wrong. The MP affected the SP full force when the game came out. My first playthrough (the one thats the most important) got screwed up because I didn`t play MP. They fixed it later, after forcing people to play it had made it a "huge hit", with DLC`s and patches.

[Ziggeh]

leaguer of one wrote...
Yes, it is. Especial when we  get the same results reguardless.

We're discussing the manner and not the results. The results aren't relevant. It's the means by which they're achieved: the tactical decisions being made, the complexity of the interactions and the speed and accuracy with which they're deployed.

All of those things are entirely disctinct between a party based, pause and play single player experience and single character multiplayer.

The case you're trying to make is that it doesn't matter how the games played as long as it's played. That's a perspective that's going to need some explanation, because I would say that it's self evident that how a game is played is important to it's design.

leaguer of one wrote...
It 'sjust an issue of control. It sounds more that you are afraid of using someone else as a safety net.

Why would my fear over anything change a games design? Or indeed impact anything, given we're talking about an optional aspect of a game?

[Malanek]

Rawgrim wrote...

leaguer of one wrote...

Blessed Silence wrote...

I think Sten says it so well ...

NO

NO

NO

ME3 was so crap with MP stuck on it like a leech, and it made the main game feel wasted. If they add it to DA:I, I will be really annoyed. Especially if they place good content in MP which SHOULD belong in the main game.

I'm not saying MP in games is a bad idea in general. If a game is originally made with it in mind, like Gears of War, that's awesome as it fits it.

Dragon Age isn't. It is an RPG with single player elements. So tacking MP on this late in the series just feels wrong. And if they put things in there that one can't get in the single game, that is going to tick many people off, as they want it for the single player experience.

Not everyone has Xbox Live in order to play games online (multiplayer wise I mean). Or do they have a really good stable internet connection to not flat out crash in MP games ... *glares at ISP*

If they make it a totally separate entity people can forget about and not be worried something they REALLY need in there to beat the main game, I'm cool with it.

Wrong. MP in ME3 barely effected it. In fact you don't even need it to get the best end. The fact that it is popular and still active mean that it's no just some mp tack on.

Any reasonable person can see mp is not an issue. If you don't like it don't play it. It matter not if it was orginally a sp game or not. Added mp does not devalue the game just by being there.

Wrong. The MP affected the SP full force when the game came out. My first playthrough (the one thats the most important) got screwed up because I didn`t play MP. They fixed it later, after forcing people to play it had made it a "huge hit", with DLC`s and patches.

Full force? The only difference was you couldn't get an ambiguous 5 second cutscene.

[Iakus]

leaguer of one wrote...

Wrong. MP in ME3 barely effected it. In fact you don't even need it to get the best end. The fact that it is popular and still active mean that it's no just some mp tack on.

Barely an effect is still an effect.  No effect means no effect.  No gameplay alterations.  No budget or asset shifting from single player to multiplayer.  No content triaged out due to lack of disk space.  No single player content cut or changed.  Not one dungeon.  Not one scene, not one line.

in addition, un ME3, he "best" ending (at least, the ending largely seen as the best one) was hidden behind a multiplayer wall for months.  Which expressley contradicted the assurances we received when MP was initially leaked.

Any reasonable person can see mp is not an issue. If you don't like it don't play it. It matter not if it was orginally a sp game or not. Added mp does not devalue the game just by being there.

So anyone who disdagrees with your stance is now unreasonable?  

[Rawgrim]

Malanek999 wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

leaguer of one wrote...

Blessed Silence wrote...

I think Sten says it so well ...

NO

NO

NO

ME3 was so crap with MP stuck on it like a leech, and it made the main game feel wasted. If they add it to DA:I, I will be really annoyed. Especially if they place good content in MP which SHOULD belong in the main game.

I'm not saying MP in games is a bad idea in general. If a game is originally made with it in mind, like Gears of War, that's awesome as it fits it.

Dragon Age isn't. It is an RPG with single player elements. So tacking MP on this late in the series just feels wrong. And if they put things in there that one can't get in the single game, that is going to tick many people off, as they want it for the single player experience.

Not everyone has Xbox Live in order to play games online (multiplayer wise I mean). Or do they have a really good stable internet connection to not flat out crash in MP games ... *glares at ISP*

If they make it a totally separate entity people can forget about and not be worried something they REALLY need in there to beat the main game, I'm cool with it.

Wrong. MP in ME3 barely effected it. In fact you don't even need it to get the best end. The fact that it is popular and still active mean that it's no just some mp tack on.

