337 réponses à ce sujet

[David7204]

Right. I should have said friendly characters. Obviously the villains kill innocent people.

[Mr.House]

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

David7204 wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

You're assuming that all the characters in Mass Effect are the same. They're not. 

You're assuming that all of our Shepard's our the same. They're not.

I know there's not a single character in the game that kills or has killed innocent people for their personal benefit.

Shepard. TIM. Miranda. Zaeed. Samara. Wrex. Jack. Hackett. The Council. Harbinger. The Catalyst. The Reapers. 

Aria, Kasumi, Liara, Grunt ect

[AlanC9]

AresKeith wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Does Samara really count as a case of personal benefit?

Well she basically threatened to kill the Detective and others if they got in her way on her recruit mission

Isn't that just what the Code says she has to do?

[Mr.House]

David7204 wrote...

Right. I should have said friendly characters. Obviously the villains kill innocent people.

Ok...

Aria, Grunt, Wrex, Morinth, Legion, Liara, Zaeed, Kasumi ect

[MassivelyEffective0730]

David7204 wrote...

Right. I should have said friendly characters. Obviously the villains kill innocent people.

Are they really the villains? 

It's not as clear cut as that. It's never that clear cut.

That's what makes Mass Effect so interesting.

Modifié par MassivelyEffective0730, 11 août 2013 - 10:21 .

[AresKeith]

AlanC9 wrote...

AresKeith wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Does Samara really count as a case of personal benefit?

Well she basically threatened to kill the Detective and others if they got in her way on her recruit mission

Isn't that just what the Code says she has to do?

It's still personal benefit because the Code allows her to do it

[Mcfly616]

David7204 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

Do we really need a great conflict in order to have a meaningful story?

Yes.

No. We don't need a "great" conflict in order to have a meaningful story.

This especially applies if Mass Effect is indeed "about the characters", as so many here on the BSN like to think.

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Right. I should have said friendly characters. Obviously the villains kill innocent people.

Are they really the villains? 

It's not as clear cut as that. It's never that clear cut.

That's what makes Mass Effect so interesting.

TIM interesting after ME3?

[The Heretic of Time]

David7204 wrote...

Right. I should have said friendly characters. Obviously the villains kill innocent people.

Ah, so half of our squad members are unfriendly villains then?

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

David7204 wrote...

Right. I should have said friendly characters. Obviously the villains kill innocent people.

Several of the "heroes" have killed innocents. *sing song voice*\\



Keep it up Davey, I love the way you lie.

[Fixers0]

AlanC9 wrote...

Isn't that just what the Code says she has to do?

She can abbandon the code anytime she want's to, the fact that she's willing to hang on to it, even when it means commiting criminal activities, proof that it's for her personal benefit.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Lizardviking wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Right. I should have said friendly characters. Obviously the villains kill innocent people.

Are they really the villains? 

It's not as clear cut as that. It's never that clear cut.

That's what makes Mass Effect so interesting.

TIM interesting after ME3?

As I wrote in the 'Cerberus Vindication' thread. Look at the ultimate reasons for why he did what he did. Look at his reaction when you talk him into killing himself. Look at how he believes in prosecuting the war against the Reapers (at least before indoctrination).

I don't know about you, but I find that very interesting and intriguing.

Modifié par MassivelyEffective0730, 11 août 2013 - 10:26 .

[Mr.House]

Samara will try to kill herself instead of following her code, she can break it if she wants to.

[Ravensword]

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Right. I should have said friendly characters. Obviously the villains kill innocent people.

Several of the "heroes" have killed innocents. *sing song voice*



Keep it up Davey, I love the way you lie.

No! No! Their heroism is stronger than any force in the galaxy!

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Right. I should have said friendly characters. Obviously the villains kill innocent people.

Are they really the villains? 

It's not as clear cut as that. It's never that clear cut.

That's what makes Mass Effect so interesting.

TIM interesting after ME3?

As I wrote in the 'Cerberus Vindication' thread. Look at the ultimate reasons for why he did what he did. Look at his reaction when you talk him into killing himself. Look at how he believes in prosecuting the war against the Reapers (at least before indoctrination).

I don't know about you, but I find that very interesting and intriguing.

Sur'Kesh, the Citadel Coup and the Tuchanka bomb and cannon are not the mark of a great, intellectual and interesting villain. They are the marks of a retarded one.

And all that dumb mustache twirlling he did in the conversations didn't help either.

[Mcfly616]

" Spending an entire series attempting to discover what happened to The Great Commander"

No offense, for real. But....Hell no. I don't want to see Shepard or any of his crew, let alone having him be the driving force of the narrative. No thanks.

Personally, I hope they don't make any choice Canon. There are plenty of stories left to be told within the current MEU, as well as multiple directions they can go with the setting and narrative.

