240 réponses à ce sujet

[hexediter]

If they can't continue conflict then why didn't they try to leave? And when they did try to leave why were they allowed to? In ME3 the geth are attacked, and they are without the power to defend themselves unless you give them the upgrades. Guess what happens if you don't? THEY ALL DIE. ALL OF THEM. 100% What mercy is ever shown the geth, and yet if they are allowed to live they give the quarians their homeworld and help them adapt. And yet that is not mercy or kindness?

[hexediter]

Also may I remind you this is also the race that thinks using it's civilian ships (which contain elderly and children) as war ships is a good idea. What choice do you have when the enemy will go that length to wage war with you.

Modifié par hexediter, 12 août 2013 - 05:31 .

[Sir DeLoria]

hexediter wrote...

If they can't continue conflict then why didn't they try to leave? And when they did try to leave why were they allowed to? In ME3 the geth are attacked, and they are without the power to defend themselves unless you give them the upgrades. Guess what happens if you don't? THEY ALL DIE. ALL OF THEM. 100% What mercy is ever shown the geth, and yet if they are allowed to live they give the quarians their homeworld and help them adapt. And yet that is not mercy or kindness?

They simply weren't allowed to leave, the Geth just shot all of them or maybe even used WMDs. The Quarians want their homeworld back. Without it, they're easy prey for the Reapers, who blames them? Well, what happens if one knucklehead Admiral decides to attack the upgraded Geth? They destroy the entire Flotilla, every Quarian aboard is(presumably) killed, you betray Tali and the Admirals, who trusted you with their lives and the lives of their species.

Calling Rannoch the 'Geth homeworld' is an insult beyond disgrace. Rannoch is the Quarian homeworld, the Geth conquered it, by slaughtering their very own creators.

[Sir DeLoria]

hexediter wrote...

Also may I remind you this is also the race that thinks using it's civilian ships (which contain elderly and children) as war ships is a good idea. What choice do you have when the enemy will go that length to wage war with you.

Haha, the Geth don't give a **** what ships are armed and which aren't. The Quarians are doomed if they don't get their homeworld back, one way or another.

[hexediter]

In that sentence their is referring to the quarians. The geth conquered it because the other option was to not exist, don't pretend like they had another option. And yes when someone opens fire on you, it's normal procedure to fire back, you don't assume they're going to stop and ask for their planet back in negotiations, especially after they had already destroyed the dyson sphere.

[hexediter]

They could have just asked for there homeworld? And there long survival away from rannoch doesn't exactly scream doomed. Only a reaper war that they are ignoring to fight geth screams doomed.

Modifié par hexediter, 12 août 2013 - 05:44 .

[Sir DeLoria]

hexediter wrote...

In that sentence their is referring to the quarians. The geth conquered it because the other option was to not exist, don't pretend like they had another option. And yes when someone opens fire on you, it's normal procedure to fire back, you don't assume they're going to stop and ask for their planet back in negotiations, especially after they had already destroyed the dyson sphere.

Destroy the military ships and force the civilians to surrender in ME3? Or even better, how about not slaughtering every civilian that wasn't fast enough to flee? It's not like a Quarian baby is a serious threat<_<

[hexediter]

Necanor wrote...

hexediter wrote...

In that sentence their is referring to the quarians. The geth conquered it because the other option was to not exist, don't pretend like they had another option. And yes when someone opens fire on you, it's normal procedure to fire back, you don't assume they're going to stop and ask for their planet back in negotiations, especially after they had already destroyed the dyson sphere.

Destroy the military ships and force the civilians to surrender in ME3? Or even better, how about not slaughtering every civilian that wasn't fast enough to flee? It's not like a Quarian baby is a serious threat<_<

ALL quarian ships are military ships in ME3, so explain how the geth are to accomplish this?  Also they didn't slaughter every civilian who wasn't fast enoguh to flee, or there wouldn't be a Quarian race.  Yes they killed alot of Quarians, but only enough to get them to leave, which apparently was quite a few.