Any reasonable person can see mp is not an issue. If you don't like it don't play it. It matter not if it was orginally a sp game or not. Added mp does not devalue the game just by being there.

Wrong. The MP affected the SP full force when the game came out. My first playthrough (the one thats the most important) got screwed up because I didn`t play MP. They fixed it later, after forcing people to play it had made it a "huge hit", with DLC`s and patches.

Full force? The only difference was you couldn't get an ambiguous 5 second cutscene.

You don`t get the "destroy" option either, if i remember correctly. And if my character lives or dies at the end, is kind of a big deal. Dying = game over.

[Malanek]

Rawgrim wrote...

Malanek999 wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

leaguer of one wrote...

Blessed Silence wrote...

I think Sten says it so well ...

NO

NO

NO

ME3 was so crap with MP stuck on it like a leech, and it made the main game feel wasted. If they add it to DA:I, I will be really annoyed. Especially if they place good content in MP which SHOULD belong in the main game.

I'm not saying MP in games is a bad idea in general. If a game is originally made with it in mind, like Gears of War, that's awesome as it fits it.

Dragon Age isn't. It is an RPG with single player elements. So tacking MP on this late in the series just feels wrong. And if they put things in there that one can't get in the single game, that is going to tick many people off, as they want it for the single player experience.

Not everyone has Xbox Live in order to play games online (multiplayer wise I mean). Or do they have a really good stable internet connection to not flat out crash in MP games ... *glares at ISP*

If they make it a totally separate entity people can forget about and not be worried something they REALLY need in there to beat the main game, I'm cool with it.

Wrong. MP in ME3 barely effected it. In fact you don't even need it to get the best end. The fact that it is popular and still active mean that it's no just some mp tack on.

Any reasonable person can see mp is not an issue. If you don't like it don't play it. It matter not if it was orginally a sp game or not. Added mp does not devalue the game just by being there.

Wrong. The MP affected the SP full force when the game came out. My first playthrough (the one thats the most important) got screwed up because I didn`t play MP. They fixed it later, after forcing people to play it had made it a "huge hit", with DLC`s and patches.

Full force? The only difference was you couldn't get an ambiguous 5 second cutscene.

You don`t get the "destroy" option either, if i remember correctly. And if my character lives or dies at the end, is kind of a big deal. Dying = game over.

You definitely did get the destroy option. Shepards outcome is ambiguous either way. I guess it does drop the hint that he/she may have survived and I do agree that it was a bit silly you couldn't get that with mp. What I don't agree with is the scale of your complaint. I don't think we (because I hadn't played mp at that point) got "screwed over" by missing that cut scene. I had a lot bigger complaints about the ending than that, in the scheme of things that was really, really minor.

[Rawgrim]

Malanek999 wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

Malanek999 wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

leaguer of one wrote...

Blessed Silence wrote...

I think Sten says it so well ...

NO

NO

NO

ME3 was so crap with MP stuck on it like a leech, and it made the main game feel wasted. If they add it to DA:I, I will be really annoyed. Especially if they place good content in MP which SHOULD belong in the main game.

I'm not saying MP in games is a bad idea in general. If a game is originally made with it in mind, like Gears of War, that's awesome as it fits it.

Dragon Age isn't. It is an RPG with single player elements. So tacking MP on this late in the series just feels wrong. And if they put things in there that one can't get in the single game, that is going to tick many people off, as they want it for the single player experience.

Not everyone has Xbox Live in order to play games online (multiplayer wise I mean). Or do they have a really good stable internet connection to not flat out crash in MP games ... *glares at ISP*

If they make it a totally separate entity people can forget about and not be worried something they REALLY need in there to beat the main game, I'm cool with it.

Wrong. MP in ME3 barely effected it. In fact you don't even need it to get the best end. The fact that it is popular and still active mean that it's no just some mp tack on.

Any reasonable person can see mp is not an issue. If you don't like it don't play it. It matter not if it was orginally a sp game or not. Added mp does not devalue the game just by being there.

Wrong. The MP affected the SP full force when the game came out. My first playthrough (the one thats the most important) got screwed up because I didn`t play MP. They fixed it later, after forcing people to play it had made it a "huge hit", with DLC`s and patches.

Full force? The only difference was you couldn't get an ambiguous 5 second cutscene.

You don`t get the "destroy" option either, if i remember correctly. And if my character lives or dies at the end, is kind of a big deal. Dying = game over.