But, just to entertain the thought posed by the topic of the thread....if they were to go with a game that takes place after High EMS Destroy, I would like it to be set hundreds of years after the Shepard Trilogy. When new AI's are arising, becoming self-aware and the "conflict" returns.

Also wouldn't mind if it took place in the immediate aftermath of the Reaper War, when species start to look out for their own during the rebuilding process with tensions high. (I wouldn't mind this scenario, but I don't necessarily want it. Too close in timeline to the Shepard Trilogy. I'm ready for a fresh start.)

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Lizardviking wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Right. I should have said friendly characters. Obviously the villains kill innocent people.

Are they really the villains? 

It's not as clear cut as that. It's never that clear cut.

That's what makes Mass Effect so interesting.

TIM interesting after ME3?

As I wrote in the 'Cerberus Vindication' thread. Look at the ultimate reasons for why he did what he did. Look at his reaction when you talk him into killing himself. Look at how he believes in prosecuting the war against the Reapers (at least before indoctrination).

I don't know about you, but I find that very interesting and intriguing.

Sur'Kesh, the Citadel Coup and the Tuchanka bomb and cannon are not the mark of a great, intellectual and interesting villain. They are the marks of a retarded one.

As I recall, TIM was under indoctrination at this time. His purpose, beyond the superficial veneer of helping humanity that the Reapers allowed him to believe, was to cause chaos and conflict to the forces fighting the Reapers. It falls under their divide and conquer strategy.

And all that dumb mustache twirlling he did in the conversations didn't help either.

He didn't really do any mustache twirling. They way he spoke of his arguments makes it pretty obvious that he's not in control. The Reapers are.

[billy the squid]

David7204 wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

You're assuming that all the characters in Mass Effect are the same. They're not. 

You're assuming that all of our Shepard's our the same. They're not.

I know there's not a single character in the game that kills or has killed innocent people for their personal benefit.

Is that because they're heroic?

[David7204]

More or less, yes.

[billy the squid]

 

Mr.House wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Right. I should have said friendly characters. Obviously the villains kill innocent people.

Ok...

Aria, Grunt, Wrex, Morinth, Legion, Liara, Zaeed, Kasumi etc

^Those Heroic characters.... the ones that didn't kill anyone.

I'm sure Zaeed who just let those enslaved people to burn alive to settle a grudge knew they were bad.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

billy the squid wrote...

 

Mr.House wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Right. I should have said friendly characters. Obviously the villains kill innocent people.

Ok...

Aria, Grunt, Wrex, Morinth, Legion, Liara, Zaeed, Kasumi etc

^Those Heroic characters.... the ones that didn't kill anyone.

I'm sure Zaeed who just let those enslaved people to burn alive to settle a grudge knew they were bad.

Zaeed was totally heroic when he killed those prisoners to settle his grudge.

Shepard was totally heroic when he killed Samara to let Morinth on the team. Or when he killed Falere. Or when he killed Ashley for finally getting fed up with her ****ing about Cerberus. Or when he punched al-Jilani. Or when he pushed the Eclipse merc out the window. Or when he stabbed the Blue Suns mechanic in the back. Or when he shot Rana Thanoptis on Virmire. Or when he shot Fade. Or when he lied to Wrex's face about not curing the Genophage and shooting him. Or when he blew Mordin away for trying to cure the genophage.

Heroism at its finest.

[AlanC9]

Fixers0 wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Isn't that just what the Code says she has to do?

She can abbandon the code anytime she want's to, the fact that she's willing to hang on to it, even when it means commiting criminal activities, proof that it's for her personal benefit.

That definition of "personal benefit" would cover any action that someone wasn't forced to commit at gunpoint. Actually, it would cover those too, since not getting shot is a personal benefit.

[o Ventus]

To be fair, Kasumi, Liara, Wrex, and Legion haven't killed anybody for personal gain (as far as we know).

David is still wrong, by all means, but that counter list is half wrong.

[The Heretic of Time]

o Ventus wrote...

To be fair, Kasumi, Liara, Wrex, and Legion haven't killed anybody for personal gain (as far as we know).

David is still wrong, by all means, but that counter list is half wrong.

Euhm Wrex was a mercenary, that's the VERY DEFINITION of killing people for personal gain (in the Mass Effect universe that is).

Can't recall Kasumi or Liara or Legion killing "innocent" folks (nobody is truly innocent) for their personal gain.

[David7204]

I forgot about Morinth. Although she hardly counts since the overwhelming majority of players kill her and she pretty much zero affection from the fanbase.

There's no indication Wrex ever killed innocent people who didn't deserve it, nor Samara. Zaeed tries to, but you can stop him and he ultimately listens and relents. In any case, that wasn't his intent.

Modifié par David7204, 12 août 2013 - 12:20 .