[Sir DeLoria]

hexediter wrote...

They could have just asked for there homeworld? And there long survival away from rannoch doesn't exactly scream doomed. Only a reaper war that they are ignoring to fight geth screams doomed.

Tali tried to contact Legion to no avail. Three Admirals wanted war, is the war the fault of the entire Quarian race now?

If the Reapers had attacked the Flotilla, the Quarians would have been dead immediately. They need Rannoch to shelter their civilians

[Sir DeLoria]

hexediter wrote...

Necanor wrote...

hexediter wrote...
In that sentence their is referring to the quarians. The geth conquered it because the other option was to not exist, don't pretend like they had another option. And yes when someone opens fire on you, it's normal procedure to fire back, you don't assume they're going to stop and ask for their planet back in negotiations, especially after they had already destroyed the dyson sphere.

Destroy the military ships and force the civilians to surrender in ME3? Or even better, how about not slaughtering every civilian that wasn't fast enough to flee? It's not like a Quarian baby is a serious threat<_<

ALL quarian ships are military ships in ME3, so explain how the geth are to accomplish this?  Also they didn't slaughter every civilian who wasn't fast enoguh to flee, or there wouldn't be a Quarian race.  Yes they killed alot of Quarians, but only enough to get them to leave, which apparently was quite a few.

Sure, the Geth could have destroyed the Cruisers and not targeted the liveships, forcing the Quarians to surrender and leaving most Quarians alive. The Geth didn't kill Quarians in order to get them to leave, the Quarians were long evacuating, when the Geth killed everyone they could get their filthy hands on. They didn't just target Quarians, but literally any organic. They let 1% of the Quarians survive, once again, aren't they merciful?

[hexediter]

Necanor wrote...

hexediter wrote...

Necanor wrote...

hexediter wrote...
In that sentence their is referring to the quarians. The geth conquered it because the other option was to not exist, don't pretend like they had another option. And yes when someone opens fire on you, it's normal procedure to fire back, you don't assume they're going to stop and ask for their planet back in negotiations, especially after they had already destroyed the dyson sphere.

Destroy the military ships and force the civilians to surrender in ME3? Or even better, how about not slaughtering every civilian that wasn't fast enough to flee? It's not like a Quarian baby is a serious threat<_<

ALL quarian ships are military ships in ME3, so explain how the geth are to accomplish this?  Also they didn't slaughter every civilian who wasn't fast enoguh to flee, or there wouldn't be a Quarian race.  Yes they killed alot of Quarians, but only enough to get them to leave, which apparently was quite a few.

Sure, the Geth could have destroyed the Cruisers and not targeted the liveships, forcing the Quarians to surrender and leaving most Quarians alive. The Geth didn't kill Quarians in order to get them to leave, the Quarians were long evacuating, when the Geth killed everyone they could get their filthy hands on. They didn't just target Quarians, but literally any organic. They let 1% of the Quarians survive, once again, aren't they merciful?

You're speculating here in regard to what the quarians did during the mournign war which is your right, but doesn't make it true.  Also how can they ignore liveships which have the same guns that the warships have?  I'm judging by what we know to be true, and what we have seen.

The only geth to aggresivly engage anyone at all since the mourning war are the heretics which leaves 300 years of no contact and no aggresion between the mournign war and heretic aggresion (not a point in your favor).  It's not like they go out and raid random organics or do anything at all besides stay away from everyone.

And why do they need ranoch to fight the reapers?  By the end of the war both the humans and turians are fighting the reapers effictivly without a homeworld to shelter there civilians on.  They would be the same as everyone else, and arguably are better prepared for such a reality.

[Sir DeLoria]

hexediter wrote...
You're speculating here in regard to what the quarians did during the mournign war which is your right, but doesn't make it true.  Also how can they ignore liveships which have the same guns that the warships have?  I'm judging by what we know to be true, and what we have seen.