You definitely did get the destroy option. Shepards outcome is ambiguous either way. I guess it does drop the hint that he/she may have survived and I do agree that it was a bit silly you couldn't get that with mp. What I don't agree with is the scale of your complaint. I don't think we (because I hadn't played mp at that point) got "screwed over" by missing that cut scene. I had a lot bigger complaints about the ending than that, in the scheme of things that was really, really minor.

The main character dies without the perfect ending. That IS a pretty valid complaint. and its not a small one.

[Ziggeh]

Malanek999 wrote...
Shepards outcome is ambiguous either way.

It's a bit metagamey, but the absence of the ambiguous scene is notable. It's extraordinarily unlikely Shepard could have survived and so without the potential being made explicit it gives the impression they've bought it.

[St. Victorious]

dekkerd wrote...

St. Victorious wrote...

iakus wrote...

It woul not break the game any more than adding mp at all would

The DLC could be free

You don't seem to care what those who don't want mp intruding on their game think as long as you're happy. So pot, meet kettle

If it's free, why not just include it with the game? There is no real argument as to not having MP. It's a simple concept, if you don't like it then don't play it. So long as there's no ridiculous EMS rating then it can be it can hang out a menu option below "Load" and all you have to do if you don't want to play it is not play it. Crazy.

since a connection is required to play MP, it should be free dlc. In that case, every bit on the disc can be devoted to sp. 

and to those saying "it was a 5 second scene, no big deal, besides they fixed it." The fact remains that that scene changed the end of the game, and someone thought it was a good idea to require MP to reach that ending. 

In case you missed it, I believe the concept of EMS is absurd. Your SP ending should not be determined by the your online participation. However saying it should be dropped from the disc and made a DLC is like saying not to put peaches in fruit salad so there's more room for apples. And we all know peaches are delicious.

[AlanC9]

iakus wrote...


Barely an effect is still an effect.  No effect means no effect.  No gameplay alterations.  No budget or asset shifting from single player to multiplayer.  No content triaged out due to lack of disk space.  No single player content cut or changed.  Not one dungeon.  Not one scene, not one line.

What about positive effects? Like free N7 maps. Or more-profitable MP subsidizing the SP game generally, though that's more speculative.

[The Flying Grey Warden]

iakus wrote...

It woul not break the game any more than adding mp at all would

The DLC could be free

You don't seem to care what those who don't want mp intruding on their game think as long as you're happy. So pot, meet kettle

Your the one saying it should be a dlc, which would eat up a lot of space on many peoples memory. I think of the console gamers, and gb's are a very precious commodety. Having something like halo 4's 8 GB download to play something every other game has on disc is insane. 

Not to mention no one is forcing you to play the multiplayer or even look at the multiplayer screen. But your option would force players to go out of their way in order to play a simple feature of the game. It's lunacy.

[Rawgrim]

The Flying Grey Warden wrote...

iakus wrote...

It woul not break the game any more than adding mp at all would

The DLC could be free

You don't seem to care what those who don't want mp intruding on their game think as long as you're happy. So pot, meet kettle

Your the one saying it should be a dlc, which would eat up a lot of space on many peoples memory. I think of the console gamers, and gb's are a very precious commodety. Having something like halo 4's 8 GB download to play something every other game has on disc is insane. 

Not to mention no one is forcing you to play the multiplayer or even look at the multiplayer screen. But your option would force players to go out of their way in order to play a simple feature of the game. It's lunacy.

And the game allways checking for new DLC (usually mp maps) every time you start it up.

[The Flying Grey Warden]

ames4u wrote...

I say focus on the game, not a useless multiplayer aspect that everyone will be bored off of within a month or two. Because all it'll do is divert time, attention and money to a useless mechanic that will never-the-less be abandoned quickly once the hype train crash's into a brick wall.

Is that why the multiplayer section of mass effect 3 is more active than the story and campaign section? 

[BouncyFrag]

The Flying Grey Warden wrote...

ames4u wrote...

I say focus on the game, not a useless multiplayer aspect that everyone will be bored off of within a month or two. Because all it'll do is divert time, attention and money to a useless mechanic that will never-the-less be abandoned quickly once the hype train crash's into a brick wall.

Is that why the multiplayer section of mass effect 3 is more active than the story and campaign section? 

Those who haven't played the ME3 MP until now will never know the feeling of flying the heavens as a transcendent Krogan Vanguard since its been patched. Lots of good times with that topic on the MP boards along with the drama of the weekly balance changes. Things would almost get as heated as these MP in DAI threads.