The only geth to aggresivly engage anyone at all since the mourning war are the heretics which leaves 300 years of no contact and no aggresion between the mournign war and heretic aggresion (not a point in your favor).  It's not like they go out and raid random organics or do anything at all besides stay away from everyone.

And why do they need ranoch to fight the reapers?  By the end of the war both the humans and turians are fighting the reapers effictivly without a homeworld to shelter there civilians on.  They would be the same as everyone else, and arguably are better prepared for such a reality.

The Geth fleet is superior in both firepower and endurance. Any honorable enemy would have given the remaining liveships a chance to surrender. Your argument about the Geth is rather false, the Geth destroyed any non-Geth ship regardless of affiliation, that entered the Perseus Veil. You seem smart enough to understand, that the Flotilla can't survive a direct confrontation with the Reapers. The Turians and Humans do need shelter for their civilians, but the vast majority of their population is on the attacked homeworlds. If the Flotilla is destroyed, the Quarians are doomed without a homeworld. 

[CynicalShep]

Oh noes, teh murderbots killed the innocent suit people. Death to the machines!!!
How 'bout the innocent suit people don't try to attack teh soulless murderbots by strapping chaiguns to school buses? You're right, you can't hold the entire race responsible just because an admiral is a homicidal warmonger. Problem is, you can't stop the innocent suit people from exterminating your entire murderbot race by towing the armed school buses because they will keep shooting. The only way to stop someone who shoots at you is to stop them from shooting, which is what Shepard tries to do if he wants to make peace. The other option is to shoot them back, which is what happens if the innocent suit people commit suicide by throwing themselves at the superior force they are attacking.
And I was if the impression that this wasn't another quarian/geth debate, or have I misread the title?

[Hazegurl]

The moment the Quarian/Geth conflict was mentioned I knew it would turn into another Geth/Quarian debate. There are no right or wrong choices in it. Keep alive or kill whomever you want.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Do I need to come in here?

[Steelcan]

I'll join in if Massively does


We need a Law for this ala Godwin

[Tron Mega]

Argolas wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

This is why you need to pay attention and make your own decisions instead of letting the position of a dialogue option on the wheel dictate your choices to you. Let your own sense of right and wrong guide you.

Paragon and renegade need to go away, if only to encourage players to think for themselves.

Indeed.

how am i supposed to be a paragon later, if im not beign a paragon now(especially ME2)? the game doesnt let you play that way. were not roll playing, were alignment playing.

completely agree about paragon VS renegade beign removed. its just unfortunate for any decision we make that doesnt need a label of good or bad. choosing between the top or the bottom is what matters, not hte text in the box.

imagin if ME1 used ME2s aligment system. there would only be two specific canon playthroughs that would allow shepard to make saren off himslef. you either play the game 100% paragon or 100% renegade or your stuck doing whats left over. doesnt that right there explain how dumb the system is? why does saving bob mcgee and susan butthead or donating money to the church of kroganism have anything to do with shepard convinceing saren to put a bullet in his head??? seriously, where do those two things meet, other then on a bar offscreen?

Modifié par Tron Mega, 13 août 2013 - 10:09 .

[Turbo_J]

How easily we forget:

In ME1 - all Geth were hostile. Legion flat out lies to Shep in ME2.

I love Legion as a characer, don't get me wrong. Having a geth squadie was awesome... so much so that I gibb him in pre Horizon most of the time to mess with Ash.

Tali's 'loyalty' mission in ME1 - get data on non heritic geth. We did that - or some of us did. What happened leading up to that? We find out these geth - not associated with the Geth who follow Sov. are massing in the Armstrong cluster. Regardless of their intentions, when we come upon their compounds - they attack. They are hostile and intend harm on Shep and squad.

The Quarians: Retcon or clue. Listen to Tali in ME1 on how her government works... then play her loyalty mission and her ME3 mission and - yeah - that's not how things should go. The Admirals should have been dispanded in ME2 after Tali's trial... In fact, I don't think they would have been involved at all given it would cost them their jobs... they would have left the trial up to the Ship captains/owners. Further to that, even if we let that go, in ME3 the Admiralty Board only gets involved to override matters/decisions within the flotilla - and their decisions have to be Unanymous with regards to the matter at hand. If they did go to war against the Geth via unanimous vote, again - they would be dispanded. Tali would have had to vote yes - to go to war - and she would no longer be an Admiral after the vote. According to Tali, her and Koris opposed the war. It should have never happened.

Regardless of these 'problems', the geth are not trustworthy. We've never seen a friendly one... not really. Legion is 1183 all rolled into one amazing concept... who eventually proves to be less than trustworthy.

Within the context of ME3 - Peace if possible - Quarians if not... and this is my personal choice. Roll Playing some Sheps; the results are - problematic.

[Nashtalia]

Kataphrut94 wrote...

The placing of geth as Paragon and quarian as Renegade does make a certain kind of sense if you consider their respective positions in this war. You have the geth, who have just been freed from Reaper control and are once again vulnerable to the quarians attacks. The quarians are openly taking advantage of this in order to finish them off. In this scenario, who is more likely to help the helpless? That's almost the definition of the Paragon playthrough. Not to mention that Paragon Shepard has already been established as believing synthetic life to be of equal value to organic life.

Mind you, it is funny how many people there are who mindlessly pick the Paragon option, then have a waah when Tali goes over the cliff. No one to blame but yourself there, sooky. If you're going to go full Paragon, you have to do it right!

and he tells you that "there" is Reaper on the code it was so hard going Renegade on Legion's back up .

i would "have" allowed Legion's back to upload the code had not had Reaper on it

it's like the situation with meeting with the Rachni Queen for the second time, that is if you let her live and go free, when you first meet the Rachni Queen

as when i first meet the Rachni Queen, she spoke of starting out a-new with Peace intensions, but seeing her again the second time...but this time she's Indocrinated, and on this second time...it was obvious for me that, leaving her to die was the choice.

Modifié par Nashtalia, 13 août 2013 - 10:28 .

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Rachni Queens are not able to be indoctrinated. Their offspring can be because the Reapers can interfere and distort the communication (or song) between the Queen and their young.

If you killed the Queen, the DNA recovered by Binary Helix from the Rachni Queen Egg that they kept on hand was recovered by the reapers and repurposed.

The Geth Consensus: "Why are the Quarians wearing masks?"

"The programs recall images from your own memories."
Shepard: "Makes sense."
SJ: "Uh, no it doesn't. If these are actual records, the Quarians should not be wearing suits... liar, liar, pants on fire."

[Jukaga]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

This is why you need to pay attention and make your own decisions instead of letting the position of a dialogue option on the wheel dictate your choices to you. Let your own sense of right and wrong guide you.

Paragon and renegade need to go away, if only to encourage players to think for themselves.

Unfortunately it's only with ME3's improved reputation system that we can play Paragades/Renegons without missing key dialog choices. Nowadays, I 'cheat' via gibbed in ME2 to max out one or the other every few missions depending on which way that Shepard is leaning and freely choose appropriate R/P responses without fear or missing content because of a balanced R/P score.

[o Ventus]

When does Legion lie in ME2?

[Jukaga]

o Ventus wrote...

When does Legion lie in ME2?

I think the consensus is when he said only the geth Heretics were hostile to organics, when the campaign in the Armstrong Nebula in ME1 proves otherwise.

[Xilizhra]

Question: did the geth ever attack anyone in the Armstrong Nebula, or were they just setting up outposts on uninhabited worlds?

[Jukaga]

Xilizhra wrote...

Question: did the geth ever attack anyone in the Armstrong Nebula, or were they just setting up outposts on uninhabited worlds?

Their presence alone is an attack, and was viewed as a prelude to invasion. Wouldn't you say they would be justified in attacking say a Turian FOB being set up in the Perseus Veil? The Armstrong Nebula is Alliance space after all.